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Tony R 
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator / Retired Admin
Joined: July 16 2004
Location: UK
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Points: 11979
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 Topic: Yes,ELP= Dream Theater ?
Posted: October 21 2007 at 12:56 |
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Honi Soit Qui Mal Y Pense.
Fermé
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Lucent
Forum Senior Member
Joined: September 18 2007
Location: Canada
Status: Offline
Points: 259
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Posted: October 21 2007 at 12:32 |
 Ivan_Melgar_M wrote:
Lucent wrote:
Back on the subject, to
the people who say I'm "totally wrong" for the right winged political
remark and comparing that to close minded ideals, it's the exact same
thinking. Think about it deeper before I actually start to back my
point.
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Yeah Right wingers like me are the sh!t of the world, when we are
not defending the Monarchy ideals, we are clubbing baby seals for fun.
Even if this was truth, where in hell do you find the relation with the music we listen?
Your ignorance in politics is only compared with your lack of
abbility to make a simil, there are stubborn close minded left wingers,
if not remember Pol Pot, and there are open minded right wingers, some
of them like Dream Theater, others not, taste has absolutely no
relation with political position.
A communist dictator in my country banned Rock because he claimed
it was a Yankee form of cultural penetration, if this is open minded,
well I rather continue being called close minded
Today it'sn easy to listen Prog, it's popular, lots of bands clain
they are Prog, but ion the late 70's or 80's it was unpopular, but we
were open minded enough to discover almost underground music when the
radios, magazines and MTV was bombing us with Disco, New Wave or
Michael Jackson.
But this is not the place for politics, there's a forum for non
musical issues, there you can rant all you want agaibnst the bad rioght
wingers.
BTW: Do you believe that only if you like Dream Theater you are
openm monded? Please don't try to backup this because iit's absurd.
Better wait until you are old enough to vote to start talking
about politics, when you earn your money with your work and don't live
of daddy's pocket, you may change your mind.
Iván
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I was planning to let go of the situation until you posted. I've been
begging for a moment to debate with you anyway, with your whining and
tl;dr posts.
You're right up to the point of which you said the biased remark of
"openm mondedness," in which I defend by saying that everyone is
prejudging Dream Theater, or not sinking themselves into every element
of the band. I would let them go with their opinions, but it's just an
insult-pool of biased remarks with these forums.
As for making my own income remark...you're a big man, aren't you? For
one who lives in a communist dictatorship, you should know a ton about
income (I just went there.)
GoldenSpiral wrote:
Please.... no more feeding the troll...
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GRAAAAAAAAAAAAH GRAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH FOOOOD FOOOOOOOOOOOOOOD! GIVE ME MORE FOOOOOOOOOOD! GARARARARARARARAAR! Nah, I'm not trying to troll anyone...I just see it as the more offensive your remarks are or the more absurd, the more people pay attention. When I throw down an opinion, treat it like any other opinion is all I'm asking you of, even though it isn't the common opinion. I'm not a mean guy, really. I like Dream Theater. I think that the remarks here are biased about Dream Theater. I used a really bad example to show that. Let us move on.
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Dim
Prog Reviewer
Joined: April 17 2007
Location: Austin TX
Status: Offline
Points: 6890
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Posted: October 20 2007 at 21:11 |
GoldenSpiral wrote:
Please.... no more feeding the troll... |
TOP PWN N00BLET
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GoldenSpiral
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: May 27 2005
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 3839
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Posted: October 20 2007 at 21:07 |
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Please.... no more feeding the troll...
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Ivan_Melgar_M
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: April 27 2004
Location: Peru
Status: Offline
Points: 19557
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Posted: October 20 2007 at 21:01 |
Lucent wrote:
Back on the subject, to the people who say I'm "totally wrong" for the right winged political remark and comparing that to close minded ideals, it's the exact same thinking. Think about it deeper before I actually start to back my point.
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Yeah Right wingers like me are the sh!t of the world, when we are not defending the Monarchy ideals, we are clubbing baby seals for fun.
Even if this was truth, where in hell do you find the relation with the music we listen?
Your ignorance in politics is only compared with your lack of abbility to make a simil, there are stubborn close minded left wingers, if not remember Pol Pot, and there are open minded right wingers, some of them like Dream Theater, others not, taste has absolutely no relation with political position.
A communist dictator in my country banned Rock because he claimed it was a Yankee form of cultural penetration, if this is open minded, well I rather continue being called close minded
Today it'sn easy to listen Prog, it's popular, lots of bands clain they are Prog, but ion the late 70's or 80's it was unpopular, but we were open minded enough to discover almost underground music when the radios, magazines and MTV was bombing us with Disco, New Wave or Michael Jackson.
But this is not the place for politics, there's a forum for non musical issues, there you can rant all you want agaibnst the bad rioght wingers.
BTW: Do you believe that only if you like Dream Theater you are openm monded? Please don't try to backup this because iit's absurd.
Better wait until you are old enough to vote to start talking about politics, when you earn your money with your work and don't live of daddy's pocket, you may change your mind.
Iván
Edited by Ivan_Melgar_M - October 20 2007 at 21:06
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Lucent
Forum Senior Member
Joined: September 18 2007
Location: Canada
Status: Offline
Points: 259
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Posted: October 20 2007 at 20:09 |
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I love how when I say one wrong thing, or defend something, the entire thread sparks into a giant drama tornado.
Man, so this must be what a lawyer feels like.
Back on the subject, to the people who say I'm "totally wrong" for the right winged political remark and comparing that to close minded ideals, it's the exact same thinking. Think about it deeper before I actually start to back my point.
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rileydog22
Forum Senior Member
Joined: August 24 2005
Location: New Jersey
Status: Offline
Points: 8844
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Posted: October 20 2007 at 18:28 |
Ivan_Melgar_M wrote:
Lucent wrote:
Get used to it, man. Everyone on this forum (probably exception me) is so right winged, it's disgusting. Thank you for being open minded :3
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I don't like Dream Theater and am a confessed Right Wionger...So what's the relation?
You don't like right wingers, i don't like anything related with the left spectrum of politics, but i reaspect the right of every person to have the position they want, maybe if you had lived in a country where a Communist President destroyed our economy and Maoist terrorists caused more than 30,000 deaths you would think different.
But, I don't care about your political position at all and it has no relation with your musical taste, think before you talk, because this is pure BS.
I have commuinist friends who hate Rock, Prog, Metal and everything, while a lot of right winged friends don't understand why I don't like Dream Theater.
Iván |
IVAN STRIKES AGAIN
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explodingjosh
Forum Senior Member
Joined: February 10 2007
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 507
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Posted: October 20 2007 at 18:25 |
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what were we talking about?
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Ivan_Melgar_M
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: April 27 2004
Location: Peru
Status: Offline
Points: 19557
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Posted: October 20 2007 at 17:28 |
Sunhillow_ wrote:
2 - this forum is intented to be a place of prog rock talking, right? ok... so ppl should keep the talking about prog rock and avoid fighting each other... |
It's not fighting Sunhillow, Politics have nothing to do with music, and this guy is nobody to criticize my political position, this is a free forum, I can believe in what I want.
It's already tiresome to read people criticizing our musical tastes, but it's part of what you can expect in a forum, but Religious and Political ideas have no business in this section of the forum.
Specially when what is writen is pure crap with no relation, more disgusting that our God given right to believe in what we want is to read Lucent speaking BS.
Iván
Edited by Ivan_Melgar_M - October 20 2007 at 17:30
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Sunhillow_
Forum Groupie
Joined: October 31 2006
Location: Brazil
Status: Offline
Points: 57
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Posted: October 20 2007 at 16:31 |
1 - What??????????? Come on. There is no comparison. How can peasents be side to side to masters??? hehehe. Now, seriously... Yes and ELP are rather different when you compare to Dream Theater. But there are some common ground... like on Yes' 1980 album Drama. All prog Metal world probably has this album as one of their must have of all time. but talking about emotion..well... if it is a matter of tastes.. there is nothing to say.. now, talking about the lead vocals.. . poor Dream Theater...jon Anderson and Greg lake are soooooooooooooo distant...... poor La Brie cant even see them...
2 - this forum is intented to be a place of prog rock talking, right? ok... so ppl should keep the talking about prog rock and avoid fighting each other...
Edited by Sunhillow_ - October 20 2007 at 16:34
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Ivan_Melgar_M
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: April 27 2004
Location: Peru
Status: Offline
Points: 19557
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Posted: October 20 2007 at 13:40 |
Lucent wrote:
Get used to it, man. Everyone on this forum (probably exception me) is so right winged, it's disgusting. Thank you for being open minded :3
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I don't like Dream Theater and am a confessed Right Wionger...So what's the relation?
You don't like right wingers, i don't like anything related with the left spectrum of politics, but i reaspect the right of every person to have the position they want, maybe if you had lived in a country where a Communist President destroyed our economy and Maoist terrorists caused more than 30,000 deaths you would think different.
But, I don't care about your political position at all and it has no relation with your musical taste, think before you talk, because this is pure BS.
I have commuinist friends who hate Rock, Prog, Metal and everything, while a lot of right winged friends don't understand why I don't like Dream Theater.
Iván
Edited by Ivan_Melgar_M - October 20 2007 at 13:42
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jammun
Prog Reviewer
Joined: July 14 2007
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 3449
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Posted: October 20 2007 at 12:02 |
MikeEnRegalia wrote:
warwick wrote:
I think ELP lyrics are excellent, musicanship is simply awesome, whereas DT lyrics are childish at best and their songs are clichee'd and artificial. Yes is perfection everywhere in their golden period, so let's not even touch them. |
Emerson likes DT.
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Just to keep things lively...
Umm, given the quality of Emerson's stuff since, oh, about 1974, not exactly a ringing endorsement.
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sarogaxnasoilgo
Forum Newbie
Joined: April 21 2007
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 16
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Posted: October 20 2007 at 11:44 |
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I don't know about anybody else but i happen to enjoy Elp, Yes and Dream Theater. Is there anybody else out there who likes all three?! As for those who say Dream Theater is cold and mechanical with no real feeling .. to each his own opinion i guess but all i can say is that yes its technical but every time i listen to The Dance of Eternity for example i get chills all over my body and it makes me feel great. Likewise Ive had similar experiences with Elp and Yes. All three of these bands genuinely make me feel good...
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MikeEnRegalia
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Joined: April 22 2005
Location: Sweden
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Points: 21596
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Posted: October 20 2007 at 06:30 |
warwick wrote:
I think ELP lyrics are excellent, musicanship is simply awesome, whereas DT lyrics are childish at best and their songs are clichee'd and artificial. Yes is perfection everywhere in their golden period, so let's not even touch them.
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Emerson likes DT.
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FruMp
Prog Reviewer
Joined: September 16 2005
Location: Australia
Status: Offline
Points: 322
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Posted: October 20 2007 at 06:01 |
warwick wrote:
I think ELP lyrics are excellent, musicanship is simply awesome, whereas DT lyrics are childish at best and their songs are clichee'd and artificial. Yes is perfection everywhere in their golden period, so let's not even touch them.
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I agree about the ELP musicianship and the cliche cheesy lyrics of DT but if Yes were perfection everywhere in their golden period then how come not every song is as good as close to the edge? There is no such thing as perfection in the music world.
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steve j
Forum Senior Member
Joined: September 30 2007
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 164
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Posted: October 20 2007 at 04:58 |
puma wrote:
russellk wrote:
They play ballads, AOR, speed metal, progressive metal and plenty of symphonic prog. Some of their music is complex (e.g. 'Dance of Eternity') and some is simple (e.g. 'The Spirit Carries On').
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Well maybe I don't want to listen to a band that caters to its genres. Ever think of that? If they were as creative as you say they are they'd do something truly different for once, instead of making the same album 4 times in a row. Not only is it bad enough that all their songs sound like songs they did before, but all their songs sound like songs Pink Floyd did before. What's the point?
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Does Pink Floyd do speed metal and prog metal? which album is it? (Note to myself - listen to more Pink Floyd).
Seriously though, no one on this board forces anyone to listen to DT. I like them, you don't, that's fine. If everybody only liked Pink Floyd, then we would live very boring lives. "Variety is the Spice of Life". What I am trying to say is "lighten up..... easy tiger", think positive, think glass half full! and smile.....  .
I going off to listen to Riverside and Pocupine tree, I got them for my Birthday.....
Happy Birthday to me..............
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Easy Livin
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator / Retired Admin
Joined: February 21 2004
Location: Scotland
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Points: 15585
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Posted: October 20 2007 at 04:38 |
Please
A)Keep it civil "You have no idea what you're taking about" is not civil for example, and
B) Keep the politics out of it, this is a music section.
This thread is now in overtime, heading the way of its predecessors.  |
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puma
Forum Senior Member
Joined: April 15 2007
Location: Boston, MA
Status: Offline
Points: 484
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Posted: October 20 2007 at 03:17 |
russellk wrote:
They play ballads, AOR, speed metal, progressive metal and plenty of symphonic prog. Some of their music is complex (e.g. 'Dance of Eternity') and some is simple (e.g. 'The Spirit Carries On').
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Well maybe I don't want to listen to a band that caters to its genres. Ever think of that? If they were as creative as you say they are they'd do something truly different for once, instead of making the same album 4 times in a row. Not only is it bad enough that all their songs sound like songs they did before, but all their songs sound like songs Pink Floyd did before. What's the point?
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russellk
Prog Reviewer
Joined: February 28 2005
Location: New Zealand
Status: Offline
Points: 782
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Posted: October 20 2007 at 02:53 |
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There's too much of: *insert band 1* are fantastic, and *insert band 2* are crap. Come on. No band was perfect. Someone stand up for YES's 'Union' and explain why it is beyond criticism. And no balanced listener could call DREAM THEATER crap. You may not like them, but there's a world of difference between dislike and a dismissively negative judgement. I actively dislike ELP, but I'm not foolish enough to think that my subjective opinion makes them objectively crap. I respect the opinions of those who are able to articulate the reasons WHY a band is worthwhile.
I'm fascinated by the DT/ELP link: the common view is that both bands indulge in a fair amount of so-called pointless soloing. I'm bemused that people would in the one breath criticise DT for soloing and in the next laud ELP. Make sense to you?
The notion that DT can be summed up in one sentence puzzles me. They play ballads, AOR, speed metal, progressive metal and plenty of symphonic prog. Some of their music is complex (e.g. 'Dance of Eternity') and some is simple (e.g. 'The Spirit Carries On'). Their career has been patchy, but that's hardly a crime. They are wholehearted, giving of everything they have on every album and at every performance. I don't think they've perpetrated a 'Love Beach' or a 'Union'. But, as the most visible representative of the prog-metal genre and recent prog music in general, they do seem to be a touchstone for those who feel the need to disparage the younger generation's prog revival. They are certainly not the most lyrically taxing band, nor are they as demanding a listen as HENRY COW or SLEEPYTIME GORILLA MUSEUM. They do have their cheesy and gauche moments. But they have drawn bucketloads of fans from metal to prog rock: not a bad thing.
Sorry for the rant (though not sorry enough to edit it).
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Dim
Prog Reviewer
Joined: April 17 2007
Location: Austin TX
Status: Offline
Points: 6890
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Posted: October 19 2007 at 22:38 |
warwick wrote:
I think ELP lyrics are excellent, musicanship is simply awesome, whereas DT lyrics are childish at best and their songs are clichee'd and artificial. Yes is perfection everywhere in their golden period, so let's not even touch them. |
3 clappies for you!
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Yes,ELP= Dream Theater ?
