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NotAProghead 
Special Collaborator
Errors & Omissions Team
Joined: October 22 2005
Location: Russia
Status: Offline
Points: 7969
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 Posted: April 06 2011 at 17:30 |
 Vibrationbaby wrote:
Do you guys actually do your record or, sorry, CD or sorry download shopping on the basis of reviews?
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Not too often, but I do. Sometimes I discover something interesting, sometimes I think it would be better to give this money to homeless people instead of buying highly rated piece of crap. 
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Who are you and who am I to say we know the reason why... (D. Gilmour)
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moshkito
Forum Senior Member
Joined: January 04 2007
Location: Grok City
Status: Offline
Points: 18146
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Posted: April 06 2011 at 19:38 |
Dean wrote:
... I can confirm what Pedro has said regarding the availability of music and the "hard to findness" of music back in the day, but not with his conclusions, which to my mind are inaccurate and so far off the mark as to be misleading.
...
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It's just a thought ... an idea ... I did not say it was a reality.
Yes, indeed, many fans, even here, have the chance to be way better informed than you or I were in those days, when I had heard some band called Broughton something had done an anti-war song about VietNam and it took me 5 years to find it ... likewise you might say ... I heard this weird long cut ... Ram ... something or other and not sure that was the name of the band ... and guess what ... I have that album!
There was information then, and one of the main reasons to visit LA all the time (not discussing the plush seats at the Pussycat Theater!), was not only to get the new Klaus Schulze, or Tangerine Dream, or Gong ... but to stop on 5th and Hill at an all night newstand that had everything and also had Melody Maker ... and you could find out a few more things ... so, yeah ... by the time we got something it could be said that we knew it a bit, or already had read something ... but both Guy and I had a really good sense for things ... and we often would do something like this ... you pick something that appeals to you, and I will also ... so we could have fun listening to something else ... and I picked up Ege Bamyasi that night and he picked up PFM ... to just give you an idea. Moby Disk, usually had a wide enough selection that if we didn't get this, we could get that ... or something else! Choosing was a major issue ... !!!
Today ... getting music ... there is no studying or choosing like we did then ... and sometimes I think the "thrill of the chase" ... loses some of the music itself ... but then, I could easily tell you that in those days I was hearing things that WERE different than the average radio stuff ... and today, this is not the case at all ... listen to the first 4 or 5 "progressive" music websites that are streaming music ... and within 10 minutes you will have the same drum beat, the same thrashing, the same guitar lead, the same screaming vocals ... with a token oldie thrown in like King Crimson, to make it look and sound ... Progressive!
We didn't have that in those days.
The internet today, do not get me wrong ... is massive ... totally ... except that you have to choose between 47 different brands of Rice Krispies for Breakfast and one of them is going to be good for you? ... that's not only hard ... it's not fun!
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...
So, it wasn't just the music that was hard to find - it was the background information - what we had came from Music magazines, written with bias and predudice by self-serving, self-publicist muso jouranlists. If that is hard to take just look at the "misinformation" regarding Punk Rock and the so-called demise of Prog in 1976 (you know that thing that happened three years before The Wall became one of the the biggest selling albums of 1980 and has since sold 12 million copies - some death throw that was  ). ...
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It wasn't too bad for us ... and a lot of it had to do with ... the right connections ... and the right place to look! .. and some luck.
Giving an example:
It was like 1971 or 1972 ... and I found a used copy of an album ... at Morninglory Music in IV ... it was "Battered Ornaments" ... and why did I pick up the album? ... one name ... Pete Brown ... who had written all kinds of stuff for Cream and such. When I got home ... ohh my gawd ... that's Pink Floyd's label ... and then I pulled it out and was gonna put it on the record player ... far out record sleeve ... it features a Breakfast Cereal and lists all kinds of Ingredients on the side that the cereal has ... and the ingredients were? (not in order) Edgar Broughton Band, Kevin Ayers, Lol Coxhill, Roy Harper, Capability Brown, Greatest Show on Earth, Third Ear Band, Spontaneous Combustion, Quatermass, Principal Edwards ... and I think a couple of others that I missed ... and the next 20 albums I got were? ... as many of these as I could ... and the ones that stuck really well were Kevin Ayers, Roy Harper as absolutely major, and then EB Band and Capability Brown for excellent music ... and the others were a bit more on the ... hmmm side ... Quatermass was a far out album and I had originally bought it for the cover, and didn't even realize it was Harvest, Spontaneous Combustion's album called Triad is very good, their other one not as good. Principal Edward's album Round Three is a delight and then some ... and Capability Brown you all have heard Dean or I, I'm sure, mention it.
From here it was easy to chase ... the KC, ELP, was already history in my book and had lost its spark ... the Pink Floyd stuff and these bands were much more interesting ... but a lot more came to light there ... that helped explain a lot of music ... and its history ... Mike Oldfield plays guitar as a kid on Kevin's albums ... Third Ear Band did music for Roman Polanski's very bloody and ugly film of Macbeth ... and the music kinda fit the mood too ... grim and grimmer ... and then one day some guy plays all the instruments and the drummer is Edgar Broughton and an album called Oora comes out ... you get it ... the title alone is worth it! It's a fabulous album ... and then the drummer shows up later in Tubular Bells ... and you know that this music scene is not a "minor" scene at all ... and I could see the connections.
And this is how I followed "music" ... and the early days Pink Floyd was also next to Barbet Schroeder, who did films that happened to have members from the Royal Shakespeare Company and the main Academie Francaise on them ... and I thought to myself ... Pink Floyd, movie and actors? ... interesting combination. Wait a minute ... now he is connected to Antonioni? ...
Now you can see, why for me, a lot of music loses its interest when it's a "song" ... and nothing else but ... it is missing a third dimention for me, that I like it associated with the arts around them ... and too many bands simply use lyrics to try and make themselves important ... and it's just talk!
Another line of folks and name thread ... we had Aphorodite's Child in our home in like ... 1968 or 1969 ... and one name involved in it? ... Gomelsky ... and as soon as I got into other music ... it was easy to chase him down and find the bands he was working on ... and of course Magma would get looked at!
One other connection ... Royal Shakespeare Company, Peter Weiss, Peter Brook, Peter Handke, Wim Wenders, Werner Herzog, and immediately you got the electronics. .. or if you want to check the classical line up and the teachers in a couple of German Schools you don't need to go any further than Stockhausen ... and the list of electronic musicians adn famous people around it is insane ... there are not that many "music teachers" in the English scene per se, which is one of the reasons why to me Genesis, ELP, King Crimson and other bands were not as rich or important ... they were still great mind you ... but to me ... too much radio music! Not enough variety! I haven't started on the French scene, the Japanese or the Italian scene yet! ... or one of the most literary and least discussed? ... New York!
It was NOT ... that hard to find things ... again, as I have mentioned before it all depends on what you want and what you have the gall to go after and learn from ...
The internet makes it all easier ... with one exception ... most of it, for me, as you can see above ... is just 4/4 rock music ... and it does not take a lot of talent to play that any more.
To me it wasn't so much about a sub-genre ... it was about the art scene, and I didn't think that Pete Brown was that great at all, but Edgar Broughton band was a double listen and a half ... your ears were going to go ... what is this? ... what the heck? ... and you heard what he said!
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Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
www.pedrosena.com
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JJLehto
Prog Reviewer
Joined: April 05 2006
Location: Tallahassee, FL
Status: Offline
Points: 34550
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Posted: April 06 2011 at 23:50 |
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My personal belief is that I will, eventually, review everything I've heard.
Just something in me, even if I hate it I can't leave it be. I feel it's only right to review it.
It does suck, seeing one of my favorite albums with one (or half) star reviews but hey...can't be a hypocrite now can I?
As long as it's fair.
If you give a really low rating, there should be a review for it and it should be objective.
I do hate seeing someone who has like 30 one star ratings for a whole genre, or style, (or whatever) with no reviews.
That's honestly the most important thing. People can think whatever and even if they hate a genre, should still review it...but they need to review it actually, to explain themselves.
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frippism
Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: July 27 2010
Location: Tel Aviv
Status: Offline
Points: 4160
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Posted: April 07 2011 at 00:24 |
Vibrationbaby wrote:
I was only k-i-d-d-i-n-g about no fun and that's not my quote above. Do you guys actually do your record or, sorry, CD or sorry download shopping on the basis of reviews?
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Yeah I don't how it came up under your name that's really weird, sorry about that. Of course you were kidding, I don't write *fancy philosopher pose* to every post. And do I buy albums according to reviews? Yes and no. First I research of the band, see what their sound is like, I like it or not, and stuff. Then when it's time to decide, yes the reviews do take a certain factor (Well most of the time. For example, I just got Zorn's side project "Painkiller" albums, because all I heard of is that it's this grindcore drummer with Zorn and another jazzer, who I can't remember the name of. That description itself sounded so awesome that I didn't even look at reviews, and the album is pretty incredible). I read the reviews, see what they say of the album, but the number does take a factor, unfortunately I can't help to notice them. That's why I think it'd better without the numbers.
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frippism
Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: July 27 2010
Location: Tel Aviv
Status: Offline
Points: 4160
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Posted: April 07 2011 at 00:41 |
moshkito wrote:
Dean wrote:
... I can confirm what Pedro has said regarding the availability of music and the "hard to findness" of music back in the day, but not with his conclusions, which to my mind are inaccurate and so far off the mark as to be misleading.
...
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It's just a thought ... an idea ... I did not say it was a reality.
Yes, indeed, many fans, even here, have the chance to be way better informed than you or I were in those days, when I had heard some band called Broughton something had done an anti-war song about VietNam and it took me 5 years to find it ... likewise you might say ... I heard this weird long cut ... Ram ... something or other and not sure that was the name of the band ... and guess what ... I have that album!
There was information then, and one of the main reasons to visit LA all the time (not discussing the plush seats at the Pussycat Theater!), was not only to get the new Klaus Schulze, or Tangerine Dream, or Gong ... but to stop on 5th and Hill at an all night newstand that had everything and also had Melody Maker ... and you could find out a few more things ... so, yeah ... by the time we got something it could be said that we knew it a bit, or already had read something ... but both Guy and I had a really good sense for things ... and we often would do something like this ... you pick something that appeals to you, and I will also ... so we could have fun listening to something else ... and I picked up Ege Bamyasi that night and he picked up PFM ... to just give you an idea. Moby Disk, usually had a wide enough selection that if we didn't get this, we could get that ... or something else! Choosing was a major issue ... !!!
Today ... getting music ... there is no studying or choosing like we did then ... and sometimes I think the "thrill of the chase" ... loses some of the music itself ... but then, I could easily tell you that in those days I was hearing things that WERE different than the average radio stuff ... and today, this is not the case at all ... listen to the first 4 or 5 "progressive" music websites that are streaming music ... and within 10 minutes you will have the same drum beat, the same thrashing, the same guitar lead, the same screaming vocals ... with a token oldie thrown in like King Crimson, to make it look and sound ... Progressive!
We didn't have that in those days.
The internet today, do not get me wrong ... is massive ... totally ... except that you have to choose between 47 different brands of Rice Krispies for Breakfast and one of them is going to be good for you? ... that's not only hard ... it's not fun!
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...
So, it wasn't just the music that was hard to find - it was the background information - what we had came from Music magazines, written with bias and predudice by self-serving, self-publicist muso jouranlists. If that is hard to take just look at the "misinformation" regarding Punk Rock and the so-called demise of Prog in 1976 (you know that thing that happened three years before The Wall became one of the the biggest selling albums of 1980 and has since sold 12 million copies - some death throw that was ). ...
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It wasn't too bad for us ... and a lot of it had to do with ... the right connections ... and the right place to look! .. and some luck.
Giving an example:
It was like 1971 or 1972 ... and I found a used copy of an album ... at Morninglory Music in IV ... it was "Battered Ornaments" ... and why did I pick up the album? ... one name ... Pete Brown ... who had written all kinds of stuff for Cream and such. When I got home ... ohh my gawd ... that's Pink Floyd's label ... and then I pulled it out and was gonna put it on the record player ... far out record sleeve ... it features a Breakfast Cereal and lists all kinds of Ingredients on the side that the cereal has ... and the ingredients were? (not in order) Edgar Broughton Band, Kevin Ayers, Lol Coxhill, Roy Harper, Capability Brown, Greatest Show on Earth, Third Ear Band, Spontaneous Combustion, Quatermass, Principal Edwards ... and I think a couple of others that I missed ... and the next 20 albums I got were? ... as many of these as I could ... and the ones that stuck really well were Kevin Ayers, Roy Harper as absolutely major, and then EB Band and Capability Brown for excellent music ... and the others were a bit more on the ... hmmm side ... Quatermass was a far out album and I had originally bought it for the cover, and didn't even realize it was Harvest, Spontaneous Combustion's album called Triad is very good, their other one not as good. Principal Edward's album Round Three is a delight and then some ... and Capability Brown you all have heard Dean or I, I'm sure, mention it.
From here it was easy to chase ... the KC, ELP, was already history in my book and had lost its spark ... the Pink Floyd stuff and these bands were much more interesting ... but a lot more came to light there ... that helped explain a lot of music ... and its history ... Mike Oldfield plays guitar as a kid on Kevin's albums ... Third Ear Band did music for Roman Polanski's very bloody and ugly film of Macbeth ... and the music kinda fit the mood too ... grim and grimmer ... and then one day some guy plays all the instruments and the drummer is Edgar Broughton and an album called Oora comes out ... you get it ... the title alone is worth it! It's a fabulous album ... and then the drummer shows up later in Tubular Bells ... and you know that this music scene is not a "minor" scene at all ... and I could see the connections.
And this is how I followed "music" ... and the early days Pink Floyd was also next to Barbet Schroeder, who did films that happened to have members from the Royal Shakespeare Company and the main Academie Francaise on them ... and I thought to myself ... Pink Floyd, movie and actors? ... interesting combination. Wait a minute ... now he is connected to Antonioni? ...
Now you can see, why for me, a lot of music loses its interest when it's a "song" ... and nothing else but ... it is missing a third dimention for me, that I like it associated with the arts around them ... and too many bands simply use lyrics to try and make themselves important ... and it's just talk!
Another line of folks and name thread ... we had Aphorodite's Child in our home in like ... 1968 or 1969 ... and one name involved in it? ... Gomelsky ... and as soon as I got into other music ... it was easy to chase him down and find the bands he was working on ... and of course Magma would get looked at!
One other connection ... Royal Shakespeare Company, Peter Weiss, Peter Brook, Peter Handke, Wim Wenders, Werner Herzog, and immediately you got the electronics. .. or if you want to check the classical line up and the teachers in a couple of German Schools you don't need to go any further than Stockhausen ... and the list of electronic musicians adn famous people around it is insane ... there are not that many "music teachers" in the English scene per se, which is one of the reasons why to me Genesis, ELP, King Crimson and other bands were not as rich or important ... they were still great mind you ... but to me ... too much radio music! Not enough variety! I haven't started on the French scene, the Japanese or the Italian scene yet! ... or one of the most literary and least discussed? ... New York!
It was NOT ... that hard to find things ... again, as I have mentioned before it all depends on what you want and what you have the gall to go after and learn from ...
The internet makes it all easier ... with one exception ... most of it, for me, as you can see above ... is just 4/4 rock music ... and it does not take a lot of talent to play that any more.
To me it wasn't so much about a sub-genre ... it was about the art scene, and I didn't think that Pete Brown was that great at all, but Edgar Broughton band was a double listen and a half ... your ears were going to go ... what is this? ... what the heck? ... and you heard what he said! |
Well of course times are different, but there's still a scene and there's still life to genre, just in different places and the music is surely different, yet still strongly progressive, and a lot of it is great, and I mean a lot of it. There's a big avant scene going on in Oakland, and the area, with band like Charming Hostess, Sleepytime Gorilla Museum and its side projects, Mike Patton and his projects come from California as well. New York is having it's own thing with John Zorn and his label, and bands like Kayo Dot, Pak, Gutbucket, really really great stuff. There's the Zheul/ Avant scene in Japan! I mean everything Tatsuya Yoshida makes deserves a listen, and Bondage Fruit, Happy Family, OOIOO (one of my favorites). It's definitely not the music that used to be, but it is just as good and at times better. As I said people tend to say "prog is dead", "rock is dead', "polka is dead", and honestly it makes me mad. There's crap, and I mean CRAP. But just like back then, you don't need to do much searching to find innovative interesting music. When wasn't rock mostly 4/4 and fun to bob your head to? And not a lot of talent to play? Listen to anyone of these bands, there's really a huge amount of talent for them.
P.S. don't want to sound like I'm attacking you or anything, just want you to know there's one hell of a music scene, and the internet is a great place to get to know it.
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frippism
Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: July 27 2010
Location: Tel Aviv
Status: Offline
Points: 4160
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Posted: April 07 2011 at 00:44 |
JJLehto wrote:
My personal belief is that I will, eventually, review everything I've heard.
Just something in me, even if I hate it I can't leave it be. I feel it's only right to review it.
It does suck, seeing one of my favorite albums with one (or half) star reviews but hey...can't be a hypocrite now can I?
As long as it's fair.
If you give a really low rating, there should be a review for it and it should be objective.
I do hate seeing someone who has like 30 one star ratings for a whole genre, or style, (or whatever) with no reviews.
That's honestly the most important thing. People can think whatever and even if they hate a genre, should still review it...but they need to review it actually, to explain themselves.
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Well yes they need to review it, of course, and so should you if you have a fair reason to do it. I mean if you just hate the sub-genre, and consider this album just another part of the sub-genre, and therefore it sucks, then really is no reason to review it, because it won't really help someone looking for music from the same sub-genre you just reviewed. In this case just keep to yourself or rant about it in the forum.
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mono
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 12 2005
Location: Paris, France
Status: Offline
Points: 652
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Posted: April 07 2011 at 05:04 |
frippism wrote:
mono wrote:
Moderating reviews.... NO!
Guidelines, Yes!
And guidelines = common sense. "useful for others" reviews.
In my opinion, a review saying "I hate growling so I hate this album" isn't so bad...
You know that the "mean score" represents very little relevant information, so just read a few reviews and you'll be better off.
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You're the one with the Opeth cover in your avatar and I'm more pissed off at it than you are! And I agree that you should read reviews, but with that, if you have to choose which an album of an artist to for first, wouldn't you go for the highest rated? So maybe the bad reviews are messing up what would've the highest rated? Who knows? |
To me it's like reading movie reviews. I'm sorry, but maybe I don't have such a high opinion of reviews at PA, but I respect the fact that everyone can say what they want. I think there is way enough good reviewers here for me to get my fill. And no, of course I don't select the highest rating..... If I did I would clearly contradict myself. Here is my 'new artist' routine. 1. Read Bio(s) 2. Go listen to a few songs on streaming 3. Look at the highest rated albumS and read some reviews on those that rose my interest so far, preferably from reviewers I 'know'. 4. Decide on an album to buy. Ratings are ratings, you have to accept that they're flawed rather than trying to correct everyone's behavior.
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https://soundcloud.com/why-music Prog trio, from ambiant to violence
https://soundcloud.com/m0n0-film Film music and production projects
https://soundcloud.com/fadisaliba (almost) everything else
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scophone
Forum Newbie
Joined: March 21 2011
Location: california
Status: Offline
Points: 2
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Posted: April 07 2011 at 05:26 |
 I can't agree
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Dean
Special Collaborator
Retired Admin and Amateur Layabout
Joined: May 13 2007
Location: Europe
Status: Offline
Points: 37575
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Posted: April 07 2011 at 05:56 |
scophone wrote:
I can't agree |
 I'm watching you.
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What?
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Evolver
Special Collaborator
Crossover & JR/F/Canterbury Teams
Joined: October 22 2005
Location: The Idiocracy
Status: Offline
Points: 5482
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Posted: April 07 2011 at 06:19 |
mono wrote:
Here is my 'new artist' routine.
1. Read Bio(s)
2. Go listen to a few songs on streaming
3. Look at the highest rated albumS and read some reviews on those that rose my interest so far, preferably from reviewers I 'know'.
4. Decide on an album to buy.
Ratings are ratings, you have to accept that they're flawed rather than trying to correct everyone's behavior.
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Exactly.
If you plan on using reviews to influence your purchases, look at reviews for albums you know, both like and dislike, and find reviewers that tend to like what you like, for the same reasons. And use their reviews for advice.
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Trust me. I know what I'm doing.
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frippism
Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: July 27 2010
Location: Tel Aviv
Status: Offline
Points: 4160
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Posted: April 07 2011 at 07:03 |
I'd be scared that emoticon creeps me out.
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frippism
Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: July 27 2010
Location: Tel Aviv
Status: Offline
Points: 4160
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Posted: April 07 2011 at 07:05 |
Evolver wrote:
mono wrote:
Here is my 'new artist' routine.
1. Read Bio(s)
2. Go listen to a few songs on streaming
3. Look at the highest rated albumS and read some reviews on those that rose my interest so far, preferably from reviewers I 'know'.
4. Decide on an album to buy.
Ratings are ratings, you have to accept that they're flawed rather than trying to correct everyone's behavior.
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Exactly.
If you plan on using reviews to influence your purchases, look at reviews for albums you know, both like and dislike, and find reviewers that tend to like what you like, for the same reasons. And use their reviews for advice. |
Yeah that rather makes sense. With that, it depends on the number of reviews that the album gets, and what if none of the reviewers I regard reviewed? It's a good way, and should be done, but still there are problems.
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Luna
Forum Senior Member
Joined: July 28 2010
Location: Funky Town
Status: Offline
Points: 12794
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Posted: April 07 2011 at 07:24 |
frippism wrote:
I'd be scared that emoticon creeps me out. |
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Dean
Special Collaborator
Retired Admin and Amateur Layabout
Joined: May 13 2007
Location: Europe
Status: Offline
Points: 37575
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Posted: April 07 2011 at 07:40 |
SolarLuna96 wrote:
frippism wrote:
I'd be scared that emoticon creeps me out. |
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If your location was "california" and were posting from Beijing I would be you too.
Clowns creep me out 
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What?
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Evolver
Special Collaborator
Crossover & JR/F/Canterbury Teams
Joined: October 22 2005
Location: The Idiocracy
Status: Offline
Points: 5482
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Posted: April 07 2011 at 07:54 |
frippism wrote:
Evolver wrote:
mono wrote:
Here is my 'new artist' routine.
1. Read Bio(s)
2. Go listen to a few songs on streaming
3. Look at the highest rated albumS and read some reviews on those that rose my interest so far, preferably from reviewers I 'know'.
4. Decide on an album to buy.
Ratings are ratings, you have to accept that they're flawed rather than trying to correct everyone's behavior.
|
Exactly.
If you plan on using reviews to influence your purchases, look at reviews for albums you know, both like and dislike, and find reviewers that tend to like what you like, for the same reasons. And use their reviews for advice. |
Yeah that rather makes sense. With that, it depends on the number of reviews that the album gets, and what if none of the reviewers I regard reviewed? It's a good way, and should be done, but still there are problems. |
There are always problems.
In the case you state, I would look at the reviews that are there, and check the reviewers' history, and see if I agree with them. If they like a lot of albums I don't like, I'll disregard the review.
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Trust me. I know what I'm doing.
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Evolver
Special Collaborator
Crossover & JR/F/Canterbury Teams
Joined: October 22 2005
Location: The Idiocracy
Status: Offline
Points: 5482
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Posted: April 07 2011 at 07:55 |
Dean wrote:
SolarLuna96 wrote:
frippism wrote:
I'd be scared that emoticon creeps me out. |
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If your location was "california" and were posting from Beijing I would be you too.
Clowns creep me out |
Then you're on the wrong web site. 
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Trust me. I know what I'm doing.
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frippism
Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: July 27 2010
Location: Tel Aviv
Status: Offline
Points: 4160
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Posted: April 07 2011 at 09:09 |
SolarLuna96 wrote:
frippism wrote:
I'd be scared that emoticon creeps me out. |
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frippism
Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: July 27 2010
Location: Tel Aviv
Status: Offline
Points: 4160
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Posted: April 07 2011 at 09:09 |
Evolver wrote:
Dean wrote:
SolarLuna96 wrote:
frippism wrote:
I'd be scared that emoticon creeps me out. |
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If your location was "california" and were posting from Beijing I would be you too.
Clowns creep me out |
Then you're on the wrong web site. |
 ?
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Sean Trane
Special Collaborator
Prog Folk
Joined: April 29 2004
Location: Heart of Europe
Status: Offline
Points: 20436
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Posted: April 07 2011 at 10:19 |
frippism wrote:
First of all- sorry if this is in the wrong place, wasn't really sure where to put it. OK carrying on:
I've started quite a hooha when I reported a review of Cardiacs' "Sing To God" when the user posting that review reviewed/rated more than 70 (or more I don't recall) albums under the RIO/Avant-Prog genre 1 star. The discussion led to should PA members be banned for generally just reviewing a bunch of albums 1 star resulting from an obvious dislike to sub-genre (and being general jerks)? My answer in the end of the matter was no- you can't. Who am I are or anyone else to judge why review anything.
Wiiiiiith that I think there is also a place to improve PA users judgement skills and make them a better PA user (in my opinion, of course) and in the end a better person! Because being a better prog reviewer leads to a better life! And my rant is this: DON'T! DO NOT! JUST DON'T REVIEW ALBUMS UNDER SUB-GENRES YOU GENERALLY DISLIKE. AND PARTICULARLY DON'T TAKE OUT YOUR DISLIKING TO A WHOLE SUB-GENRE IN ONE REVIEW OF ONE ALBUM, WHO DOESN'T DESERVE THE UNFAIR REVIEW.
Back to library voice. Let me use an example: I rather have a disliking to Neo-Prog. Not only in its sound and melodic and harmonic compositional approach to music, but also in its composing ideology. And because I have a general disliking for Neo-Prog I DO NOT REVIEW NEO-PROGRESSIVE MUSIC. My opinions will not only hurt an albums rating average, but it will do so unfairly. All I will be able to write is why I dislike the album because I dislike Neo-Prog (enter general Neo-Prog stereotype here). Someone who says- "I enjoy lush keyboards and soaring guitars and long compositions", will not care for my review which will say "I don't like lush keyboards and soaring guitars and that's why this album sucks". Instead, this reviewer will be and should be interested in the opinions of those who like Neo-Prog as a whole, like many bands from Neo-Prog, and agree with the general Neo-Prog ideology. The people who enjoy and listen to Neo-Prog can give a fairer criterion (well it won't be perfect in any way, but fairer it will be) on whether the album is a good album or not, according to what a Neo-Prog fan would want to find in an album.
So conclusion, if you simply review an album badly because you hate on a certain sub-genre, instead of why the album is good or bad according from someone who understands more in the sub-genre, generally appreciates the genre, and has a well and strong opinion on why this albums is good and why the album is bad. They shouldn't dish out some annoying fact like: " I hate growling= bad music/album" |
I can see where you're getting at...
I'm generally seen as someone who hates metal and neo prog genres (I don't really  )... Metal music is part of my teendom (or teenhood if you prefer) and Script is probably on my Desert Island disc list.... but I don't reviewmuch in those given genres either, because I tend not to buy or listen to stuff that I know will bore me.... Mostly when I review one of thosde metal or neo album, it's because I rented it from my library system.
It's quite true that there aren't many albums (in those genres I cited) that I actually like, but then again most of those genres keep flinging out new albums that are beating the same old ground... and that's bloody boooooooring to me, and extended boredom sessions drive me to sort of dislike the album that drives to that state.
That's the main reasn why I would rate badly an album... and I'd tend to want to warn potential victims to stay away from it, whatever genre it might be in.
if we weren't allowed to rate things we like less, then every rating left would be good ratings and therefore useless to the decerning prospective proghead...
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let's just stay above the moral melee
prefer the sink to the gutter
keep our sand-castle virtues
content to be a doer
as well as a thinker,
prefer lifting our pen
rather than un-sheath our sword
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frippism
Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: July 27 2010
Location: Tel Aviv
Status: Offline
Points: 4160
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Posted: April 07 2011 at 11:23 |
Sean Trane wrote:
I can see where you're getting at...
I'm generally seen as someone who hates metal and neo prog genres (I don't really )... Metal music is part of my teendom (or teenhood if you prefer) and Script is probably on my Desert Island disc list.... but I don't reviewmuch in those given genres either, because I tend not to buy or listen to stuff that I know will bore me.... Mostly when I review one of thosde metal or neo album, it's because I rented it from my library system.
It's quite true that there aren't many albums (in those genres I cited) that I actually like, but then again most of those genres keep flinging out new albums that are beating the same old ground... and that's bloody boooooooring to me, and extended boredom sessions drive me to sort of dislike the album that drives to that state.
That's the main reasn why I would rate badly an album... and I'd tend to want to warn potential victims to stay away from it, whatever genre it might be in.
if we weren't allowed to rate things we like less, then every rating left would be good ratings and therefore useless to the decerning prospective proghead...
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Oh no no I don't mean not rating albums you don't like. And there's definitely a difference between disliking a sub-genre and disliking the bands in the genre. Reviewing albums low for lack of original or creative ideas is in my eyes completely fair. For me it's the most important trait in an album. What I think someone shouldn't review is an album that he dislikes because it sounds too prog metal (i don't know... Too much distortion, too much Dream Theater?). If you like prog metal's sound and invest time in prog metal, than I don't see why you shouldn't review albums low for their compositional structures (fancy.....) and creativity, not because they are too prog metal-y.
Edited by frippism - April 07 2011 at 11:24
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My PA rant: Stop reviewing sub-genres you dislike
