Make me sound like John Mclaughlin!
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Forum Name: Music and Musicians Exchange
Forum Description: Talk with and get feedback from other musicians on the site
URL: http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=53527
Printed Date: November 26 2024 at 06:27
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Topic: Make me sound like John Mclaughlin!
Posted By: mrcozdude
Subject: Make me sound like John Mclaughlin!
Date Posted: November 22 2008 at 11:04
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What scales/modes do you guys like to use for a jazz/fusion sound?
I'm familliar with major modes but i seem to get stuck in a routine using the same passages and shapes during solos and im hoping with an insite to new modes etc it will encourage me to pick my bass up again and practice. ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/cozfunkel/" rel="nofollow"> 
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Replies:
Posted By: Guy-McPerson
Date Posted: November 24 2008 at 14:12
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I wouldn't say there's any modes or scales that define jazz/fusion. But you can try messing around with the whole tone and diminished scales. The bebop scale, or just try doing chord tones but include the leading tones. (IE, a C Major 7 would be C E G B, include B (which is already there by chord definition) D#, F#, and A#. Personally, I would care more about making your own distinct sound. Although John Mclaughlin is definitely not the worst guitarist to want to emulate. |
Posted By: Slartibartfast
Date Posted: November 24 2008 at 17:51
I think first of all, don't you need a Hindu name?  I think there's a spare Devadip floating around.  OK my internet research wasn't able to confirm that Santana let that one go.  My last wise crack is "Do you want us torture you until you sound like JM?" We will make you sound like John McLaughlin.  |
Posted By: Petrovsk Mizinski
Date Posted: November 24 2008 at 17:55
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Sounding like a true jazz fusion fusion player is not simply "let's use a few scales and modes here and there". It's defined by a whole sound, not by some scales or modes, as mentioned by the second poster. Learning the modes of the melodic minor can make the difference between a mediocre fusion player, to one who can really play the genre. The main reason why I never tried to play much fusion is because currently my knowledge extends only to the modes of the major scale. Learning the modes of the melodic minor and the chords associated with them, is what you should really get into. And remember, it wont come over night.......but as someone who has said you know the modes of the major scale, you should be fully aware by now of how much work it takes not only to understand it in theoretical terms, but to actually apply it in a musical way. |
Posted By: Easy Money
Date Posted: November 24 2008 at 18:11
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Dude, we have had this conversation before, there are a lot of scales and modes that Johnny uses, but if you want the classic McLaughlin sound, it is a 6 note altered mixolydian scale ie root, flat 9, major 3rd, perfect 4th, perfect 5th and flat 7. The major or flatted 6th can be added as well, if you add the flatted 6th, that is one of Miles' favorite scales.
OK, in C the McLaughlin scale is C Db E F G Bb or in G - G Ab B C D F Listen to early Shakti, Devotion or Maha Orchestra and you will hear that scale alot. He also favors Locrian and half step-whole step diminished scales. A lot of the scales he uses fall neatly on the gtr neck and/or kybd for max speed effect. I like to play the same way on kybds, fingering and the scales you use are the key to fast playing. |
Posted By: Guy-McPerson
Date Posted: November 25 2008 at 11:49
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That altered mixolydian scale is pretty much phrygian dominant. C Phrygian Dominant - C - Db - E - F - G - Ab - Bb - C It's called that probably because it is otherwise the phrygian mode except for a major third, which turns the I chord into a dominant 7 chord. Another name it is called is the Spanish Phyrgian, because is it common in some spanish music. It's just a mode of harmonic minor, common in a lot of spanish stuff. It allows you to get the Major I, Major II, Major III progression (based on the phrygian roots) or set of chords you hear a lot. If you're soloing in phyrgian dominant, you can also flat the third (IE do a minor third) a lot as it is a minor mode. You can even hear this in the recognizable malaguena melody (C - E - G - C - E - G - F - Ab - G - F - Eb (minor third) - Db - C) Also, as easy money said, the diminished scale is pretty good for, well... all diminished chords. So, If you see a Cdim7 chord, you can play: C - D - Eb - F - Gb - Ab - Bbb - Cb - C And wholetone works good over augmented chords. Ie, you see a Caug chord, play: C - D - E - F# - G# - A# - B# (C) |
Posted By: mrcozdude
Date Posted: November 26 2008 at 19:56
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I thought the last topic was more about general raga rock,sounds i think.I was hoping this could be more of a discussion about everyones favourites.
I use locrian for the flat fives,unfortunately i dont come across enough dimished chords in chord progressions with my bands.
Some good ones mentioned! ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/cozfunkel/" rel="nofollow">
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Posted By: Atavachron
Date Posted: November 26 2008 at 20:11
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seems to me John's sound is more to do with his approach, attack, and intensity of feeling.. but you guys know that of course mrcozdude you might try playing around with the individual notes in the chords you're using (jazz or other); play the notes in different patterns and out of sequence over the rhythms and a nice effect can be had (this is slightly different than an 'arpeggio' which is usually a chord's notes played in proper sequence) ..and skip a string now and then, go to the one two or three away instead of just the closest one, good luck |
Posted By: Slartibartfast
Date Posted: November 26 2008 at 20:59
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And now for something completely different: turn me into a newt. Theory is only part of the equation. If you want to sound like JL, you're really going to need to combine that with inspiration, which can only come from yourself. It won't hurt to immerse yourself in listening to as much of John's music as possible either. Soak it into your brain. But still you must find your own path. ------------- Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened... 
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Posted By: Guy-McPerson
Date Posted: November 28 2008 at 02:23
| Also, play very fast. |
Posted By: Dick Heath
Date Posted: November 28 2008 at 09:02
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Also helps to have been playing almost a decade of session work, so you have had full exposure to most things wrt guitar, whilst jamming with folks on favourite musics (including putting up with the nastier side of Ginger Peter Baker) - here blues and and jazz, then raga. Then according to McLaughlin's latest instructional video, teach yourself basic and then the advanced Indian percussive language and incorporate into your music..... ------------- The best eclectic music on the Web,8-11pm BST/GMT THURS. CLICK ON: http://www.lborosu.org.uk/media/lcr/live.php - http://www.lborosu.org.uk/media/lcr/live.php Host by PA's Dick Heath. |
Posted By: St.Cleve Chronicle
Date Posted: December 17 2008 at 12:10
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I mostly just use the dorian scale with the added blue note (b5) on all styles of music (if the song's not in a major key, of course). I don't think it's so much about scales, but more like the way you use them. |
Posted By: Vibrationbaby
Date Posted: December 19 2008 at 04:41
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Do you really want to sound like john? keep learning. He's always learning. ------------- |
Posted By: darkshade
Date Posted: December 21 2008 at 13:00
i did that for a while and eventually found myself getting bored and not picking up the guitar for a while. you have to mix it up with lydian, dorian, mixolydian, phrygian, pentatonic, harmonic minor, major and minor modes, tri tones, whole tones, chromatic, etc... etc... etc... ive recently been trying to learn some indian scales. as a guitarist, ive always wanted to sound like a jazz sax player. not in actual sound, but in what a great jazz sax player would actually play, and play that on guitar ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/MysticBoogy" rel="nofollow - My Last.fm 
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St.Cleve Chronicle wrote:Posted By: Vibrationbaby
Date Posted: December 22 2008 at 05:08
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So why don't you pick up a sax and try to sound like a guitar player? ------------- |
Posted By: darkshade
Date Posted: December 22 2008 at 19:58
because Coltrane already did that. ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/MysticBoogy" rel="nofollow - My Last.fm
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Posted By: Vibrationbaby
Date Posted: December 23 2008 at 06:34
 ! ------------- |
Posted By: Vibrationbaby
Date Posted: December 23 2008 at 06:44
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