Man Overboard wrote: Against other albums by the artist?  Against the best the genre has to offer?  Against its own subgenre?

Very good question.

It's really hard to say how the top list(s) should be, to me Dream Theater is not even on top 5000 but that's maybe me only and that's taste and it would be cool if all the user could have their own list(s) (somewhere in their profile for example) that would be super 

About the top 100 list... it's not a bad list because it shows what albums are most loved here at the archives of it's users on the other hand it's scary to see Octavarium go from spot 45 to spot 28 in just one day (it's at 27 at the moment though).

So i really don't know how to change the big list... better maybe to have it what like it is now and don't take it so serious...

Man Overboard wrote: I'm confused.

The whole world of progressive rock is mate so don't be 

reviews are subjective, based on personal opinions.  I believe they should only act as a guideline, so the reader can decide for themselves. 

you get a feel for different types of reviewers and where they're coming from; if you generally agree with the person, then refer to their reviews to find out about a record.

spectral wrote: you get a feel for different types of reviewers and where they're coming from; if you generally agree with the person, then refer to their reviews to find out about a record.

So true mate 

Man Overboard wrote: I saw a guy who reviewed a Dream Theater EP release and gave it one star because he hated the title track.  He'd never heard the single-release, which was full of yummy B-sides, he just felt the need to say "Hollow Years blows, 1-star " or something along those lines.  This was almost definitely a reaction to the whole Octavarium issue.

That wasn't fair mate...

Hammill wrote: well it depends on how muc i spent to get the album.....if i spent a lot then i would say that is masterpiece otherwise i will be an as***le

cool idea.  so all albums should be rated on price and price alone.  the more expensive the more stars it gets.

what a grrreat society we live in!

Actually , this has been a discussion since day one, but the general feeling is that an album should first be compared to the rest of the artist's catalogue and in general terms against all other prog albums , certainly by genre but the whole of prog also. This would seem logical in sense of perspective and for not mis-leading others. Most ProgReviewers (IMHO) have that more or less in mind when choosing a rating.

However the casual reviewers do not seem to follow any rules and may not be aware of this because clear guidelines are not set and I believe because the admins choose to keep it so! Gnosis2000 is a closed circle of reviewers with strict guidelines for rating (on a almost linear scale of 15) and this is why I consider them the safest rating website around . Written review section is rather thin and divided in two sections. A new album cannot receive more than 11 out of 15 until a few months after its release. This given on the Archives, Octavarium would not get more than 4* because it is new and reviews are based on enthusiasm instead of clear tought-over opinions. I believe I am not the only one thinking so!

I think historically important album , such as The Nice's debut or Marillion's script should get even a higher rating just because they were influential album. A bit like Beach Boys 's Pet Sounds (not listed) influenced a lot of album and pushed the Beatles to outdo them with Sergeant Pepper's, some prog albums managed to be highly influential but have not been heard by many but the artist who based their works on those. 

But in general , five stars album are just too many , although before the latest DT album , the over-rating was less than it used to.

IMHO, 5* rating should only concern the top 5% of your albums, the rest of those you love being on the 4* status. remember that 3* is still a very good rating (some people would consider disgraceful to rate an album they like 3* , but this is still good but non-essential meaning that there are better albums to investigate both for a given artist but in the genre also).

Two star rating means average (therefore for fans only)and normally average would concern some 50% of all prog albums around.

Hammill wrote: spectral you know that i was kidding, honestly i believe that everything in live is subjective...someone might like pink floyd someone not....the problem is that many people follow other's opinion and don't create their own taste on music.

Dude, I know you were joking.  I thought it was funny. 

Man Overboard wrote: I never took the big list too seriously...  I love Close To The Edge, but there are dozens, if not hundreds of albums I enjoy better... It's not like it's a definitive list that states "THESE are the top 100 prog albums to exist, to have a different opinion is to be WRONG!".  It just means "Of what people have felt strongly enough about to review, these are the highest-ranked, weighted on amounts of reviews."

This is the problem about being young (I was also, some two decades ago)  , being worried about list and wanting to see your albums at the top of every list , having your best friend (i even a knew a poor sod who ranked is best friends as he ranked his best movies and his best albums etc...) . I maybe took a look at that list twice since early feb 2004. do not really care to know if CTTE is higher rated than DT albums (since Dt fans are not likely to review much Yes albums and since progmetal heads have become the majority) .

You state that all reviews of the first two weeks should be deleted and not be able to review the album before some months.

my point exactly.....

It would be great if there was not only five star rate but a ten star rate and that we could rate in half stars aswell so if i was going to do a review i could give it 7.5 star rating.

^ Some is rating the album with one star and says: + another half star and another one says - a half star...

krauthead wrote: It would be great if there was not only five star rate but a ten star rate and that we could rate in half stars aswell so if i was going to do a review i could give it 7.5 star rating. ^ Some is rating the album with one star and says: + another half star and another one says - a half star...

This has been in discussion for a while and they are still pondering it! I usually state it right after the star if I give another halfstar. But remember that theoretically 3,5 stars should not mean 7/10 or 70%. This should not be too mathematically scholar.

If you are to say - (minus ) a hafstar , then it would be fair to go to the inferior rating and add a halfstar to the lower rating.

logical , no?

I think you should rate an album truly and honestly as you can.  If it is a 4 star or 5 star to you then it is.  If someone feels as strongly on the other side of the opinion then they will give it less and balance it out.  As for Dream Theater i think it is just a lack of maturity on the reviewer,s part for the most as it was a few months ago during the Radiohead debacle. 

firth_of_Fifth wrote: I don't think there should be reviews and all music should be free. Life would be much easier.

How about binary ranking: Either I like the record or I don't. You can still show a 5 star rating as an average. But there would be no more arguing about whether someone should have given the album 4 or 5 stars.

The binary ranking is interesting. If it weren't abused, it would probably be more informative than the 1 to 5 star ranking (or used together it could be even more effective).

I have never heard Dream Theater (to use an oft mentioned example), but I don't want to belittle their fans or their output. I have been listening to and in one way or another reviewing music for thirty plus years, and performing for twenty, but I wouldn't even begin to think I am qualified to make an opinion about any of their work in the context of, say, someone familiar with that type of music.

I am instantly turned off to it because it is lumped as heavy metal, or prog metal, or whatever. I personally think most of that genre sounds the same, just as many people think that certain other genres sound the same. I'll admit it, but that doesn't mean I won't listen to it with at least an open mind. I may not like it, but then again, I don't have to buy it, and my opinion isn't going to matter to fans of that genre anyway.

I really like this website, but it is irritating to see so many people actually take the time to bash music they really haven't heard enough of to form an informative opinion. Move along, I say, or spend their time reviewing music they like.

Cheers!

Rick Wakeman said at classicrockrevisted.com: "You can't compare albums . the only way you ever could is if two albums were recorded at the same time . Albums created at different times have different sources of music and influence and therefore can never be compared . Also trying to compare one of my albums with Fragile is like trying to compare a goalkeeper with a goal scorer. "