The EP, is there a point?
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Topic: The EP, is there a point?
Posted By: sleeper
Subject: The EP, is there a point?
Date Posted: January 02 2010 at 11:27
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For those of you that noticed, I wrote a review of Pain of Salvations Linoleum EP a few days ago and in it I stated that EP's were not something that I generally bought. For the most part, I cant see why they exist. If a band is going to go into the studio, why dont they spend the time to create a full album of new materiel rather than just 20+ minutes worth.
Now, I can understand why there would be exceptions, the aformentioned PoS EP was to tide the fans over during the lengthy delay with the new Road Salt album, and bands that are starting out would use it to get their name out there. But I cant for the life of me see why established bands like Pelican and Deathspell Omega release EP's.
So, ladies and gentlemen, anyone care to try and enlighten me? ------------- Spending more than I should on Prog since 2005 
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Replies:
Posted By: MovingPictures07
Date Posted: January 02 2010 at 11:28
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I've always felt very similarly to you in that I think EPs are an idea that I deem pointless for 99% of situations. ------------- 
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Posted By: harmonium.ro
Date Posted: January 02 2010 at 11:33
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I suppose it's cheaper to release EPs? Maybe a band doesn't have enough resources to record, produce and release a full album at some point and doesn't want to leave its fans waiting too much; in this case an EP is a good solution. How about material that left over material that can't become an album, but still deserves to be released? |
Posted By: The Truth
Date Posted: January 02 2010 at 11:39
I don't question it because I like Act 1 by The Dear Hunter  ------------- http://blindpoetrecords.bandcamp.com/" rel="nofollow">  
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Posted By: Epignosis
Date Posted: January 02 2010 at 11:39
Without going into the logistical aspects of LPs and EPs (I will leave that to Dean  ), I'd just make a few quick comments:EPs are favored by lots of fledgling indie artists also, because they are cheaper to record and produce, but still provides them with the benefit of an actual physical product. EPs are also (ideally) great for getting a taste of an artist without spending a lot of money (except this isn't the case because you've got acts like Porcupine Tree selling EPs for $18.99, knowing they can). What I think is silly is when a band makes an hour-long album and then calls it an EP. That makes no sense. To me, that's like writing a 100,000 word piece of fiction and then calling it a short story. Anyway, to answer the original question, "Why not make a full album," I think there's plenty of ways to answer this: 1. The band only has 20 minutes of quality material. 2. The band does not want to add another 20 minutes of filler (and God bless them for that). 3. Fans might appreciate a "snack" to hold them over (as the original poster mentioned). 4. The material might serve as a standalone concept and the artists do not want to distract attention from it by adding additional material. 5. The band might like to try something out of their "comfort zone" (for lack of a better term). ------------- https://epignosis.bandcamp.com/album/a-month-of-sundays" rel="nofollow - https://epignosis.bandcamp.com/album/a-month-of-sundays |
Posted By: The Sleepwalker
Date Posted: January 02 2010 at 11:46
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The post above me explains a lot I guess. I also would like to add that a bunch of B-sides and leftover tracks also can make an EP. Radiohead is a nice example of this, as they've released quite a few of those EP's, of which some sound very good IMO. ------------- 
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Posted By: NotAProghead
Date Posted: January 02 2010 at 14:08
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A good EP is better than a bad album, so if artists decide to release them, why not. By the way, many RPI classics like PFM's "Storia di un minuto" or "Per un amico" are, according to today's standards, closer to EPs than to albums. ------------- Who are you and who am I to say we know the reason why... (D. Gilmour) |
Posted By: clarke2001
Date Posted: January 02 2010 at 14:08
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Without trying to be offensive or patronizing: Sleeper, have you ever been in a band? Creating music is not something that happens in quantums of an album-length. Moreover, various issues - time, money, label policy, artistic statement (or lack thereof) , advertising, might move a band along with tidal ups and downs, for good or for bad. Every piece of musical package, an unit - hence art - is legitimate and it serves various purposes. The length may vary from 5 minute single to quadruple albums. And it's all fine, there's something for everyone. Everything else Epignosis summed up really well. ------------- |
Posted By: TheGazzardian
Date Posted: January 02 2010 at 21:58
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Why do bands go into the studio to only record single disc albums? I think it's a waste of time if they don't record enough material for a double disc album. With enough bonus material for a third disc. And a making of DVD. And a full length feature film loosely based on the lyrical content of the album (or based on the abstract that inspired the music, etc.). And a novel based on the film, written in such a way to not only spawn a sequel, but generate a storyverse including the ability to produce action figures, posters, and multimedia based on the book (including, preferably, more double albums + bonus content + making of dvds). :D
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Posted By: Moatilliatta
Date Posted: January 03 2010 at 00:01
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I'm in concurrence with Epignosis and clarke. There are several reasons which those two have explained very well.
What's your beef with the EP? I for one love having EPs around. Often times I want to listen to music but only have a small amount of time to do so and therefore don't want to start a full-length.
Having been in a couple bands, I know that there are times where you have some strokes of inspiration and you come up with 3-4 songs that you really feel good about. When those ideas are fresh and you are still really excited about them is sometimes, if not most times, the best time to go into the studio. If you let that material sit around while you work on more material, the other material might lose its relevance or you might lose your interest for a while. Sometimes that works in your advantage (Radiohead's "Nude" had been in the works since OK Computer) and sometimes it doesn't (I've heard plenty of demo recordings that could have been great songs had they been properly recorded). ------------- www.last.fm/user/ThisCenotaph  
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Posted By: JD
Date Posted: January 03 2010 at 00:16
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In a nut shell it can be summed up in one work "MONEY". The cost of recording music is not cheap. Unless the band is doing it in their own studio on their own equipment, pro studio time is insanely expensive. Now add a producer's wage and the engineer's wage, and the more time you spend the more money you spend. Manufacturing costs are for the most part flat. Whether it's 1 song or 20, once the music is done (except for packaging) the cost is pretty much is static. As stated in some previous posts, for indie bands it's a great jumping off point to get the gums wagging, For signed bands it's a marketing tool to get more money from the fan/collector/completest and perhaps unload some of the rather dubious tracks that would garner the ire of reviewers. That being said, Peter Gabriel released a number of EP's around the Security time with extended tracks and remixes. These would never really fit into an album proper except possibly as "Bonus Tracks". In the case of these tracks specifically, I believe the intent was to give a "Club" version to DJ's. Most regular fans would more than likely be disgusted by the repetitive nature of the music as well as the heavy rhythm section in the mix since that's not what his music is most known for. ------------- Thank you for supporting independently produced music |
Posted By: Kestrel
Date Posted: January 03 2010 at 00:24
| I wish there were more EPs than 80-minute CDs. |
Posted By: Dean
Date Posted: January 03 2010 at 07:59
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One of the other reasons for releasing EPs is nothing to do with full length albums, but with singles. Many labels wanted their bands to release singles: for a bit of chart success; some radio-play; recognition in the music press; to advertise a new album or to bolster sales of an existing one. Historically Prog bands didn't like singles much, so some released longer-format singles in the form of EPs and this tradition continues to some extent, though bands now have their own reasons for releasing them, or just tack them onto the album as a bonus disc (Riverside's Rapid Eye Movement for example) or as a later release (eg PT's Nil Recurring). In the UK during the 90s Mansun had a modicome of chart success on both the singles and album charts and in their brief career released 14 EPs but only 4 singles.
------------- What? |
Posted By: d.o.k
Date Posted: January 03 2010 at 11:41
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I'm really surprised by the title of this thread : is there a point ? Of course there is ! The money part has already been discussed, but artistically speaking there is not A point, but many different points possible. - An EP can reflect a specific period of a band (just like an LP). If a band has spent 6 months on electronic music whereas is mainly a folk-rock, the bandmates may want to release this material separately from their usual music. If there is 45 min of music go for an LP, but if it's more 15/20 min it's an EP. - Mogwai did release the EP "My father my king" (a 20min track) right after their 40 min album "Rock action", while they could have released a 60min album. It may be a pure commercial thing, but I also can imagine they didn't want to merge a very unified group of songs (the album "rock action") with M.F.M.K. which is quite different material. ------------- my band : http://lgab.tk - http://lgab.tk |
Posted By: FusionKing
Date Posted: January 05 2010 at 08:12
| An EP full of new or unreleased songs is great. However, I don't really understand the musical value of EP's which have work on them which has already been released for the most part. The latter, I feel is nothing more than a collector's item. |
Posted By: J-Man
Date Posted: February 14 2010 at 14:29
That's a spot-on explanation!  ------------- 
Check out my YouTube channel! http://www.youtube.com/user/demiseoftime" rel="nofollow - http://www.youtube.com/user/demiseoftime |
Epignosis wrote:Posted By: Queen By-Tor
Date Posted: February 14 2010 at 18:51
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I just bought an EP from one of my favorite bands because A - it was on vinyl B - it has a "rarity" b-side on it. Collector's items, nothing more. We buy them, others may not. I'm even listening to an EP right now on vinyl (3 tracks on 2 sides) before having seen this thread. |
Posted By: The Pessimist
Date Posted: February 15 2010 at 05:04
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Well let's put it this way: I'm releasing an EP sometime soon of 3 songs, that are not going to be included on my album that will be released in October. An EP, for me, is just a way to release your music that won't fit on an album, for whatever reason, whether it be time, or stylistic differences. ------------- "Market value is irrelevant to intrinsic value." Arnold Schoenberg |
Posted By: Slartibartfast
Date Posted: February 15 2010 at 07:30
At first glance, I thought this thread was "ELP, is there a point?" 
------------- Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened... 
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Posted By: Dean
Date Posted: February 15 2010 at 07:48
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would that be a retorical question? ------------- What? |
Posted By: Kashmir75
Date Posted: February 15 2010 at 21:20
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Dream Theater- A Change Of Seasons
Porcupine Tree- Nil Recurring
Pain of Salvation- Linoleum
Oceansize- Home and Minor
All EPs, all great IMO. I'd rather have 20 minutes of good material than 75 of filler tracks. ------------- Hello, mirror. So glad to see you, my friend. It's been a while... |