About the top 100
Printed From: Progarchives.com
Category: Progressive Music Lounges
Forum Name: Prog Music Lounge
Forum Description: General progressive music discussions
URL: http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=6892
Printed Date: February 11 2025 at 16:26
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 11.01 - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: About the top 100
Posted By: niki
Subject: About the top 100
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 17:51
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Hello everyone, I 'm new here. Well, something bothers me in the top 100 albums (our choices) at progarchives: Have you noticed that only 8 bands (Pink Floyd, Genesis, Yes, King Crimson, Jethro Tull, Marillion, Dream Theater, Rush) represent almost 60 albums in the top 100! Don't get me wrong, I love them all but isn't that a little bit too much? What about the others? This musical genre is supposed to be very rich, with a lot of different talents, bands. Instead of that, I got the feeling that prog rock is dominated by only a few (still great) names.
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Replies:
Posted By: memowakeman
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 17:53
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SIMPLI: I AGREE WITH YOU!! THERES A LOT OF EXCELLENT MUSIC, AND EXCELLENT ALBUMS WHO DESERVES TO BE IN THE TOP 100... NOT ONLY THOSE BANDS THAT YOU HAVE MENTION...
------------- Follow me on twitter @memowakeman |
Posted By: Man With Hat
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 18:03
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Zappa's not there That one i don't get. There are some other great bands out there, but, unfortunatly, aren't well known. So i can see if they are not present. It's a shame how many great bands are underappreciated. But, i guess thats why were here. To learn about all of that out there. Welcome, btw. ------------- Dig me...But don't...Bury me I'm running still, I shall until, one day, I hope that I'll arrive Warning: Listening to jazz excessively can cause a laxative effect. |
Posted By: niki
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 18:05
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PS: You add Camel, Gentle Giant, Van Der Graaf and ELP + the 8 bands mentionned before and you have about 80 albums by only those 12 bands in the top 100!!! |
Posted By: bluetailfly
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 18:06
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It makes complete sense to me that that would be the case. Those are the prog rock heavyweights. Like it or not, they have defined the genre. I would expect most of Yes's albums to be there, same with Genesis, Pink Floyd, King Crimson. What is a crime, imo, is that ELPs aren't ranked higher: Certainly, BSS, Trilogy, the first album and Tarkus should be higher than they are, but their fan base is smaller. But in terms of influence, they deserve to be higher. They are absolutely fantastic albums that were hugely influential when they were released. I think we should have an "ELP Day" on the site, and each member must play one of the first 8 LP albums in their entirety and then rate it.
------------- "The red polygon's only desire / is to get to the blue triangle." |
Posted By: Miaugion
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 18:08
Great collection.  And no, I don't agree. This is simply the cream that most people love. Most of the other stuff is derivative and immature in comparison to the greats and can be found on the lower ranks where it belongs. 90 % of all the prog albums I've ever listened to were just average (and who needs "average"?) or forgettable, especially lyrically. ------------- You house proud town mouse ha ha, charade you are |
niki wrote:Posted By: memowakeman
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 18:11
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ITS A QUESTION OF TASTE... ------------- Follow me on twitter @memowakeman |
Posted By: BaldJean
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 18:12
That they have defined the genre does not mean that all their albums should be up there. I am a huge fan of VdGG but would only put 2 albums of them in the top 100, "Pawn Hearts" and "Godbluff". Other bands made excellent albums too that sometimes surpass certain albums of the founders. -------------  A shot of me as High Priestess of Gaia during our fall festival. Ceterum censeo principiis obsta |
Posted By: niki
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 18:16
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No question about it: they are HUGE bands but the problem is that everyone knows them! I'm curious and hungry by nature so I'd be very disappointed if the entire prog-rock genre is more or less reprensented by 8-12 names. |
Posted By: Certif1ed
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 18:18
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They're most popular because they got most votes. I hate to see any Yes or Dream Theater rated as highly or higher than Marillion, Pink Floyd, Tull, KC, Rush or Genesis when it quite blatantly isn't true... It's like the pop charts - at the top is the most pop. |
Posted By: King of Loss
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 18:21
Close to the Edge Pop? For me its the quinessential 70s Prog Release. |
Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 18:23
The list just represents the collective opinion. The rock/pop music-scene was never, before or after, near as fantastic as it was during the period from 1966-1976. That's a almost an exepted fact amongst rock/pop music-lovers. And I said ALMOST, as I fully respect those who thinks otherwise. And I'm NOT saying that good musc wasn't done before or after this period, BUT the period I mentioned is OUTSTANDING in rock/pop music history. Study, and you'll probably will agree in the end.
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Posted By: BaldJean
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 18:25
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At least 70% of the albums named in the top 100 don't belong there. Not a single Canterbury or RIO or Zeuhl album mentioned. No Krautrock either. But I never gave a damn about the charts. Again I'll stick with Kobori Enshu: "I used to praise the artist because he created what I liked. Now I praise myself because I like what the artist has chosen for me". ------------- A shot of me as High Priestess of Gaia during our fall festival. Ceterum censeo principiis obsta |
Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 18:53
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70 % !!!!!!!!!!! Oh my !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! |
Posted By: mickstafa
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 18:55
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Not that charts matter really, but look what you are doing: you are
complaining that more obscure genres and bands aren't on a top 100
chart (which of course ranks popularity). Sure some of the bands
I love aren't on there either, but its undeniable that there are the 6
or 7 heavyweights and that there are just more people into symphonic
prog, metal prog, etc. Canterbury or RIO, while people like them,
just aren't the majority's cup of tea. So they don't make the top 100 charts. Personally, I listen to the heavyweights much more than the others; they are heavyweights for a reason -- because lots of people like them best and they have a diverse/large collection. Luckily we have things like these boards to discuss and discover bands and talk with a bit more depth than a popularity contest. In short, don't worry about it. |
Posted By: BaldJean
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 19:00
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As I said, I don't give a damn about charts. I have my personal charts, and while I perfectly accept the important role that these heavyweights have played in the history of prog I hardly ever listen to their records anymore. At least not more often than I listen to other bands. And a lot of bands surpass these heavyweights in their oeuvre. ------------- A shot of me as High Priestess of Gaia during our fall festival. Ceterum censeo principiis obsta |
Posted By: mickstafa
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 19:03
Well prepare to be disappointed about all art movements. Just as there are genres of music, there are movements of art. And with each movement there are the Monets, Picassos, and Rockwells. In short, you'll be hard pressed to find any substantial genre of anything without heavyweights. Its not a bad thing, Niki. Use the boards to find discussion on less "prog pop" bands. |
Posted By: The-Bullet
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 19:10
"Quite blatantly" -, what do you base this on, or did you just forget to add "in my opinion" ? ------------- 
"Why say it cannot be done.....they'd be better doing pop songs?" |
Posted By: mickstafa
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 19:12
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Posted By: SomethingGood
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 19:17
| could the list be limited to show only 1 or 2 albums per artist or something? that'd help give a much wider perspective of the genre. (i'm new btw, hi all). |
Posted By: frenchie
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 19:20
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i still think they should ditch it, its a crap top 100, we have a key albums list and nobody agrees with it! Bring back album pick of the week ------------- The Worthless Recluse 
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Posted By: dalt99
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 19:21
The Yes Album = POP? Fragile = POP? Close to the Edge = POP? Relayer = POP? Tales from Topographic Oceans = POP?!?!?!
Dream Theater however...I won't argue them. Maybe by saying "pop" you mean Popular. Well, the most popular is usually the best. At least when talking about over a long period of time. You don't see Motley Crue or Guns and Roses being ranked as the best heavy metal band now but in the 80's many lists had them near the top. Only the best stand the test of time! Wow, did I just date myself or what? |
Posted By: BaldJean
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 19:25
You can' be serious about that. The most popular are simply that - the most popular. And usually because they are the most easily digestible. ------------- A shot of me as High Priestess of Gaia during our fall festival. Ceterum censeo principiis obsta |
Posted By: dalt99
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 19:26
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By the way - Welcome Niki and SomethingGood!
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Posted By: mickstafa
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 19:31
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I totally agree with Dalt. Its so funny watching people avoid the
word "popular" like the plague (kinda like the word "tradition" in that
other thread today). I believe there is Pop and popular.
Pop obviously is the boring cookiecutter music we all love to
hate. Popular though just means that the majority likes it.
And while some people get a high off of being "not like those majority
sheep," things are just naturally popular or unpopular. Its so funny to see people who think they are being all original by scoffing at popularity and intentionally listening to the antithesis of it on the sheer basis it is popular rather than making a conscious decision to do so. Keep wearing colors everyone - we're making those Goths only think they are wearing black by choice!  |
Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 19:32
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If you don't "give a damn" about charts: Why did you write your post??? I DON'T mean this as an insault!!! I'm just corious!! NO ILLWILL!!! |
Posted By: BaldJean
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 19:36
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As I said, I don't give a damn if a band is popular or not. "Auch ein blindes Huhn findet ein Korn" ("even a blind chicken occasionally finds a grain of corn"), as a German proverb says. In the long run it is true though that the most popular are usually not the best, in prog as well as in any other style of music. ------------- A shot of me as High Priestess of Gaia during our fall festival. Ceterum censeo principiis obsta |
Posted By: dalt99
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 19:38
Sorry but I must Laugh Out Loud at your suggestion. I am DEAD serious about it. It's the case that the most popular in a genre DEFINE THE GENRE so in time these bands/artists just seem the most digestible. Do you mean to tell me that The Beatles suck? Metallica sucks? Yes and Genesis suck? Miles Davis sucks? Bach and Mozart suck? Jimi Hendrix sucks? Bob Marley sucks? B.B. King sucks? Magma sucks? Tangerine Dream sucks? I am sure you wouldn't say that about them all yet these artists are among the most popular in their genre and are usually classified as the best or about the best in their genre of music because they are very good. They may seem easy to digest but that's because they helped to define their genre of music. As time goes on music progresses but I know many people that think The Mars Volta is "easier to digest" then Yes or King Crimson! Go figure |
Posted By: Tony R
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 19:38
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Come on,you guys-open your ears!!! Close To The Edge is just one pop tune after another,simply segued together.The beat,such as it is,is designed to be danced to-in that "I'd better make some movement because it is music and the girlies will think I am really lame if I just stand here motionless with my beer in my hand" kind of way.The lyrics are obviously designed for communal singalong and the keyboards are simplistic so granny can play along too.
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Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 19:41
Ok, I think I understand you, even if you didn't answer my question in a direct sort of way |
Posted By: The-Bullet
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 19:41
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Hi Tony, congrat's on finding a gif that show's all of neil's moves -------------
"Why say it cannot be done.....they'd be better doing pop songs?" |
Posted By: Tony R
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 19:41
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Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 19:43
Well, Tony R, NOW I understand what u ment by your comment before (know what I mean |
Posted By: BaldJean
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 19:43
I wouldn't exactly call Magma or King Crimson easily digestible. ------------- A shot of me as High Priestess of Gaia during our fall festival. Ceterum censeo principiis obsta |
Posted By: mickstafa
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 19:43
I disagree. Here's what it all comes down to: Although you don't listen to the more popular bands of the prog genre, you are still being controlled because they are popular. While its not as simple as that, according to your logic, the worse a band is, the more people like it, therefore making it popular. To break away from this conformity you listen to more underground stuff and enjoy it more. But ask yourself this: Do you dislike the popular bands because they don't have the talent or because they are merely popular? Obviously they have talent if they are popular (at least in this "snobby" genre) so that can't be the case. So, you dislike popular bands mostly on the basis of their popularity. Therefore popularity also controls your musical decisions. You said yourself you didn't give a damn about charts, yet you won't listen to bands that are on them The moral of the story: listen to what you like, and let your neighbor listens to what he likes. If the two of you realize you like the same thing (thus its popular) don't let that deter you. Interesting posts. |
Posted By: BaldJean
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 19:45
------------- A shot of me as High Priestess of Gaia during our fall festival. Ceterum censeo principiis obsta |
Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 19:46
The genre; "progressive rock", as a whole, is NOT easy digestible!!! Please!!! , we're in this TOGETHER!!!
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Posted By: gdub411
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 19:46
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Okay...you kiddies need another lesson. The Top 100 list is based on number of reviews that were given to that band....nothing else....take Piper At the Gates of Dawn(rated at 31) has a 3.99 rating whereas In the Land of Grey and Pink(rated at 50) has a 4.61... ALL THE LIST IS IS THE 100 ALBUMS THAT HAVE BEEN REVIEWED THE MOST! End of lesson. |
Posted By: Snow Dog
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 19:49
But in this case the most popular are the best! ................. ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Snow_Dog" rel="nofollow"> 
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Posted By: BaldJean
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 19:50
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I disagree. You didn't get me at all. I don't care one bit whether a band is popular or not. It may very well be that I agree with most of the listeners. I don't vote for other bands just because I want to be different. But I prefer to keep my ears open and be unbiased by the opinion of others, and that's in a positive way as well as in a negative. Simply saying just because all others like it it can't be good would be idiotic. ------------- A shot of me as High Priestess of Gaia during our fall festival. Ceterum censeo principiis obsta |
Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 19:50
Seriously: THANKS!!! I did not know that!!! Then the whole list is NOT a good thing and should be changed imediately!!!! ps. thanks for calling me a kid at the age of 42 |
Posted By: Snow Dog
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 19:52
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Hey Tony R! Which one is you and which is your brother?
------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Snow_Dog" rel="nofollow">
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Posted By: dalt99
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 19:57
No they aren't but your point is that the most popular are not the best and I stated that the most popular are usually very good and define their genre. I included Magma as arguably they most popular band in the Zeuhl genre. |
Posted By: Poxx
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 20:00
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These band defined the genre.. blah blah they are the best of the genre blah blah ELP are good... blah blah. Hogwash. The reason for the top 100 consisting of albums from a select few bands, is simple. People don't know that many albums, nor have they listened to enough albums to review albums relatively relatively. Relativity is the key when making a top 100. You don't have to know all albums in prog-rock to know that 'The Snow Goose' is a masterpiece, but you have to know a great deal when composing a top 100. Conclusion: The top 100 list doesn't represent the top 100 albums of the genre, but are based on this site's reviewer's rating, and amount of ratings. |
Posted By: BaldJean
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 20:03
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I stated that from being the most popular you can't derive they are the best, and I'll stick with that. And it is certainly true in many cases that bands are simply overrated by the majority. My personal opinion is that about 10-20% of what is very popular also is very good, compared with the unpopular stuff. But mere popularity of a certain band or album says absolutely nothing about the quality. ------------- A shot of me as High Priestess of Gaia during our fall festival. Ceterum censeo principiis obsta |
Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 20:07
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Well, in prog it does. 'cause prog is a genre of music that is NOT regarded as popular!!! |
Posted By: dalt99
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 20:08
Thanks for the information! I figured out long ago it wasn't based on ratings though since there are alot of albums with 2 or 3 ratings that have a 4.66 rating that aren't on the list. The list does though in a roundabout (HA, a Yes song! No pun intended) way of showing which albums (and bands) are the most popular. |
Posted By: dalt99
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 20:13
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I respectfully disagree with you. I would like you to tell me who YOU think are the top 5 best progressive rock artists in YOUR opinion. Also, you have not commented on my view that all the artists that I mentioned (Genesis, Miles Davis, Mozart, Bob Marley, etc.) are very good. Do you disagree? I doubt you do, which is why your argument fails to hold up. |
Posted By: frippertronik
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 20:16
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dream theater is a great band, but along the ranking, their albums appears too much, when only 2 cd's must be in the top100 ------------- a plague of lighthouse keepers |
Posted By: Borealis
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 20:20
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The top100 is actually based on the number of rating instead of the actual overall note of the album. Dream Theater's Train of Thought is 14th with a 3.24 rating! (297 reviews) This is one of the most contreversial album on the site. It's far from being the best DT album, it's a lot more metal than prog, and it's actually pretty bad in my opinion. I accept somes like it, but well, number 14 on a top100 prog album ever!?! Pink Floyd's Division Bell is 47th with a 3.76 rating. (88 Reviews) Not a bad album, but well... Radiohead's OK Computer is 82th with a 3.87 rating. (55 reviews) Not bad for an album which isn't considered prog by many people, including Radiohead members. ------------- Vive le Québec libre!... |
Posted By: AcdcFan411
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 20:21
 U guys dont know the meaning of a great band, the best band is ac dcTop Ten Ac/Dc cds 1Jailbreak 2Razors edge 3 DirtyDeedsDoneDirtCheap 4 ACDC Live 5 Let There Be Rock 6 Stiff upper lip 7 Sattilite blues 8 High Voltage 9 Back In Black 10 Powerage ------------- Daniel Cunningham |
Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 20:24
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No dissrespect, but are you sure you've come to the right web-site??? |
Posted By: BaldJean
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 20:25
That's neither true for prog nor is it true for any other genre of music (or, for that matter, art or cinema or literature or whatever). Personal preference plays a big role, of course. I have a certain dislike for bands tht are too willinglky pleasing for the ear. I already quoted the Japanese tea-master Kobori Enshu before and do it again here: "I used to praise the artist because he created what I liked. Now I praise myself because I like what the artist has chosen for me." What Kobori Enshu wants to say with that is that an artist should not try to create something that is pleasing for the listener, he should create what what he likes no matter if anyone else likes it. Most bands don't follow this rule, because it simply doesn't pay off financially, so they create what the audience wants to hear. Once again I want to state that I don't expect the artist to deliberately create something most people don't like, he just shouldn't care about it. And very few artists nowadays have this integrity. ------------- A shot of me as High Priestess of Gaia during our fall festival. Ceterum censeo principiis obsta |
Posted By: krauthead
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 20:25
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ACDC must be one of the rock bands I dislike the most, I can't stand a single tune... so shall I throw my 5000+ albums out with the garbage since they must be crap? ------------- *Dancing madly backwards on a sea of air* - Captain Beyond |
Posted By: krauthead
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 20:28
But since the chart is made out of how much reviews the records have they shall be there, to my ears i don't wanna any dt album at top 5000, but that's another thing called taste and if the chart was made out of taste it would almost look the same no matter what... ------------- *Dancing madly backwards on a sea of air* - Captain Beyond |
Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 20:31
I agree with you on this! BUT, I still think that TRUE prog IS a genre that holds VERY much of what you seem to like. Otherwise, why prog??? |
Posted By: BaldJean
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 20:35
I disagree in the case of Bob Marley; he is overrated. And I happen to prefer Beethoven to Mozart (though I have nothing against Mozart; he just isn't my favorite classical composer. But he wrote my favorite opera, "Don Giovanni"). As to my personal top 5 in Prog: I don't even know if I have any, but I think if pressed I would certainly put Gong among them. Probably Magma too, and Embryo (a band no-one ever lists). Peter Hammill (including VdGG), and Guru Guru. Or possibly King Crimson. As to Genesis: They certainly defined the genre, but on the whole they are a little too tame to be rated at the very top. I respect them and even like them, but not absolutely top. ------------- A shot of me as High Priestess of Gaia during our fall festival. Ceterum censeo principiis obsta |
Posted By: krauthead
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 20:40
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Both Embryo and Guru Guru is at my top 5 :) And to me Genesis ain't bad at all but nothing like Yes, King Crimson & Pink Floyd to name a few. ------------- *Dancing madly backwards on a sea of air* - Captain Beyond |
Posted By: BaldJean
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 20:51
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Nice to see someone knows Guru Guru and Embryo. And Captain Beyond too. ------------- A shot of me as High Priestess of Gaia during our fall festival. Ceterum censeo principiis obsta |
Posted By: Fitzcarraldo
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 20:54
Sorry, gdub411, but that's not correct. The Top 100 is based on both the number of ratings per album AND the value of each rating for an album. See the following thread for a detailed explanation: http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=4038 - http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=4038 particularly my two very long posts on the 3rd and 4th pages of that thread. That thread also should hopefully make it clear why just using the arithmetic mean alone is not a good way of ranking albums. The current algorithm takes into account how many people like/dislike an album and by how much they like/dislike it. This topic is perennial. Hell will freeze over on the day every Prog fan independently comes up with an identical list of Top 100 albums. I suppose the fun is in the discussion. It's all subjective at the end of the day: one man's meat is another man's poison.
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Posted By: krauthead
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 20:55
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Yeah ------------- *Dancing madly backwards on a sea of air* - Captain Beyond |
Posted By: Poxx
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 20:59
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Haha. 1. This thread is about the top 100 prog album list featured on this site, not the "post your top 10 albums by AC/DC". 2. AC/DC suck. 3. It's "'74 Jailbreak". This is important, for the sake of not confusing it with Thin Lizzy's 'Jailbreak', which is actually a decent hard rock record. |
Posted By: krauthead
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 21:02
LOL! Nice to see that some in here don't need a hearing aid Thin Lizzy - Jailbreak is a good rocker imo and it's beat all ACDC anyday ------------- *Dancing madly backwards on a sea of air* - Captain Beyond |
Posted By: krauthead
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 21:21
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My last post on this topic i hope The most of the top 100 list is very great albums and I have the most of them (the ones i like) and I have many other albums so I don't think more than 3-5 on that list will end up on my own top 100 list of progressive rock albums though the ones on the list here are the classics of the genre. It's all about the taste, I dislike Neo Prog and Prog Metal though I can see why others love it... it's all about the taste
Peace, Love & Understanding ------------- *Dancing madly backwards on a sea of air* - Captain Beyond |
Posted By: bluetailfly
Date Posted: June 01 2005 at 22:14
Who said it represnted the top 100 in the genre? Who is suffering that delusion? Nobody. But the list is a pretty good indication of what are the best albums in the genre based on a large group of serious fans who vote by rating them. To me, that's a pretty darn good system, and it produces valuable information, imo. Collectively, we know a lot of albums. Just because BSS is #23 (or whatever) doesn't mean it's worse than Red, but it means that it's probably a pretty damn good album. The fact that it's in the top 100 means its a pretty damn good album. And ELP are good (no blah blah necessary). So you just...you know... don't go around badmouthing them, mister! ------------- "The red polygon's only desire / is to get to the blue triangle." |
Posted By: DallasBryan
Date Posted: June 02 2005 at 02:58
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my top 100 is a much better yardstick, excuse me!
I think we are waking up to the fact that the US had the best guitarists, the Germans had the best keyboardist and the English created the best lyrics! Slowly we are maturing to see that the world's musicians are not braindead outside of the US and UK. But that the US and UK listeners are deaf to the WORLD! Takes time but once you break the media barrier you will find a new world!
Bald angels, cast out to hell. Bald angels, how deep we fell! Bald angels, oh what a fall! Bald angels, love conquers all. BaldJean I am able to come to your defense, krauthead we have worked long for your presence! Dont be dismayed by the agressive english banishment, this forum is opening up to ALL!
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Posted By: Cluster One
Date Posted: June 02 2005 at 03:17
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The best thing about this site is that you are allowed to make your own
'Top 100' should you so desire. You choose which 100 albums you like,
and then go out and buy/download them... The Top 100 List is merely a tool, for the 'newer' and 'older' fan alike. To give them an idea on what is typically popular in the genre, and where to start next in terms of investigating new (old?) music... There are over 7500+ albums listed on this site, and growing daily. Hugues Chantraine comes closest  but for someone to
have actually listened to ALL these albums, and then objectively
categorized and properly ranked them from 'best to worst' (which is
always subjective) is ultimately impossible.Don't criticize, use the list as a tool, not as doctrine. Or better yet, get off yer rusty dusty and review some albums yourself and help contribute to the database/listings. IMHO the list has been tweaked and experimented with much in the past, and I quite appreciate the end result / current method of determing a (notice I said A and not THE) Top 100. Except for the presence of all those DT albums, of course  ------------- Marmalade...I like marmalade. |
Posted By: BaldJean
Date Posted: June 02 2005 at 06:26
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Some argued the top 100 list was "helpful". Somehow I fail to see how it is helpful when it only consists of stuff everyone already knows by heart. Here is my own personal top 50, in arbitrary order; the one that is listed first is not necessarily my ultra-favorite. Also be aware that these top 50 could be a completely different list on another day. And I will only allow myself 1 album per artist only. 1. Clearlight - Symphony As I said, on another day it might be a completely different list. The absence of bands like Camel, Kansas, Dream Theater or any Neo-Prog has some significance though; just not my cup of tea.
I just noticed I forgot an all time favorite, which should definitely be listed in the prog database: 51. Nik Turner's Sphynx - Xitintoday http://rateyourmusic.com/album_images/o102190.jpg"> It features Nik Turner, Steve Hillage, Mike Howlett, Miquette Giraudy, Tim Blake, Alan Powell, Morris Pert (among others). Highly recommended!!! ------------- A shot of me as High Priestess of Gaia during our fall festival. Ceterum censeo principiis obsta |
Posted By: Miaugion
Date Posted: June 02 2005 at 07:16
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I don't know if it's technically possible but here's an idea:
The site's administrators could add a "Special Recommendation"-option to the regular rating buttons (1 - 5 stars). This "SR"-option should be used when you, the reviewer, think an album by a relatively unknown band or artist should appear in the headlight of the public's eye. This could lead to a second top-list, e.g. an "independent top 30 list" featuring albums ignored by most. Example: Artist: John Arch. Album: "A Twist of Fate" Personal rating: **** (4 stars) Special Recommendation yes/no: Yes. Just an idea. I think this could be interesting. ------------- You house proud town mouse ha ha, charade you are |
Posted By: lynton samuel
Date Posted: June 02 2005 at 07:45
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I took i brief look at the list, and noticed that Porcupine Tree's latest, Deadwing, is on 51st place.
Seriously, I love PT, but Deadwing does not belong in top 100. All their previous albums are better. As mentioned before in this thread, the list contains the albums that are reviewed the most times, therefore they are probably the most popular ones, not the best. This proves my point. Deadwing is PT's most accessible album yet, hence the 51st place. It's not because it's their best. I think this is applies to many of the albums in the top 100 list. |
Posted By: krauthead
Date Posted: June 02 2005 at 08:55
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Cool list BaldJean ------------- *Dancing madly backwards on a sea of air* - Captain Beyond |
Posted By: Gentle Ronnie
Date Posted: June 02 2005 at 09:14
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This topic sucks. It's as if I complained why 50 Cent has more fans than Gentle Giant. Obviously, the top 100 is a list of albums that are more popular. Is Train Of Thought or The Wall better than Io Sono Nato Libero? Definitely not. ------------- 
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Posted By: mickstafa
Date Posted: June 02 2005 at 09:26
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Yeah, this topic used to be interesting, now its just bitter people mad
that their more "obscure" cds aren't in a top 100 list. I think I
speak for many for saying if it weren't for the "big guys," I wouldn't
be into this genre. I only know the more obscure stuff because of
my interest for more prog. But once again, we've come to a thread that is about people posting personal opinions as if they are fact. More well-known albums will get more reviews and if those albums are good, then they will get on this list. That's the bottom line. Its no conspiracy or anything like that. |
Posted By: lynton samuel
Date Posted: June 02 2005 at 09:41
that's the bottom line? is that a fact? i mostly agree with you. but you can't accuse people for posting personal opinions as facts, and then end your post with "that's the bottom line". hypocrisy!!! |
Posted By: BaldJean
Date Posted: June 02 2005 at 09:52
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I'm neither mad nor bitter that my "obscure" CDs aren't in the top 100. My only aim is to expand the spectrum of music of those who listen to the big guns only. In the forest of prog the prettiest flowers grow further in the wilderness; the ones who stay close to the main path through it will never see them. There are some beautiful mushrooms too, but many will take them for toadstools and don't dare to pick them. Some of these toadstools only need to be "cooked" though (listened to closely repeatedly) to become edible and very delicious.
------------- A shot of me as High Priestess of Gaia during our fall festival. Ceterum censeo principiis obsta |
Posted By: Certif1ed
Date Posted: June 02 2005 at 10:12
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I love the over-reactions to my post - absolute classic stuff!!! Note I used pop (small p) as a way of distinguishing from Pop. Nowhere did I suggest that CTTE is Pop music - but there's no denying it's popular.
But my personal favourite is this one;
Did you notice the "..."? That was intended to convey the fact that I was taking the piss. The "IMO" was quite clearly implied.
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Posted By: The-Bullet
Date Posted: June 02 2005 at 10:18
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OK Cert I've just done a google search on "..." and can't find any reference to mickey taking or opinion stating... -------------
"Why say it cannot be done.....they'd be better doing pop songs?" |
Posted By: Tony R
Date Posted: June 02 2005 at 10:18
I can see this year's intake are going to be hard work,Professor Cert !
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Posted By: omri
Date Posted: June 02 2005 at 10:25
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gdub 411 wrote : Okay...you kiddies need another lesson. The Top 100 list is based on number of reviews that were given to that band....nothing else....take Piper At the Gates of Dawn(rated at 31) has a 3.99 rating whereas In the Land of Grey and Pink(rated at 50) has a 4.61... ALL THE LIST IS IS THE 100 ALBUMS THAT HAVE BEEN REVIEWED THE MOST! End of lesson. O.K. father, Here is your lesson : the mechanism is to time the average rate by the number of reviews. So if 297 rated DT's Train of thought and it's average rate is 3.2 than the result will be approx' 1000. This will put it in a very good place in the list. On the other hand Talk talk's "Spirit of eden" that it's average is 4.82 but only reviewed by 11 people will get the result of 53.02 and therefor will not be on the top 100 list. End of lesson, start of discussion : A month ago, after understanding that mechanism I wrote a thread that suggested a diferent list of the highly rated albums (by lets say 10 reviews or more). This kind of list will be much more diverse and more representative cause to be on that one you only need few that will review the album but all of them should love the album. I also think that kind of a list will be a better tool to find some beatiful music you (and I) do'nt know yet. P.S. calling every one else kiddies and then be wrong in understanding ....... well, maybe you be a beat more polite next time !
------------- omri |
Posted By: Certif1ed
Date Posted: June 02 2005 at 12:43
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You know, I'm very tempted to agree there...
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Posted By: Snow Dog
Date Posted: June 02 2005 at 12:52
He's doing "..." again! ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Snow_Dog" rel="nofollow">
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Posted By: Certif1ed
Date Posted: June 02 2005 at 13:16
In this case it means "but they're not prog". "..." is so versatile... |
Posted By: Snow Dog
Date Posted: June 02 2005 at 13:22
Does it have to be three"..."? Does four"...." or five or more "..............." signify something different? Or are the amouint of "." dependent on ones personallity? ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Snow_Dog" rel="nofollow">
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Posted By: Dreamer
Date Posted: June 02 2005 at 13:33
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well, the top 100 list was very useful for me, and I'm sure alot of new people also check it out. I do miss the Album of the Week feature though |
Posted By: BaldJean
Date Posted: June 02 2005 at 13:52
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I like to get new suggestions what to listen to. The top 100 list doesn't provide any though. ------------- A shot of me as High Priestess of Gaia during our fall festival. Ceterum censeo principiis obsta |
Posted By: colin007
Date Posted: June 02 2005 at 14:07
by the same token, is Io Sono Nato Libero better than Train of Thought or The Wall? Definitely not. no artist is better than any other. its just a matter of who you like more. Amon Duul 2 is no better than Britney Spears... ------------- This body holding me reminds me of my own mortality. Embrace this moment. Remember. We are eternal. All this pain is an illusion. |
Posted By: Easy Livin
Date Posted: June 02 2005 at 14:42
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Here's a tip to see more than just the top 100. Once you've clicked on the link which says show top 100 (after the 50th entry), the URL in the address line will look like this: http://www.progarchives.com/?MostPopular=100 - http://www.progarchives.com/?MostPopular=100 Change the number 100 in the URL to say 200, and hey presto you'll get the top 200.
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Posted By: Miaugion
Date Posted: June 02 2005 at 14:45
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... or the amazing top 7500. ------------- You house proud town mouse ha ha, charade you are |
Posted By: mickstafa
Date Posted: June 02 2005 at 14:46
Read the other reviews featured on the main page. I rarely know all the cds that are listed by reviewers. Plus, you get a review rather than a mere ranking number. |
Posted By: dalt99
Date Posted: June 02 2005 at 15:20
Also there are TONS of threads asking who people think are the more underrated bands or less heard of bands that you can read. Since you like Krautrock, click on the Krautrock link within this site and read the bios on all the bands listed there you haven't heard. If you have heard of them all then do the same for any other genre you like. I don't think I have ever used a Top 100 type of list to find new albums since I have usually heard of all the bands on those lists. Most of the lesser known bands I have found I had to do some research. Check out their websites and listen to their samples. |
Posted By: gdub411
Date Posted: June 02 2005 at 15:44
Polite!?!....Ha!!...Bugger off kiddo!! |
Posted By: BaldFriede
Date Posted: June 02 2005 at 15:54
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I had a look at the so-called top 100, and now, after having seen them, I think it is a totally unnecessary list. It does not supply you with any interesting information, because anyone who is into prog will most probably know the bands named there. -------------  BaldJean and I; I am the one in blue. |
Posted By: gdub411
Date Posted: June 02 2005 at 16:12
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BaldFred is absolutely correct. |
Posted By: Certif1ed
Date Posted: June 02 2005 at 16:15
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In theory you'd think it would stop all those newbie threads like "Hi, I'm new to Prog - what would you recommend", as there is 100 great albums to choose from. I think it's interesting to see what's popular - then you can go check it out and see if you agree or not and discuss it here in the forum. I doubt that everyone who posts here has the entire top 100 in their collection, and it's worth discussing the well-known just as much as the obscure recordings, IMO |
Posted By: Swinton MCR
Date Posted: June 02 2005 at 16:19
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I can't argue with most of the albums in the top 100 - You have the cream of progressive rock and that cream is represented by Yes, Genesis, Camel, Rush, ELP, Pink floyd, Dream Theater, King Crimson...... No arguments from me here - And Tony R's assertion that CTTE is a series of pop songs stitched together - Thats a throw-away line designed to get a reaction.... CTTE is about as far from pop as you can get - My WIFE hates the guitar intro possibly more than any other music i've played...... ------------- Play me my song, here it comes again |
Posted By: gdub411
Date Posted: June 02 2005 at 16:19
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^..I certainly haven't heard all the top 100...there's even a few bands that I haven't even heard yet.
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Posted By: bluetailfly
Date Posted: June 02 2005 at 16:25
Wow. I disagree. I thought I was pretty knowledgeable about prog before I found this website. The top 100 really opened my eyes to a lot of albums that I'd never heard of, or heard of but never knew a thing about. I found it very useful, and still do. I'd like at some point to hear them all. ------------- "The red polygon's only desire / is to get to the blue triangle." |
Posted By: BaldFriede
Date Posted: June 02 2005 at 16:27
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I tend to to have a dfferent opinion. It is mostly a list of the albums that had the biggest commercial success, which does not say anything about their quality or importance. You might as well draw similar inferences from the current pop charts. Charts of whatever kind, and I mean whatever, are not a reflection of quality. ------------- BaldJean and I; I am the one in blue. |
Posted By: Under
Date Posted: June 02 2005 at 16:28
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I like the top 100, but it suprises me that most of the albums are more than 20 years old. Besides Dream Theater prog is apparently old. I like music from the '70, but there must be some new albums from new talent suitable for the top 100. It is a bit like Bohemian Rapsody from Queen. That song will never be replaced on the overall top 100. People would get confused if Pink Floyd or Yes are not in the top 3. But hey, are we just people? |
Posted By: omri
Date Posted: June 02 2005 at 16:32
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gdub411 wrote : Polite!?!....Ha!!...Bugger off kiddo!! I'm 41 years old grampa ! are you older than that ? There are things you learn when you get old and wise. And you did get it wrong, remember ? ------------- omri |