Edenbridge falls victim to witchhunt

Hi, folks:

It is my sad duty to say ProgArchives is not the same anymore. Recently I tried to included band Edenbridge in PA. To the rest fo the world they are known as a Prog metal band. I thought to bring them in would be a piece of cake, since it was quite obvious to anyone who heard their CDs that they deserve a place in this site. Unfortunatly this is not so. The band was not considered prog metal, the explanations I got were not really convincing, unless you take a `Not prog enough` as a complete and detailed answer. But, anyway, I still thought there was enough open minded people in other departments here to include them as maybe Art Rock or, at the very least, prog related. Nope! Believe it or not, Edenbridge was simply rejected.

One might wonder why they did that, since there are already dozens of bands included here that I would never ever labeled them as prog. Or anyone I know. But I don´t mind, never did. Prog music is a wide concept and that is (or was) the beauty in prog archives. There was room for everybody. In my 30+ years of loving prog music I found progressive relations in pop, jazz, blues, folk and so forth . So, to me, PA policies were just right.

Unfortunatly it seems that things are changing and there is a purge going on. Some people deciding some things are not  "prog enough" and, consequently, not good for ProgArchives. What are the new  parameters of what´s `really progressive´? A mystery.  No information given (are they classified?). Are the purists winning over the liberals? (I guess so!)

Edenbridge was unluckly caught in the middle of this witchhunt. A few months ago it would be included here easily. I know, it was nothing personal, just bad timing... But this is not what worries me the most. I wonder how many more have been and will be rejected right away. And then, what comes next, since many, many groups already included here are not... prog enough? Will they be just ignored like skeletons on their closets? Or cut off from PA? And if they do, how that will be accomplished? Will they be eliminated quietly during the still of the night and no explanations given? One day you wake up and they´re gone forever. Or will they burn them at the stake for all to see?

Oh, I´m really sorry. Maybe I was too naive to believe it would last. Excuse me, but that´s how things start to go downhill. When a few people decides what´s good for the rest.  It seems we have some guardians deciding to purge this site from what may be a threat to the purity of the holy progressive church. And we did not know it!

PA became great for what it was  liberal, generous, open minded. I learned a lot here and I´m really thankful. Still, I don´t like and fear the way things are going now.


Respectfully

Tarcísio B. Moura

Hi, Bhikkhu:

Thanks for your opinion.  I tried very hard to talk my reasons and even opened a forum about it. Unfortunatly the explanations I got were, mostly, dreadful, including one by a so called ´specialist´. Maybe he did not have enough time to go on long explantions, I don´t know. All my arguments fell to deaf ears. I´d love to hear a conving answer to why this band could not be included here. At least one! If something´s really going on is anyone´s guess, like me others think the same way. I thought they judgement was unfair, and I still do. Specially for not include them in any category (and there are many!). PA is the only place I know that does not consider Edenbridge a ProgMetal band. Even though they have all the characteristics to fill that spot. That´s what really amazes me.

Best wishes

Tarcísio Moura

I can't imagine why you think there would be a "witchhunt" going on. The prog-metal team know their stuff and must have had their reasons for deciding this band isn't suitable for inclusion.
Interestingly I've just Googled "Edenbridge" and everyone seems to have them down as a "metal" band but there is no mention of "prog-metal". Sometimes you have to accept that not everyone has the same opinions as you.

Am I alone in getting totally fed up with this kind of childish reaction to NOT GETTING YOUR OWN WAY?

I am beginning to lose count of the times I have read an insinuation that seems to imply that certain individuals are working in the background making dodgy decisions for their own ends or for some unexplained and unfathomable reason.

Enough!

There are no witch hunts and quite frankly I think that we need to address this kind of attack officially in the rules.

I would suggest you re-read the responses from the prog-metal team in your previous rant, sorry I mean thread, http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=33292&PID=2342499

The responses from MikeEnRegalia and The Progtologist seem pretty clear to me. As Jody says, it was a unanimous rejection.

Tony R wrote: Am I alone in getting totally fed up with this kind of childish reaction to NOT GETTING YOUR OWN WAY? I am beginning to lose count of the times I have read an insinuation that seems to imply that certain individuals are working in the background making dodgy decisions for their own ends or for some unexplained and unfathomable reason. Enough! There are no witch hunts and quite frankly I think that we need to address this kind of attack officially in the rules. How dare you make such a casually insulting and derogatory remark!   It is perfectly OK to suggest that a mistake has been made, even accuse people of being incompetent (as long as you give very good reasons) but to suggest that some kind of impropriety has taken place, some nefarious blocking of certain bands or type of bands is totally unacceptable.   To be perfectly frank, I personally dont want people like you on this forum, but luckily for you and your type its not about what I want. You are the kind of egocentric ingrate that will ultimately be the ruin of this wonderful website.   47 year old psychologist eh? I give in.....Edenbridge prey to a witch hunt. Very mature.   You familiar with the word "libel"?

Dear Tony R:

Yes, I know what it means. I am really sorry if I upset you. That was not my intention, neither was to offend anybody in this site. As I wrote in my post and you should read it, I really love PA, I learned a lot here, and I am very grateful for many things. For weeks I did not know if I should post my opinion or not. I tried very hard to be heard, to talk to everyone I could about this subject matter. And got no feedback. Yes, I am hurt and I think It was an unfair decision. I only voiced mine and some people´s  opinion. As you said, I´m not the only one. There´s been a lot of talking lately. I can be wrong, ok. Call me naive to think I could speak this out. It would be a lot easier for me to shut up and keep my suspicions to myself. But I thought I should speak my mind, that this could be done, since I tell no names and I try to be respectful to everyone. If I failed on this subject I can´t do anything but to apologise.

But I really thought someone had to speak about this subject, even if it stinks. A democractic site should not fear or hate a sincere opinion.  If you think that expelling me and others from the forum (or the site, for the matter) is the solution, then you´re only cofirming our suspicions.  I let myself be crucified because  I want to voice what I fear. I know it won´t score many points to a lot of people.  But, please, don´t say this is some personal attack. It is not. This is a question. It was painful to write it. I urge people to stop hatemail and write to the forum to tell whatever they think. Even at the risk of a great misunderstanding it´s better to say it out loud and got an answer than to fear being criticised.

I really wish I´m wrong all the way.

Long live  Progahcives

Respectfully

Tarcísio B. Moura

Tarcisio Moura wrote: If you think that expelling me and others from the forum (or the site, for the matter) is the solution, then you´re only cofirming our suspicions.  I let myself be crucified because  I want to voice what I fear. I know it won´t score many points to a lot of people.  But, please, don´t say this is some personal attack. It is not. This is a question. It was painful to write it. I urge people to stop hatemail and write to the forum to tell whatever they think. Even at the risk of a great misunderstanding it´s better to say it out loud and got an answer than to fear being criticised.

I seem to side with Tarcisio on this one. Not having heard any of the music mentioned it seems a bad case of miscommunication. It also appears to me that maybe Tarcisio feels he did not get an explanation about why they were rejected from PA. From reading hte posts of this and the other thread started by Tarcisio I do not see a reason given for why they were rejected. It seems to be comparing bands and saying its almost prog but not prog with any backing u of the opinion or specific examples. And Tony's post

 "You are the kind of egocentric ingrate that will ultimately be the ruin of this wonderful website."

is a bit over the top I might add. Of course it makes sense why he would answer like that with all the stuff he deals with being an admin after all. It just seems to be a confusing mess that has been made here.  Also notice that the title of this thread doesn't help much.


Edited by progismylife - February 21 2007 at 18:46

Dear  mr R:

Well, if expressing my thoughts is acting like a child, then I am one. I´m really sorry for giving such a bad impression. I´ll try to deal with it.

Best regards

Tarcísio B. Moura 

Tony R wrote: progismylife wrote: I seem to side with Tarcisio on this one. Not having heard any of the music mentioned it seems a bad case of miscommunication. It also appears to me that maybe Tarcisio feels he did not get an explanation about why they were rejected from PA. From reading hte posts of this and the other thread started by Tarcisio I do not see a reason given for why they were rejected. It seems to be comparing bands and saying its almost prog but not prog with any backing u of the opinion or specific examples. And Tony's post  "You are the kind of egocentric ingrate that will ultimately be the ruin of this wonderful website." is a bit over the top I might add. Of course it makes sense why he would answer like that with all the stuff he deals with being an admin after all. It just seems to be a confusing mess that has been made here.   what on earth are you rambling on about?   http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=33292&PID=2342499     From time to time certain members appear whose only agenda here is to get a certain band "added" as a Prog band. This time its Edenbridge, in the past it has been others. These people post pages and pages of type demanding a rethink, a recount or that their "single" opinion is more weighty than a team od experts.   In plain language what our friend here is doing is having a tantrum or trolling us.   Trust me.

I did read that thread Tony. And I did say I seem to side with Tarcisio. Not fully but seem. And after rereading the thread (this one and the other one) I can see some things I didn't notice before.

I do trust you Tony.

Oh well I'll just leave this thread and move on to other things. Hopefully other people can do this too.