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Why Iron Maiden is better than DT

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Topic: Why Iron Maiden is better than DT
Posted By: Lindsay Lohan
Subject: Why Iron Maiden is better than DT
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 05:50

1.They got a better vocalist.

2.They are better at making flawless timechanges.

3.Their guitarists have more melodic solos.

4.They sound more symphonic.

5.They have some of the best and most original sounding riffs in metal history. (Supposedly because of steve is composing on bass.)

6.They invented the best rhytmic sections in the world. (The gallopping thing.)

7.The coolest bass sound on earth.

8.Better lyrics.

9.They dont make sentimental ballads.

10.They are much better live.




Replies:
Posted By: undefinability
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 06:01

I had thought we were running a little low on Dream Theater threads (i.e., hate reasoning, comparisons, and/or praise).

Thanks for supplying us with yet another tremendous topic, and I disagree with all of your reasons except numbers four and six.



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"Don't listen to me."

[IMG]http://www.freewebs.com/shahath/shadowid.jpg">


Posted By: tuxon
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 06:08
who's IM

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I'm always almost unlucky _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ Id5ZcnjXSZaSMFMC Id5LM2q2jfqz3YxT


Posted By: henri_ds
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 06:14
Originally posted by tuxon tuxon wrote:

who's IM


+1

who are they


Posted By: MorgothSunshine
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 06:17
HIM ???  

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For every truth even the contrary is true...


Posted By: GrahamK
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 06:29
Iron Maiden...at least I think thats who he means...


Posted By: Tony R
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 06:42
Originally posted by maidenrulez maidenrulez wrote:

1.They got a better vocalist.

2.They are better at making flawless timechanges.

3.Their guitarists have more melodic solos.

4.They sound more symphonic.

5.They have some of the best and most original sounding riffs in metal history. (Supposedly because of steve is composing on bass.)

6.They invented the best rhytmic sections in the world. (The gallopping thing.)

7.The coolest bass sound on earth.

8.Better lyrics.

9.They dont make sentimental ballads.

10.They are much better live.

Jeezus Tap-Dancing Kerrrissst!

I'm just off to douse myself in petrol and end this miserable existence........



Posted By: undefinability
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 06:49

Originally posted by GrahamK GrahamK wrote:

Iron Maiden...at least I think thats who he means...

. . . that's who I thought, too.



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"Don't listen to me."

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Posted By: sideways
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 08:31
Originally posted by maidenrulez maidenrulez wrote:

1.They got a better vocalist. More melodic yes. Labrie is MUCH better live

2.They are better at making flawless timechanges. Ahhh......not even close, not even the same
                                                                                League

3.Their guitarists have more melodic solos. Agreed, but Adrian and Dave feed off each other,
                                                                    Only one Petrucci

4.They sound more symphonic.  Need your deffinition of "Symphonic"  and a couple
                                                  comparrisons to comment

5.They have some of the best and most original sounding riffs in metal history. (Supposedly because of steve is composing on bass.) Deffinatly some classic Riffs, agreed....some of the
                                                               best metal riffs around,  DT isn't metal though, at least
                                                              in the 80's traditional sense

6.They invented the best rhytmic sections in the world. (The gallopping thing.) Agreed...again
                                                                                                                         the Smith-Murray
                                                                                                                         connection

7.The coolest bass sound on earth. For speed yeah....the pattended machine gun Bass
                                                       For diversity and skil? Myung has Harris beat hands down

8.Better lyrics.  Subjective, I probably like Maidens lyrics better because they are RL story
                        Driven

9.They dont make sentimental ballads.  Because they're a Metal band

10.They are much better live.  Ahhh...ya saved the best for last.  I've seen Maiden 3 times,
                                               Piece of Mind, Powerslave, 7th son.  I've seen DT 4 times,
                                               twice "An Evening with".  DT is IMHO,  hands down, not even
                                               close, the best live band I've ever seen. Technically better
                                               Musicians by far than Maiden.



Was A Maiden fan long before DT hit the scene....that being said.......I would categorize them totally seperatly.  Maiden is more mainstream radio friendly Metal.  DT is more progressive Hard rock, with splashes of metal.  Both great bands in their respective sub-genre's


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"Who would wish this on our people?..And proclaim that his will be done" Sacrificed Sons - Dream Theater


Posted By: transend
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 08:40

Oh no...not another DT bashing thread....

AM SO (yawning) BORED OF THIS sh*t ON THIS SITE

Can we get off DT for one bloody second everyone??

PLEASE FOR THE LOVE OF GOD



Posted By: gabbel ratchett
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 08:53
this is even dumber than the animals vs octavarium thread

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dead things don't talk too well, they've got a shaky sense of diction.


Posted By: Lindsay Lohan
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 08:58

 Just could not resist....ah well sorry but i compared IRON MAIDEN to the artist DT not dream theater.

DREADFUL ARTIST REALLY



Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 09:27
Originally posted by maidenrulez maidenrulez wrote:

6.They invented the best rhytmic sections in the world. (The gallopping thing.)

Heart: Barracuda.

THEY invented that!



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Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 09:41

Originally posted by maidenrulez maidenrulez wrote:

1.They got a better vocalist.

He has a more variable voice and a little more edge to it ... but LaBrie is no slouch.

Originally posted by maidenrulez maidenrulez wrote:

2.They are better at making flawless timechanges.

Ridiculous. They play far less complicated music than DT. And what flaws in DT's playing are you talking about ... I've been at many concerts and they NEVER made any mistakes as far as timechanges are concerned.

Originally posted by maidenrulez maidenrulez wrote:

3.Their guitarists have more melodic solos.

Also not true. Both have melodic solos. You can choose 10 IM songs without melodic solos, as well as 10 melodic DT songs.

Originally posted by maidenrulez maidenrulez wrote:

4.They sound more symphonic.

Rubbish. When do IM ever sound symphonic? Blind Guardian sound symphonic (classical), Spock's Beard sound symphonic (as in symphonic prog). IM sound more metal, that's all.

Originally posted by maidenrulez maidenrulez wrote:

5.They have some of the best and most original sounding riffs in metal history. (Supposedly because of steve is composing on bass.)

Agreed. But so do DT, and bands like Symphony X surpass both when it comes to great riffs.

Originally posted by maidenrulez maidenrulez wrote:

6.They invented the best rhytmic sections in the world. (The gallopping thing.)

That rhythm is as old as music itself. Listen to Am I Evil (Original or the Metallica version) ... the riff from the fast part is amazing. Or listen to Master Of Puppets (the song).

If there's a thing that IM are famous for, then it's their 2 guitar rhythmic work, e.g. Aces High. And the riff from Number Of The Beast is a classic, too. But they're clearly not THE band that invented riffing.

Originally posted by maidenrulez maidenrulez wrote:

7.The coolest bass sound on earth.

It's quite nice, but again ... easily argueable. This one clearly is a matter of taste.

Originally posted by maidenrulez maidenrulez wrote:

8.Better lyrics.

Maybe ... certainly different. They're more direct.

Originally posted by maidenrulez maidenrulez wrote:

9.They dont make sentimental ballads.

Yes ... that's a negative thing, isn't it? It clearly shows that DT are more diverse. Bruce Dickinson made a number of ballads, just not with Iron Maiden. And I recently read an interview where he indirectly complains about the rigid song writing process of IM. I highly recommend his newest solo record!

Originally posted by maidenrulez maidenrulez wrote:

10.They are much better live.

You may be right ... for musicians, DT are better. For the average metal fan, DT are boring - at least the 3 hour sets they normaly play.

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Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 09:45

Originally posted by gabbel ratchett gabbel ratchett wrote:

this is even dumber than the animals vs octavarium thread

Agreed ... and why does he still have Octavarium as his avatar while at the same time bashing them whenever there's a chance? 



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Posted By: Velvetclown
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 09:49


-------------
Billy Connolly
Dream Theater
Terry Gilliam
Hagen Quartet
Jethro Tull
Mike Keneally


Posted By: Prog_Bassist
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 09:49
Iron Maiden = the suck. 

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Posted By: Velvetclown
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 09:53
Big Time. 

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Billy Connolly
Dream Theater
Terry Gilliam
Hagen Quartet
Jethro Tull
Mike Keneally


Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 09:57
Iron Maiden are IMHO one of the 10 best metal bands of all times.

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Posted By: Velvetclown
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 10:11
Yes but not ProgMetal.

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Billy Connolly
Dream Theater
Terry Gilliam
Hagen Quartet
Jethro Tull
Mike Keneally


Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 10:12

Originally posted by Velvetclown Velvetclown wrote:

Yes but not ProgMetal.

Do you have to be that blunt?



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Posted By: Velvetclown
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 10:13
Sorry  

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Billy Connolly
Dream Theater
Terry Gilliam
Hagen Quartet
Jethro Tull
Mike Keneally


Posted By: Lindsay Lohan
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 10:14
Ah well anybody heard about DT anyways?


Posted By: Velvetclown
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 10:17
NOPE ????

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Billy Connolly
Dream Theater
Terry Gilliam
Hagen Quartet
Jethro Tull
Mike Keneally


Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 10:17

Originally posted by maidenrulez maidenrulez wrote:

Ah well anybody heard about DT anyways?

Heard what?



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Posted By: Velvetclown
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 10:18
I´m hard of hearing....You have to SHOUT !!!!!!!!!!

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Billy Connolly
Dream Theater
Terry Gilliam
Hagen Quartet
Jethro Tull
Mike Keneally


Posted By: Bowzo
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 10:27

I see.... Well, I like Dream Theater much more than Iron Maiden, and find most of the songs I've heard by them to be repetitive at times. But I haven';t heard much. But I do like Hallowed Be Thy Name. And think Cradle of Filth shouldn't have covered it.



Posted By: alan_pfeifer
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 12:34
Originally posted by MikeEnRegalia MikeEnRegalia wrote:

Originally posted by maidenrulez maidenrulez wrote:

6.They invented the best rhytmic sections in the world. (The gallopping thing.)

Heart: Barracuda.

THEY invented that!

 

I thought Zeppelin invented the gallop with Achillies Last Stand?



Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 12:36
Originally posted by alan_pfeifer alan_pfeifer wrote:

Originally posted by MikeEnRegalia MikeEnRegalia wrote:

Originally posted by maidenrulez maidenrulez wrote:

6.They invented the best rhytmic sections in the world. (The gallopping thing.)

Heart: Barracuda.

THEY invented that!

I thought Zeppelin invented the gallop with Achillies Last Stand?

Damn! But I already said in another post that it's as old as music itself anyway, so who cares about WHO did it first? I don't.



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Posted By: alan_pfeifer
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 12:46
Good point.


Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 12:53
But Iron Maiden invented the idea of their drummer telling funny stories about the band on the singles' b sides ... he really has a talent for comedy

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Posted By: Garion81
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 12:55
Originally posted by MikeEnRegalia MikeEnRegalia wrote:

Originally posted by maidenrulez maidenrulez wrote:


6.They invented the best rhytmic sections in the world. (The gallopping thing.)



Heart: Barracuda.


THEY invented that!



No Kansas did Circa Leftoverature 1976. and no I din't read your other post. One lame thread is enough this morning.

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"What are you going to do when that damn thing rusts?"


Posted By: philippe
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 12:57
this subject should be moved to "non prog music..."

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Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 13:00

Originally posted by philippe philippe wrote:

this subject should be moved to "non prog music..."

It will be moved there soon enough. BTW: any more useful comments about my signature?



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Posted By: philippe
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 13:01
check what I've said to the relative subject (Do you think that prog is crap?) and you will have the answer

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Posted By: tuxon
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 13:02

^^ I haven't heard any of the mentioned albums, and only know one of the mentioned bands

what am I doing on this forum



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I'm always almost unlucky _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ Id5ZcnjXSZaSMFMC Id5LM2q2jfqz3YxT


Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 13:06
Originally posted by Garion81 Garion81 wrote:

Originally posted by MikeEnRegalia MikeEnRegalia wrote:

Originally posted by maidenrulez maidenrulez wrote:


6.They invented the best rhytmic sections in the world. (The gallopping thing.)



Heart: Barracuda.


THEY invented that!



No Kansas did Circa Leftoverature 1976. and no I din't read your other post. One lame thread is enough this morning.

Barracuda was published in 1977, that's a close shave!



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Posted By: Hammill
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 13:17
how can someone compare a classic heavy metal band with a prog metal band? 

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Posted By: floydaholic
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 13:19
Dream Theater is way better instrumentally than iron maiden and thats a given. maiden has a better singer in bruce dickinson. In terms of who writes better songs it depends on your tastes. maidens are more metal than dream theater. dream theater actually has some touching emotional songs with pretty good lyrics. and dream theaters albums oveall are more conceptual than maiden. i prefer concept to regular anyday. and the complexity or dream theaters music is evident in their epic songs and instrumentals

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I'll see you on the Darkside of the moon...


Posted By: HeirToRuin
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 13:34
The best thing for maidenrulez to do is...

Do not listen to Dream Theater.

Is it that complicated??  I don't like Linkin Park so I don't listen to them.


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L.i.E. - http://www.reverbnati


Posted By: The Miracle
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 13:36

1.They got a better vocalist.

2.They are better at making flawless timechanges.

3.Their guitarists have more melodic solos.

4.They sound more symphonic.

5.They have some of the best and most original sounding riffs in metal history. (Supposedly because of steve is composing on bass.)

6.They invented the best rhytmic sections in the world. (The gallopping thing.)maybe

7.The coolest bass sound on earth.

8.Better lyrics.

9.They dont make sentimental ballads.maybe

10.They are much better live.

 



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Posted By: DarHobo
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 14:46
"Yeah, there are guitarists out there that are super fast, like
John Petrucci, but they are also super lame."
                                                                    - Alexi Laiho

haha I just read that in an issue of guitar world, its so true.


Posted By: Tony R
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 14:51

Originally posted by DarHobo DarHobo wrote:

"Yeah, there are guitarists out there that are super fast, like
John Petrucci, but they are also super lame."
                                                                    - Alexi Laiho

haha I just read that in an issue of guitar world, its so true.

because Alexi Laiho is the arbiter of taste for the music whole world is he...........?



Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 15:16
Originally posted by Tony R Tony R wrote:

Originally posted by DarHobo DarHobo wrote:

"Yeah, there are guitarists out there that are super fast, like
John Petrucci, but they are also super lame."
                                                                    - Alexi Laiho

haha I just read that in an issue of guitar world, its so true.

because Alexi Laiho is the arbiter of taste for the music whole world is he...........?

Children Of Bodom aren't exactly the foremost address for innovative guitar work.



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Posted By: alan_pfeifer
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 15:49
Originally posted by MikeEnRegalia MikeEnRegalia wrote:

Originally posted by Garion81 Garion81 wrote:

Originally posted by MikeEnRegalia MikeEnRegalia wrote:

Originally posted by maidenrulez maidenrulez wrote:


6.They invented the best rhytmic sections in the world. (The gallopping thing.)



Heart: Barracuda.


THEY invented that!



No Kansas did Circa Leftoverature 1976. and no I din't read your other post. One lame thread is enough this morning.

Barracuda was published in 1977, that's a close shave!

It was Zeppelin who "invented" the groove with Achillies Last Stand.  But read the man's comments, really. 



Posted By: Lindsay Lohan
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 15:49

blah i have been talking about the band that is called DT and not dream theater...isnt that plainly obvious.

I dont know who gave you that idea that i was talking about dream theater.



Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 15:54
Who the .... is DT then?

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Posted By: Lindsay Lohan
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 15:58

DT is a bit unknown rock band wich released a really crappy album...heres is the cover:



Posted By: Tony R
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 15:59

Originally posted by MikeEnRegalia MikeEnRegalia wrote:

Who the .... is DT then?

Mike,I dont like your new avatar-that top is very distasteful,please remove it!



Posted By: Tony R
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 16:00
Originally posted by maidenrulez maidenrulez wrote:

DT is a bit unknown rock band wich released a really crappy album...heres is the cover:

Bet it's lots better than Octavarium...



Posted By: Certif1ed
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 16:12
Originally posted by Tony R Tony R wrote:

Originally posted by MikeEnRegalia MikeEnRegalia wrote:

Who the .... is DT then?

Mike,I dont like your new avatar-that top is very distasteful,please remove it!

I agree - it reminds me of a Bon Jovi album cover...



Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 16:13
Originally posted by Certif1ed Certif1ed wrote:

Originally posted by Tony R Tony R wrote:

Originally posted by MikeEnRegalia MikeEnRegalia wrote:

Who the .... is DT then?

Mike,I dont like your new avatar-that top is very distasteful,please remove it!

I agree - it reminds me of a Bon Jovi album cover...

You all don't know that cover, do you?



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Posted By: hdfisch
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 18:05

I agree partly on these points.Though #1 refers as well to Metallica and some other Metal bands.#9 is correct but some diversity would not harm to IM's music (actually I like much of their stuff,as well Dickinson solo).#10 I agree as well partly, might be correct seen by a Heavy Metal fan, but for a ProgMetal fan DT is better live, at least when Mr. LaBrie has a good day!LOL

Actually I don't get the point at all how someone can have the idea to create such a thread. To compare two bands that are obviously that much different from each other is absolutely ridiculous and is just proving that the person doing such a comparison has absolutely no idea about music.

IRON MAIDEN IS AN EXCELLENT HEAVY METAL BAND and

DREAM THEATER IS AN EXCELLENT PROG METAL BAND!

Got it, MaidenRulez?And please stop posting such stupid threads! (Or go to a pure Metal forum!)

Originally posted by maidenrulez maidenrulez wrote:

1.They got a better vocalist.

9.They dont make sentimental ballads.

10.They are much better live.



Posted By: DarHobo
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 18:24
Originally posted by Tony R Tony R wrote:

Originally posted by DarHobo DarHobo wrote:

"Yeah, there are guitarists out there that are super fast, like
John Petrucci, but they are also super lame."
                                                                    - Alexi Laiho

haha I just read that in an issue of guitar world, its so true.

because Alexi Laiho is the arbiter of taste for the music whole world is he...........?

 

No, because he stated his opinion which I find to be True.  Being a guitarist myself I prefer musicians like Steve Hillage and David Gilmour to John Petrucci, with his gameboyesque shredding, and 14 year old fanbase who are so amazed "OmG JoHN PetrUCCI PlaYs LyKE 12npS!!!111111."  At least other shredders like Michael Romeo dont overly wank with a lame alternate picked line for 12 measures.



Posted By: DarHobo
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 18:25
Originally posted by MikeEnRegalia MikeEnRegalia wrote:

Originally posted by Tony R Tony R wrote:

Originally posted by DarHobo DarHobo wrote:

"Yeah, there are guitarists out there that are super fast, like
John Petrucci, but they are also super lame."
                                                                    - Alexi Laiho

haha I just read that in an issue of guitar world, its so true.

because Alexi Laiho is the arbiter of taste for the music whole world is he...........?

Children Of Bodom aren't exactly the foremost address for innovative guitar work.

True, but they rock oh so much harder then Dream Theater ever can and will.



Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 18:33
Originally posted by DarHobo DarHobo wrote:

Originally posted by MikeEnRegalia MikeEnRegalia wrote:

Originally posted by Tony R Tony R wrote:

Originally posted by DarHobo DarHobo wrote:

"Yeah, there are guitarists out there that are super fast, like
John Petrucci, but they are also super lame."
                                                                    - Alexi Laiho

haha I just read that in an issue of guitar world, its so true.

because Alexi Laiho is the arbiter of taste for the music whole world is he...........?

Children Of Bodom aren't exactly the foremost address for innovative guitar work.

True, but they rock oh so much harder then Dream Theater ever can and will.

And Strapping Young Lad rock even harder than every other band I know, including Children Of Bodom. That doesn't change the fact that their guitarist is nothing special.



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Posted By: DarHobo
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 18:44
Originally posted by MikeEnRegalia MikeEnRegalia wrote:

Originally posted by DarHobo DarHobo wrote:

Originally posted by MikeEnRegalia MikeEnRegalia wrote:

Originally posted by Tony R Tony R wrote:

Originally posted by DarHobo DarHobo wrote:

"Yeah, there are guitarists out there that are super fast, like
John Petrucci, but they are also super lame."
                                                                    - Alexi Laiho

haha I just read that in an issue of guitar world, its so true.

because Alexi Laiho is the arbiter of taste for the music whole world is he...........?

Children Of Bodom aren't exactly the foremost address for innovative guitar work.

True, but they rock oh so much harder then Dream Theater ever can and will.

And Strapping Young Lad rock even harder than every other band I know, including Children Of Bodom. That doesn't change the fact that their guitarist is nothing special.

Cryptopsy are even harder rocking then Strapping Young Lad  And John Petrucci still produces dull guitar lines similar to a pinball machine after you obtain a highscore.



Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 18:50
Originally posted by DarHobo DarHobo wrote:

Originally posted by MikeEnRegalia MikeEnRegalia wrote:

Originally posted by DarHobo DarHobo wrote:

Originally posted by MikeEnRegalia MikeEnRegalia wrote:

Originally posted by Tony R Tony R wrote:

Originally posted by DarHobo DarHobo wrote:

"Yeah, there are guitarists out there that are super fast, like
John Petrucci, but they are also super lame."
                                                                    - Alexi Laiho

haha I just read that in an issue of guitar world, its so true.

because Alexi Laiho is the arbiter of taste for the music whole world is he...........?

Children Of Bodom aren't exactly the foremost address for innovative guitar work.

True, but they rock oh so much harder then Dream Theater ever can and will.

And Strapping Young Lad rock even harder than every other band I know, including Children Of Bodom. That doesn't change the fact that their guitarist is nothing special.

Cryptopsy are even harder rocking then Strapping Young Lad  And John Petrucci still produces dull guitar lines similar to a pinball machine after you obtain a highscore.

Go ask a musician whom you trust whether Petrucci plays dull guitar lines. Let me know what he said ...



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Posted By: DarHobo
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 19:05
Originally posted by MikeEnRegalia MikeEnRegalia wrote:

Originally posted by DarHobo DarHobo wrote:

Originally posted by MikeEnRegalia MikeEnRegalia wrote:

Originally posted by DarHobo DarHobo wrote:

Originally posted by MikeEnRegalia MikeEnRegalia wrote:

Originally posted by Tony R Tony R wrote:

Originally posted by DarHobo DarHobo wrote:

"Yeah, there are guitarists out there that are super fast, like
John Petrucci, but they are also super lame."
                                                                    - Alexi Laiho

haha I just read that in an issue of guitar world, its so true.

because Alexi Laiho is the arbiter of taste for the music whole world is he...........?

Children Of Bodom aren't exactly the foremost address for innovative guitar work.

True, but they rock oh so much harder then Dream Theater ever can and will.

And Strapping Young Lad rock even harder than every other band I know, including Children Of Bodom. That doesn't change the fact that their guitarist is nothing special.

Cryptopsy are even harder rocking then Strapping Young Lad  And John Petrucci still produces dull guitar lines similar to a pinball machine after you obtain a highscore.

Go ask a musician whom you trust whether Petrucci plays dull guitar lines. Let me know what he said ...

John Petrucci is, at best, a good player. The thing is, as a 'technical' guitar player, he is probably the most overrated player ever! He isn't that good of a shredder, period. And this comes from a big DT fan who would defend him to death just a few months ago...

Besides, he stepped on his own tail and tried to pull out stuff that's way harder than what he can play! His performance on the new Dream Theater DVD is very dissapointing. He messed up on just about every 'shred' section on all of his songs! And his clean solos on Solitary Shell and Hollow Years... well, besides hitting the wrong notes a lot, his string action is so stupidly low that his clean tone is terrible! I could hear nothing but fret buzz... a shame. He's way too sloppy for what he tries to play.

I have to say he's a alright songwriter, though. But he should have taken a Valium a long time ago and not try to give Michael Angelo a run for his money, cuz it didn't work...



Posted By: greenback
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 19:05
Originally posted by maidenrulez maidenrulez wrote:

1.They got a better vocalist. FALSE!!

2.They are better at making flawless timechanges. FALSE!

3.Their guitarists have more melodic solos. TRUE!

4.They sound more symphonic. NONE OF THE 2  SOUND SYMPHONIC!

5.They have some of the best and most original sounding riffs in metal history. (Supposedly because of steve is composing on bass.) TRUE!

6.They invented the best rhytmic sections in the world. (The gallopping thing.) MAYBE!

7.The coolest bass sound on earth. TRUE!

8.Better lyrics. I DON'T CARE, BUT TRUE PROBABLY BECAUSE DICKINSON HAS A HISTORY DEGREE!

9.They dont make sentimental ballads. THIS DOES NOT MAKE THEM BETTER!

10.They are much better live. DUNNO!

SHALL I ADD: DT MAKE SLOWER MUSIC BUT MORE PROGRESSIVE & COMPLEX PATTERNS



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Posted By: GrahamK
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 19:11

YOu know the snobbery on here is quite funny...

"OH NOES JOHN PETRUCIC IZ TEH SUXORS!!!"

Dream Theater might not be the worlds best prog band but they have 8 more albums in the cd stores than you.



Posted By: Snow Dog
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 19:15
Actually Greenback, Dickinson wrote only a few songs for IM

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Posted By: DarHobo
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 19:22
Originally posted by GrahamK GrahamK wrote:

YOu know the snobbery on here is quite funny...

"OH NOES JOHN PETRUCIC IZ TEH SUXORS!!!"

Dream Theater might not be the worlds best prog band but they have 8 more albums in the cd stores than you.

"OH n03S!!1111oneone J0hn Petrucc1 is t3h sux0rz h3 me5535 up EveryTh1nG Liv3 i'vee s33n him LyKe 3 TymES!!!1111 StOp TrYin To Be MicHaEL AnGelo Batio 5t00pid j0hn petrruciis"



Posted By: HeirToRuin
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 19:51
Originally posted by DarHobo DarHobo wrote:

"Yeah, there are guitarists out there that are super fast, like
John Petrucci, but they are also super lame."
                    &nbs p;          &n bsp;                     &nbs p;          &n bsp;    - Alexi Laiho

haha I just read that in an issue of guitar world, its so true.



Alexi Laiho is a coke head and also said in that same interview that an energetic performance is better than playing your songs correctly. 

In other words, his excuse for f**king up so much during performances is that he is so "high energy."

Have you listened to Children of Bodom??  Can you say Maiden ripoff done poorly?


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Posted By: DarHobo
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 20:14

Originally posted by HeirToRuin HeirToRuin wrote:

Originally posted by DarHobo DarHobo wrote:

"Yeah, there are guitarists out there that are super fast, like
John Petrucci, but they are also super lame."
                    &n bs p;          &n bsp;                     &nbs p;          &n bsp;    - Alexi Laiho

haha I just read that in an issue of guitar world, its so true.



Alexi Laiho is a coke head and also said in that same interview that an energetic performance is better than playing your songs correctly. 

In other words, his excuse for f**king up so much during performances is that he is so "high energy."

Have you listened to Children of Bodom??  Can you say Maiden ripoff done poorly?

 

Yes, I have seen Bodom in concert, they did put on a high energetic show, and Alexi did play his leads perfectly unlike Petrucci which I have seen two times live.  Have you listened to Peterucci?? can you say gameboy music done poorly?



Posted By: GrahamK
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 20:48

Can you play guitar as well as John Petrucci?

Thought not.



Posted By: DarHobo
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 21:09
Originally posted by GrahamK GrahamK wrote:

Can you play guitar as well as John Petrucci?

Thought not.

   actually I can, alt. picking runs and arp. sweeps are easy for me....


Posted By: TheProgtologist
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 21:19
WTF maidenrulez?You claim to love DT and post threads talking about how great they are and then bash them in another.All your topics are juvenile "this _______ band rules" or "this______band sucks" or "this______band is better than that_____band".Pointless BS.

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Posted By: DarHobo
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 21:24

Originally posted by TheProgtologist TheProgtologist wrote:

WTF maidenrulez?You claim to love DT and post threads talking about how great they are and then bash them in another.All your topics are juvenile "this _______ band rules" or "this______band sucks" or "this______band is better than that_____band".Pointless BS.

He might have multiple personality disorder?



Posted By: TheProgtologist
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 21:54
Originally posted by DarHobo DarHobo wrote:

Originally posted by TheProgtologist TheProgtologist wrote:

WTF maidenrulez?You claim to love DT and post threads talking about how great they are and then bash them in another.All your topics are juvenile "this _______ band rules" or "this______band sucks" or "this______band is better than that_____band".Pointless BS.

He might have multiple personality disorder?

good point



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Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: June 20 2005 at 02:05
Originally posted by DarHobo DarHobo wrote:

Originally posted by HeirToRuin HeirToRuin wrote:

Originally posted by DarHobo DarHobo wrote:

"Yeah, there are guitarists out there that are super fast, like
John Petrucci, but they are also super lame."
                    &n bs p;          &n bsp;                     &nbs p;          &n bsp;    - Alexi Laiho

haha I just read that in an issue of guitar world, its so true.



Alexi Laiho is a coke head and also said in that same interview that an energetic performance is better than playing your songs correctly. 

In other words, his excuse for f**king up so much during performances is that he is so "high energy."

Have you listened to Children of Bodom??  Can you say Maiden ripoff done poorly?

 

Yes, I have seen Bodom in concert, they did put on a high energetic show, and Alexi did play his leads perfectly unlike Petrucci which I have seen two times live.  Have you listened to Peterucci?? can you say gameboy music done poorly?

 What a pity that this forum doesn't have an ignore function ... or a "rate member" function, that would be even better. God, I hate it when you want to discuss something and the other one keeps on saying "no, it isn't" when EVERYBODY IN THE WHOLE WORLD KNOWS IT IS.

But I don't have to convince anyone. The proof is there for all to see on Live at Budokan, go see for yourself.

Go on, give me another one of these "no, it isn't" jokes!



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Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: June 20 2005 at 02:36

Originally posted by DarHobo DarHobo wrote:



Besides, he stepped on his own tail and tried to pull out stuff that's way harder than what he can play! His performance on the new Dream Theater DVD is very dissapointing. He messed up on just about every 'shred' section on all of his songs! And his clean solos on Solitary Shell and Hollow Years... well, besides hitting the wrong notes a lot, his string action is so stupidly low that his clean tone is terrible! I could hear nothing but fret buzz... a shame. He's way too sloppy for what he tries to play.

I'm curious ... could you give me an example? What part of which song does he screw up?



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Posted By: Trotsky
Date Posted: June 22 2005 at 23:50

I'm a hard-core classic prog fan (90% of my prog is from 68-75) and I distinctly prefer listening to Iron Maiden (own around 8 albums) to Dream Theater (own 3) ...

I would never use the word better though ... and most of the points you mentioned maidenrulez, are subjective



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"No" replies the unhumbled optimist "You are only the present."


Posted By: Certif1ed
Date Posted: June 23 2005 at 16:03
Originally posted by Trotsky Trotsky wrote:

I'm a hard-core classic prog fan (90% of my prog is from 68-75) and I distinctly prefer listening to Iron Maiden (own around 8 albums) to Dream Theater (own 3) ...

I would never use the word better though ... and most of the points you mentioned maidenrulez, are subjective

I agree.

I would use the terms "I prefer" and "because..."

Doing this ensures a discussion rather than a boring exchange of opinions. This board has a much higher ratio of discussions to slanging matches compared to other forums out there - which is a large part of what keeps me coming back.

I must admit, I prefer listening to Iron Maiden - their early albums (up to and including "Number Of The Beast") are heavy metal classics of the highest order, IMO. Just pretentious enough, very melodic and catchy, driving slabs of power that develop and grow in exactly the right way to provoke an air-guitar attack.

I can listen to "Number..." from start to finish anytime. I can hardly make it to track 3 of the average Dream Theater album without getting bored of waiting for the energy to kick in or the emotions to carry me away. It just doesn't happen. And I never feel like air-guitaring to Petrucci - he just doesn't know how to ROCK, IMO.

Iron Maiden's debut is a total classic too - ragged, raw, tribal power with a pure aggression that makes the so-called Death Metal bands of Norway and suchlike seem somewhat tame. This album contains a double measure of neat, 50% proof feeling and energy.

But anyone who likes metal should own "Head On" by Samson. This not only has more raw energy than Iron Maiden's debut, but it has what that album lacks: Bruce Dickinson on vocals!



Posted By: salmacis
Date Posted: June 24 2005 at 11:12

Personally speaking, I much prefer Iron Maiden over Dream Theater, as Maiden are simply one of the most influential bands ever, having had two of the greatest vocalists ever in Di'Anno and Dickinson (let's forget the Blaze Bayley debacle). Maiden's first 8 albums are incredible metal masterworks, and they've recently done their best album in years with 'Dance Of Death'.

Glad to see Samson namechecked- I think the album after 'Head On', 'Shock Tactics' is even better- and one of the greatest British metal albums ever- Dickinson is on astounding vocal form.

Did anyone ever hear Samson's successor to Bruce, Nicky Moore? That guy has an astonishingly good rock voice.

 



Posted By: Trotsky
Date Posted: June 26 2005 at 13:07
Man, Salmacis & Certif1ed, you guys really got me regretting passing on Samson ... I once saw their first two albums in a bargain bin and moved on ...

in my defence I'd just picked up Procol Harum and Pavlov's Dog albums and was in a big hurry

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"Death to Utopia! Death to faith! Death to love! Death to hope?" thunders the 20th century. "Surrender, you pathetic dreamer.”

"No" replies the unhumbled optimist "You are only the present."


Posted By: TheProgtologist
Date Posted: June 26 2005 at 13:49

Originally posted by Trotsky Trotsky wrote:

Man, Salmacis & Certif1ed, you guys really got me regretting passing on Samson ... I once saw their first two albums in a bargain bin and moved on ...

in my defence I'd just picked up Procol Harum and Pavlov's Dog albums and was in a big hurry

Trotsky,if you like the New Wave of British Heavy Metal era of bands(which I loved as a teenager and still dig)The Dickinson era Samson albums are awesome.Likewise Samson with Nicky Moore.If you ever get a chance to pick them up again don't pass it up.



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Posted By: Certif1ed
Date Posted: June 27 2005 at 03:05
Originally posted by salmacis salmacis wrote:

Personally speaking, I much prefer Iron Maiden over Dream Theater, as Maiden are simply one of the most influential bands ever, having had two of the greatest vocalists ever in Di'Anno and Dickinson (let's forget the Blaze Bayley debacle). Maiden's first 8 albums are incredible metal masterworks, and they've recently done their best album in years with 'Dance Of Death'.

Glad to see Samson namechecked- I think the album after 'Head On', 'Shock Tactics' is even better- and one of the greatest British metal albums ever- Dickinson is on astounding vocal form.

Did anyone ever hear Samson's successor to Bruce, Nicky Moore? That guy has an astonishingly good rock voice.

Yeah, I saw them at a gig in Reading - I didn't really like Moore's voice then - but I suppose Dickinson was a hard act to follow, and there was tons of great metal around. "Riding With The Angels" was a great track.

I've got an (autographed) EP of Samson/Moore - "Losing My Grip", which I won with the gig tickets in a local radio competition - I'll dig it out for a re-listen - thanks for the reminder!

"Head On" really stands out because of the sheer inventiveness on that album - sure the guys were still finding their feet as musicians, but the enthusiasm - especially from the drummer (who was called "Thunderstick", and kept locked in a cage...) and the amazing Paul Samson (RIP).

An indication of Samson's incredible talent is that he went on to play with such rock luminaries as Ric Lee (Ten Years After), Ian Ellis (Savoy Brown) and Chris Farlowe.



Posted By: Reaper16
Date Posted: June 27 2005 at 03:33
This is very simple. Iron Maiden run rings around Dream Theatre. Mainly becasue DT aren't songwriters. Like, at all. Amazingly talented musicians that don't have very many strong songs. It;s the same problem that plagues Pain of Salvation, although to a lesser degree.

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Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: June 27 2005 at 04:52

Originally posted by Reaper16 Reaper16 wrote:

This is very simple. Iron Maiden run rings around Dream Theatre. Mainly becasue DT aren't songwriters. Like, at all. Amazingly talented musicians that don't have very many strong songs. It;s the same problem that plagues Pain of Salvation, although to a lesser degree.

Dream Theater run rings around Iron Maiden in terms of complexity and structure. Iron Maiden write catchy metal songs.



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Posted By: TheProgtologist
Date Posted: June 27 2005 at 10:54

Originally posted by Reaper16 Reaper16 wrote:

This is very simple. Iron Maiden run rings around Dream Theatre. Mainly becasue DT aren't songwriters. Like, at all. Amazingly talented musicians that don't have very many strong songs. It;s the same problem that plagues Pain of Salvation, although to a lesser degree.

BS...Gildenlow's songwriting skills are very strong.I consider the man damn near a musical genius.

 



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Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: June 27 2005 at 11:07

He is ... many other influential musicians (Portnoy for instance) say that he's a genius.



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Posted By: Certif1ed
Date Posted: June 27 2005 at 15:26
Originally posted by MikeEnRegalia MikeEnRegalia wrote:

Originally posted by Reaper16 Reaper16 wrote:

This is very simple. Iron Maiden run rings around Dream Theatre. Mainly becasue DT aren't songwriters. Like, at all. Amazingly talented musicians that don't have very many strong songs. It;s the same problem that plagues Pain of Salvation, although to a lesser degree.

Dream Theater run rings around Iron Maiden in terms of complexity and structure. Iron Maiden write catchy metal songs.

Not the Dream Theater I've heard - they use simple rock song structures and decorate them with unnecessary bridges and codas in a vain attempt to hide the simple underlying structure. That's one of my biggest criticisms of them, and the main reason I can't accept them as true prog.

In just about everything I've heard, it's Intro-Verse-Chorus-Verse-Choruse-Bridge-Verse-Chorus-Coda with frills, and nothing else.

*yawn!*

Maiden, at least, were not trying to be prog



Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: June 27 2005 at 15:34
Originally posted by Certif1ed Certif1ed wrote:

Originally posted by MikeEnRegalia MikeEnRegalia wrote:

Originally posted by Reaper16 Reaper16 wrote:

This is very simple. Iron Maiden run rings around Dream Theatre. Mainly becasue DT aren't songwriters. Like, at all. Amazingly talented musicians that don't have very many strong songs. It;s the same problem that plagues Pain of Salvation, although to a lesser degree.

Dream Theater run rings around Iron Maiden in terms of complexity and structure. Iron Maiden write catchy metal songs.

Not the Dream Theater I've heard - they use simple rock song structures and decorate them with unnecessary bridges and codas in a vain attempt to hide the simple underlying structure. That's one of my biggest criticisms of them, and the main reason I can't accept them as true prog.

In just about everything I've heard, it's Intro-Verse-Chorus-Verse-Choruse-Bridge-Verse-Chorus-Coda with frills, and nothing else.

*yawn!*

Maiden, at least, were not trying to be prog

You should swap your FII for some IaW or A!

BTW: Who said that prog songs are not allowed to have verse-chorus? Say goodbye to 50% of Pink Floyd ...



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Posted By: Certif1ed
Date Posted: June 28 2005 at 03:18
Originally posted by MikeEnRegalia MikeEnRegalia wrote:

Originally posted by Certif1ed Certif1ed wrote:

Originally posted by MikeEnRegalia MikeEnRegalia wrote:

Originally posted by Reaper16 Reaper16 wrote:

This is very simple. Iron Maiden run rings around Dream Theatre. Mainly becasue DT aren't songwriters. Like, at all. Amazingly talented musicians that don't have very many strong songs. It;s the same problem that plagues Pain of Salvation, although to a lesser degree.

Dream Theater run rings around Iron Maiden in terms of complexity and structure. Iron Maiden write catchy metal songs.

Not the Dream Theater I've heard - they use simple rock song structures and decorate them with unnecessary bridges and codas in a vain attempt to hide the simple underlying structure. That's one of my biggest criticisms of them, and the main reason I can't accept them as true prog.

In just about everything I've heard, it's Intro-Verse-Chorus-Verse-Choruse-Bridge-Verse-Chorus-Coda with frills, and nothing else.

*yawn!*

Maiden, at least, were not trying to be prog

You should swap your FII for some IaW or A!

BTW: Who said that prog songs are not allowed to have verse-chorus? Say goodbye to 50% of Pink Floyd ...

No-one said that.

It's how it's done, not what is done. With most Floyd, the structure is carefully hidden. With almost any DT, it's wide open and blatantly obvious - hardly progressive.

I've heard "IaW", and it's more pop-rock ballads in standard form - hardly a masterpiece of prog. Not even prog, really.

 

 



Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: June 28 2005 at 04:57
Originally posted by Certif1ed Certif1ed wrote:

Originally posted by MikeEnRegalia MikeEnRegalia wrote:

Originally posted by Certif1ed Certif1ed wrote:

Originally posted by MikeEnRegalia MikeEnRegalia wrote:

Originally posted by Reaper16 Reaper16 wrote:

This is very simple. Iron Maiden run rings around Dream Theatre. Mainly becasue DT aren't songwriters. Like, at all. Amazingly talented musicians that don't have very many strong songs. It;s the same problem that plagues Pain of Salvation, although to a lesser degree.

Dream Theater run rings around Iron Maiden in terms of complexity and structure. Iron Maiden write catchy metal songs.

Not the Dream Theater I've heard - they use simple rock song structures and decorate them with unnecessary bridges and codas in a vain attempt to hide the simple underlying structure. That's one of my biggest criticisms of them, and the main reason I can't accept them as true prog.

In just about everything I've heard, it's Intro-Verse-Chorus-Verse-Choruse-Bridge-Verse-Chorus-Coda with frills, and nothing else.

*yawn!*

Maiden, at least, were not trying to be prog

You should swap your FII for some IaW or A!

BTW: Who said that prog songs are not allowed to have verse-chorus? Say goodbye to 50% of Pink Floyd ...

No-one said that.

It's how it's done, not what is done. With most Floyd, the structure is carefully hidden. With almost any DT, it's wide open and blatantly obvious - hardly progressive.

I've heard "IaW", and it's more pop-rock ballads in standard form - hardly a masterpiece of prog. Not even prog, really.

Sorry John sorry better listen again.

I respect your opinion on DT, but are you sure that you're even trying to be objective here? I mean, Pull Me Under is a metal song, I give you that. Another Day is an AORish ballad, no problem admitting that either. But all the other tracks are prog. Play them to someone who's used to pop rock ballads, and he'd hurl them right back at you.

Did you listen closely to Wait For Sleep, and how that theme is played with during all of Learning To Live? Did you listen to Metropolis Pt.1 and recognize how those themes are played with on their other records?

I agree that most of what DT do is usually right in your face, not very subtile. But not ALL of it.

BTW: I think that Awake is much better than I&W. If you're looking for an inventive, spontaneous and truly majestic album, then it can only be Awake. They have pop elements there too, on Innocence faded and Lifting Shadows ..., but even they are full of complex riffs, solos and rhythmic extravaganzas.



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Posted By: Dream Theater
Date Posted: June 29 2005 at 11:36
I'm a big fan of DT and Iron Maiden but i prefer DT by far!

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