Alex Lifeson Distortion
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Forum Name: Tech Talk
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URL: http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=81705
Printed Date: November 18 2024 at 00:21
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Topic: Alex Lifeson Distortion
Posted By: Fox On The Rocks
Subject: Alex Lifeson Distortion
Date Posted: October 03 2011 at 19:33
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Wasn't sure if this falled under Tech Talk or Musician's exchange but whatever. Anyways, Does anybody know what kind of distortion Alex used in the late 70's/early 80's (Farewell To Kings - Moving Pictures). He has probably my favourite guitar tone ever, along with Stephen Hacketts, and he's never really publicly discussed before. Was he just using his Amplifier distortion or did he have various pedals? I know he used Hiwatts and Marshalls along with a lot of Chorus. ------------- 
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Replies:
Posted By: Atavachron
Date Posted: October 03 2011 at 19:41
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Fox On The Rocks wrote:Posted By: clarkpegasus4001
Date Posted: October 04 2011 at 00:28
I was a big fan of Rush at the time. As far as I can remember he used an MXR Distortion+ and an MXR Micro Amp. ------------- Tony C. |
Posted By: Atavachron
Date Posted: October 04 2011 at 00:57
| ^ hmm, like Randy Rhoads.. great little box, used to have a buddy with one |
Posted By: clarkpegasus4001
Date Posted: October 04 2011 at 16:00
Yes that's right. I used to own both those pedals when I played guitar in 1981. I actually had another Distortion + pedal that I sold last year to a friend. The pedal apparently belonged to guitarist Robert Quine. I didn't know that when I bought it, I was told after I had already purchased it from the seller. I had never heard of him myself but I hear he was big on the "punk" scene? he had apparently passed away. I sold it because it wasn't getting used anymore and it "ate" batteries for some unknown reason! ------------- Tony C. |
Posted By: Fox On The Rocks
Date Posted: October 04 2011 at 21:56
Wow really? Would have never guessed. I've never really tried out any MXR's and I probably should since there so highly acclaimed and celebrated. I have a Boss DS-1 and you can sort of get some of Alex's tones but the overall sound of the pedal is not very appealing to me. For example on my guitar, Ibanez RG321MH  , if you switch to the neck pickup, turn your guitar tone a bit down and have the pedal tone eq at midway and have the distortion at about just after 3 qaurters, I get a really good Jacob's Ladder tone. Mind you, I have to feed it through some chorus too which I have a Electro Harmonix Small Clone and its a really nice pedal.-------------
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Posted By: Fox On The Rocks
Date Posted: October 04 2011 at 22:01
Ya Randy did use it on the first 2 Ozzy solo albums, I believe. Not fan of his tone though and the only thing I like about his guitar playing is that he's classically influenced and trained, but other than that he's just another metal guitarist.. Actually in fact I'm not a fan of an Ozzy music except for Black Sabbath (a bit). -------------
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Posted By: Atavachron
Date Posted: October 04 2011 at 22:28
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I suppose I can understand not being a fan of his tone, though it was one of the richest, heaviest in the history of rock (see a wildly unsuccessful thread I started on this subject; forum_posts.asp?TID=78681" rel="nofollow - http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=78681 -), but Rhoads was absolutely without any doubt not just another metal guitarist. He wasn't just 'classically influenced and trained', he was one of the finest guitar players in the world, and that's just his classical (which everyone and their gardener was waiting in line to learn)-- his rock playing made such a deep impact I don't even think many realize how deep it was. Particularly his approach to rhythm and songwriting was quite fresh and most of the metal that came after utilized his up/down patterns, taking the sense of swing in hard rock Jimmy Page and Tony Iommi had founded a step or two further. Not to mention his extraordinary taste, solos and fills, and musicalogic knowledge. Rhoads was a true master, unlike most of his peers who were happy to get by on warmed-over blues riffs and clichéd song structures. Further, Diary of a Madman is not only a brilliantly conceived album that set a standard so high it turned out to be impossible to match, but was one of the first progressive metal records. |
Posted By: Fox On The Rocks
Date Posted: October 06 2011 at 21:06
Quite the convincing argument Atavachron!  Your right, I was wrong to say that he was just a metal player because yes he was a highly influential player and had a lot of ecletic inluences, I'd say. I'm just not that keen to the metal approach of the guitar. Not a big fan of over the top distortion, shred all the time solos and cliche tapping. I just find that a lot of metal (especially nowdays) sounds all the same and lacks, originality, uniqueness and imagination.-------------
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Posted By: Fox On The Rocks
Date Posted: October 13 2011 at 19:05
I went on facebook and found this on Rush's page: http://www.premierguitar.com/Magazine/Issue/2011/Nov/GALLERY_Pro_Pedalboards_Volume_II.aspx?Page=21&#gallery" rel="nofollow - http://www.premierguitar.com/Magazine/Issue/2011/Nov/GALLERY_Pro_Pedalboards_Volume_II.aspx?Page=21&#gallery Alex's current pedalboard and effects setup. Never would have thought he used an Axe-FX  .
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Posted By: clarkpegasus4001
Date Posted: October 14 2011 at 00:09
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This tells all........ http://www.musictoyz.com/articles/chopalex.php Note; Moving Pictures tour he did indeed use an MXR Distortion + and an MXR Micro amp as i'd thought. ------------- Tony C. |
Posted By: Fox On The Rocks
Date Posted: October 14 2011 at 15:36
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Thank You clarkpegasus! So it turns out Alex only really used his Amp distortion and MXRs after all. -------------
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Posted By: clarkpegasus4001
Date Posted: October 14 2011 at 19:21
You are welcome!  ------------- Tony C. |
Posted By: digitalchemistry
Date Posted: November 21 2011 at 15:31
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You can imitate most of his tones with a combination of Chameleon/ Voodoo Valve preamps...I did when I was in a Rush tribute... Lifeson is God... LOL.. seriously...he taught me a great deal when I was just learning to play.... |
Posted By: Alberto Muñoz
Date Posted: March 24 2012 at 12:32
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A cracker Marshall and some phase shifter/delay i think...
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Posted By: Alberto Muñoz
Date Posted: March 24 2012 at 12:35
a nice and useful too! ------------- |
Posted By: Fox On The Rocks
Date Posted: March 26 2012 at 16:50
I don't think Lex was as big into Phasers as he was into chorus. I think there's some phaser on Cygnus X-1: Hemispheres and Permanent Waves tracks. Anymore to mention? In the 80's he was very big on chorus and delay and that kind of became his signature sound even though his signature playing was on earlier albums. Marshalls are awesome!  -------------
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Posted By: Fox On The Rocks
Date Posted: March 26 2012 at 16:53
I know, it's a great little box. So many different tones that you can get. Just a really big, shimmering chorus tone, and that's how I like it!  Do you have one?-------------
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Posted By: Alberto Muñoz
Date Posted: March 26 2012 at 16:56
Yes i have one of the nano series and many more of Electro Harmonix, those are responsible for my total lack of posting in forums  ------------- |
Posted By: Fox On The Rocks
Date Posted: March 26 2012 at 17:09
I have the regular non-Nano model. Is there a difference other than the mobility/portability and size? It's great to see another guitarist on this site with such a great taste in pedals.  I also have a Big Muff Pi, Small Stone Nano and Holy Grail reverb. Electro Harmonix is just awesome! My favourite pedal company, by far. I've tried many other pedals but there's something about EH tones that's so appealing. What kind of guitar do you have?-------------
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Posted By: Triceratopsoil
Date Posted: March 26 2012 at 17:16
| I always thought he used a Hiwatt more than a Marshall |
Posted By: Alberto Muñoz
Date Posted: March 26 2012 at 17:32
Well in quiet parts of Xanadu maybe is using a reverb or phase (i'm guessing). ------------- |
Posted By: Alberto Muñoz
Date Posted: March 26 2012 at 17:44
Yes, i like too the EH pedals, i have a Gibson SG cherry red and a orange type 15 watts amp, also i have the neo clone, the holy Grail, the analogizer, the big muff pi, the big muff with tone wicker and the little big muff, also i have the nano muff and the screaming bird. also i have other pedals Boss, MXR, BYOC, Dunlop, Modtone, Zoom, etc. ------------- |
Posted By: Fox On The Rocks
Date Posted: March 26 2012 at 18:11
He used Hiwatts in the 70's and early 80's and then I think he switched over to Marshalls in the 80's and 90's. Hughes and Kettner is what he mainly uses now. I wish I had the kind of money to afford a Hughes And Kettner.  Fantastic amps.-------------
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Posted By: clarkpegasus4001
Date Posted: March 26 2012 at 18:11
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I remember Alex had a lot of problems with his Marshall amps cutting out, and when I watched them at a later gig he had switched to Hiwatt amps. I also recall he used to duck down when flash bombs went off and he always seemed to snap a string! ha, those were the days!
------------- Tony C. |
Posted By: Fox On The Rocks
Date Posted: March 26 2012 at 18:20
Wow, you certainly have a great list of gear. Other pedals I have are the Boss DS-1, MXR Distortion III and Dunlop Wah. Orange amplification is another favourite of mine, as well. What does the tone wicker do, exactly? I was going to get that model but the regular Pi was cheaper. -------------
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Posted By: Fox On The Rocks
Date Posted: March 26 2012 at 18:23
Flash mobs!? What year was the gig?-------------
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Posted By: Alberto Muñoz
Date Posted: March 26 2012 at 18:28
i have 25+ effects i am a gear junkie! you can find me as mi old name (zafreth) in harmony central and ilove fuzz. currently i´m tracking a wilson wah, supposedly the best wah in this generation and try bypass. ------------- |
Posted By: AnchovyRun
Date Posted: March 26 2012 at 20:58
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Its pretty uncertain as to whether he used Hiwatts or Marshalls more during his early years but either choice ( And many others) would get you a tone similar to his. In my opinion, the biggest thing about his early tone is using as much power tube distortion as you can with preamp distortion as seasoning. The phaser was more prevalent on his earlier recordings. Just listen to Caress of Steel, its all over that and in 2112 and Fly By Night. The chorus came to the forefront with A farewell to kings and on wards. In conclusion, my Lifeson formula: -Less distortion than you think you would use -Phaser or chorus for arpeggiated chords -Little preamp distortion and more poweramp overdrive (Dependant upon your volume limitations) -Maybe some sort of boost pedal for solos and leads, generally with the "overdrive" control pretty low Hope it was helpful!  ------------- <>< The Anchovy Run ><> ------------------------------ Caravaning For Your Convenience |
Posted By: clarkpegasus4001
Date Posted: March 27 2012 at 10:39
Now you're asking! my memory for gigs is crap I went to so many back in the day, but it was probably around 1979, definitely late 70's. I've been trying to remember what track it was when he used to snap his string but I just can't recall it at the moment. The first time I watched Rush was on June 3rd 1977 at Birmingham Odeon with Stray supporting and it wasn't at that gig. I think the next one I attended was in 1979. If I remember i'll let you know! Talking of Electro Harmonix effects (i'm a fan as well), here's my old Electric Mistress Flanger  Tony C. ------------- Tony C. |
Posted By: Fox On The Rocks
Date Posted: March 27 2012 at 15:17
Aw Yes! I forgot about Caress Of Steel. The Phaser is all over that album. Was it phaser Alex was using in the Discovery section of 2112? I am certain he was using it on Grand Finale and Overture for sure. Thanks for your formula. My Lifeson tone is very similar to that, but I think I slap on a bit too much distortion. I'll be sure to turn the knobs down a bit, next time I'm playing.-------------
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Posted By: Fox On The Rocks
Date Posted: March 27 2012 at 15:31
Beauty! What year is that reissue, do you know? The newest ones are silver and black.That's incredible that you got to see Rush back in their golden days. I've only seen them once at The Air Canada Centre in Toronto for the 2010 Time Machine Tour. Man, was it a great setlist. They played all of Moving Pictures, of course, and they did some stuff off of Permanent Waves, Hemispheres, Hold Your Fire, Counterparts to even some new stuff off on Clockwork Angels and Snakes And Arrows. -------------
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Posted By: clarkpegasus4001
Date Posted: March 27 2012 at 15:57
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Reissue? no sir mine is an original one from about 1978 I believe. I know someone who had an even earlier one which was blue/red but it was not working, but mine is fully operational. I was very lucky to watch Rush a few times. The first time was1977 as I have stated before. I missed Farewell To Kings I think but I watched them on Hemispheres, Permanent Waves, and Moving Pictures tours, I can't remember after that. I met them afterwards after that first gig (their first UK tour) and got the autographs on the back of the tour program which I later sold in 1981 to my best mate when I was out of work and broke. My mate subsequently sold it on, something i'll always regret doing. I had a lot of autographs then, Van Halen Pat Travers, Budgie stuff. I still have Gary Moore's when he was with Coliseum 2 (all of the bands autographs) Mel Galley and Dave Holland from Trapeze autographs on You Are The Music album and Starcastle's first album signed by all amongst others. I went off Rush in the 80's but they were unbeatable in the 70's. Here's some more old gear for you. Here is my 1975 Rickenbacker 4001 and my 1974 Fender Jazz bass.  ------------- Tony C. |
Posted By: Fox On The Rocks
Date Posted: March 28 2012 at 15:54
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I love that Rick! If I ever get a Bass, it's going to be a Rickenbacker. Did you get these guitars back in the day, or are they a recent purchase? That's unbelievable that you met the guys after the gig! What did they say!? Sorry to hear about your situation at the time, along with the autographs - unfortunate. Favourite Rush album? Sorry for all the questions. -------------
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Posted By: clarkpegasus4001
Date Posted: March 28 2012 at 18:45
Hi, no problem! I love talking about gear I'll try to cut it short though, so as not to bore others who might read this! My mate and I went to see Rush on 3rd June 1977 at Birmingham Odeon UK. They were supported by a band called Stray. Afterwards we went to the side of the building in the hope of meeting them which we did, and there were quite a few folk milling around with the same idea. We were in awe of them of course, they were our heroes and I was16 years old at the time. Luckily I had bought a program and they duly signed it on the back. We didn't hold any conversations as such but I put my arm on Geddy's back and thanked him. he just turned and smiled. Geddy and Alex seemed to do the talking and Neil seemed a bit quiet, but they were really nice guys as I recall. When they left, they were sat to the rear and side of the coach and they were waving to us as they departed. Of course we were thrilled as you'd expect. My memory of the set list is vague i'm afraid but i'm sure they played everything from the All The World's A Stage plus Necromancer which was a suprise. 2112 was the current studio album at the time but I think it was probably billed as All The Worlds A Stage tour. My fave Rush album? probably Moving Pictures but I used to love All The Worlds A Stage which I played to death at the time but I like them all up to 1981 really. My Rickenbacker bass was bought in 2005 I got it from a guy in North Carolina in the USA from Craigslist. My Fender was bought just last month from a guy in St. Albans in the UK. They are both original and come with the covers which i've removed. My EH pedal was bought about 4 years ago. I had another one same colour which was identical but my car was broken into and my gig bag was stolen which had all my leads and my pedal in it.  I was very lucky to find another one in better condition than the one stolen!Thanks for your questions ------------- Tony C. |
Posted By: Fox On The Rocks
Date Posted: March 28 2012 at 19:03
If I'm correct, Rush didn't come to England till after 2112 was released, is that true? So that must mean that you saw the guys on their very first UK tour, probably? I don't know if that's right, I heard that on The Beyond The Lighted Stage documentary. I look up to all of three of those guys. They are my idols and they influence not only by their music, but also who they are as people. Neil has always been sort of a reserved, shy guy, so I'm not surprised he said that much, but I can also relate to that. That's just phenomenal that you got to meet them and you were the same age then as I am now! I would be freaking out just as much as you if I had the privilege to meet the guys! How many people were at the show? Were they wearing their Japanese silk kimonos? Classic.My favourite Rush albums: Permanent Waves and Hemispheres. -------------
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Posted By: clarkpegasus4001
Date Posted: March 29 2012 at 08:25
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[/QUOTE] If I'm correct, Rush didn't come to England till after 2112 was released, is that true? So that must mean that you saw the guys on their very first UK tour, probably? I don't know if that's right, I heard that on The Beyond The Lighted Stage documentary. I look up to all of three of those guys. They are my idols and they influence not only by their music, but also who they are as people. Neil has always been sort of a reserved, shy guy, so I'm not surprised he said that much, but I can also relate to that. That's just phenomenal that you got to meet them and you were the same age then as I am now! I would be freaking out just as much as you if I had the privilege to meet the guys! How many people were at the show? Were they wearing their Japanese silk kimonos? Classic.My favourite Rush albums: Permanent Waves and Hemispheres. [/QUOTE] June 1, 1977 City Hall Sheffield, England (Stray) June 2, 1977 Free Trade Hall Manchester, England June 3, 1977 Birmingham
Odeon Birmingham, England (Stray) (the one we were at) June 4, 1977 Hammersmith Odeon London, England (Stray) June 8, 1977 Gota Lejon Stockholm, Sweden June 11, 1977 Newcastle City Hall Newcastle, England June 12, 1977 The Apollo Glasgow, Scotland June 13, 1977 Liverpool Empire Liverpool, England Yes it was their first UK tour. It was actually my second ever gig. I had watched a band called Automatic Fine Tuning before, I think it was about November 1976. The Birmingham gig was packed. They always seemed to sell out every where. I can easily understand why they are your heroes, they were certainly mine for a while. Geddy Lee has certainly had some influence in the the way I play bass. I can also understand your choice of albums they are both excellent. At that time my fave bands were Rush, Max Webster, Pat Travers (all Canadian) I was very lucky to watch so many great bands around the late 70's. I was lucky enough to see Rush a few times the last being 1981. I can't recall seeing them after that but my best mate saw them on Roll The Bones tour. You are taking me back to some wonderful memories now ya know! ------------- Tony C. |
Posted By: Fox On The Rocks
Date Posted: March 29 2012 at 18:46
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I've grown up with all those Canadian bands - Rush, Max Webster, Saga,
FM,Triumph. All bands that originate from where I live, Toronto. For
years, me and my dad have listened to this radio station called Q107
Classic Rock (probably the biggest classic rock station in Canada), that
is native to Toronto and all four of those bands are frequently played
on the channel. I'm surprised you know Max Webster. They never made it
that big outside of Canada, really, but Kim Mitchell's solo career has
gotten some international recognition, mostly due to "Go For A Soda". Love that tune. If you haven't listened to FM, listen to this: -------------
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Posted By: clarkpegasus4001
Date Posted: March 30 2012 at 00:13
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You'd be suprised! I have ALL of Max Webster's albums still on vinyl and a Million Vacations on CD. I also have Kim Mitchell's first album which was a mini album with 5 songs on it, which is brill. My mate had Kim's solo stuff. I also have Max Webster live on video from about 1980 and a Kim Mitchell concert. I watched Max Webster a couple of times supporting Rush. I am a big fan of Kim's playing I think he's a wonderful guitarist and Dave Myles was a great bass player IMO. All the guy's I knew back in the day liked Max Webster in fact some thought they were better than Rush when we saw them both at Birmingham Odeon. It was sad that when they were going to tour here as an head-line act, they had to cancel because of poor ticket sales. I have not heard FM before but you mention Rush and Max Webster, Saga, (I like them as well), and Triumph, (not a band I really cared for) but again my mate had loads of their albums and he saw them live. May I also mention Wireless, Touch, and Frank Marino and Mahogany Rush in the Canadian mix along with Pat Travers of course. There's been some top bands from your country.....Uzeb, there's another one! You and your dad have great taste obviously! i'll see if i can get that station on my phone. Edit: just been on the stations website.....very cool!By the way, kind of  but did you know that Alex Lifeson was known for using an Electro Harmonix Electric Mistress? http://www.woodytone.com/2009/07/23/alex-lifesons-permanent-waves-gear/Anyway, might as well go for soda !  ------------- Tony C. |
Posted By: Fox On The Rocks
Date Posted: March 30 2012 at 22:32
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Ah, a Gibson Howard Roberts Fusion was what Alex was using on the Exit...Stage Left dvd. I've always wondered what kind of guitar it was. I always thought it was a Les Paul with a modified, custom body, but then I saw the F-hole. I love that guitar, but my favourite guitar Lerxst used was his signature Gibson ES-335 with the natural/tan finish. The tone is phenomenal and it looks great! Wow, I didn't know he used an Electric Mistress on Spirit Of The Radio?! I thought it was a Boss. Do you know one any other Rush songs that feature the Electric Mistress as a prominent guitar effect? Kim has actually worked for Q107 as a radio host/DJ since 2004. You can listen to his show between 2-5, Eastern Time. A friend of mine actually used to live just down the street from him when he was living in Mississauga, Ontario (suburb of Toronto), about 5 years back. Very jealous! I love Kim's guitar playing. Extremely unique and melodic. Check out his stuff on In The Context Of The Moon. Very modal and captivating. What's your favourite Max Webster or Kim Mitchell tune?-------------
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Posted By: clarkpegasus4001
Date Posted: March 31 2012 at 06:45
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My fave Max Webster tracks? well Context Of the Moon is a great track, Here Among The Cats and Lily are another good one's, but my faves are Paradise Skies and The Party. Kim Mitchell solo stuff? I really like Kids In Action, Miss Demeanor and Chain Of Events from the mini album, (his first solo album). Here is a brilliant version of Max Webster's The Party with the original line- up (reunion) with Mike Tilka on bass. I think sums up just how good he really is on guitar! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a3RJnmTwjck I can't find Chain of Events on Youtube but here is Kids In Action and Miss Demeanor: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YtkoBxuSWBU http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4qv7SW8k2dY Alex mainly used his Gibson Les Paul when I first watched them. I read an interview with him he stated it took him a couple of year to get used to playing that guitar! As you said, he also later purchased a Gibson Howard Roberts Fusion. He also used a Gibson SG double neck in white finish and a 335 and a gorgeous white Gibson 355 which is the guitar I think you might be referring to? (it might look natural under lights). He later used a black Strat. I'm not sure what other songs he used an EH EM flanger on but I suspect it would have been on many tracks, it certainly sounds like one on Spirit Of Radio. I was watching the Kim Mitchell guitar lessons on that radio station last night, he has a great sense of humour as well as being an incredibly good guitarist. Here is some footage of Max Webster from that video I have from 1980: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B2EibD7eElc&feature=relmfu ------------- Tony C. |
Posted By: Fox On The Rocks
Date Posted: March 31 2012 at 11:11
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Christ, the band's on fire here! Watkinson and Kim, especially. Is it
just me? Or do you ever sense that Kim and Max Webster got a lot of
influence from Frank Zappa. The way Kim sings, the humorous lyrics and
musicianship of the band just reminds me of Zappa for some reason. If I
ever meet him someday, which is quite possible, I'm going ask him that.
Do you know what kind of modes and scales Kim's using on that song?
Dorian and Phrygian, I think. Watkinson's using Ionian and Mixolydian,
maybe? I might have to work on my theory . Check out this tune Kim plays: Really beautiful playing, I wish Kim made this into an official track on one of his albums. -------------
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Posted By: clarkpegasus4001
Date Posted: March 31 2012 at 12:38
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Although I can play quite a few things on bass and some guitar riff's etc.....I actually play by ear only, so I can't help you there. Is there a way of sending Kim an email? maybe via the radio station he's on? That is a pretty tune he has going on there. Yes I personally think he is influenced by Zappa and probably The Beatles and maybe The Kinks given his compositions.......ask him. I'm sure he'll respond. Somebody once said to me after a gig (when I was playing in a Wishbone Ash tribute band), "hey that was great, do you do tab"? my reply was, "tab? yes I have two, I use them for hearing"! ------------- Tony C. |
Posted By: Fox On The Rocks
Date Posted: March 31 2012 at 19:54
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Well, I've been taking guitar lessons for 4 years and piano for 2
years. Personally, I'm not the best at theory and I just result to tab
for guitar, as well. Let's face it, it's easier and more efficient. The
problem is, a lot of Prog is really hard to tab and thus you can't
really find that many tabs, or good tabs for bands like Yes, Genesis,
Gentle Giant, The Mahavishnu Orchestra, etc. There's obviously a bunch
of Rush and Floyd roaming around the internet. I can figure out stuff by
ear, but only if it's something more simpler like a Pearl Jam tune or a
Stones song. I suppose I could figure out Rush by ear if I really
tried. I attempted at Jacob's Ladder, about a year ago, and I got the
whole thing pretty accurately, I think. The solo and the odd timed riffs
were the trickiest of course. If you can get Q107 over in England, definitely tune in. They have a hilarious morning program called Derringer In The Morning. Kim's show always has special guests like Roger Hodgson (Supertramp), Slash, Bachman Tuner Overdrive and much more. Also, there is an all day show on Sunday called Psychedelic Sunday. They play only songs between the years 65-75 on that day. Yes and Genesis show up "once every blue moon". This is absolutely hilarious! -------------
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Posted By: clarkpegasus4001
Date Posted: April 02 2012 at 13:50
That was funny!  Also interesting is the acoustic clip. I have a 1977 Takamine acoustic which is a dead-ringer copy of a Guild acoustic just like Roger is using! except mine is a 6 string. It's actually for sale as I don't use it, here: By the way I have just sent Kim Mitchel an email via Q107 website, I hope it reaches him. I have also got Q107 Toronto on my phone now thanks to you so I can listen to Kim's show.....nice one! ------------- Tony C. |
Posted By: Negoba
Date Posted: April 02 2012 at 14:10
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I've been playing guitar for about 25 years now and every time this kind of subject comes up, I have to make a few comments.
I remember trying to dial in various favorite tones and it never really sounding like the player I was trying to emulate. Sounding like xxxx is so much more about your fingers, your pick attack, the way you clip or sustain notes than it is your rig. Obviously you have to get the basics in terms of overall kind of distortion, pickups, etc, but you're not going to dial in Alex. It's about ears and hands.
I was a massive Randy Rhoads fan and love his live tone from Tribute, which was probably somewhat altered for that record off the board tracks, I'm guessing. I was much less a fan of his studio tone. I give Rhoads the credit from expanding the standard of hard rock beyond pentatonic ideas. I lot of his stuff seems simple now, especially for prog heads, but he's the one that made rock bigger than loud blues to some extent. And clappies for turning down the distortion. Fizzy tone drives me crazy. And it's not what makes alot of our favorite classic tones. ------------- You are quite a fine person, and I am very fond of you. But you are only quite a little fellow, in a wide world, after all. |
Posted By: Fox On The Rocks
Date Posted: April 02 2012 at 18:30
No problem. When did you get that guitar? It has a very nice finish. So, Takamine copied an already existing Guild model? Takamine's a pretty big guitar company, does Guild know about this? It's not like a cheap guitar brand rips off a Gibson or Fender model, they can get away with that easily.What was the question you asked Kim? (If you don't mind me asking )-------------
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Posted By: Fox On The Rocks
Date Posted: April 02 2012 at 18:40
I'm not a big fan of "over the top" distortion myself. Randy is a great player. Highly influential to guitarists and he contributed heavily to Metal and Hard Rock, as you said. I'm not the biggest fan of either his guitar playing or Ozzy's solo work, to be quite honest, but I acknowledge his influence and legacy. Were you referring to Randy not using that much distortion? Alex never used that much either and that's one of the things I like about his tone. I think from not using too much distortion, he managed to get all those shimmering arpeggios out of his guitar and all those big, atmospheric chords. Also, from what you said about Alex, . -------------
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Posted By: clarkpegasus4001
Date Posted: April 03 2012 at 00:33
Takamine made some high quality Guild rip-offs in the late 70's and other companies from Japan such as Ibanez were doing the same, ripping off the likes of Fender and Gibson. The guitars produced then are commonly known as "lawsuit" guitars although there was never an "actual" lawsuit bought against these companies, they threatened it so the copyists backed down somewhat. The model I have is a Takamine F-390S made in November 1977 and it's a pretty rare model, as they didn't produce many of them. Mine also has a pick up built in the bridge, you plug a lead in at the bottom strap button, very cunning! and then you use your amp to set the tone as the guitar has no tone controls. There is a battery hidden inside the guitar. So technically it's an electro/acoustic, but i've only used it for it's natural acoustic sound. I bought it last year from Texas USA for recording purposes, but an old mate of mine wants it and I am selling it because I simply don't play it, which is a waste. It will probably be sold at the end of this week actually. The same mate bought an old 1970's Electro Harmonix Clone Theory chorus pedal from me a couple of weeks ago, again because it wasn't getting used. At least I know they will be in safe hands, he's had a few things from me. I asked Kim for a request actually, so keep listening! ------------- Tony C. |
Posted By: Fox On The Rocks
Date Posted: April 03 2012 at 21:23
Was it something by Budgie or Wishbone Ash? I can guarantee you that they've probably never played anything by those two bands in the history of the station. That would definitely be a surprise for Kim, the Q107 crew and listeners! If they were going to play any of those two bands, it would probably be on Psychedelic Sunday, if any day. I've actually never gotten into Wishbone Ash. I've seen a famous performance of them at the BBC in 1974, I think? I don't what song it was, but I'm pretty sure it was an instrumental and the dude was rocking the bass! Any albums you could recommend? How would you describe them?Great to hear that your gear isn't going to collect dust in your basement! -------------
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Posted By: clarkpegasus4001
Date Posted: April 04 2012 at 01:07
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No nothing by either of them, if I tell you it will ruin the suprise! Wishbone Ash were really the first band to use twin harmony guitars. They influenced many bands such as Thin Lizzy. Argus from 1973 was a worldwide selling album and put them on the world map selling millions and a firm fave with many WA fans. Funnily enough it's not my fave. I prefer the mid/ late 70's stuff the "Laurie Wisefield" era WA's second guitarist (he became guitarist for Tina Turner after WA). My fave albums are New England and There's The Rub, although I do have a fondness for the 1st album. I like Just Testing album also and saw them on that tour. After that album original bassist Martin Turner left. I personally don't think they have been the same since. He formed his own version of WA in 2005 the same year my tribute band formed. WA are still going with just guitarist Andy Powell from the early days but the music is different to my ears. I watched them live for the first time in 1978 which was No Smoke Without Fire Tour. Here's some samples of their stuff I dunno if you will like it or not: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7zYCkysupUo http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IVunNDAz6sk&feature=relmfu http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sD6OWWxt6h8 I am also partial to the track Handy from the 1st album which is a long track that features bass solo's, we used to play that live. I suspect Kim Mitchell has heard of both WA and Budgie. My mate says he is buying my acoustic on Friday. I am also trying to sell my bass amp and cab. ------------- Tony C. |
Posted By: Negoba
Date Posted: April 04 2012 at 09:35
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I love Lifeson's tone especially during the middle classic period. He's got a big sustain, thick textured tone. His suspended chords add alot to the bigger rhythm presence. Back in my rock band days "Limelight" was one of my favorite songs to play as a guitarist. That solo is relatively simple but so tasty. ------------- You are quite a fine person, and I am very fond of you. But you are only quite a little fellow, in a wide world, after all. |
Posted By: clarkpegasus4001
Date Posted: April 04 2012 at 10:01
I love Limelight too. ------------- Tony C. |
Posted By: Fox On The Rocks
Date Posted: April 04 2012 at 21:08
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I assume they had a big impact on Iron Maiden as well, seeing as the
guys from Maiden are know for their twin guitar sound and must have
drawn influence from Wishbone Ash. I just searched up the BBC
performance I was talking about and this is it: Jazzy drums and great, bluesy guitar work! Which bands are their biggest influences? Zeppelin must be one of them. Any Prog influences? Yes, maybe? -------------
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Posted By: Fox On The Rocks
Date Posted: April 04 2012 at 21:50
One of Lerxt's best! He creates an incredible atmosphere and mood with that solo. I couldn't imagine Limelight with any other solo other than that. It perfectly fits the tone and concept of the song. What I really find interesting about Limelight, and I get this from one of Ged's interviews, is that the verses and the choruses of the song contradict moods. The verses are upbeat and display the happiness of fame, while the choruses and solo show the sadness/cons, or something along the lines of that. Guys like Petrucci and Adam Jones owe a lot to Alex for their playing styles.-------------
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Posted By: clarkpegasus4001
Date Posted: April 05 2012 at 00:21
Yeah Rush do that a lot, night and shade in their songs, slow, then up tempo. Another of my fave songs by them which has that pattern, and a song i've always had a soft spot for is Lakeside Park. Up tempo verse, slow tempo chorus, and mellow bridge. ------------- Tony C. |
Posted By: clarkpegasus4001
Date Posted: April 05 2012 at 00:42
Iron Maiden were influenced by Wishbone Ash alright, but they were more heavily influenced by Judas Priest and Budgie. Iron Maiden and Judas Priest both supported Budgie back in the day believe it or not! Priest used to support Budgie in the mid 70's, Maiden sometime later. Both bands went massive, Budgie? well that's another story!The track on Youtube is Vas Dis which was an unusual one for Wishbone Ash because they didn't write it themselves like they did with just about everything else. It is the opening track from the second album Pilgrimage. I really like that one, because i love the jazz feel and it's different I guess. I did learn it on bass but our band never played it live, only jammed it not long before we split up. Martin Turner is using a black Rickenbacker which got broke on an aircraft, so he started calling them "girl's basses"  but it didn't stop him asking to borrow mine when he re-made Argus (Argus Through The Looking Glass) with his band Martin Turner's Wishbone Ash did it? He has a modified black Rickenbacker 4000 now with an added "toaster" neck pick up, girls bass indeed! ha!  I'll be seeing Martin Turner's Wishbone Ash live in a few days actually. ------------- Tony C. |
Posted By: Fox On The Rocks
Date Posted: April 05 2012 at 23:11
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Lakeside Park is a great tune. It gets played on Q a lot. If you are
referring to the ending of the song as the bridge (which I'm pretty sure
it is), it's one the most beautiful things that Alex has created. Those
suspended chords, add 9ths and arpeggios are classic, indisputable
Lifeson riffs. It leaves such a warm, happy, but also a bit melancholic
mood - I guess to show the nostalgia within the lyrics. Classic Lifeson
solo, as well. That's actually sort of ironic. The fact that those two bands were opening for Budgie, but in a couple years would begin to sell out stadiums and become Metal gods. Gee, poor Budgie.So, you've met Martin Turner and he asked you if he could use your Bass for a remaster? That's unbelievable! How did you guys come into contact with each other? Mutual friends? Was he at one of your shows? Girl's basses! Let's give that title to Gibson basses instead!  Have a great time at the show.-------------
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Posted By: clarkpegasus4001
Date Posted: April 06 2012 at 01:01
What happened was, our Wishbone Ash tribute band called Phoenix Rising formed in 2005 the same year Martin started his version of Wishbone Ash. They did a "warm up" gig in November 2005 at a small club in Measham, Derbyshire (not too far from where I live) so our band went along to watch them, and they were excellent, we were blown away to be honest. We got talking to the band after the gig. I got on really well with the (now ex-drummer) Rob Hewins and we became good friends after that. We, of course, mentioned that we had set up a tribute band etc....... One afternoon I got a call from someone saying it was Martin Turner and could he speak to me, I thought it was some sort of joke at first as you would. So I asked how he got my number and he got it from Rob, so it really was him! He said he was in the recording studio's in Milton Keynes (not too far from London) and he wanted to re-record Argus with his new band and call it Argus Through The Looking Glass. He said to me "I hear you have got an old Rickenbacker 4001?" He said he needed one to recreate the sound he got at the time of the original Argus recording back in 1972, so he asked if could he borrow mine.
Not a problem. So I met up with (now ex-guitarist) Keith Buck and he
took it and bought it back a few days later. Martin then rang me a week
or so later to ask if he could borrow it again because there was a
recording "blip" on the track "Blowin' Free" so he borrowed it again for
a couple of days. Except for the intro part on the opening track "Time Was" which is like a couple of harmonic notes, the rest of the album is my bass. That's why there is a thanks to me (Tony Clark) on the inner sleeve notes, there is also a thanks to me on one of the two live albums the band also did. I became friends with the band, but mainly Rob and current guitarist Ray Hatfield in particular. I've watched the band over a dozen times or more, but not since Feb 2010. I've watched Rob and Ray in other projects, solo gigs etc.......as well, and Ray was even kind enough to come around to my place and put some guitar solo's on a project I started doing. After we watched them in 2005, our band played our first ever gig just 2 months later Jan 2006, Rob and Ray turned up! we were gobsmacked that two such wonderful musicians would even bother to watch us, but they did. I hadn't been in a band for 25 years , as if i wasn't nervous enough!
They came to see us again some time after. At another gig, Keith Buck
and his girlfriend came to watch us. Unfortunately Martin lives the
other side of the country so he never did get to see us. Our band split
up after a couple of years, but i'd rather not say why on an open forum.------------- Tony C. |
Posted By: Fox On The Rocks
Date Posted: April 06 2012 at 15:33
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That's just phenomenal! You are so lucky Tony. That project you were referring to, are you still working on it or is it something of the past? Also, I read somewhere that John Wetton was a member of Wishbone Ash for sometime.
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Posted By: clarkpegasus4001
Date Posted: April 06 2012 at 19:04
Lucky? yes sometimes, sometimes not! Another nice little story for you is my current band In For The Kill (Budgie tribute) decided to do a gig for Budgie fans (called Bando Bash after the fan forum website and budgie cd Bandolier). We invited a band called Anubis to open for us. This was to be their very first gig. Anubis are a band formed by ex-Budgie guitarist Simon Lees, he played on their last studio album. We asked Simon if he would like to join us on stage after our set which he duly did! So we got to jam with him which was very cool . He sang and played the solo to a song called "I Turned To Stone" We did not rehearse it, it was the first time (and last) we had met, but it was great fun! It is on Youtube somewhere. Yes I started doing my own recording project, writing and playing my own material. It's rock, not prog, it's kind of Budgie, "riff" based 70's classic rock in style I guess. It's unfinished as it needs vocals, backing vocals and in some cases....some lyrics! because i'm not happy with some of them. Rob Hewins ex-MTWA drummer is an excellent engineer so I hope he will re-mix it and make it listenable if I can persuade him, I've done it on a laptop using Cubase recording software and very simple equipment, as i've never recorded anything before. It really needs some work, I dunno if i'll ever get it done. I have had a friend do a cd cover for it (he has done 3 Martin Turner's Wishbone Ash cd covers) and I have thought up a title for it. I'll reveal all IF I ever get it done.John Wetton did join Wishbone Ash yes, he's on the Number The Brave album, he came in after Martin Turner left, but he did not last long. ------------- Tony C. |
Posted By: Fox On The Rocks
Date Posted: April 06 2012 at 20:33
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Is this it? It has no sound for some reason. I've checked some of your videos out on your website and you guys are great! Tony, you have an awesome voice! You haven't played any gigs outside of England, have you? How long have you known your other band members for? You got a great guitar player and drummer.Here's my guitar teacher/ friend's Rush tribute band called Middletown Dreams: They got together about a year ago and have gotten a few gigs in my greater Toronto area city, Hamilton. They play Rush material from all of their eras - everything from Cygnus X-1, to YYZ and The Pass. My guitar teacher is a fantastic guitar player. I haven't gotten together with him for about 5 months now because he moved to a different area of the city that is less convenient for me to get to. I had been taking lessons with him for 3 years prior. I should really contact him sometime soon. We both share a fair amount of mutual musical interests like Genesis, Rush, Yes, Dream Theater, Pink Floyd, The Mahavishnu Orchestra, Return To Forever, Led Zeppelin, etc. -------------
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Posted By: clarkpegasus4001
Date Posted: April 07 2012 at 07:57
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Yeah that's the video with Simon Lees playing. The sound is ok I can't understand why you can't hear it? Simon is a mega guitar player playing in Anubis and solo projects. He's also a guitar teacher, there's lots of video's of him playing his "one man show" stuff on the web. John Shaw, the drummer in that video was one of the guitar players in what became Phoenix Rising (Wishbone Ash tribute) I met him in 2005. He had came to my place to buy some gear I was selling. It was he who asked me to go for a jam. They needed a bass player so I borrowed John's bass for the jam because I hadn't got one and I had only played a VERY limited amount of bass up until this point, because I was a 6 string rhythm player, playing in the home for fun They had been playing just a couple of WA tracks for months! We just jammed the WA track Blind Eye and I was asked to join instantly! with no bass, and no knowledge on how to play the bl**dy stuff! It was my idea to form a WA tribute band because we all liked them and we didn't think there were any WA tributes around at that time but there turned out to be 4! I then went and bought my Rickenbacker bass from the States. I had never played any WA stuff on bass before although i've been a fan for years, so I had to learn very quickly! It turned out both guitarists had the talent to play WA stuff. John had only been playing drums for about 8 months prior to that video, he had no lessons either, he's an amazing talent really and quite an accomplished guitarist as well. Unfortunately he left In For The kill in the summer last year after he lost his dad to an heart attack and it affected John quite badly. He has since resumed playing guitar again, playing in a local covers band. He was replaced by James Baxter who also plays in Russ's Black Sabbath tribute band (Sack sabbath). and teaches drums, mainly to youngsters. Russell Saxton i've known only since he joined us in 2008. Another great little story there! John was going to be the guitarist in IFTK. We couldn't find a drummer so he decided he would do it (he said he'd always wanted to have a go at drumming anyway) and we would try to find a guitarist because good drummers are hard to find and there seemed to be more guitar players around. On the very day he bought his kit, Russ was teaching in the very same shop upstairs. John knew of Russ because he lived locally, and he asked him if he would like to play guitar for us. Russ is in a Black Sabbath tribute so he said he didn't have much time, but he asked John what music we were playing and he said Budgie. Russ said YES!! I LOVE Budgie, he's been a big Budgie fan for years, so he came to rehearsals the following day and joined straight away. We were gigging about 6 months later. Russ plays in Sack Sabbath, IFTK and an acoustic duo playing Led Zep stuff, he's also a guitar teacher, a busy man then! Thanks for your comments regarding my vocals, however I hate the sound of my voice which is the main reason why i've not finished my recording project! Your friends Rush tribute band are awesome! They are such a difficult band to copy.May I humbly suggest that you continue with some lessons. I am self taught but that makes me somewhat limited. Good luck! ------------- Tony C. |
Posted By: Fox On The Rocks
Date Posted: April 08 2012 at 13:41
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Thanks Tony Hope you have a great time at the WA show, and if you already went, I hope you had a good time. Have you guys ever considered covering Rush? Or is it only, strictly Budgie and Wishbone Ash?
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Posted By: clarkpegasus4001
Date Posted: April 08 2012 at 14:09
Thanks! I will go and see Martin Turner's Wishbone Ash on 21st April which is the day after our next gig in my home city, Nottingham (should be fun)! The last time we played there, George Lynch from the band Dokken (now Lynch Mob) walked in and spoke to me, I didn't even recognise him! His band were playing at Rock City, a large venue nearby, the following day after our gig. His band Lynch Mob was headlining "Firefest" which Rock City have every year with loads of bands on. Mind you he has changed a lot in appearance since I saw Dokken support AC/DC in the mid 1980's.It's been a while since i've watched MTWA so no doubt i'll have a good chat with him (and the band). In For The kill is strictly a BUDGIE tribute band so no we won't play any covers...not even Rush! That said i've been thinking of doing a second band playing covers but that's just a thought and not yet reality. I've been listening to some Q107 radio yesterday and today, you are right it is a good station. too many adverts though! By the way you have a PM so please check your messages. ------------- Tony C. |
Posted By: Fathergolem
Date Posted: April 17 2012 at 17:23
I think the guitar sound of Moving Pictures does not come from a Marshall. I have a Marshall 1959 Superlead and, in my opinion, is not the kind of sound that amp makes. Maybe with an overdrive, but really I think it's not a Marshall. Of course, Marshall amps are awesome. I like Plexis, JCM800 and JTM60 combo, but having to choose between Marshall and Mesa Boogie... I prefer Mesa. |
Posted By: clarkpegasus4001
Date Posted: April 18 2012 at 06:52
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Here you are guy's, not Alex but a couple of nice Geddy Lee interviews that I found this morning on the Basschat forum that i'm on talking about his bass tone: http://basschat.co.uk/topic/173867-geddy-lee-on-his-tone-and-playing/ ------------- Tony C. |
Posted By: Berserker
Date Posted: July 12 2012 at 13:18
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If anyone is interested in Guitar or bass sounds from "Rush" to Grace Under Pressure" and you just can't find the info anywhere I'd love to help you find your sounds...
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Posted By: kludge
Date Posted: August 15 2012 at 23:43
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I love the Grace Under Pressure sounds. But when I think of Lifeson's tone from that era, I think a lot more of his use of chorus/flange and reverb than I do his distortion. Then again, I tend to attribute that sort of tonal control to picking hand dynamics and technique, rather than gear. Give Alex Lifeson any random guitar, amp, distortion, and chorus/reverb, and he'll sound EXACTLY like Alex Lifeson. The only time his gear choice has really struck me was when I saw them on tour a couple of years ago. He was of course blowing through a whole bunch of guitars onstage. I went to get a drink, and suddenly his tone SNAPPED to my attention. It was the white Gibson ES-345. When I think classic Lifeson tone, I think of that guitar, more than any particular amp/effects. ------------- Why doesn't the Earth fall? How can you walk upon it? It's the music. It's the music of the Earth, and the Sun, and the Stars. It's the music of yourself, vibrating. -Sun Ra |