Criteria of ratings
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Topic: Criteria of ratings
Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Subject: Criteria of ratings
Date Posted: May 16 2012 at 15:10
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I have a quick question: I've rated quite a lot of things according to my taste instead of just going along with how each rating (1- through 5-stars) is defined on PA. I've rated Vangelis' "Blade Runner" 5 stars, but now I'm thinking: "Well, it does not sound like core prog. There are keyboards, but no bass guitar or electric guitar and no drums. It sure sounds progressive electronic, but can I consider it 'essential: a masterpiece of progressive rock music'?" Bert Jansch's "Rosemary Lane" suffers the same problem; it's prog folk more than prog rock. Prog related albums like Talking Heads' albums are kind of safe here since they can become, say, 'excellent addition to any rock music collection' (not 'excellent addition to any prog rock music collection'), although down at the bottom of the page it is offered the option "essential: a masterpiece of prog rock music. Can somebody please help me out here? How should I rate those albums? |
Replies:
Posted By: Ambient Hurricanes
Date Posted: May 16 2012 at 15:22
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I'm not sure what the admins' guidelines say, but I honestly think it's ridiculous to give an album a lower rating because it isn't "proggy" enough. In my opinion, you should judge the album according to its merit regardless of the genre. ------------- I love dogs, I've always loved dogs |
Posted By: Easy Livin
Date Posted: May 17 2012 at 02:53
| No point in getting tied up in rules about such things. Just go with what you think is right. |
Posted By: irrelevant
Date Posted: May 17 2012 at 05:07
 ------------- https://gabebuller.bandcamp.com/" rel="nofollow - New album! http://www.progarchives.com/artist.asp?id=7385" rel="nofollow - http://www.progarchives.com/artist.asp?id=7385 |
Easy Livin wrote:Posted By: HolyMoly
Date Posted: May 17 2012 at 06:42
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But nobody is immune to criticism as to the ratings they give. It's all part of the game. We all have our own ideas as to what's worthy and what's not, but your opinion counts, even if it goes against the grain. The only thing I think an admin would have a problem with is abusive overuse of 1's and 5's, which is pretty easy to spot. That, and reviews that do not address the topic of the album, or do so in an inappropriate manner. I don't think you need to worry about either one - your heart's obviously in the right place, I think. ------------- My other avatar is a Porsche It is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle if it is lightly greased. -Kehlog Albran |
Posted By: Guldbamsen
Date Posted: May 17 2012 at 06:53
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Well apart from that 1 star rating you assigned to Future Days, which obviously was done out of delirium and a feverish state, I completely agree with Steve here. You shouldn't worry too much about the ratings, as long as you don't use them to bash, insult or you carelessly throw either extreme around like were they candy. I know what the ratings state ie "a masterpiece of progressive rock" and all that, but anyway you slice it, they can't possible read your mind, let alone speak for the 30+thousand members of this site on what they think of any given music's merits. Look at them as guidelines, but use your own feelings about the music at hand to come to a definitive conclusion. ------------- “The Guide says there is an art to flying or rather a knack. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.” - Douglas Adams |
Posted By: Gerinski
Date Posted: May 17 2012 at 07:49
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This is a recurring question. X stars within its sub-genre / context or X stars in the overall history of prog music?
If I am, just for example, mostly a classic Symphonic, Psychedelic and RIO fan and generally speaking I hold Crossover in a "lower" tier, I might consider Big Big Train's The Underfall Yard as a masterpiece within Crossover but just a 3 or 4 star album within the all-encompassing prog landscape. How should I rate it?
And given the rather long history of prog by now, the same is happening regarding epochs. If you are a 70's classic prog fan there may be contemporary albums which you may consider "masterpiece within the 21st century prog" or something like that but lesser when you compare them to your beloved classic 70's albums.
Or the other ways around of course.
We see an increasing number of young proggers who rate classics rather low from their current point of view, being either because currently other sub-genres are taking more importance or because stylistically the music of that type has evolved and they do not connect so much with the pioneers anymore.
When I face this kind of dilemma I tend to rate in between the 2 approaches. If I think an album is a masterpiece within its sub-genre or context but only a 3 star in the overall prog history, I will give it 4 stars etc.
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Posted By: HolyMoly
Date Posted: May 17 2012 at 08:30
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Off on a brief related tangent here -- as part of my job, I follow and analyze documentation for physician office visits, and there's a similar conundrum in that arena as well. When a patient comes in for a medical condition, be it a cold or some chronic illness like diabetes, the physician has to assess the complexity of the condition, do some level of medical decision making, and can usually get reimbursed a higher rate for a higher level of complexity and decision making. The codes used to submit claims for payment go from level 1 to level 5, and the physician chooses the level of the visit and submits it on a claim for payment. Statistically, most visits should be level 3, with very few level 1 and level 5 visits. Still, many physicians will tend to concentrate most of their coding in the level 4-5 range, and this is considered by us to be potentially abusive billing. The assumption is that the "bell curve" distribution of patient complexity should apply; in fact, the system of levels is designed in a way such that patients should naturally fall into that type of distribution. I feel the same way about album ratings. Most albums out there in prog land should theoretically be 3's, with very few 1's and 5's. If you're only rating your 5 favorite albums, of course, that distribution would probably not apply, since you're selecting a cherry-picked sample. But over the course of hundreds of albums, I feel the prudent thing is to try to keep the normal bell-curve distribution in mind. ------------- My other avatar is a Porsche It is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle if it is lightly greased. -Kehlog Albran |
Posted By: Guldbamsen
Date Posted: May 17 2012 at 08:41
I partly agree with this, but if one has accumulated 2500+ albums over the years, and write as slow as I do(I gather I'll never ever reach those heights some of the more productive reviewers here have), then I think it's fair to concentrate on those one deem as great and recommendable - instead of having to write about all those meh and middle of the road albums. I still think it's a good rule of thumb trying to keep the normal bell curve in mind, as you put it Steve, but to those who have a vast collection and maybe only gets 20% of that reviewed, I then think the curve can be persuaded to lie higher than 'normal'. I could of course use the rating only thing, but it just doesn't interest me. Still, I think this was a great and very thoughtful post. I really like the imagery as well. ------------- “The Guide says there is an art to flying or rather a knack. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.” - Douglas Adams |
Posted By: Slartibartfast
Date Posted: May 17 2012 at 10:11
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Don't worry about or pay too much attention to the ratings. The guidelines are guidelines. If I don't think an album is prog enough to be here, I don't review it anyway, giving it an effective rating of zero. When I review something my rating is weighted by whether or not the music is good.
------------- Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened... 
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Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: May 17 2012 at 12:56
Sorry for the deviation, but ... : What led you to that thought, if I may ask?
 'Cause, like the review says, the album has nothing to do with the resonant and the musico-cognitive. |
Posted By: Guldbamsen
Date Posted: May 17 2012 at 13:03
The internet is such a bad place for irony... Sorry dude. ------------- “The Guide says there is an art to flying or rather a knack. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.” - Douglas Adams |
Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: May 17 2012 at 13:29
| ^ Keep going ... where did you sense irony? |
Posted By: Guldbamsen
Date Posted: May 17 2012 at 13:49
I was being ironic  People are of course allowed to feel what they want to in regards to music. I was just being overly ironic, because I happen to adore that album. ------------- “The Guide says there is an art to flying or rather a knack. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.” - Douglas Adams |
Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: May 17 2012 at 13:59
^ Oh, my head was all messed up. After spending a few minutes on the definitions of dramatic irony, verbal irony, and situational irony, my head was all like  , which is why I asked about the irony.Anywa-a-a-a-a-ay ... thank you all ye who responded. I'm glad that you've cleared all this up for me. I was afraid this thread would have only one reply.
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Posted By: Ambient Hurricanes
Date Posted: May 17 2012 at 15:20
You didn't like my reply?
  ------------- I love dogs, I've always loved dogs |
Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: May 17 2012 at 15:39
^  . Every person provides his own single (or more than one) perspective, and I very much wanted to get quite a few. But then again, you might have just made a joke, but I'll never know.
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Posted By: Ambient Hurricanes
Date Posted: May 17 2012 at 21:28
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You mean that my initial reply was a joke (it wasn't) or my post today was a joke (it was)? ------------- I love dogs, I've always loved dogs |
Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: May 17 2012 at 23:12
| ^ Why, that last one, of course. |
Posted By: ExittheLemming
Date Posted: May 18 2012 at 05:57
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The 'excellent addition to any prog rock music collection' needn't necessarily be a Prog album ya dig bro?
------------- 
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Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: May 18 2012 at 12:00
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^ Well, thank you ... I trust your judgment.
BTW: gotta work on that slang, homie
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