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presdoug
Forum Senior Member
Joined: January 24 2010
Location: Canada
Status: Offline
Points: 8657
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Posted: December 23 2010 at 17:26 |
moshkito wrote:
presdoug wrote:
No music, as long as it is listened to and appreciated, is dead, regardless of what any "fashion", or "in vogue" period would dictate heck, i listen to and appreciate music recordings from before 1900, let alone 1989, and they work wonders for me the worst thing that anybody can do is to dictate what has value and what does not All music is not crap, it is all good -to whomever likes it
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Shhhhh!!!
That is way too musically literate to be posted here and everyone will think you are being stubborn like Mosh!
Actually there is a good point to that ... as an "experiential" art, it dies the moment after it passes, and it is your mind that recreates something of that moment that is not necessarily a part of it.
Recordings and such, allow for us to "relive" that moment and feeling, and even that is hardly the original feeling from that one specific moment in time ... and thus, when it changes so much, eventually most of us will get bored with it.
I live for those moments, and the only music that stands up in my ears and mind is the music that ... opens up that incredible array of images and thoughts and everything else you can think of ... and the day it came from, has absolutely nothing to do with it at all ... not one iota.
I do think that Walter's comment has a lot more to do with the commercial crap than it does the music itself. It has a tendency to make the music appear to look better when so few people around you have the patience or the ability to even sit through 5 minutes of what you and I can listen to.
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Hi, Mosh, I like and relate to your concept of "reliving" a moment and feeling with a recording-man, it is like true time travel! In some ways, for myself, the further back in time, the greater the thrill! But , like you say, the feeling does change in a way over time-i guess where we may differ is that the date of a recording does have something to do with it, for me. Not in a sort of "classification" way, but as a sort of historical study, you might say (part of my background is historical research, archaeology, museum work), so dates mean something,but not in a pretentious, "show me" kind of way-my next project is to find the recordings from the pianist Hoffmann that were made literally days from Edison's cylinder machine invention (1888) Now, talk about a blast from the past!
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darkshade
Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: November 19 2005
Location: New Jersey
Status: Offline
Points: 10964
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Posted: December 23 2010 at 17:01 |
im began a King Crimson marathon of all the studio albums, (particularly for the 70s output, we'll see what happens after Red ). I'm up to In The Wake of Poseidon and all i can say is... "I DISAGREE"
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someone_else
Forum Senior Member
VIP Member
Joined: May 02 2008
Location: Going Bananas
Status: Offline
Points: 24389
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Posted: December 23 2010 at 16:53 |
Moogtron III wrote:
CPicard wrote:
Don't you mean "Post Neo"? |
No, that will only start in 2025
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This timing seems right to me, but the name Post Neo will only be used in France and Québec, and maybe in some other French-speaking territories which may become acquainted with prog in the meantime.
Edited by someone_else - December 23 2010 at 16:55
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moshkito
Forum Senior Member
Joined: January 04 2007
Location: Grok City
Status: Offline
Points: 17832
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Posted: December 23 2010 at 16:33 |
presdoug wrote:
No music, as long as it is listened to and appreciated, is dead, regardless of what any "fashion", or "in vogue" period would dictate heck, i listen to and appreciate music recordings from before 1900, let alone 1989, and they work wonders for me the worst thing that anybody can do is to dictate what has value and what does not All music is not crap, it is all good -to whomever likes it
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Shhhhh!!!
That is way too musically literate to be posted here and everyone will think you are being stubborn like Mosh!
Actually there is a good point to that ... as an "experiential" art, it dies the moment after it passes, and it is your mind that recreates something of that moment that is not necessarily a part of it.
Recordings and such, allow for us to "relive" that moment and feeling, and even that is hardly the original feeling from that one specific moment in time ... and thus, when it changes so much, eventually most of us will get bored with it.
I live for those moments, and the only music that stands up in my ears and mind is the music that ... opens up that incredible array of images and thoughts and everything else you can think of ... and the day it came from, has absolutely nothing to do with it at all ... not one iota.
I do think that Walter's comment has a lot more to do with the commercial crap than it does the music itself. It has a tendency to make the music appear to look better when so few people around you have the patience or the ability to even sit through 5 minutes of what you and I can listen to.
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Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told! www.pedrosena.com
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Moogtron III
Prog Reviewer
Joined: April 26 2005
Location: Belgium
Status: Offline
Points: 10616
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Posted: December 23 2010 at 13:56 |
CPicard wrote:
Don't you mean "Post Neo"? |
No, that will only start in 2025
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CPicard
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 03 2008
Location: Là, sui monti.
Status: Offline
Points: 10841
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Posted: December 23 2010 at 13:46 |
Don't you mean "Post Neo"?
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Moogtron III
Prog Reviewer
Joined: April 26 2005
Location: Belgium
Status: Offline
Points: 10616
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Posted: December 22 2010 at 03:51 |
I think all of 1989 music on PA should be put in the section proto-progressive.
Or, no, all music before 1969 should become proto-proto-progressive, no?
Or maybe Procol Harum was proto-proto-proto-progressive, Gabriel era Genesis proto-proto-progressive, Fish era Marillion proto-progressive and 1989 was where it all really began with Dream Theater's When Dream And Day Unite and Marillion's Season's End
I think neo will start in 2015
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irrelevant
Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: March 07 2010
Location: Australia
Status: Offline
Points: 13382
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Posted: December 22 2010 at 03:03 |
"Just for Fun"
Edited by irrelevant - December 22 2010 at 03:04
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Padraic
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: February 16 2006
Location: Pennsylvania
Status: Offline
Points: 31169
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Posted: December 21 2010 at 21:22 |
$ART_FORM that was created [before/after] $DATE is obviously terrible
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Equality 7-2521
Forum Senior Member
Joined: August 11 2005
Location: Philly
Status: Offline
Points: 15784
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Posted: December 21 2010 at 21:20 |
Clearly the socio-economic, societal, and cultural climate of the pre-1989 era precludes any music made in the centuries of human existence before 1989 from being good. Only a moron would attempt to argue this point.
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"One had to be a Newton to notice that the moon is falling, when everyone sees that it doesn't fall. "
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presdoug
Forum Senior Member
Joined: January 24 2010
Location: Canada
Status: Offline
Points: 8657
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Posted: December 21 2010 at 20:35 |
No music, as long as it is listened to and appreciated, is dead, regardless of what any "fashion", or "in vogue" period would dictate heck, i listen to and appreciate music recordings from before 1900, let alone 1989, and they work wonders for me the worst thing that anybody can do is to dictate what has value and what does not All music is not crap, it is all good -to whomever likes it
Edited by presdoug - December 21 2010 at 20:37
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moshkito
Forum Senior Member
Joined: January 04 2007
Location: Grok City
Status: Offline
Points: 17832
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Posted: December 21 2010 at 20:12 |
Eärendil wrote:
I think it's common knowledge by now that all older music (with the cutoff at exactly 1989) is irrelevant. Not only is it unoriginal, but also bad. All of the pre-89 music will soon fade into oblivion to be seceded by the vastly superior modern music. The noise created by these pre-89 caveman should not even be called music. Say NO to the dark shadow of music past and embrace the present! |
Even I will not be that mean to Walter.
Sorry, but I personally feel that the post is mis-guided, ethnocentric and disrespectful to a lot of music ... you might as well stretch your point to say that Beethoven is stupid, Mozart sux and Bach is a flippin idiot! ... and that today's music makes all of them look like white punks on dope ... actually, I would like to suggest the opposite, and I am not trying to tube down a band!
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Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told! www.pedrosena.com
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Baggra
Forum Senior Member
Joined: December 16 2010
Location: Canada
Status: Offline
Points: 221
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Posted: December 21 2010 at 16:48 |
Okay, I realize your all not being serious on this thread, but Id like to say:
for myself the turning point, the most important period in "modern" music is '60-'64*, when artists began to put out their OWN work and not just mirror previous success/fad.
* even though the music was rather shoite.
And you know what? Im not being serious here either.
Devil's advocate, like.
Recall its the Baggman who previously claimed he LIKES shameless copyists - new bands imitating the 70s prog.
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Anthony H.
Prog Reviewer
Joined: April 11 2010
Location: Virginia
Status: Offline
Points: 6088
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Posted: December 21 2010 at 16:30 |
The only real music was released in April 1983.
Edited by Anthony H. - December 21 2010 at 16:36
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Tapfret
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator / Retired Admin
Joined: August 12 2007
Location: Bryant, Wa
Status: Offline
Points: 8594
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Posted: December 21 2010 at 16:19 |
I have no time for your retrograde buffoonery.
Accept creativity, refute the ramblings of extinct species.
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someone_else
Forum Senior Member
VIP Member
Joined: May 02 2008
Location: Going Bananas
Status: Offline
Points: 24389
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Posted: December 21 2010 at 13:42 |
Padraic wrote:
someone_else wrote:
Pre-89 music is not dead. It is not even undead, it is immortal.
In PA's studio album top 100, there are 71 pre-89 albums, of which the first one is encountered on #13.
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Just a wild guess, but I don't think you were supposed to take this thread seriously... |
You are obviously right, my answer was too serious (but while doing some research I detected a possible error in the WR calculation, used for the ordering).
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Padraic
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: February 16 2006
Location: Pennsylvania
Status: Offline
Points: 31169
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Posted: December 21 2010 at 13:21 |
someone_else wrote:
Pre-89 music is not dead. It is not even undead, it is immortal.
In PA's studio album top 100, there are 71 pre-89 albums, of which the first one is encountered on #13.
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Just a wild guess, but I don't think you were supposed to take this thread seriously...
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CPicard
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 03 2008
Location: Là, sui monti.
Status: Offline
Points: 10841
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Posted: December 21 2010 at 13:20 |
I only listen to ancient Greek music, which vibrations had been recorded on old ceramics discs.
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someone_else
Forum Senior Member
VIP Member
Joined: May 02 2008
Location: Going Bananas
Status: Offline
Points: 24389
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Posted: December 21 2010 at 13:06 |
Pre-89 music is not dead. It is not even undead, it is immortal.
In PA's studio album top 100, there are 71 pre-89 albums, of which the first one is encountered on #13.
Edited by someone_else - December 21 2010 at 13:18
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lazland
Prog Reviewer
Joined: October 28 2008
Location: Wales
Status: Offline
Points: 13739
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Posted: December 21 2010 at 12:51 |
topographicbroadways wrote:
i never understand the post-89/pre-89 arguments music changed way more between 1979 and 1980 than it did between 1989 and 1990 |
This is because your name is not Walter. This is a good thing
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Enhance your life. Get down to www.lazland.org
Now also broadcasting on www.progzilla.com Every Saturday, 4.00 p.m. UK time!
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