What Does Dream Theater Need to Do? (Musically)
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Forum Name: Prog Bands, Artists and Genres Appreciation
Forum Description: Discuss specific prog bands and their members or a specific sub-genre
URL: http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=58618
Printed Date: February 22 2025 at 13:37
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Topic: What Does Dream Theater Need to Do? (Musically)
Posted By: darkshade
Subject: What Does Dream Theater Need to Do? (Musically)
Date Posted: June 08 2009 at 13:35
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well? personally, i think they would benefit from throwing a little jazz into their mix of prog rock/metal. im not saying they should have walking basslines everywhere and screaming sax, but adding a little jazz vocabulary and voicing would make their music a little more interesting. Im saying more of the fusion influence than "traditional" jazz. Maybe even throw in some funky lines (you knoow they can do it) on the other hand, i could see them royally F**king it up, and going for cliche chord progressions and obvious Charlie Parker licks on guitar. "we wear our influences on our sleeeeeeves!!" i think they should check out their ex-mates band Planet X for inspiration, or Garaj Mahal. Id say other (older) fusion artists, but the band knows these bands, they listen to them. or maybe they dont because "we wear our influences on our sleeeeeeves!!" ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/MysticBoogy" rel="nofollow - My Last.fm 
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Replies:
Posted By: jplanet
Date Posted: June 08 2009 at 13:56
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I could see them doing some jazz "interludes" the same way Transatlantic did, but as a direction of the band that would seem weird to me. If anything, it would be interesting seeing them do something purely atmospheric, a la Sigur Ros...I long to see Petrucci just going nuts with feedback and distortion, creating textures with effects instead of so many precisely-executed scales... Although, It's strange to me to speculate about what a band "should" do - unless it's a member of the band making that speculation - they should do whatever they feel good about doing, and hopefully challenge themselves and their listeners along the way. It's another thing to think of a specific goal, such as, what do they need to do to win a bigger audience, or what do they need to do for their music to be more enjoyable to me personally (for me it would involve dropping all of the double-kick stuff, and more soulful soloing)... ------------- https://www.facebook.com/ShadowCircus/" rel="nofollow - ..::welcome to the shadow circus::.. |
Posted By: Visitor13
Date Posted: June 08 2009 at 14:12
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For a start, they should get a bassist. They should look somewhere more interesting for inspiration. Petrucci used to be able to play surprisingly decent Holdsworth-style solos. I wouldn't mind an album of songs in the style of "Trail of Tears" (never going to happen, I know). |
Posted By: Mr ProgFreak
Date Posted: June 08 2009 at 14:25
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And you have to discuss this two weeks before the album is released because ...
------------- https://tagyourmusic.org/users/Mike" rel="nofollow - https://tagyourmusic.org/users/Mike |
Posted By: Visitor13
Date Posted: June 08 2009 at 14:30
Because there is still time to implement the changes we suggest  |
Mr ProgFreak wrote:Posted By: Kyo
Date Posted: June 08 2009 at 14:39
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They should try writing lyrics to a song first, then come up with music that fits. ------------- "Freedom in the 21st Century means being incommunicado." http://www.relocator-project.com" rel="nofollow"> 
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Posted By: The T
Date Posted: June 08 2009 at 15:20
I'd suggest you understand the fact that these people (DT) are 40 years old and they don't need to adapt themselves for the needs of younger generations or of anybody for that matter. If they don't play what you think they should play, it will always be like that. So I suggest instead of suffering because they " wear their influences on their sleeeeeves" why don't you buy records you actually enjoooooooy?
I just don't understand why this happens only with DT...
maybe because people realize the talent they have and wish they played more to their tastes... or even because commercial success breeds hate and jealosy... I have no idea.... I've yet to understand why... apparently, DT is in the mouth of everybody here, haters or lovers.... ------------- 
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Posted By: Alitare
Date Posted: June 08 2009 at 15:31
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Which is exactly why I am only a casual fan. Kinda like them, kinda don't. I'd never ask a band to do what I want. I mean, what I want, in the end, could be worse than what they give me, for me. What the hell do I know? I am not them. At any rate, I preferred their I&W-SDOIT era, and nothing else really got to me. I don't expect anything else they make in the future to appeal to me, and that's ok. I fully agree with T. Now for some VDGG. |
Posted By: The T
Date Posted: June 08 2009 at 15:37
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^that makes sense. Believe me, I could start 92871 threads like "What does The Mars Volta need to do?" (and my answer would be get rid of the drummer and drop the caffeinne...but that's another story)... what would be the point?
Let's enjoy artists for what they are. Yes, let's criticize them, let's give opinions on their music... But let's quit this day-dreaming about how ideal they could be if they only played exactly like we, hardly musicians most of us, like them to play. -------------
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Posted By: The Quiet One
Date Posted: June 08 2009 at 16:43
| If DT does that with Rudess send me a PM guys!! I would really love to hear a more chill-out band, just like in Falling Into Infinity, Derek's jazzy tones are superb, even though they were few and shadowed in the mix!! |
Posted By: Slartibartfast
Date Posted: June 08 2009 at 17:01
It's so obvious, disco!!! 
------------- Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened... 
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Posted By: KingCrimson250
Date Posted: June 08 2009 at 17:03
Now that's not fair at all. You bash people for singling out Dream Theater, and then you go ahead and start specifically targeting Yes? Unbelievable  I think Dream Theater needs to do acid. And maybe spend some time bumming around India. I'll bet that would result in a whole new direction for them. |
Posted By: The T
Date Posted: June 08 2009 at 17:14
 No... this applies to all artists.... -------------
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Posted By: King Crimson776
Date Posted: June 08 2009 at 17:37
Well that's pretty much it for me, I've seen what they've done in the past and I've seen what they are capable of, so when they come out with the butt metal crap they're coming out with today... of course I'm going to say they should go back to being more progressive and interesting. I've been thinking that they should stress the "progressive" over the "metal" more, which is never what they've done, but I think they could do that well... I'm sure Mike Portnoy would be happy.
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Posted By: Alitare
Date Posted: June 08 2009 at 17:43
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"going back to progressive" Is it me, or is that statement inherently funny? (No offense to anyone) |
Posted By: rpe9p
Date Posted: June 08 2009 at 17:43
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Posted By: toolis
Date Posted: June 08 2009 at 17:46
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1.get rid of Jordan 2.get rid of La Brie 3.focus on the structure of the songs 4.stop making singles 5.shave 6.eggs 7.mil.... no wait, i got carried away... ------------- -music is like pornography... sometimes amateurs turn us on, even more... -sometimes you are the pigeon and sometimes you are the statue... |
Posted By: Epignosis
Date Posted: June 08 2009 at 17:54
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Dream Theater needs to lose the "bad ass" image. They're almost old enough to qualify for social security. Very few old men can pull of the bad ass thing. On that note, I think I should get them to play my son's upcoming second birthday party... ------------- https://epignosis.bandcamp.com/album/a-month-of-sundays" rel="nofollow - https://epignosis.bandcamp.com/album/a-month-of-sundays |
Posted By: The T
Date Posted: June 08 2009 at 18:04
Precisely... now how many old men have you ever seen change their ways?
 They will never change.... what we have is what we'll have....
If people really want to waste their time thinking how artists should change their styles (because is not that they listen to us anyway), at least do so for younger bands who may actually have change still as a possibility in their bloods.... -------------
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Posted By: LiquidEternity
Date Posted: June 08 2009 at 18:10
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They should do the same thing a lot of metal bands need to do, in my opinion: back off the solos a little bit. Man, I love solos. Guitar solos and bass solos and drum solos and keyboard solos and everything mixed in between. But I noticed this first with Symphony X and it applies to Dream Theater too. They need to back off the choppy instrumental bits somewhat. Not that they should get rid of them, by any means. But they have proven in the past and even through Systematic Chaos, they have shown that they can write good melodies, well-balanced songs, everything they need to be doing. But they do solo after solo that are written over some special riff just for the jam session that really detracts from the flow and feel of the rest of the song (biggest point in case, In the Name of God). These solos aren't usually a problem, but I just feel like they are so desperate to write big noodles that they sacrifice some of their best songs to do it. Just my opinion. And it's likely wrong, because I like Mike Patton. ------------- 
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Posted By: Epignosis
Date Posted: June 08 2009 at 18:17
You do realize my whole post was a joke, right? Well, except the "only a few old men can pull of the bad ass thing." That's true. ------------- https://epignosis.bandcamp.com/album/a-month-of-sundays" rel="nofollow - https://epignosis.bandcamp.com/album/a-month-of-sundays |
Posted By: Telinstryata
Date Posted: June 08 2009 at 18:19
We've got Pain of Salvation if we want some disco |
Posted By: Epignosis
Date Posted: June 08 2009 at 18:22
In all seriousness, I find Dream Theater to be precisely what I want in a prog metal band (at least since 1999). We'll see how I feel when the new album comes out, but I think their latter work is TONS better than their goofy Images & Words business. 
------------- https://epignosis.bandcamp.com/album/a-month-of-sundays" rel="nofollow - https://epignosis.bandcamp.com/album/a-month-of-sundays |
Posted By: The T
Date Posted: June 08 2009 at 18:32
Yes, I realized it was a joke. But with rings of true around it (they're old after all... )-------------
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Posted By: The Quiet One
Date Posted: June 08 2009 at 18:38
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I think you're being quite a bit extremist T, well at least from my point of view. Concerning your example about Zappa, he never played hip-hop nor black metal, while Dream Theater has played some jazzy things, which is something people would like to expect more from DT, and it's not something outrageous like asking black metal or hip-hop from Zappa. Maybe I'm not a expext on DT, but I know albums by them, and I know they did some jazzy stuff mixed with metal of course. I would really like if they once developed that side a bit more, or at least do that again. I'm not asking for them to do stuff ala Gentle Giant nor Magma, no, just wished if they could go a bit deeper in territories they once touched. |
Posted By: Alitare
Date Posted: June 08 2009 at 18:45
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I think we should hold Dream Theater captive a la The Prisoner, and force them to do any random genre or style we can think of on threat of torture. Make them record over and over, and force them into a grueling process of album creation, making sure each recording is absolutely perfect to our whims. But you can't forget how magical an imperfect album can be, over too accurate perfection, so we will also force them to be sloppy and imperfect like a band struggling to find itself in the slew of identities will will shove them into. And after the band members die, we'll release every recording they produced there as one extended song called "Dreams of a Theater" and it will be weeks long, in itself. I am a genius. |
Posted By: OzzProg
Date Posted: June 08 2009 at 18:48
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Bring in the London Philharmonic! That solves every band's low point in their careers. In all seriousness: 1. Turn up their Bass player's amp 2. Stop thinking about making quick cash on "Hit singles" 3. Get back to wicked ass keyboards like in "THE DANCE OF ETERNITY!" Woooo! -------------  |
Posted By: The T
Date Posted: June 08 2009 at 18:50
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^That's very reasonable (I agree my Zappa example was an exaggeration, as always necessary to drive a point home), but I also think that what many people always ask from DT is not just "play more this" or "more that", but "play this" or "play that". The band has shown us what they like to do. They have shown us what direction they'll take in the future. It's naive at this point to pretend that DT will suddenly become much more jazz-oriented or anything....
And the fact that is the only band that gets this treatment... -------------
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Posted By: The Pessimist
Date Posted: June 08 2009 at 19:00
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I think they need to start playing for the music instead of their own egos. You could say that I haven't heard much of them, and that would be true, but The Dance Of Eternity is all I need to hear.
------------- "Market value is irrelevant to intrinsic value." Arnold Schoenberg |
Posted By: Slartibartfast
Date Posted: June 08 2009 at 19:04
Did you ever hear the Dr. Koop song on Broadway The Hardway or the Michael Jackson song on the same? ------------- Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...
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Posted By: Epignosis
Date Posted: June 08 2009 at 19:04
You know what? A plus right there. Myung is a fantastic bassist, but you'd almost never know it. Portnoy drowns him out every time. Dream Theater does not need singles if they're making solid albums (and they are). And yes, Rudess is excellent, especially when he uses various tones (instead of the electric guitar clone). ------------- https://epignosis.bandcamp.com/album/a-month-of-sundays" rel="nofollow - https://epignosis.bandcamp.com/album/a-month-of-sundays |
Posted By: The Quiet One
Date Posted: June 08 2009 at 19:14
Yeah the 'electric guitar tone' is pretty boring. Some Hammond wouldn't do any wrong you know |
Posted By: OzzProg
Date Posted: June 08 2009 at 19:20
At times if you are just causally listening, you can mistake keyboards for guitar. I also think they should ditch the whole "Bad ass Metal Band" attitude. Many (no, not all) Metal heads dismiss Dream Theater as poppy fluff. Even if they are good, they shouldn't try and be like that crowd, they are distinctly different. (did you see that promo picture they released just before this new album! AHHH!) ------------- |
Posted By: KingCrimson250
Date Posted: June 08 2009 at 19:22
I can't really think of any jazzy things that DT played, unless you count Another Day, their tribute to Kenny G. What songs were you thinking of? |
Posted By: The Quiet One
Date Posted: June 08 2009 at 19:27
Derek Sherinian-era: Falling into Infinity has some slightly jazz touches, which are magnificent, though would be greater if they were levelled-up in the mix. |
Posted By: el böthy
Date Posted: June 08 2009 at 19:28
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What does Dream Theater need to do? How about what their fans need to do? Like not being such little bitches about every f**king album they release asking "what they need to do?" ... just a thought  ------------- "You want me to play what, Robert?" 
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Posted By: Epignosis
Date Posted: June 08 2009 at 19:31
Well, that's what I mean. Is that dark, bad ass image really necessary? Every metal band almost tries to pull it off...what if you're just a meek computer programmer with acne but can shred your grandmother's head off? ------------- https://epignosis.bandcamp.com/album/a-month-of-sundays" rel="nofollow - https://epignosis.bandcamp.com/album/a-month-of-sundays |
Posted By: jplanet
Date Posted: June 08 2009 at 19:50
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If it wasn't for their metal leanings, in both image and sound, we wouldn't even be talking about them right now. The vast majority of Dream Theater fans are metal fans - as prog fans, we make up only a very tiny subset of their audience...Metal sells. Prog doesn't. This is the same reason Opeth, Devin Townsend, and Porcupine Tree have achieved greater popularity compared to Flower Kings, Spock's Beard, etc. They all have a sound that can be marketed as "metal". The only non-metal prog bands that can afford to tour regularly are the ones that have a legacy dating back to the 70's (Yes, Jethro Tull). Otherwise, as large a community as this site appears to have, we're not even a blip on the map of any record executive. ------------- https://www.facebook.com/ShadowCircus/" rel="nofollow - ..::welcome to the shadow circus::.. |
Posted By: Isa
Date Posted: June 08 2009 at 20:05
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Obviously the whole point of the thread is not to argue whether arguing about how a band should change they're style is pointless to argue or not. The point of the thread is each person's opinion of what musical direction the band should go. I personally agree that adding some jazz-fusion or textural metal influences would be a good way to spice up their music, if it worked out alright in the end. I think their getting a bit static in their music, not horribly, but enough to feel like I'm hearing mostly the same stuff repeated. But then again, the whole point of Dream Theater (as much as I like their music) seems to be to combine prog stereotypes with metal, period. There's nothing truly experimental about their music, even if they've changed their sound a bit over the years. I would even argue they've made some of the greatest metal in history. But they're not developing today's musical landscape, they're rolling in the doe, and good for them. |
Posted By: King Crimson776
Date Posted: June 08 2009 at 20:12
lol, yeah but I mean go back to their previous state of being progressive (more the sound than the idea of progressing in music, because it is a sound at this point).
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Posted By: Progosopher
Date Posted: June 08 2009 at 22:34
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Dream Theater is what it is. They're not one of my favorites, but they do come up in circulation fairly regularly. I can only take them at face value. They do what they do, warts and all. I do find it intriguing that this band, more than any others perhaps, incites such love and hate, praise and riducule. I don't know why that is. What I like about them: Smokin' hot and great playing.
 What I don't like: Their songs. I find their lyrics trite, even though they try to be profound (but I have REALLY high standards for that sort of thing). The songs are written to accomodate the solos and the jams. Now, I really like solos and jams, but they tend to not be a strong basis for a good song.
 What I would change about them is to have them write better songs. Or just can the vocals entirely and do all instrumental. But then we would have Liquid Tension Experiment, and not Dream Theater.  Just my humble opnion.  ------------- The world of sound is certainly capable of infinite variety and, were our sense developed, of infinite extensions. -- George Santayana, "The Sense of Beauty" |
Posted By: KingCrimson250
Date Posted: June 08 2009 at 23:11
I agree with that, but it's interesting to note that on a metal-oriented forum that I'm on, a lot of the users (not all) seem just as displeased with DT's recent albums as we are. Which is ironic, I think, because a lot of the newer albums seem to be more catering to the metal fans. Despite that, they don't really seem to be catching a lot of new attention in the metal scene. I suppose DT's sense of what "heavy" is may be a little dated. As I Am, for example, is pretty heavy for maybe ten or fifteen years ago, but with what seems to be the rise of death metal in metal circles, it isn't really catching on. For example, I can almost guarantee you that if a metalhead had a prog metal album on a Top Ten Albums Of The Last Year Or So list (or whatever), it would probably be Watershed, not Systematic Chaos. |
Posted By: Marty McFly
Date Posted: June 09 2009 at 00:09
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it's interesting to read these ideas what DT should do. They will not, why ? Some of us know why :- ) god, this is funny topic ------------- There's a point where "avant-garde" and "experimental" becomes "terrible" and "pointless," -Andyman1125 on Lulu  Even my |
Posted By: Mr ProgFreak
Date Posted: June 09 2009 at 01:17
I resent this separation between metal fans and prog fans. People who like metal but not prog would never listen to a band like Dream Theater. ------------- https://tagyourmusic.org/users/Mike" rel="nofollow - https://tagyourmusic.org/users/Mike |
Posted By: progkidjoel
Date Posted: June 09 2009 at 01:25
A FELLOW BELIEVER! I believe what Kyo said would be fantastic, and, they should also make the bass audible, and John Myung should try to play less fast. He sounds muddy and undefined 90% of the time that you can hear him. ------------- 
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Posted By: toolis
Date Posted: June 09 2009 at 01:45
God, i hope this is a joke, too... ------------- -music is like pornography... sometimes amateurs turn us on, even more... -sometimes you are the pigeon and sometimes you are the statue... |
Posted By: topofsm
Date Posted: June 09 2009 at 02:03
Quoted for truth.
Even Systematic Chaos is not really geared for metalheads, rather for prog-metalheads instead of the general prog fanbase, even if prog-metalheads still don't enjoy it.
For one, "Forsaken" isn't a metal track, it's almost like Evanescence. "Repentance" and "Prophets of War" aren't metal either, though I could see a metal fan appreciating the former. TMOLS doesn't get metal until about halfway through, and both parts of ITPOE are way too proggy in structure for straight up metal fans to fully appreciate it. That leaves only "Constant Motion" and TDEN, the latter of which goes insanely technical and proggy so that any fan of traditional metal would go "This is crap".
I think the only album that a regular metal fan would appreciate is TOT. Obviously they aren't aiming for the metal fans. If anything, because of "Forsaken" being a single, their latest image trend, and the 'gothic' sound Rudess is talking about they are aiming for misunderstood 14 year girls now. ------------- 
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Posted By: Visitor13
Date Posted: June 09 2009 at 02:06
Actually that's perfect advice for DT. |
Posted By: theBox
Date Posted: June 09 2009 at 02:53
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I admit i have a love/hate relationship with the band. Their first period (IaW through FFI) is what got me into prog music in the first place. Since then, I have watched the band rapidly deteriorating in just about every aspect: Lyricwise (SFaM being the pinacle of BAD lyric writing), soundwise (why the crushing chuga-chuga riffs in 6D, ToT and SC?) and composition-wise (just about everything post SFaM with the exception of the brilliant 8V title track). The thing that saddens me the most is that just about every record 6D throu BC&sL has random moments of former brilliance on display, but they are way to few and far between. So what i'm trying to say is i believe the band still has talent but they need to retain their focus, take their time and let good ideas develop. Try some quality contol for heaven's sake! I believe it worked with octavarium (title track) it can happen again! Oh and PLEASE, step off the *ULTRA* heavy metal wagon, it is SO beneath you. Just my 2 cents... p.s. I had high expectations for BC&SL. I stand dissapointed once again... ------------- |
Posted By: friso
Date Posted: June 09 2009 at 03:06
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What they should do? The same thing as every modern band:
- get an organ and a mellotron
- no digital amplification for guitars, just Fender's and stompboxes
- Let Patrucci play on a strangly tuned guitar, maybe it would get more interesting.
For instance: E G C# G C D
- Try to make a record live in a mediumsized theatre withoud fans.
Seems like a plan to me.
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Posted By: theBox
Date Posted: June 09 2009 at 03:08
I love you man... ------------- |
Posted By: Alitare
Date Posted: June 09 2009 at 03:35
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I know. Pink Floyd sucks. They need to resurrect Rick. Until then, I can't be happy with any album they release in the future. Screw you, Pink Floyd, for not having necromantic capabilities. |
Posted By: Epignosis
Date Posted: June 09 2009 at 07:05
I now know this much is true: 1) You don't know me very well and 2) You don't read my reviews. ------------- https://epignosis.bandcamp.com/album/a-month-of-sundays" rel="nofollow - https://epignosis.bandcamp.com/album/a-month-of-sundays |
Posted By: Mr_Upside_Down
Date Posted: June 09 2009 at 07:06
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They need to hire an editor. Seriously, they should have someone outside the band critically review their work prior to publication - someone who they can trust and is capable of being brutally honest. IMO, with each album DT show an increasing tendency to kill otherwise good songs by forgetting the fundamental axiom that "less is more". They should try to get rid of all the pointless noodling and retain only their best instrumental breaks, delete those musical interludes that interrupt the mood and feel of the song, smooth out the time/tempo/mood changes that just don't work, rewrite some of their sillier lyrics, and drop the idea that an album has to be 80 minutes long just because you can fit that much music on a CD. I think someone needs to save DT from themselves... and I'm sure there's no shortage of volunteers! |
Posted By: Petrovsk Mizinski
Date Posted: June 09 2009 at 07:14
I've mentioned this before but if you can't hear Myung, buy new speakers. Seriously, listening through studio monitors, I can hear Myung perfectly. ------------- 
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Posted By: Petrovsk Mizinski
Date Posted: June 09 2009 at 07:17
Plenty of metal fans that don't care for prog at all yet like Dream Theater anyway. I go to enough heavy metal forums to see that this is true. -------------
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Posted By: Mr ProgFreak
Date Posted: June 09 2009 at 07:20
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^ I've yet to meet one. Of course not every DT fan will like Yes or Genesis, but come on ... show me a DT fan who likes none of the bands listed as prog here, and not rooted in metal.
------------- https://tagyourmusic.org/users/Mike" rel="nofollow - https://tagyourmusic.org/users/Mike |
Posted By: Petrovsk Mizinski
Date Posted: June 09 2009 at 07:21
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As far as I see it, Petrucci and Portnoy need to stop producing, because they aren't clearly not the best at the job. The band has the chops and talent to do almost anything, they need a real kick along by an inspired producer. They also need to ditch Paul Northfield. How a band with that much success under their belts and presumably enough money decide to hire the guy again even if his sound engineering skills are clearly not as good as some other metal producers beats me. Paul Northfield's mixes give this irritating sameness to the overall sound and it's partly what drove me away from really enjoying Systematic Chaos as much as I could have. -------------
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Posted By: UMUR
Date Posted: June 09 2009 at 07:30
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I agree that Portnoy and Petrucci should stop producing. The two best Dream Theater albums Images & Words and Awake were produced by others and it´s audible.
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Posted By: Epignosis
Date Posted: June 09 2009 at 07:37
I've listened through many different avenues, and it's rare that I can hear him clearly. Remember that most consumers don't have studio monitors to enjoy their music, so its up to the band to sound good on merely decent speakers. ------------- https://epignosis.bandcamp.com/album/a-month-of-sundays" rel="nofollow - https://epignosis.bandcamp.com/album/a-month-of-sundays |
Posted By: StyLaZyn
Date Posted: June 09 2009 at 07:54
Some would say they don't need to do anything. I am not one of those. I feel they have been wasting their Prog talents for quite some time. These guys should be able to write many different types of music, but they choose metal?!?  ------------- 
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Posted By: npjnpj
Date Posted: June 09 2009 at 07:54
| I like their music as it is. Why should I start bashing a band that has been giving me more pleasure and entertainment than the majority of other acts? I wouldn't want to change a thing and I hope they keep going for years. |
Posted By: moshkito
Date Posted: June 09 2009 at 07:55
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Hi,
The only thing that DT needs to do ... is
NEVER ... EVER ...
listen to armchair critics like us ... and concentrate on their own work.
So you think you can be a Picasso doing what you want? If so why aren't you doing it instead of being an armchair critic?
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Posted By: StyLaZyn
Date Posted: June 09 2009 at 07:56
LOL! Me too. I am not alone in this. -------------
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Posted By: mirco
Date Posted: June 09 2009 at 09:17
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Just a line to say that I sense a great deal of unfairness towards DT. Probably the most trashed band ever. ------------- Please forgive me for my crappy english! |
Posted By: StyLaZyn
Date Posted: June 09 2009 at 09:24
And why is this? -------------
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Posted By: friso
Date Posted: June 09 2009 at 10:02
I think this isn't true. The question is asked on a progressive rock forum, from that point of view there's a lot to say. They aren't the first band to get stuck in the same music over a period of time. They can use some feedback! We are the ones that consider buying their records.
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Posted By: mirco
Date Posted: June 09 2009 at 10:20
------------- Please forgive me for my crappy english! |
Posted By: StyLaZyn
Date Posted: June 09 2009 at 10:22
OK, you are just messing around with us, right? -------------
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Posted By: mirco
Date Posted: June 09 2009 at 10:58
------------- Please forgive me for my crappy english! |
Posted By: jplanet
Date Posted: June 09 2009 at 11:05
I resent it as well, but it's true! Watch the Live at Budokan DVD, where they discuss which full album to cover - they end up going with Iron Maiden, and point out that they couldn't do something like Yes in Japan because their fans there are into metal, not prog. (But they suggest they might have gotten away with it in Europe). Then consider how many prog bands get to play a venue the size of the Budokan...if Dream Theater had as many prog fans as they do metal, why aren't there any prog bands playing arenas that size? If there are, I guarantee you they are also crossover metal bands like Porcupine Tree, Opeth, Coheed and Cambria, etc., or bands that started in the 70's like Yes, Jethro Tull...There are no new non-metal prog bands who have anything like the commercial success of Dream Theater. Show me one and prove me wrong, please, I'd be very happy to hear otherwise... If you look at the most commercially successful new non-metal prog bands out there, they can barely mount a European tour, let alone a world tour that covers arenas and NYC...let alone make a living. ------------- https://www.facebook.com/ShadowCircus/" rel="nofollow - ..::welcome to the shadow circus::.. |
Posted By: crimson87
Date Posted: June 09 2009 at 11:26
They would be the second one behind ELP
What do they need to do? I mean they are the kings of progressive metal , sure their latest albums weren't that good but I have hope the new one can be as good as ToT.
I don't think that can "solve" their problem since the band is not the same after Kevin Moore left. The guy was all about athmospere and the best composer of the band , Rudess on the other hand likes to have solo spots. Those are different styles that affect the quality of the compositions.
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Posted By: Henry Plainview
Date Posted: June 09 2009 at 11:53
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Sound more like a cross between Bon Jovi and Gentle Giant. ------------- if you own a sodastream i hate you |
Posted By: OzzProg
Date Posted: June 09 2009 at 12:03
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Time for some some cheese: "With great power, comes great responsibility."  I have paid so much money as a fan buying all their albums, spent hours upon hours listening to their music, and suggested their music to friends. I think its fair to suggest ways to improve their music. (Its not like they're going to read this anyways, so its pretty much what the writer would dream about hearing in this band) If I was in a mega-huge band, I would like to get as much constructive criticism as I could. Even if I thought the band was perfect, and everything was going well, I'd love to hear what some Ya-Hoos have to say on Progarchives.com, even if they were disliking the direction the band was taking. ------------- |
Posted By: Henry Plainview
Date Posted: June 09 2009 at 12:09
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The problem with listening to people on the internet is that people on the internet are stupid. ------------- if you own a sodastream i hate you |
Posted By: StyLaZyn
Date Posted: June 09 2009 at 12:10
Except for you, of course. -------------
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Posted By: Henry Plainview
Date Posted: June 09 2009 at 12:24
------------- if you own a sodastream i hate you |
Posted By: jplanet
Date Posted: June 09 2009 at 12:40
This should be in big bold letters at the top of every single website. Although, people aren't any more impressive in person or over the phone...they're even less impressive while driving! ------------- https://www.facebook.com/ShadowCircus/" rel="nofollow - ..::welcome to the shadow circus::.. |
Posted By: infandous
Date Posted: June 09 2009 at 13:36
No, not stupid. But they do have a tendency to make sweeping generalizations about people they know nothing about |
Posted By: OzzProg
Date Posted: June 09 2009 at 13:39
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^ Zing! ------------- |
Posted By: infandous
Date Posted: June 09 2009 at 13:43
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Generally speaking, I'm of the opinion that DT should do whatever they feel like doing. It's their band after all. If they are enjoying their music, then to hell with what us prog nerds think. Obviously, there are still enough people who like what they do for them to keep making albums and DVD's and moderatly large tours in decent sized venues (which, as a previous poster pointed out, makes them pretty unique amoung modern prog bands....metal or otherwise). However, if I was to point out a criticism it would be that they probably could use an outside producer to keep things a bit more concise. But that would probably be good for a great many modern prog bands as well (and in some cases, I'm sure I wouldn't like the results). Other than that, I'd say they need to get a lyricist. But on the whole, I've been fairly happy with their last few releases. I'm not a huge fan, but I enjoy them when I want hear crazy technicality for crazy technicality's sake, mixed with big 80's style dramatic melodies and vocals. I don't much care for their 90's stuff.......way to glam sounding (the drum sound on I&W just irritates the hell out of me......can't stand that album because of it, though I like hearing some of those songs live on Scenes from New York and Score). |
Posted By: moshkito
Date Posted: June 09 2009 at 13:54
King ... no band can survive criticism ... when you instill doubt into the creative process, in the end you start hurting it and closing it down ... if you're gonna be a Dream Theater, or any band, and you have no learned to shut off the external dialogue that has nothing to do with the music and what they want to do ... you would be already dead!
If you want to buy it or not? ... it's not for discussion ... that's your personal choice ... but you have no right to determine or state what a musician should do for you, personally.
You can NOT live someone's life ... and neither can any musician or band out there if they wanna make it on their own!
The multitude of opinions and this in that and that and that alone will drive you crazy ... you have to separate it from your life ...
Not sure you understand that ....
As for the stupidity comment ... I can see the wry humor in it, and in the end if it were me as the big artist or musician, I might say that in private to a close friend on a bad moment ... but in general it is not good policy to go around saying that ... even if only for being polite.
No band out there, would ever make it ... if they had to go through this board ... the criticisms that are posted here are not (usually) positive and above all, are not respectful of someone's musical desire and preference ... and this is the reason why I do not "compare" things at all ... we're like a fish in a glass (to name a wonderful song) ...
Some artists will fall for that slave stuff and do what you want ... and I can tell you they aren't prog ... because no prog anything fool would ever do something just for you! Or me!
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Posted By: topofsm
Date Posted: June 09 2009 at 16:45
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Maybe they should break up and reform a la Crimson... -------------
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Posted By: CPicard
Date Posted: June 09 2009 at 16:51
| You mean, with a second drummer??? Where is the emoticon for "fear" when you need it? |
Posted By: King Crimson776
Date Posted: June 09 2009 at 17:51
That doesn't even make sense, Portnoy's drumming is the least of their worries. But that sure as hell works for The Mars Volta.
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Posted By: King Crimson776
Date Posted: June 09 2009 at 17:55
Or you could take note of the criticism, take it for what it's worth, and then proceed to make the music how you want to.
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Posted By: Slartibartfast
Date Posted: June 09 2009 at 18:08
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Oh to heck with what Dream Theater should do? (musically), what should Dream Theater have for dinner? (food-wise) ------------- Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...
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Posted By: horsewithteeth11
Date Posted: June 09 2009 at 23:36
/Thread ------------- 
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Posted By: horsewithteeth11
Date Posted: June 09 2009 at 23:38
Lol at the thought that Theodore is more talented than Pridgen. -------------
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Posted By: Prog_Bassist
Date Posted: June 10 2009 at 01:52
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They need to get Kevin Moore back behind the keys, he's the only one they've had that hasn't w**ked his way through the tunes, and actually played with feeling. plus they just need to stop sucking, their last good album was change of seasons. after that they just plain suck. ------------- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uhuxaD8NzaY" rel="nofollow - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uhuxaD8NzaY |
Posted By: npjnpj
Date Posted: June 10 2009 at 02:05
| If DT listened to criticism and changed accordingly, I probably wouldn't like them half so much anymore. |
Posted By: stonebeard
Date Posted: June 10 2009 at 02:28
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-Less really really fast guitar licks -More prominent keyboards -More interesting keyboard effects -Less predictable -More atmosphere The new album fixes some of these areas a bit. ------------- http://soundcloud.com/drewagler" rel="nofollow - My soundcloud. Please give feedback if you want! |
Posted By: StyLaZyn
Date Posted: June 10 2009 at 06:53
Agreed! Look at what KM has done solo and with OSI. That type of thing would be welcome to me with Myung and Petrucci. -------------
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Posted By: StyLaZyn
Date Posted: June 10 2009 at 06:54
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Posted By: Vompatti
Date Posted: June 10 2009 at 07:01
| I think they should write an 8-hour opera and then quit. |
Posted By: Alitare
Date Posted: June 10 2009 at 07:11
| Do a metal remake of Tristan und Isolde? |
Posted By: Epignosis
Date Posted: June 10 2009 at 07:17
Brokeback Mountain. ------------- https://epignosis.bandcamp.com/album/a-month-of-sundays" rel="nofollow - https://epignosis.bandcamp.com/album/a-month-of-sundays |
Posted By: Johnny_Tsunami
Date Posted: June 11 2009 at 12:45
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Dream Theater (along with most other prog metal bands) would be awesome with a more contemporary-voiced vocalist. I hate listening to an awesome song and then have Labrie come in with his ****ty falsetto and ruin the band's style. I'm sorry, for Labrie fans, or Russell Allen fans or Daniel Gildenlow fans, but there's just no place for those vocals in rock/metal. No doubt they're superbly talented singers, and I used to be in to that whole thing, but it just makes each word they sing sound extremely cheesy. That's the root of any prog-metal band's problem; vocals!Just my opinion, don't want to offend! ------------- I likes musics |
Posted By: Alitare
Date Posted: June 11 2009 at 14:00
| Ahaha. I actually really love falsetto when it is implemented well. Which means I don't like Labrie's. But, I absolutely love Gildenlow's vocals. It is a style. I get the same from people who dislike death growling. It is a style, and it evokes a mood. Why should we limit the mood of music in general by disallowing bands to utilize a mood crafter? "No place"? Why? Just because you don't like it? It is a band's choice to do or not to do as they please. Even if I dislike a vocal style, I am glad it exists, if for no other reason than to enhance and expand upon the overall musical palette I am able to subject myself to. |
Posted By: The T
Date Posted: June 11 2009 at 14:21
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The only thing Dream Theater really need to do is never to pay any attention to what's said in "What does DT need to do" threads... -------------
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