Who plays music or understands theory?
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Forum Name: Music and Musicians Exchange
Forum Description: Talk with and get feedback from other musicians on the site
URL: http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=63299
Printed Date: November 25 2024 at 13:10
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Topic: Who plays music or understands theory?
Posted By: cyclysm748
Subject: Who plays music or understands theory?
Date Posted: December 02 2009 at 23:14
| I am just curious if most readers on here play music themselves, or know much music theory and what is going on in the music. I just get the feeling that many people on here know a lot about theory and music. I'm not saying it's better to know these things, as you don't need to play or understand theory to love music, though it certainly helped me enjoy music more. I myself am studying music in college. Just curious. |
Replies:
Posted By: progkidjoel
Date Posted: December 02 2009 at 23:19
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I played piano for quite a while, but I haven't been learning/playing much for a year now.
I lost interest in theory, mainly because it seemed like a small annoyance more than a useful tool. After a certain point it gets ridiculous for me. Welcome to PA 
-Joel ------------- 
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Posted By: cyclysm748
Date Posted: December 02 2009 at 23:20
| Yeah, I get what you're saying ProgKidJoel, I am in the upper levels of theory now, and it seems to get a little overanalytical. Thanks for the welcome. My brothers name is Joel. |
Posted By: SaltyJon
Date Posted: December 02 2009 at 23:21
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Several of us play music and/or understand theory. There's a thread you may want to visit if you're curious to find out who all plays what, etc.: http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=3874 - http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=3874 ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Salty_Jon" rel="nofollow"> 
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Posted By: Henry Plainview
Date Posted: December 02 2009 at 23:21
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I play piano (poorly), and I passed Music Theory 101, but I can't hear the different technical things when listening, and I don't know how other people can. ------------- if you own a sodastream i hate you |
Posted By: jplanet
Date Posted: December 02 2009 at 23:24
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I am mostly self-taught when it comes to theory - I know enough to know what key I'm in, find the melodies and chord progressions I hear in my head, have my favorite modes to improvise with, etc...
------------- https://www.facebook.com/ShadowCircus/" rel="nofollow - ..::welcome to the shadow circus::.. |
Posted By: rpe9p
Date Posted: December 02 2009 at 23:28
| I think it is much more common for people who like prog to be musicians, however personally I dont know a thing about music other than that I like to listen to it |
Posted By: topofsm
Date Posted: December 02 2009 at 23:41
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I'm a high school student but I understand music theory better than most people my age. The thing is I love knowing what things sound like. For example when I hear a whole tone scale run I find it very exciting to hear that unusual choice of notes, not only because it sounds cool but because I know what's going on. I love hearing a few bars and listening to the chord changes and trying to pick them out. I love listening to a song and getting confused by the rhythm, and depending on how unusual the time signature is I get a big thrill out of figuring it out. I can understand why some people don't like it, but I find it fascinating. Of course, there's some music theory where you just have to learn the names of crap (Inversions on triads, the names of the note steps, stuff like that) that to me are pretty much a waste of time. ------------- 
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Posted By: The Runaway
Date Posted: December 02 2009 at 23:41
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I had one real lesson of theory but I picked up most of what I know from my aficionado piano player friend, who is a theory genius. I play guitar, bass, drums, keyboards, flute, mandolin and glockenspiel. I actually have a thread for my own music in Music and Musicians Exchange. ------------- http://www.formspring.me/Aragorn224" rel="nofollow - Trendsetter win! The search for nonexistent perfection. |
Posted By: Moogtron III
Date Posted: December 03 2009 at 04:01
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I had general music theory for two years (playing recorder) and 9 years of claasical piano training, and I followed some courses afterwards (classical; improvising) I play piano and synth, and play in a band, and still find some time to compose for a three man outfit (two synth players and drums) |
Posted By: The Pessimist
Date Posted: December 03 2009 at 07:21
I'm an almost concert standard pianist and intermediate guitarist, and I do know my way around theory pretty well I suppose. Mainly harmony and chord progressions, and a bit about complex polyrhythms/meters and the like. I hate to err... blow my own trumpet but ye know 
------------- "Market value is irrelevant to intrinsic value." Arnold Schoenberg |
Posted By: Negoba
Date Posted: December 03 2009 at 08:15
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I know a moderate amount of theory. It's very helpful for me because my natural ear is average at best. I've worked on that aspect of my musicianship too, but theory saves my rear in lots of situations. I think knowing the basics of how I ii iii IV V iv iivo I and circle of fifths and basic stuff like that probably should be under the belt of anyone who wants to be a serious musician. There's a lot more out there which I find useful, but not everyone will want to spend their time on. ------------- You are quite a fine person, and I am very fond of you. But you are only quite a little fellow, in a wide world, after all. |
Posted By: Abstrakt
Date Posted: December 03 2009 at 10:59
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Plays bass, keyboards (&guitar) Pretty good at learning stuff by ear Knowns enough music theory, i know far from everything. Oh, and mostly self-taught |
Posted By: Pekka
Date Posted: December 03 2009 at 11:08
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I play drums, bass, guitar and a tiny bit of keys, self taught except for a couple of guitar lessons six or so years ago. I've recorded some tracks (one I'm working on right now) which are available for download here: http://www.last.fm/music/I+Am+Three+People - http://www.last.fm/music/I+Am+Three+People I know barely anything about theory, perhaps some simplest stuff on rhythm and harmonics. ------------- http://www.progarchives.com/album.asp?id=42652" rel="nofollow - It's on PA! 
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Posted By: Equality 7-2521
Date Posted: December 03 2009 at 11:43
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I've been playing keyboard for a few months and have studied Theory independently in the past. I know basic stuff, but my ear isn't too trained so I suffer there. ------------- "One had to be a Newton to notice that the moon is falling, when everyone sees that it doesn't fall. " |
Posted By: Ricochet
Date Posted: December 03 2009 at 11:59
heh --- I play the piano, and study music in all its major fields (except composition). ------------- 
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Henry Plainview wrote:Posted By: Negoba
Date Posted: December 03 2009 at 12:02
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Pessimist posted videos of his piano playing once...holy cow.
Steve Vai and Satriani know so much theory it's ridiculous. I don't think it hurt them. ------------- You are quite a fine person, and I am very fond of you. But you are only quite a little fellow, in a wide world, after all. |
Posted By: TODDLER
Date Posted: December 03 2009 at 12:35
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I give guitar lessons and teach the proper dosage of music theory along with it. The problem that I run into quite often is that parents desire more for their child to read and dismiss the hard working process that goes into developing techniques on the instrument. I played various styles of guitar playing for more than 30 years. Woopy do! Now I sit at home with the kids and work on Wes Montgomery pieces. My musical ear was fully developed from hearing my uncles play jazz piano around the house. My father played jazz guitar in the 30's and 40's.. When I worked with showbands I would tape the chord charts to the stage floor as I only had 3 days to memorize 65 show tunes. I worked with a guy from New York that was multi talented. He taught me the N.Y. musicians short hand method of writing chord charts and reading them. I had a lot of primitive culture type musical training as well from blues and jazz musicians on the road. I told once that I sounded like a Dennis Sandoli student. Sandoli was an avant-garde composer and a master of guitar in Philadelphia. He would not except me for a student due to the simple fact that I was mostly a wrist kinda guy. At the age of 28 he wanted me to start all over and use the fore-arm. I use the fore-arm a bit when I play John McLaughlin pieces. But for Alan Holdsworth or Wes Montgomery I don't. He saw that as a flaw. So that was a bit of a blow. |
Posted By: Slartibartfast
Date Posted: December 03 2009 at 12:35
I do not believe in the theory of music because it's just a theory after all.  However I do play. I have tried book lessons and even a live instructor before but never got very far. I love to improvise and found I could do things much more interesting than the lessons. ------------- Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened... 
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Posted By: TODDLER
Date Posted: December 03 2009 at 13:06
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Posted By: Slartibartfast
Date Posted: December 03 2009 at 13:22
Interesting, I think I have developed a natural ear many years ago just from all the music I'd listened to. I still can't play guitar chords for sh*t.  Fairly good at arpeggios though. I like to play guitar and synthesizer. I almost always do improv with the synth, but I've probably played acoustic guitar mostly over the years just because you don't have to crank up an amp and it's easy to pick up and put down. What can I say? I'm just a dabbler, but I can get pretty good when I'm in the mood. Unfortunately my house was flooded in September and my amp, sampler, and guitar effects box were ruined. My synth and electric guitar survived though, so I'm not complaining. (I carried out the acoustic through the flood waters.) Any suggestions for a good multi-purpose amp would be appreciated. I never used the sequencer much so am thinking about replacing it with a sequencer as I only play with myself. ------------- Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...
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Posted By: moshkito
Date Posted: December 03 2009 at 13:26
I play a little, not enough to write home to mom about or to impress my friends.
When it comes to theory, I am not a music major but I am an art major ... so to speak ... and have a BFA ...
Personally I have no beef with music theory, except one detail ... ALL theory is designed/define after the fact, and it is amazing, that some folks will try to define music --- aka progressive -- as something that "should" have this and that ... to be "progressive" ... and that is actually a bad thing, and is intimidating to the most important thing about ALL music that has been around forever ... people's desire and intuition for wanting to do something with an instrument ... and basically being told ... that it is'nt good, and not "worthy" ... because it is compared to a theoretical something or other ... that is more representative of what once "WAS" ... than it is representative of what "IS" ....
Theory makes sense a lot of times ... it helps you see the flow and the progress and process of music over thousands of years ... but to think that the only way that you can "understand?know" music is by knowing theory, is to inadvertantly dis-respecting all the creative forces and minds that have ever been ... in essence they were all a "reaction" to the known "rules" ...
Music history is not "kind" to creativity ... in general ... it is almost the same here ... it's never good enough because ... it doesn't have this or that ... I always send people to go see "Amadeus" so you can see the same thing at a different time ... when the line ... "too many notes ... " is said about Mozart's new piece ... it's still the same today ... exactly the same ... nothing has changed.
It will ALWAYS be about the music itself ... never the theory ... ------------- Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told! www.pedrosena.com |
Posted By: The Pessimist
Date Posted: December 03 2009 at 19:12
Haha, I'm gonna take that as a compliment Negoba and thank you as well Yeah, if anything I think it makes them both a cut above the rest. Add Ron Jarzombek to that list (he's very hot on theory as well) and you've pretty much got the technically best guitarists in the world in my opoinion. ------------- "Market value is irrelevant to intrinsic value." Arnold Schoenberg |
Posted By: TODDLER
Date Posted: December 03 2009 at 21:20
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[QUOTE=Slartibartfast] . I still can't play guitar chords for sh*t. Fairly good at arpeggios though. I like to play guitar and synthesizer. I almost always do improv with the synth, but I've probably played acoustic guitar mostly
If you ever decide to expand on chord knowledge, don't forget to try mountain chords. This is an old term used by Jon Field and Tony Duhig from Jade Warrior. Most of them are 5 to 7 fret stretches with fingers placed on the E6th, A string, and D string and sometimes the G string. The idea is to create an atmospheric sound by opening your left hand up and playing the G,B,and E1st strings open. Sometimes just the B and E1st. On acoustic guitar it creates a very tranquill climate. I'm not sure if this style of chord work originated in the Asian mountains. Perhaps it did. It is a difficult feat to identify certain techniques that derive from Asian music or just Ancient music in general. All I know is if you sit on a mountain or in an open meadow with an acoustic and proceed to play these kinds of open chords, everything falls into place. Some of the same chord voicings are used in open tunings by Michael Hedges and Nick Drake.
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Posted By: Slartibartfast
Date Posted: December 03 2009 at 21:49
| Thanks for the tip, I'll give it a try. I can do the C chord OK, its the one I do to check if it's in tune. |
Posted By: Easy Money
Date Posted: December 03 2009 at 22:13
I don't know if you are still checking your thread or not, but if you were still looking for people who studied theory, I have a master's degree, but learning how to play jazz really makes it all practical and more memorable. |
Posted By: cyclysm748
Date Posted: December 03 2009 at 23:19
| Easy Money-Heck yes I am still checking this thread. Masters degree, wow. Yeah, theory is very important in jazz, though I'm not the greatest improviser at this point. What instrument do you play? |
Posted By: laplace
Date Posted: December 04 2009 at 03:47
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I've been playing keyboard for fifteen years and managed to learn more about how music works than how to really play it very well ;p my favourite instrument right now is the nintendo entertainment system, ala http://8bitcollective.com/music/Zan-zan-zawa-veia/Bull+Rush/ - this song I wrote . composed on keyboard and then reimagined for something I like the sound of better. ------------- FREEDOM OF SPEECH GO TO HELL |
Posted By: Easy Money
Date Posted: December 04 2009 at 08:19
I play kybds, I guess you play guitar. Where are you going to school? |
Posted By: LOUDTRAX
Date Posted: December 04 2009 at 08:41
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Studied Classical Piano, DEC in Music, and played keys in a progressive metal band. Don't play as much any more, but still have my little studio and toy around. I think most prog fans are musicians. Let's face it, you just appreciate it more than if you are a casual music fan. too bad most people who run the music business have never touch an instrument in their lives! ------------- www.Loudtrax.com |
Posted By: Trademark
Date Posted: December 04 2009 at 08:47
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I have a Master's in Miusic Composition & Theory, A Master's in Music History and my doctorate in Interdisciplinary Arts with a focus in Music Aesthetics and Philosophy so, yeah, I've had a course or two (and taught a course or two) in theory. I'll echo Easy Money's question, where are you studying? If you're at Kearney there are some folks you can say hello to for me.
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Posted By: infandous
Date Posted: December 04 2009 at 09:41
I've played guitar and sung for 20 years. Primarily by ear, though I did have guitar lessons for the first two years I played. But that was mostly learning songs, chords, scales, and some improv. I also took piano lessons for a semester in college, where I learned basic sight reading, but I've pretty much forgotten all that now  I do feel that more theory would have helped me, as I feel that much of my music lacks melodic development. Though I can impress my friends with my fast fretting and crazy chord structures. I do feel somewhat limited by my lack of musical knowledge, but I also feel like I've created some interesting music partly due to this lack of knowledge (i.e., not knowing the "rules"). I assume I must have a fairly good ear, as I usually have little trouble figuring out how to play things by listening to them a few times and working it out. This isn't the case with a Satriani solo though, however Gilmore and Hackett I've always been able to work out. Mostly though, I prefer to come up with my own stuff and I generally improvise solos. When recording, I will often do several takes, and kind of "learn" the solo that I think works best and then use that as the final version. |
Posted By: Slartibartfast
Date Posted: December 04 2009 at 10:25
Wow, you must have some heavy calluses on your ear. |
Posted By: Bj-1
Date Posted: December 04 2009 at 10:33
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Im a self-taught drummer, very good at learning by listening although I never studied much theory.
Main inluences are Phil Collins, Bill Bruford, Daniel Denis, Christian Vander, Mark Zonder and Billy Cobham!
 ------------- RIO/AVANT/ZEUHL - The best thing you can get with yer pants on! |
Posted By: Abstrakt
Date Posted: December 04 2009 at 13:01
Wouldn't it be fun if we jammed sometime? |
Posted By: infandous
Date Posted: December 04 2009 at 13:09
Well, I figured if Hendrix could use his tongue, why couldn't I use my ear? |
Posted By: Slartibartfast
Date Posted: December 04 2009 at 14:18
If anyone's interested, here's my keyboard:Kawai • K1 The K1 is one of Kawai's most economic digital synthesizers in the K-series. The K1 has 256 digital samples of waveforms, 50 of which are from acoustic instruments. You combine up to four wave shapes to create very new and unique sounds. The K1 is capable of very good acoustic recreation, excellent unique synth sounds or at times, completely noisy walls of complex sound. Here's my first one: info from the link below Korg • Poly-61 The Korg Poly-61 was released in 1982 as the successor to the Polysix. It was somewhat of a step up from the Polysix, as it has 2 DCOs for better reliability. It also retained the arpeggiator of the Polysix. It has a very dirty sharp sound much like the http://www.vintagesynth.com/yamaha/dx7.php - Yamaha DX7 . This is good if you are into the lo-fi sound of electronica. The Poly-61 can provide cool gritty basses or trippy analog sounds and fx. Also added is the familiar Korg joystick, which can be used to modulate the VCO or the VCF. However, its filter only has 7 steps of resonance and is not as fat as the Polysix's filter. It also uses the same method of programming the Poly-800 and Yamaha DX-7 use, so it's not a very useful synth for real-time-tweaking junkies. The first Poly-61s didn't have MIDI, but the Poly-61M released in 1984 corrects this. Overall, the Poly-61 is still a decent synth, and it can be acquired for practically nothing! It has been used by FM Static and The Faint. http://www.vintagesynth.com - http://www.vintagesynth.com ------------- Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...
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Posted By: Petrovsk Mizinski
Date Posted: December 05 2009 at 01:29
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I play guitar and bass guitar. I know the modes of the major scale pretty much inside out and also know the chord scale relationships as a result of studying that stuff. I know a bit about counterpoint, chord/arpeggio substitution and a few other concepts.
I can definitely agree with this. I can work out stuff like the outro instrumental section of White Walls or some Buckethead guitar solos by ear, and to many people that's considered impressive (but I don't particularly think so haha), and I did put in a fair bit of work to get to that level with my ear but I put on something like Allan Holdsworth or say, Shawn Lane's really jazz fusion-y moments and that sh*t just goes way above my head, I just can't hear what's going on. I can listen to it and appreciate the beauty in it, but is it a lydian flat 7 scale, or an altered scale going on kinda thing? I really just don't have a clue. I also don't really understand that kind of music theory a lot of jazzers and fusioners know either, but then again I have no plans to venture outside rock and metal anyway haha |
Posted By: Time Signature
Date Posted: December 05 2009 at 10:29
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I play music and am involved in a number of projects in my spare time; I know a bit of theory
------------- This user has left the PA fora, but will occasionally post reviews so as to support artists. |
Posted By: Guitar1Jesse
Date Posted: December 05 2009 at 10:38
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I've been playing guitar for almost 17 years and I also dabble with other instruments (for purposes of recording). I was much more into theory in my late teens and early twenties, but I do know a moderate amount.
------------- Take a few minutes and listen to this! http://www.myspace.com/jlangmusic |
Posted By: cyclysm748
Date Posted: December 05 2009 at 12:05
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@Trade Mark and Easy Money I am studying at a small school in North Dakota, Minot State University. I am studying trumpet and majoring in Music Education. But yeah, I also play guitar just for fun. Where is Kearney?
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Posted By: himtroy
Date Posted: December 05 2009 at 13:38
| I CAN play any instrument you'd really involve in most band setups. I actually am proficient on guitar, harmonica, organ, and synth. And i'm currently in a band that started with me on guitar, but now i'm almost always on organ and synth. I have been taking theory classes for a few years and am going to college next year and either majoring or minoring in music. |
Posted By: Trademark
Date Posted: December 05 2009 at 18:29
Cyclsym: sorry, my mistake. For some reason I was reading North Dakota and thinking Nebraska  which is where Kearney is located. |
Posted By: Abstrakt
Date Posted: December 06 2009 at 06:48
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Just jammed together some awesome riffs on bass! They're in D-tuning and would work in Grunge, Heavy Blues Rock, Sabbath-sounding-Metal, psychedelic rock or Stoner rock.  |
Posted By: Petrovsk Mizinski
Date Posted: December 07 2009 at 00:03
You must wake up in the morning and tell yourself you're a special boy. |
Posted By: The Pessimist
Date Posted: December 07 2009 at 10:44
------------- "Market value is irrelevant to intrinsic value." Arnold Schoenberg |