Asia....rising from the rubble of prog rock??
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Topic: Asia....rising from the rubble of prog rock??
Posted By: cstack3
Subject: Asia....rising from the rubble of prog rock??
Date Posted: November 22 2011 at 13:38
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So says Gibson Guitar Company! Asia was a powerhouse band, but would we consider them one of the "Ten Greatest Super Groups?" http://www.gibson.com/en-us/Lifestyle/Features/supergroups-1121-2011/" rel="nofollow - http://www.gibson.com/en-us/Lifestyle/Features/supergroups-1121-2011/ Asia Rising from the rubble of prog rock, which had been hammered to bits by the punk explosion, Asia boasted a spectacularly talented lineup in the persons of Steve Howe (Yes), John Wetton (King Crimson), Carl Palmer (ELP) and Geoff Downes (The Buggles). Releasing their debut album in 1982, the band scored a massive hit – as well as endless rounds of MTV airplay – with the arena-ready pop song, “Heat of the Moment.” Critics were never enamored of Asia, but the band’s debut remains emblematic of a certain brand of ’80s rock. The group has survived in myriad incarnations through the years. |
Replies:
Posted By: lazland
Date Posted: November 22 2011 at 13:46
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I would, certainly as a "super group" as I understand the phrase. I've always liked Asia. ------------- Enhance your life. Get down to www.lazland.org Now also broadcasting on www.progzilla.com Every Saturday, 4.00 p.m. UK time! |
Posted By: Snow Dog
Date Posted: November 22 2011 at 13:48
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I agree with Lazarus. ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Snow_Dog" rel="nofollow"> 
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Posted By: The Miracle
Date Posted: November 22 2011 at 14:02
Asia *are* the rubble of prog rock...
------------- http://www.last.fm/user/ocellatedgod" rel="nofollow - last.fm |
Posted By: cstack3
Date Posted: November 22 2011 at 14:04
Truly, a band with some incredible music! But, would we agree with Gibson and consider them one of the Ten Greatest Super-Groups? That's where I would waffle a bit...Asia were VERY popular back in the '80's, with some good AM radio hits, but so were Saga, GTR, and post-Gabriel Genesis. Not sure that I'd put them on the same pedestal as Cream for example. I'd name Yes or Genesis before I'd name Asia.
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lazland wrote:Posted By: lazland
Date Posted: November 22 2011 at 14:10
But Charles, Yes & Genesis were not supergroups, at least not in the context I understand the word. Supergroups were acts that brought together a mix of artists from previously very successful acts. Another example would be GTR, which brought Hackett & Howe into the same "supergroup". Cream were a supergroup - look at the background of Baker, Clapron, and Bruce. Yes & Genesis were original bands, who started off as being completely unknown. ------------- Enhance your life. Get down to www.lazland.org Now also broadcasting on www.progzilla.com Every Saturday, 4.00 p.m. UK time! |
Posted By: Marty McFly
Date Posted: November 22 2011 at 14:34
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Asia has its moments. But I agree with you, because these moments are far too few. And besides, with a lineup like that, they were expected to do much more than what they did. They are probably the biggest supergroup that wasn't releasing Prog albums. ------------- There's a point where "avant-garde" and "experimental" becomes "terrible" and "pointless," -Andyman1125 on Lulu  Even my |
Posted By: Marty McFly
Date Posted: November 22 2011 at 14:36
Indeed, Yes, Genesis and King Crimson were the breeding ground for supergroup-members to come, as was Spock's Beard (Nick, Neal) in the 90s. Oh, actually Dream Theater is also breeding ground for such supergroups, right ? ------------- There's a point where "avant-garde" and "experimental" becomes "terrible" and "pointless," -Andyman1125 on Lulu Even my |
Posted By: Midnight Lightning
Date Posted: November 22 2011 at 14:40
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It's kinda ironic how most "super" groups actually never came close to the caliber of the "not super" groups that their members came from. Maybe a better term would be compound groups.
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Posted By: richardh
Date Posted: November 22 2011 at 15:07
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''Splinter groups'' was the term that used quite a bit.
Probably the best supergroup ever was formed to play at the event to aid the victims of the Japanase earthquake in the early 90's
Keith Emerson,Jeff Baxter,Simon Phillips, Joe Walsh,John Entwistle
It could only have one name!
The DVD was recently re-released.It's worth having!
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Posted By: Catcher10
Date Posted: November 22 2011 at 15:28
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I've liked Asia too.......I remember that debut album and I just loved it. But seeing them perform on TV a couple months ago at some 2010 music festival....Ooofahh!! That was horrible, Wetton was just aweful on vocals, barely moved a muscle, and poor Howe looked like a skeleton with a bit of skin to it. -------------   
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Posted By: Icarium
Date Posted: November 22 2011 at 16:55
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what about UK they are a quite good supergroup, i would say with one very good album comprised of members of previous bands,
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Posted By: cstack3
Date Posted: November 22 2011 at 16:58
OK, thanks my friend! Point well taken, and I agree with your logic. I was quite excited when Asia first broke out, and they were very popular for quite a stretch. I've often considered Wetton to be (arguably) the "most successful prog bassist" due to his stint in Asia, following KC. Not sure how many would agree with me, but he did sell a ton of records. However, if we dial it back enough, Yes were started with guys from Mabel Greer's Toy Shop, The Syn etc. And, ELP was cobbled together with a bit of The NIce, KC and Crazy World of Arthur Brown!! They all came from somewhere! My own favorite "group that should have become a super group" was the late, great U.K.! My God, that was some music! |
Posted By: moshkito
Date Posted: November 22 2011 at 19:40
I don't disagree, to be honest.
But we have to really decide that just because it is a "supergroup" and it has people that are famous, that it is also "progressive" and deserves the credit and the reputation.
I am not sure that they deserve that, because unlike the originals they were a part of, by comparison this was just songs for the populace and a chance for some of those folks to make some money. Goodness .. didn't Picasso, Cocteau and Satie do a play on two on the stage with their own work? ... so what?
You gotta be jaded, when you have worked for 10, 15 years, not made a penny, have a wife and a kid, and you don't have a house ... so helping get some money is probably a good thing, and I would not object, and neither would you.
Some of the "purist" thinking is scary ... but it should not be the definition of "progressive".
Again, a "style" is NOT a process, and thus the definition of this is invalid for music history. Style is a RESULT, of what was done, and in this case the combination of folks and work. And it is mostly an academic and commercial definition for the sake of education and money and has nothing to do with the music itself!
The group is fine and the music is fine. But I prefer Tales, and Close to the Edge ... etc, etc ... ------------- Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told! www.pedrosena.com |
Posted By: The Dark Elf
Date Posted: November 22 2011 at 20:57
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I never cared for Asia, as a band or a continent. ------------- ...a vigorous circular motion hitherto unknown to the people of this area, but destined to take the place of the mud shark in your mythology... |
Posted By: Catcher10
Date Posted: November 22 2011 at 20:58
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I am all for these artists to make money, I hope they make a gazillion $$.........but because of the style of music they play to accomplish this, some people label them sellouts or simply....pop music.....and so the purists do not give them the time of day. -------------
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Posted By: Catcher10
Date Posted: November 22 2011 at 20:59
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Posted By: Evolver
Date Posted: November 22 2011 at 22:32
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Asia? Bland boring pablum. They deserved the famous review that was given to GTR. ------------- Trust me. I know what I'm doing. |
Posted By: cstack3
Date Posted: November 22 2011 at 22:44
Yes, thanks, I sure agree!! They put on an AMAZING show! The ability of Wetton to play very complicated bass lines while singing was just uncanny! He was one of the very best at that skill!
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Posted By: ExittheLemming
Date Posted: November 23 2011 at 02:53
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I admired (but didn't love) the song-writing on the 1st Asia album - these were premeditated radio salvoes all brilliantly crafted and arranged for maximum consumption. Say what you like about a band you could be forgiven for thinking was designed by suits, it was for a short while, brilliant pop music. ------------- 
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Posted By: yanch
Date Posted: November 23 2011 at 05:32
Absolutely. Never liked them. I had such high expectations given the line up and the bands these guys came from, but the music, for me, was bland formulaic, corporate rock. I don't begrudge them making money, but to put out that music given that talent was a waste. I wouldn't put them in a top 10 of supergroups. Bands like UK, Transatlantic, Liquid Tension Experiment, Cream are your true supergroups.
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Posted By: richardh
Date Posted: November 23 2011 at 15:52
| I still like the debut album and downloaded both their recent albums (Phoenix and Omega) which have some very acceptable songs to me.Not a progressive rock band but of course its not necessary for everything to be ''progressive''.(honest) |
Posted By: cstack3
Date Posted: November 23 2011 at 16:26
Indeed! I also have wondered what the aborted "XYZ" (ex-Zepplin, ex-Yes) project might have sounded like. Could have been interesting! Or not! "Zappa Plays Zappa" is a contemporary twist on the "supergroup" concept and well worth the price of admission!
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Posted By: Intruder
Date Posted: November 23 2011 at 18:29
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If those radio singles had been put out by anyone else but that particular "supergroup", it definitely would be a step above the mainstream of the early 80s, but with Wetton, Palmer, Downes and Howe we expected more....man, did they ever underutilize their talents. Asia....a greater waste of natural resources than a '78 Cadillac. ------------- I like to feel the suspense when you're certain you know I am there..... |
Posted By: Slartibartfast
Date Posted: November 23 2011 at 18:59
I'm on the side of Asia being the rubble rather than rising from it. It was the heat of the vomit... I kept following the old greats as they descended into commercialitis, but then I just lost interest.
------------- Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened... 
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Posted By: rogerthat
Date Posted: November 23 2011 at 19:03
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Posted By: BarryGlibb
Date Posted: November 24 2011 at 04:05
| Asia were full of awe and vice versa (mostly). |
Posted By: Moogtron III
Date Posted: November 24 2011 at 05:02
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I like the first Asia album enormously, but only that album. The rest I don't care for. Asia are for me only a supergroup in the sense that it was a band that had been formed by musicians that were already well known. Like ELP, Transatlantic, and outside prog: Blind Faith. For me it says nothing about the qualities of the music. Of course, record companies might like to make you believe that big names means big music, but it doesn't always work that way. So I would like to avoid the word supergroup myself: it's confusing. |
Posted By: Snow Dog
Date Posted: November 24 2011 at 05:56
Being a band that you like is not part of the definition. Asia is also a "true" supergroup. In fact more of a true supergroup than Transatlantic or LTE as the musicians in Asia were actually famous.
------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Snow_Dog" rel="nofollow">
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Posted By: Slartibartfast
Date Posted: November 24 2011 at 06:46
They were a true prog supergroup, that there was really little prog going on there was really disappointing to me at the time when they formed. ------------- Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...
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Posted By: Snow Dog
Date Posted: November 24 2011 at 07:00
I'm not saying the were "Prog" Supergroup. Just a plain supergroup. It's a lame word when you think about it. Let's not say it again.  ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Snow_Dog" rel="nofollow">
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Posted By: Icarium
Date Posted: November 24 2011 at 07:25
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i call them superdupergroup from now
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Posted By: rogerthat
Date Posted: November 24 2011 at 10:27
I think the all star concept in jazz is more relevant than 'supergroups' in rock. Barring ELP and UK, supergroups have rarely done anything I found amazing. I guess you could sort of call National Health a supergroup and they were very good too. |
Posted By: Moogtron III
Date Posted: November 24 2011 at 12:11
Well, the jazz comparison in an interesting one. Yes, I think you're right. |
Posted By: lucas
Date Posted: November 24 2011 at 14:59
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one of the worse bands ever. ------------- "Magma was the very first gothic rock band" (Didier Lockwood) |
Posted By: CPicard
Date Posted: November 25 2011 at 05:53
/thread] I guess? Anyway, having listened to... What, two albums? Well, I never could get through two albums. Goodly recorded, but not my cup of tea. |
Posted By: Dellinger
Date Posted: November 25 2011 at 18:51
| I did find Asia to be rather a dissapointment, and really would have liked them to do something else. The music doesn't really bother me, and they have a few songs I really like a lot, but indeed I would have liked to listen to a true prog masterpiece from them. However, the one song that came close enough to prog for me is "Parallel Worlds / Deja / Vortex"... or something like that, from Phoenix... I might say I'm glad Asia existed only because of that song (well, it's actually a good pop song followed by a great instrumental passage, but that was good enough for me, I really love that song). |
Posted By: lucas
Date Posted: November 26 2011 at 05:08
re-phrasing my opinion :
Asia is one of the worst bands ever. ------------- "Magma was the very first gothic rock band" (Didier Lockwood) |
Posted By: Slartibartfast
Date Posted: November 26 2011 at 09:10
Unless restating is rephrasing you have just repeated yourself.  ------------- Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...
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Posted By: jammun
Date Posted: November 26 2011 at 11:01
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C'mon, we had high expectations when we saw the makeup of the group. Our expectations were not met in that sense. Still a pretty good band. I mean, what was the competition at the time? I have the Anthologia CD. I should review it. It's not as bad a some here think. Heat of the Moment is a fine song, certainly ranking up there with Genesis' output at the time. ------------- Can you tell me where we're headin'? Lincoln County Road or Armageddon. |
Posted By: andrewskirooh
Date Posted: December 01 2011 at 15:03
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I agree that it's interesting to see that although the members by themselves are so talented and with the previous groups that they contributed to, the "chemistry" within the "super-group" just isn't quite there....fell quite short of the expectations of many..I'm sure. I remember being quite disappointed when Asia's 1st album came out because I was so convinced that their sound or direction was going to be reminiscent of UK. I mean, look at the line-up and the past work of these guys...how could it not? My main opinion on hearing 'Heat Of The Moment' ? was....they sold out...I can't believe it! http://remenescent.deviantart.com/" rel="nofollow - http://remenescent.deviantart.com/" rel="nofollow - |
Posted By: lazland
Date Posted: December 01 2011 at 15:14
An equally valid alternative view, of course, and one that I hold to, is that they merely sold a lot of records, which is not the same thing as selling out ------------- Enhance your life. Get down to www.lazland.org Now also broadcasting on www.progzilla.com Every Saturday, 4.00 p.m. UK time! |
Posted By: Evolver
Date Posted: December 01 2011 at 17:18
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A band that was far less than the sum of it's parts. ------------- Trust me. I know what I'm doing. |
Posted By: Slartibartfast
Date Posted: December 01 2011 at 19:05
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Asia, rubble from the rising of prog rock. ------------- Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...
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Posted By: richardh
Date Posted: December 02 2011 at 14:44
Its an unusual track as it has two instrumental passages. The first one has Carl Palmer doing some trademark fastfootwork on the twin bass drums and then Howe takes over for the last bit (slightly reminiscent of the instrumental section of Layla in mood). This is the kind of thing Asia do best I think. They never wanted to be a full blown prog band and made that clear from the beginning. This was something that came mainly from Wetton and lead to some friction between him and Howe if I understand correctly. Asia could be seen as a waste of prog talent but individually they had already done it with their previous groups and probably reasoned it would have been pointless and self defeating to try and repeat all that again.
My favourite Asia track is probably Cutting It Fine from the debut. Thats for me a great ensemble peice and I simply don't care whether its ''prog'' or not.
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Posted By: Ytse_Jam
Date Posted: December 08 2011 at 19:24
| Always loved them, also more that Wetton's previus group UK.. |
Posted By: spknoevl
Date Posted: January 09 2012 at 10:30
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Never really cared for Asia, especially after their debut release. They sounded like a pop band masquerading as a prog band. As much as I liked Wetton, I preferred his work in KC and UK far more.
I think Asia was designed by Wetton to be an attempt to become a more commercially acceptable version of what UK had tried to be. The need to include Howe and Palmer probaby had more to do with their name recognition than any other factor and both sounded badly dated on the recordings. ------------- http://martinwebb.bandcamp.com The notes are just an interesting way to get from one silence to the next - Mick Gooderick |
Posted By: lucas
Date Posted: January 09 2012 at 12:52
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I still don't understand why they are in PA. ------------- "Magma was the very first gothic rock band" (Didier Lockwood) |
Posted By: richardh
Date Posted: January 09 2012 at 14:49
As for Howe I think he sort of got caught up in and perhaps needed a band with Yes not an option at the time. He was the first of the original line up to jump ship after falling out with Wetton over the bands direction.Downes was never really a 'progger' as such despite a brief dalliance with Yes.
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Posted By: Slartibartfast
Date Posted: January 09 2012 at 15:42
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I think the nickname of Nausia is entirely fitting. If you got into them at the time and still like them there is a high naustalgia factor going on. Same with GTR, etc. It was the heat of the vomit... ------------- Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...
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Posted By: prog4evr
Date Posted: January 09 2012 at 23:09
Well said. A real waste of talent by Steve Howe, Carl Palmer, and John Wetton (and, then, even Greg Lake when he replaced Wetton)...
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Posted By: Ytse_Jam
Date Posted: January 10 2012 at 09:44
| Their AOR however, even if not prog, isn't so bad.. |
Posted By: verslibre
Date Posted: January 10 2012 at 13:14
I agree, best song on the album.
------------- https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_ipg=50&_sop=1&_rdc=1&_ssn=musicosm" rel="nofollow - eBay |
Posted By: richardh
Date Posted: January 10 2012 at 15:28
To be honest I preferred Asia over what Yes and Genesis were doing at the time and just couldn't get into the new King Crimson style at all.
Carl Palmer was still a big presence on the debut album and Howe wasn't bad . It was when they got to Alpha that they depressed me and Astra was dreadfull.
Greg Lake only replaced Wetton for one live show.
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Posted By: Slartibartfast
Date Posted: January 10 2012 at 18:13
I of course base this opinion on KC not achieving commercial success. ------------- Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...
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Posted By: rogerthat
Date Posted: January 11 2012 at 06:31
Would be quite happy to take 90125 over the Asia s/t. And for That's All and Job to Do, would take the Genesis s/t too though that's much closer. |
Posted By: AmbianceMan
Date Posted: January 14 2012 at 12:45
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I am familiar with Asia, and from what I know I never considered them to be related to prog rock. They are the epitome of everything I hate about popular guitar rock. I put them in the class of late 80's early 90's hair metal ballads. When I heard who was in the band, I admit I had to do a double take and say WTF? I'm not bashing those who are fans, but on the surface I would use their CD as a beer coaster.
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Posted By: brainstormer
Date Posted: January 14 2012 at 15:42
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The phrase "rubble of prog rock" goes along rather eerily with the demise of intelligent culture in the foreground of popular media. It's almost like more intelligent people are more of a threat to those that own big interests in manufacturing and so on. I think dumbing down a culture is a spiritual evil, so I don't look at it in any socialist way, as I am a capitalist (not a predatory capitalist, but the Andrew Carnegie/George Eastman kind). ------------- -- Robert Pearson Regenerative Music http://www.regenerativemusic.net Telical Books http://www.telicalbooks.com ParaMind Brainstorming Software http://www.paramind.net |
Posted By: prog4evr
Date Posted: January 21 2012 at 22:55
Well said, my good man!
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Posted By: geneyesontle
Date Posted: January 25 2012 at 17:10
| I think that the songs of this band are not so good but all the musicians of this band are awesome (except maybe Geoff Downes). |
Posted By: Slartibartfast
Date Posted: January 25 2012 at 17:36
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Geoff Downes was ok on keys and the songs were ok for commercial. By the way I was exaggerating the awesomeness of King Crimson in relation to Yes and Genesis. ------------- Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...
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Posted By: igySK
Date Posted: February 01 2012 at 06:25
| I know they're an OK band but I just don't feel that excited when I listen to it. Although some parts are really epic, I don't really like the band's drum style and I just don't feel any kind of creativity in it... |
Posted By: King Manuel
Date Posted: February 16 2012 at 05:46
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Actually long ago before I kew about the existance of prog rock I heard a few Asia tracks. I was very impressed with their bombastic sound. Tracks like Don´t Cry, Heat of the Moment, Midnight Sun, etc. spoke to me. Years later, when I had turned from a metal head into a prog head I started buying some Asia CDs and attend two concerts, and yes, to make a long story short, there is something to them, I don´t like all their stuff, but I still put them regularly in my CD player ... maybe this has also to do with the fact that my wife tolerates them being played loud in her presence, something which can´t be said about a lot of other stuff I listen to .... ------------- Don't Bore Us, Get To The Chorus |
Posted By: cstack3
Date Posted: February 17 2012 at 00:34
I tend to agree! Looking at all of the personnel changes they had, I'm not sure that they stayed in the category of "Supergroup" once founding members started to check out. More like a "franchise." From the Wikipedia page: PersonnelThrough the years, Geoff Downes and John Payne were the two most consistent members of the band, which experienced a revolving roster of noted musicians, particularly in the 1990s. The lineup has been as follows: Current members of Asia are the following founding members:
Former band members of Asia are:
Certain musicians have joined and left after a short time without recording any studio material with the group. The most notable collaboration of this kind was the participation of http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greg_Lake" rel="nofollow - Greg Lake in the "Asia in Asia" concert on bass guitar and lead vocals. Yet more musicians have played as http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Session_musicians" rel="nofollow - session musicians or have guested with the band without formally joining. Some of these artists include: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Fleischman" rel="nofollow - Robert Fleischman , http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vinnie_Colaiuta" rel="nofollow - Vinnie Colaiuta , http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Francis_Dunnery" rel="nofollow - Francis Dunnery , Ant Glynne, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scott_Gorham" rel="nofollow - Scott Gorham , http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tomoyasu_Hotei" rel="nofollow - Tomoyasu Hotei , http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luis_Jardim" rel="nofollow - Luis Jardim , Ron Komie, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tony_Levin" rel="nofollow - Tony Levin , http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steve_Lukather" rel="nofollow - Steve Lukather , http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Lang" rel="nofollow - Thomas Lang , http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kim_Nielsen-Parsons" rel="nofollow - Kim Nielsen-Parsons , http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simon_Phillips" rel="nofollow - Simon Phillips , and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alex_Thomas_%28musician%29" rel="nofollow - Alex Thomas . [ http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Asia_%28band%29&action=edit§ion=9" rel="nofollow - edit ] |
Posted By: richardh
Date Posted: February 17 2012 at 01:45
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^ the only lineup worth talking about is the orginal one. I have heard some of the other albums and they are okay. Asia were always meant to be a superior pop band or 'pop prog' band. In some respects they paved the way for It Bites which was a nice radio friendly version of prog.
as a side note there was a short lived project between Geoff Downes and Greg Lake called 'Ride The Tiger'. Two tracks can be found on Greg Lake's compilation album ' From The Beginning'. That was quite interesting but never got off the ground sadly.
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Posted By: ProgBob
Date Posted: February 17 2012 at 16:58
I recall reading this sort of comment about Asia in other threads but I don't really agree. Firstly, Asia were still working in a rock idiom. The music was guitar based, had rock-style vocals and their image was rock. The fact that it was polished and commercial does not make it good pop. It was just crap rock. In fact it was AOR. Secondly, there is real pop music out there that has progressive elements (in the broadest sense) and which is far superior to anything that Asia ever did. You could go back to the Beatles for this, or contemporaries of Asia such as Kate Bush, Peter Gabriel, or XTC, or more recent bands such as Everything, Everything or Field Music. That to me is good progressive pop music; quite unlike the commercial second rate rock churned out by Asia. Forgive me if I sound overly critical, but I still remember the disappointment I felt when that album came out. I am the right age to have got heavily into Yes as a teenager in the early 80's just after they split following Drama. It was in many ways a depressing time to discover Yes and other prog as it was all so out of favour and there was no new music nor bands I could go to see. I remember being very excited when I first heard of Asia forming, only to have my hopes dashed when I first heard the album. ------------- Bob |
Posted By: rupert
Date Posted: February 17 2012 at 17:03
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I don't like the debut, but after Howe/Palmer/Wetton ( which are all great musicians, of course ) had left I think they produced some good albums - I've been to a concert of the John Payne-Era once and afterwards I talked to Geoff Downes saying "You're better than ever - please go on this way !" He thanked me kindly but did not take my advice  !------------- ...I'm a musician/singer/songwriter, visit me on www.reverbnation.com/rupertlenz and there you can choose from 125 recordings you can listen to ( for free ) if you're not limited to prog-rock ! |
Posted By: richardh
Date Posted: February 18 2012 at 02:56
Pop music and rock music can be the same thing its never been a case of 'never the twain shall meet'. Genesis and Yes often strayed into poppier areas and were not always grounded in epic symphonic prog even in the seventies.
Wetton made it clear that he had got fed up working with Eddie Jobson (although its good that UK have reformed ,well the 3 peice version anyway) and wanted to do shorter songs. Of course with Howe and Palmer in the band it was always going to have some rock edge to it.
I liked the Asia debut because it had some strong prog elements but after that they went for a radio friendly approach pretty much with every song. There is some comparision with the last two albums where Phoenix has some nice prog related stuff but Omega is just good solid songs but nothing 'prog' based.
AOR is a very broad vague term and failry meangless imo.
BTW I agree about Kate Bush and Peter Gabriel. Funny thing I was thinking about this yesterday. Gabriel's early solo albums are not really 'pop' in any sense. I remember he was genuinely surprised when Games WIthout Frontiers became a hit. It was a very cold political song but just happened to have a bit of a hook. I suppose what is 'pop' music is what people like but then to some extent music is forced on us by what the the record companies and radio stations decide should go. But that's a whole other discussion!
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Posted By: rogerthat
Date Posted: February 18 2012 at 03:24
| Quite inclined to agree with ProgBob. Let alone Kate Bush, the Asia debut is not imo as sophisticated as even Purple Rain or Synchronicity. It was decent AOR but then again Yes bettered them at that with 90125. Those vocal harmonies in Leave It showed Yes channeling their prog background in a pop/rock format whereas in Asia, all these prog musicians seemed to want to conform as far as possible to pop/rock. |
Posted By: richardh
Date Posted: February 18 2012 at 03:33
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Posted By: cstack3
Date Posted: February 19 2012 at 18:25
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Given that the founding members of this band all checked out, who was making the musical & personnel decisions??? The whole Asia thing reeked of "AOR formula" music, which was quite successful (in financial terms) for a while. I dunno, looks like this band was more of a corporate construct than true rock band driven by creative impulses of its members!
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Posted By: rogerthat
Date Posted: February 19 2012 at 22:31
John Wetton especially was very clear that he saw Asia as the vehicle to achieve the commercial success he could not get with King Crimson. I remember he said UK was a little better but it was the first Asia album that fulfilled his commercial aspirations. |
Posted By: Slartibartfast
Date Posted: February 20 2012 at 06:39
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I basically took the position that if a prog artist had paid their dues so to speak I wasn't going to begrudge them when they attempted to achieve commercial success, but I didn't need to be along for the ride. And it's always a pleasure when these guys realize that there is still a decent prog fan base still out there and a newer generation worth making prog for. ------------- Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...
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