I am curious what do you prefer overall, if Genesis from 1977 till end or Gabriel´s solo.

me:

1977 - Peter Gabriel 1 vs Wind and Wuthering - WW is better

1978 - Peter Gabriel II vs And Then there were three - PG II is better

1980 - PG III vs Duke - PG 3 is better

1982/83 - PG IV vs Genesis - PG IV without doubt

1986 - So vs Invisible Touch - So is better

1991/92 - Us vs We cant dance - Us is better

and Wilson´s era

1997/2002 - Up vs Calling All stations - Up is better :)

6:1 for Gabe :-)))) and you ?

I prefer Genesis actually to the majority of PG's solo output, I like his 70's output, but I don't like his worldbeat stuff.  I actually like Invisible Touch minus a few tracks, I think there is a good 30 minutes of good material there.

Peter Gabriel's music gets a bit dull in my opinion, but his lyrics are always great.

1976 "A trick of the Tail" was a surprise. Even their live outfit showed more than great! There could be real Genesis after PG. But I´m afraid that only lasted one more year. In my opinion punk killed Genesis as we knew it. To me Genesis vanished in 1978.

On the other hand PG was entering new paths and territories. The album match versus Genesis for the 1977-1992 period is clear. PG - Genesis: 7 - 0 

Oh Rael, we are the Lamia of the pool...

The last Genesys album that was realy good was W&W but and then there were 3 and duke was at least nice pop music. After that I lost any interest with that band.

On the other hand, Gabriel went to duferent teritories with some great songs in the 3 first solo albums (III was his best IMO) and a beat dull and popy in his 4th album. But from So I lost interest with him too. He started to be more interested of falling to the croud then in music.

So I would say after PG left, Genesys made 2 good albums and 2 not bad albums and then lot of crap and PG did 3 good album, 1 not bad and then crap. A little advantage to PG but more than that a good era for other musicians (Peter Hamil made some good music those days for example) that we should pay attention to instead of asking ourselfes who fell harder !

yes, i prefer all albums of gabriel when collins still is genesis....

gabriel is a god

collins is a rat

omri:PG IV is not popy album , african rhytms etc.

Try to listen UP, it is absolute different, SO and US were maybe more commercial, but UP is dark, great album.

The Letter M wrote: I actually like the output during Collins' time as singer. Sure, ATTW3 wasn't that proggy, but Duke and Abacab are pretty good albums, IMO, esepcially Duke. The Genesis album, as well as IT and WCD have good moments, especially the epics, and some of their better hits like Mama, Tonight and No Son Of Mine. CAS is a pretty good album too, and it's a shame the instrumentals were left off the album, especially 7/8. The super-prog side of me adores the Gabriel-Era, but the other half of my musical tastes appreciates what the band did after Hackett left as well. Duke and ATOTT are fastly becoming a favorites of mine, behind SEBTP and The Lamb, so it rather obvious that I like either era of Genesis! -Marc.

I agree - Duke is my favorite album of the 1980's - so fresh and energetic, but still with a prog attitude.

The last really good Genesis album was Wind and Wuthering. After that, And Then There Were 3 and Duke were okay, and then they sucked.

FOREVER

And as for PG, he did some pretty good stuff. It blew away 80s Genesis.

I vote PG.  I have heard 1, 4, So, and I have the Growing Up DVD.  A Trick of the Tail beats all of these IMHO, but the following Genesis albums weren't as good.  I love WAW and ATTWT, but I don't find them as good as Peter's solo stuff.

Edit: I find every Genesis album after ATTWT awful!

Gabriel=

Collins= (Most of the time)  sh*tty pop singer

Rob The Plant wrote: BaldFriede wrote: With the release of "And Then There Were Three" Genesis were no longer bearable. The first slo works of Gabriel were ok, but with "So" he slipped badly. anyone who negatively reviews "So" clearly hasn't given it a chance, or is judgeing from the narrow view of a prog fanatic. It's a different genre, and the best in it's genre. "So" is brilliant. Truth is Gabriel Doesn't have a bad album, and he's a better singer now than in the Genesis days. Genesis has god stuff all the way up to "invisible touch", but "Abacab", and "Genesis" are as filled with crap as they are with pretty good music. Personally I'd say the only of the post Gabriel Genesis albums that top any Gabriel era woudl be "Trick of the Tail", which I prefer only to "Trespass". Check out "Seconds Out", proof that Collins simply is inferior as a vocalist to Gabriel. Not to mention a bit of a tool to ruin great songs with adding randomly "Now".

yes, Collins does annoying repeat words infintely live.

however I think both are VERY strong singers, in different ways.  Collins, due to his awful pop is extremely underrated.  The truth is he has a much smoother and stronger voice than Gabriel, and it can be very enjoyable when given the right material.  Check out his rendition of "In the Cage" on Three Sides Live.  Better than Gabriel!

but 'tis all opinion!

Oh God... I have to save GENESIS here...

The only album ok by PG was his first. And I have the "Plays Live" only like a postum work cause I'm a GENESIS fan...

And WW is one of the best works I ever heard (maybe because was my first GENESIS LP)...

And the only bad disc by GENESIS is Abacab... Well, Calling All Stations is very weak... but is better than actual PG outputs.

And I don't like the fact that PG deny his glorious days with GENESIS. Did you ever heard him sing his classic prog tunes of Gen days in his solo career ??? When he cames to Brazil, he invited Milton Nascimento to the stage, and when they were singing a song together Milton started to sing "We've got to get in to get out"...  What did Mr. Gabriel ? He leaved the stage leting Milton alone with the band !!! This is a disrespect with the other colleague and with the band that made he famous... And he re-recorded "Carpet Crawlers" with the band only for the money...

Well, that's why I don't like PG after GENESIS...

herbie53 wrote: Oh God... I have to save GENESIS here... The only album ok by PG was his first. And I have the "Plays Live" only like a postum work cause I'm a GENESIS fan... And WW is one of the best works I ever heard (maybe because was my first GENESIS LP)... And the only bad disc by GENESIS is Abacab... Well, Calling All Stations is very weak... but is better than actual PG outputs. And I don't like the fact that PG deny his glorious days with GENESIS. Did you ever heard him sing his classic prog tunes of Gen days in his solo career ??? When he cames to Brazil, he invited Milton Nascimento to the stage, and when they were singing a song together Milton started to sing "We've got to get in to get out"...  What did Mr. Gabriel ? He leaved the stage leting Milton alone with the band !!! This is a disrespect with the other colleague and with the band that made he famous... And he re-recorded "Carpet Crawlers" with the band only for the money... Well, that's why I don't like PG after GENESIS...

i dont think they made much money of it.

and yes I wish he would respect his prog-roots.

Man, Collins was a FANSTASTIC drummer with the Gabriel era Genesis....he really shines on the Foxtrot LP, really jazzy stuff that drove Banks and the band.....when Gabriel left, Collins started getting more into composition, lyrics and fronting the band....and his "sound" really suffered.....I don't remember too many groovy Collins licks after the Wind LP......just sterile and sythesized.

Yeah, Gabriel's solo stuff has its merits, but I think his first two LPs are overrated and suffer from poor production....still, without Gabriel's magic, Hackett's musical ideas, and Collins' impeccable drumming, Banks is left to his own devices....and that spells trouble!

Arsillus wrote: The last really good Genesis album was Wind and Wuthering. After that, And Then There Were 3 and Duke were okay, and then they sucked. FOREVER And as for PG, he did some pretty good stuff. It blew away 80s Genesis.

Indeed. And I agree with others that So is a great album. In fact, all regular PG solo albums (1-4, So, Us, Up) rate at least 4 stars. Wind and Wuthering is the last Genesis album that does so. IMHO of course.

yes, Collins does annoying repeat words infintely live.

however I think both are VERY strong singers, in different ways.  Collins, due to his awful pop is extremely underrated.  The truth is he has a much smoother and stronger voice than Gabriel, and it can be very enjoyable when given the right material.  Check out his rendition of "In the Cage" on Three Sides Live.  Better than Gabriel!

but 'tis all opinion!

Although Collins may have given a better technical performance in terms of vocals, he lacked the emotion and dramatism that made Gabriel a great live performer. Try to search a bootleg of a show of The lamb tour and listen to "in the cage". Gabriel sounds dramatic , desperate, trapped, etc.

Titan wrote :

omri:PG IV is not popy album , african rhytms etc.

Try to listen UP, it is absolute different, SO and US were maybe more commercial, but UP is dark, great album.

I said a beat popy & dull . I know the album and he continues with the african rythms that's right. I feel that the melodies were less nice or interesting and went to simplicity. I'm not blaming PG in becoming a pop singer at this one (I save that claim to sleadge hammer - that's pop crap IMO).

Up I do not know and perhaps I should listen to it. The problem with loosing interest is that an artist can do later a good album and you would'nt notice. No such problem with Genesys cause they became very popular and it was on the radio a lot so I know I did'nt miss a thing.

I like everything they done up to and including Duke, after that they were mostly awful, although there were good tracks here and there IMO. I dont think the best of either era is any better than the other. Just different, and in answer to the question I think Collins era Genesis is better than Gabriels solo output overall.

BiGi wrote: It seems to me that the real focal point of this thread is "Phil Collins SUCKS!" and this implies that post-Gabriel Genesis suck as well! I disagree about the first statement, and though I fail to see a cause-effect relatioship between these two statements, I must say that I disagree also with the second! I like both Peter and Phil, and even though I personally prefer Peter, that does not mean the other sucks! Peter is more theatrical, more intense if you wish, while Phil has a straighter, in-the-face approach: two different ways of singing and proposing themselves to the audience! As for the compositions, I think they were able to reinvent themselves in relation to the modifications of the music ambience throughout the eighties! And come on, do you really think pieces like Dodo, Mama, Home by the Sea, Domino, No son of mine and Fading lights are CRAP???? Ok, they also produced blatant pop songs which I in the first place cannot bear (for instance, No reply at all, In too deep, Throwing it all away, Hold on my heart and the like), but that does not mean Genesis' eighties production deserves to be discarded as a whole!

 Exactly!

Mategra wrote: BiGi wrote: It seems to me that the real focal point of this thread is "Phil Collins SUCKS!" and this implies that post-Gabriel Genesis suck as well! I disagree about the first statement, and though I fail to see a cause-effect relatioship between these two statements, I must say that I disagree also with the second! I like both Peter and Phil, and even though I personally prefer Peter, that does not mean the other sucks! Peter is more theatrical, more intense if you wish, while Phil has a straighter, in-the-face approach: two different ways of singing and proposing themselves to the audience! As for the compositions, I think they were able to reinvent themselves in relation to the modifications of the music ambience throughout the eighties! And come on, do you really think pieces like Dodo, Mama, Home by the Sea, Domino, No son of mine and Fading lights are CRAP???? Ok, they also produced blatant pop songs which I in the first place cannot bear (for instance, No reply at all, In too deep, Throwing it all away, Hold on my heart and the like), but that does not mean Genesis' eighties production deserves to be discarded as a whole!  Exactly!

 *while listening to DUKE*