What does Dream Theater need ?
Printed From: Progarchives.com
Category: Progressive Music Lounges
Forum Name: Prog Bands, Artists and Genres Appreciation
Forum Description: Discuss specific prog bands and their members or a specific sub-genre
URL: http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=43772
Printed Date: November 27 2024 at 07:34
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Topic: What does Dream Theater need ?
Posted By: Lonely Progger
Subject: What does Dream Theater need ?
Date Posted: November 24 2007 at 06:09
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I've thought a lot about this and was wondering what Dream Theater needed to take them to the Top 15 studio albums of this site.
Because they are all four obviously very talented musicians with a very wide range of different styles, just have to listen to "Evening with J.Rudess & J. Petrucci" & LTE .
I'm listening to Lunar Sea by Camel right now and they could just never do that.
Well they are Brilliant musicians but when they do something like "The Dance Of Eternity" you're amazed but there is just something missing.What is it to you ?
So if you had the 4 members of DT in front of you discussing about their 2009 album what advice would you give them ? ------------- Lost in the south of france: " Le rock progressif ? C'est quoi cette connerie? " |
Replies:
Posted By: Jared
Date Posted: November 24 2007 at 06:13
which of their 5 members were you hoping might leave??
 ...personally, and I feel I am increasingly in the minority in saying this... I like them just the way they are... turning out a top rate album every 2 years...they should simply be left alone to get on with it...  ------------- Music has always been a matter of energy to me. On some nights I believe that a car with the needle on empty can run 50 more miles if you have the right music very loud on the radio. Hunter S Thompson |
Lonely Progger wrote:Posted By: Lonely Progger
Date Posted: November 24 2007 at 06:32
I do consider Labrie a but as a musical deadweight ^^, How can you respect a singer who doesn't contribute to the music and doesn't even write the lyrics he sings !
But he must feel crushed by Petrucci's and Rudess' musical knowledge most of the time and he isn't really a progger to, Mike Portnoy said he listened to maroon 5 and stuff like that . So it must be quite hard for him to find his place in the machine that is Dream theater.
Top rate albums to you, but not to the majority so would you have nothing to say ?
------------- Lost in the south of france: " Le rock progressif ? C'est quoi cette connerie? " |
Posted By: Dalezilla
Date Posted: November 24 2007 at 06:33
| I think they should start being what they are instead of trying to be what they were. |
Posted By: Dean
Date Posted: November 24 2007 at 06:34
Good Question, but one I don't think there is an answer to 
The obvious answer is that as a Prog Metal band they never will deliver a Prog album that appeals to all Proggers, which wouild put them in the top 15, or even the top 50.
Pehaps they could adopt some self-control - they are very talented musicians with many good ideas, but perhaps they shouldn't try and use them all at once. But then that is their style, that is what makes them DT.
Also, I was listening to Systematic Chaos yesterday and it struck me how much old ground they were retreading on that album, there are tracks there that would fit comfortably on Scenes, Train and Octavarium, for example Forsaken could easily be (yet another) ending for Scenes - they don't need to do that, there are more than enough original ideas without having to do. ------------- What? |
Posted By: Jared
Date Posted: November 24 2007 at 06:48
no...nothing to add...I've been happy listening to their music since before you were born (with the exception of FII which was quite a disappointment) ...and will probably still be happy with them, when you have kids of your own.... ------------- Music has always been a matter of energy to me. On some nights I believe that a car with the needle on empty can run 50 more miles if you have the right music very loud on the radio. Hunter S Thompson |
Posted By: aapatsos
Date Posted: November 24 2007 at 06:52
| Emotion |
Posted By: Jared
Date Posted: November 24 2007 at 07:01
good grief...I think they have bucket loads....maybe you should go and listen to some Spiral Architect, then re-evaluate...  ------------- Music has always been a matter of energy to me. On some nights I believe that a car with the needle on empty can run 50 more miles if you have the right music very loud on the radio. Hunter S Thompson |
Posted By: Darklord55
Date Posted: November 24 2007 at 07:06
Agreed!!!! Call me or us DT fan boys, I don't care. Why change something that is near perfection. IMHO. Anyway, I am sure they would not want our advice.
Dream Theater, Opeth, 3 and Between the Buried and Me, 2008!! WOW!!! |
Posted By: Evandro Martini
Date Posted: November 24 2007 at 07:19
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In my opinion, DT doesn't suffer a lack of something, but an excess of many things: Excess of bad singing. Excess of velocity, just to show up. We can listen to what they are playing... Excess of bad timbres. ------------- "You’ll never make any money playing music that people can’t sing.” Keith Emerson's father |
Posted By: Frippertron
Date Posted: November 24 2007 at 07:42
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I suppose its not what Dream Theater needs but what prog rock fans need.
I would suggest clearing out their ears from the same old tat that classes itself as prog rock but is in fact plagirism rock (where do I start?)
I am happy with Dream Theater and wouldnt want anything to change about their overall sound or anything.
End of ------------- The Cheerful Insanity of Prog Rock |
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: November 24 2007 at 07:59
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I think they somehow lost their inspiration after SDoiT. I love Train of Thought and enjoy listening to Octavarium and Systematic Chaos, but they're definitely lacking in the songwriting department. Of course they're free to do whatever they want to do, but my suggestion would be for them to try something completely different ... and *not* trying to fuse their sound with that of other artists. I mean, influences are ok and it's better to steal than to imitate, but I'm sick of listening to their albums and thinking "ok, that's the Muse song of the album, here they're sounding like Opeth ... that track has Linkin Park written all over it etc. etc.".
------------- https://awesomeprog.com/users/Mike" rel="nofollow">Recently listened to: 
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Posted By: Lonely Progger
Date Posted: November 24 2007 at 08:16
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fandango
"no...nothing to add...I've been happy listening to their music since before you were born (with the exception of FII which was quite a disappointment) ...and will probably still be happy with them, when you have kids of your own....
"Well good for you, but i think they are capable of much better.
http://www.progarchives.com/forum/member_profile.asp?PF=13705&FID=3 - darqdean
"The obvious answer is that as a Prog Metal band they never will deliver a Prog album that appeals to all Proggers, which wouild put them in the top 15, or even the top 50."
That's just the thing they don't have to do prog metal they are a very versatile group,Petrucci shows his different guitar styles In LTE & In the live with J.Rudess, Portnoy's drumming isn't always violent=transatlantic & Myung's bass could be used in something other than a metal context. But if they did drop the power chords would they still be as impressive as they are in Prog metal ? and would they be any good.
And also Prog to me is about 2 major things and 1 less important one.
First it's being complicated so as not to get bored when you listen to the music DT will satisfy anyone there. The second is being progressive so taking the words of http://www.progarchives.com/forum/member_profile.asp?PF=13705&FID=3 - darqdean :Also, I was listening to Systematic Chaos yesterday and it struck me how much old ground they were retreading on that album.
Which is true they don't seem to have evolved much in the last 8 years.
------------- Lost in the south of france: " Le rock progressif ? C'est quoi cette connerie? " |
Posted By: Dean
Date Posted: November 24 2007 at 08:40
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^ they could do all those things, but they wouldn't be Dream Theater any more, so what is the point? ------------- What? |
Posted By: Shakespeare
Date Posted: November 24 2007 at 08:59
SPARE US! or Make it a Zorn wannabee insane avant-garde 79 minute opus. or An instrumental album. Complexity/musicianship toned down. Focus on melodies. |
Posted By: aapatsos
Date Posted: November 24 2007 at 09:01
 I get your point (Spiral Architect rule anyway)actually I don't mean this 'cheesy' emotion that they produce sometimes they need deeper emotion when they get 'cheesy' and they need deeper emotion when they confuse recording with jamming...  and a bit more inspiration after Metropolis pt.2 would not have been bad... |
Posted By: Chicapah
Date Posted: November 24 2007 at 10:25
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I personally think they should cut ties with their metal past and move into more varied landscapes. No doubt they are giants of metal rock and their early albums are testaments to that prowess but been there, done that, fellas. Their greatest triumphs have been when they allowed themselves to dabble in symphonic themes and more ethereal soundscapes and I would love to see them further explore the direction they took with their epic Octavarium and Six Degrees. Their latest CD did absolutely nothing for me and I gave it to my son. ------------- "Literature is well enough, as a time-passer, and for the improvement and general elevation and purification of mankind, but it has no practical value" - Mark Twain |
Posted By: cuncuna
Date Posted: November 24 2007 at 10:26
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They need to be owned by Steve Hackett, so they can finally loose their manly urges and create something with true beauty inside instead of empty technique. ------------- ¡Beware of the Bee! |
Posted By: Dean
Date Posted: November 24 2007 at 10:27
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Hackett pwned them years ago ------------- What? |
Posted By: MajesterX
Date Posted: November 24 2007 at 10:47
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They need to do something new- ie take a risk. They need to be Dream Theater, not a band that makes albums filled with songs that could be picked out as having a certain influence as their last album was. I think they need a few years off to really think about making an album in less than a month. They need emotion. They need to blend their many, many obvious influences into something fresh. New music comes from the combination other music and styles, not from making a bunch of songs in which every song has an obvious influence. They need to blend. Frankly, I think they've passed their peak and I'm not expecting anything fantastic out of them for the rest of their career if they continue in the manner they've been going. ------------- 
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Posted By: Yorkie X
Date Posted: November 24 2007 at 11:11
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DT are a great band but I think they need more acoustic guitar and less chunk and balls |
Posted By: Nightfly
Date Posted: November 24 2007 at 11:15
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I wouldn't be devastated if Labrie left as I don't think he's in the same class as the rest of the band and a stronger vocalist could make all the difference.
Stronger melodies wouldn't go amiss at times either.
Despite that I still think they're a hell of a good band and just about the best in the Prog Metal genre today.
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Posted By: rileydog22
Date Posted: November 24 2007 at 12:11
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Yes! Another Dream Theater thread! I can't get enough of these! -------------   |
Posted By: heyitsthatguy
Date Posted: November 24 2007 at 12:17
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/\ oh come on, it's been a little while as for me, I like all their output for the most part, except when they're trying to be "overly metal"....Train of Thought is an example of this gone awry. I did like the new album though and felt it was a step in the right direction, despite some missteps along the way (Constant Motion and Forsaken come to mind, neither of which is horrendous but could've been left off the album and I would have been fine) ------------- 
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Posted By: rileydog22
Date Posted: November 24 2007 at 12:19
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I think they should add more GUITAR SOLOS! Petrucci is liek god so I don't get why they dont just put out albums of him soloing cause hes the best guitarist evr or mabye an album of drum soloz cause dude portnoy is amazing.
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Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: November 24 2007 at 12:29
I doubt whether sarcasm will help ... and fortunately the typical DT fan isn't like you describe it.  ------------- https://awesomeprog.com/users/Mike" rel="nofollow">Recently listened to:
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Posted By: Tapfret
Date Posted: November 24 2007 at 12:38
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They need more:
http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.makezine.com/blog/meat224.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.makezine.com/blog/archive/2006/02/make_a_meat_reddening_carbon_m.html&h=374&w=498&sz=43&tbnid=MsFEx2hc6pb1zM:&tbnh=98&tbnw=130&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dmeat%2Bphoto%26um%3D1&start=1&sa=X&oi=images&ct=image&cd=1 -
 And less:
 http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://blogs.knoxnews.com/knx/telebuddy/archives/cheese.jpg&imgrefurl=http://blogs.knoxnews.com/knx/telebuddy/archives/2007/03/cheese_anyone.shtml&h=600&w=600&sz=34&tbnid=o6K5m-0ccyeFAM:&tbnh=135&tbnw=135&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dcheese%2Bphoto%26um%3D1&start=2&sa=X&oi=images&ct=image&cd=2 - The last DT I bought was Train of Thougt which just bored me to tears when it wasn't annoying me. Jumping on the suburban-upper-middleclass-whiteboy-rap-metal thing was particularly hideous. And really, throughout their career (except "Scenes from a Memory") I find they have been unable to slow things down without sounding generic hair metal to AOR and uninspired. And its not that I don't like having slower moments I just want to hear it done less formulaic.
And seriously, I grow weary of the technicality = lack of feeling concept. Its all very subjective and in the case of Dream Theater what people call emotion I call boring and unlistenable. Its true that contrast is very important. But even the quietest moments can be done with skill, exploration and without trying to cater to the mainstream. Right now they are far from the best thing that progmetal has to offer. ------------- https://www.last.fm/user/Tapfret" rel="nofollow">  https://bandcamp.com/tapfret" rel="nofollow - Bandcamp |
Posted By: ProgBagel
Date Posted: November 24 2007 at 14:45
| I think Rudess needs the boot. Brilliant keyboard player, but has gone to far in chops. Not saying I want Petrucci to have the spotlight...but having an insane guitar then keyboard solo is getting old. I prefer a symphonic one like Kevin Moore. |
Posted By: docsolar
Date Posted: November 24 2007 at 22:53
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I actually feel like Rudess' contributions need to be more pronounced in the music like in Metropolis 2 and Six Degrees...with those albums (especially 6), you can tell that Rudess is contributing the melodies and other symphonicness that the band needs in order to be successful in avoiding things like "Constant Motion".
------------- 
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Posted By: micky
Date Posted: November 25 2007 at 00:19
don't just stop with Rudess... they all need the boot (but Myung perhaps.. he has the good sense to remain..errrr.. silent hhahahha) ..... a little less soloing.. and a bit more playing together as a band.. not a vehicle for insane guitar...and insane keyboard solos.. it has to get tiring after awhile for even the most acne-scarred of DT fans... ------------- The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip |
Posted By: Harry Hood
Date Posted: November 25 2007 at 00:25
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Make however many albums they need with Roadrunner and get a deal with a label like InsideOut. ------------- 
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Posted By: stonebeard
Date Posted: November 25 2007 at 00:29
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Better ideas.
------------- http://soundcloud.com/drewagler" rel="nofollow - My soundcloud. Please give feedback if you want! |
Posted By: rushfan4
Date Posted: November 25 2007 at 00:30
 InsideOut is one of the best prog rock labels out there in my opinion. I am sure that they would be thrilled to have the real thing with all of the similar bands like Vanden Plas that they now have on their label.------------- 
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Posted By: micky
Date Posted: November 25 2007 at 00:47
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you all aren't blaming the record company for any problems DT are
having are you all... this group should have creative control over it's
own music.. if they don't... then it is their own damn fault.. god
knows how many albums they have sold. and are an established group.. if
they felf they were stiffled in the studio... they easily.. as many
artists have done in the past... create their own label... especially
in the internet age. The only problems I have heard of with their current company are distribution and promotion.... not creative control. Unless I just hadn't hadn't heard of it.. .I haven't checked their fan websites in like..err....ever hahhahah. ------------- The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip |
Posted By: rushfan4
Date Posted: November 25 2007 at 00:57
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Hey Micky, I agree to disagree with you when it comes to Dream Theater. Your dislike for them is well-established. InsideOut Music is my favorite prog rock label. I pretty religiously follow their new releases and I just feel that Dream Theater would be a crown jewel for the types of bands that InsideOut Music carries. And yes I frequently hear artists on this label claim that they are given complete freedom with their music. As far as distribution goes, InsideOut could be better, but many of their new releases are quite easy to find at any superstore like Best Buy, Circuit City or FYE. When it comes to Roadrunner Records the first band that comes to mind is Nickelback. Decent band IMO. but in relatively few other opinions here, but most definitely not prog.
The only thing that would make DT sound better for you is if they started singing in Italian like your beloved RPI bands. -------------
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Posted By: rileydog22
Date Posted: November 25 2007 at 01:01
...but DT's music wouldn't change significantly from the switch. ------------- |
Posted By: Harry Hood
Date Posted: November 25 2007 at 01:01
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I can just imagine Derek Shulman , in a big expensive suit, chomping a cigar, walking into the studio as the band rehearses "Dark Eternal Night":
"This sounds pretty good, but have you heard of a band called Slipknot? They're on the label too, the kids love 'em. You guys should try to sound more like them." -------------
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Posted By: micky
Date Posted: November 25 2007 at 01:06
oh no... don't misunderstand me.... while I'd never pass up a chance to take a cheap shot at them.... I have never liked them.. and never wil... but the several people in this thread who DO mentioned a decline over the last couple of albums... my point in my previous post was a serious..a genuine one.. that IF that was the case.. that changing the label. .is not going to help that situation at all. Face it ... ALL artist have a creative shelf-life before they start becoming formulamatic or just going through the motions. Sure it might be that DT would be a crown jewel at InsideOut.. but will that stop the decay of the group... help them create something different from the same old highly technical .. solo filled music that may impress at first.. but can only impress so many times before it gets old. ------------- The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip |
Posted By: rushfan4
Date Posted: November 25 2007 at 01:06
Agreed. Thank you for completing that part of my thought (if that was your intent).
Asking DT to change their sound is almost as silly as asking Opeth to release metal albums with clean vocals. Oh, wait, I wholeheartedly supported that idea and was shot down by three quarters of the members on PA. -------------
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Posted By: ProgBagel
Date Posted: November 25 2007 at 18:23
Thats not the first time I've seen that...lol, whats with you and acne-scarred teens?
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Posted By: oroboross
Date Posted: November 27 2007 at 13:58
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Dream Theater is a progressive metal band. They do side projects to do the other things that DT is not. I saw them when James was just starting and hardly anybody knew who they were and James was not a good singer then but he has improved greatly. What DT needs is to stop listening to everybody that thinks they know what DT needs more than they do. DT writes music for thier fans and they don't try to please anybody else. DT needs to keep producing the best progmetal anywhere. |
Posted By: limeyrob
Date Posted: November 27 2007 at 14:43
| A decent drummer or less of the snare drum - but then you were expecting me to say that. |
Posted By: mrcozdude
Date Posted: November 27 2007 at 14:44
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i'd say another vocalist and some songs that are out of key ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/cozfunkel/" rel="nofollow"> 
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Posted By: sircosick
Date Posted: November 27 2007 at 14:53
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Eh? Ah? What...? I'd ask "what doesn't DT need?" Hahaha....... ------------- The best you can is good enough... |
Posted By: 1800iareyay
Date Posted: November 27 2007 at 15:10
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Posted By: ProgBagel
Date Posted: November 27 2007 at 15:36
Ah hahahaha. Nice  .
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Posted By: sircosick
Date Posted: November 27 2007 at 15:46
Ooh....... let's begin with it though. Emotion... a measure-less thing, isn't it? ...I see DT as a band who makes extremely progressive music.... I mean, it seems to me that they took the main parameters (say complexity, for eg.) of prog music one by one and from that basement, they built the stuff, virtuosistic-oriented as prog uses to be. But they seemed to forget how old prog bands assembled all that parameters: with 'emotion'; 'feeling'...... They are that distorted 'cause maybe they've to hide some weakness (musically).... and here plays the metal component. I think so about all metal bands I've listened to. That was my two cents no more, eh? ------------- The best you can is good enough... |
Posted By: StyLaZyn
Date Posted: November 28 2007 at 12:39
#1) Drop the egos.
#2) Drop Rudess
#3) Beg Moore to return
#4) Stop acting like a metal band
#5) Bring Myung out more in the mix
#6) Focus on the music and not the overplaying of it because there is some great melody
#7) Stop pressuring LaBrie sing a certain way.
#8) Adopt a Space Rock element to add to a few songs
#9) Don't let Portnoy sing
#10) Have a sexy girl on the next cover. ------------- 
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Posted By: Abstrakt
Date Posted: November 28 2007 at 12:46
There
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Posted By: Bj-1
Date Posted: November 28 2007 at 12:52
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I think DT have kind of stagnated musically over their last few albums. If they managed to make an album in the vein of their Awake album again that would be much better. ------------- RIO/AVANT/ZEUHL - The best thing you can get with yer pants on! |
Posted By: ProgBagel
Date Posted: November 28 2007 at 13:48
That album was just an explosion of musicianship. Some of the best prog-metal guitar and keyboard work. LaBrie was stunning on it too. |
Posted By: The T
Date Posted: November 28 2007 at 14:10
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DT doesn't need anything. As every band that walks the earth (yes, even mighty VDGG or Magma) they sometimes can release music that sucks.
DT doesn't need anything. If you don't like DT, or hate DT, or when you're listening to DT feel like there's million things you could change, well...I'll tell you this: DT doesn't need anything. It's YOU who need stop listening to DT, as you obviously don't like their music!
It's like I said "What do Sigur Ros need for me to like them?" Well, they need to... turn into a complete different band!
there's some things that can be fixed in some DT songs (or albums, like erase the complete 6DOIT-side ONE) but the band is what it is. ------------- 
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Posted By: The T
Date Posted: November 28 2007 at 14:11
This guy is Dream Theater's biggest problem.
 -------------
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Posted By: StyLaZyn
Date Posted: November 28 2007 at 14:20
Miles ahead of you on that. I did not buy Systematic Chaos because it was garbage to me. (Yes I listened to it illegally first....and damn glad I did). It also made some other DT music I did like less enjoyable.
Still, I&W and Awake are excellent CDs. I look to what they had present in those releases to identify what I would like to add to or remove from their next offering, as if they would even consider it.
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Posted By: Barla
Date Posted: November 28 2007 at 14:27
Is it really that bad? I'm planning to buy 6DOIT (it's their only album I've never heard a note!). Will it be worth my $$? ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Barla/?chartstyle=LastfmMyspace">  
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Posted By: The T
Date Posted: November 28 2007 at 14:30
No, go and get it. You see, that's my opinion. If you ask 60% of DT fans, they'll love the first side. I just happen to think it should have been... forgotten and only the title track released. ... But many fans love those 5 songs. It'll be worth your $$$-------------
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Posted By: darkmatter
Date Posted: November 28 2007 at 14:32
I think disc one is better than the second disc.... |
Posted By: The T
Date Posted: November 28 2007 at 14:38
You see what I said Barla? I;'m kind of alone in this one.... -------------
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Posted By: oroboross
Date Posted: November 28 2007 at 14:38
| What DT needs is less idiot opinions. Like them or hate them, they will survive without you. And their true fans will continue to buy and enjoy their albums, liking some better than others. |
Posted By: The T
Date Posted: November 28 2007 at 14:47
So much wisdom, it makes me cry...
 Couldn't have said it better myself
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Posted By: heyitsthatguy
Date Posted: November 28 2007 at 15:04
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I think the T has stigmatized the glass prison to a point where he can't listen to anything on that disc its easily one of their most 'overtly' metal tracks and I used to love it, now I kind of just are "meh" towards it. Great intro, goes waaay too long with the solo section. The other songs aren't exactly DT's best but you'll find at least something to like in one of them (I personally really like/love them, The Great Debate is a song they always get sh*t for for some reason, at least from what I've seen, but it's my favorite on disc 1) -------------
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Posted By: StyLaZyn
Date Posted: November 28 2007 at 15:10
I viewed this as a fun little thread. That being said you are right about idiot opinions and also their survival. I read your comment as an opinion.
And I am sincerely happy you are a true fan. I once was too.  And that would be right after I&W was released. It wasn't until the last two years or so either my taste has matured or I saw the lack of growth by the band, or both. I find it as one of the great tragedies of Progressive music. Maybe I will listen to some DT now and weep. -------------
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Posted By: Dean
Date Posted: November 28 2007 at 16:08
I bought this when it first came out, in the UK it cost £28 (or the equivalent of $56!!!!!) - which for 96 minutes of music isn't that bad (I guess
), but for 42 minutes that I like and 54 that I don't, I couldn't call it value for money. Luckily for you, it available for a fraction of that now. ------------- What? |
Posted By: micky
Date Posted: November 28 2007 at 16:11
hahahhaha... if THAT was all DT needed ..I'd sure as hell shut my idiotic mouth up ------------- The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip |
Posted By: Snipergoat
Date Posted: November 28 2007 at 16:27
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Better Lyrics A new singer Less mindless w**king |
Posted By: ProgBagel
Date Posted: November 28 2007 at 17:09
I thought 'The Great Debate' was quite the masterpiece as well. |
Posted By: Barla
Date Posted: November 28 2007 at 17:15
Yeah, here it is brand new for 10 dollars!  ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Barla/?chartstyle=LastfmMyspace">
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Posted By: 1800iareyay
Date Posted: November 28 2007 at 17:45
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What does DT need? Jesus. Now I'll sit back and watch this thread get very interesting. |
Posted By: heyitsthatguy
Date Posted: November 28 2007 at 17:46
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CROWN OF THORRRNS AT MY SIDE
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Posted By: cynthiasmallet
Date Posted: November 28 2007 at 17:56
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The three things that DT need the most are stage presence, restraint and some action with the ladies. ------------- Would you like to watch TV, or get between the sheets, or contemplate the silent freeway, would you like something to eat? |
Posted By: Harry Hood
Date Posted: November 28 2007 at 19:31
Hell, it worked for Neal Morse. And Portnoy has toured with Morse's solo band, so he already knows how to play some mean Christian prog drumming. Metropolis Part 3: Scenes From The Life Of Christ? That'd be pretty sick. -------------
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Posted By: Progger
Date Posted: November 28 2007 at 21:49
Nah! Hackett didn't contribute enough to Genesis.He only played on about 10% of each Genesis album.
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Posted By: Shakespeare
Date Posted: November 28 2007 at 21:53
Have you found Jesus, I didn't know I was supposed to be looking for him. |
Posted By: micky
Date Posted: November 28 2007 at 22:03
ahem... http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=16098&KW=God&PN=1 - http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=16098&KW=God&PN=1 so I guess Jesus is what.. Pattrucci's son...  and who is dear old mom...   ------------- The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip |
Posted By: ProgBagel
Date Posted: November 28 2007 at 22:18
Got a picture of the other members wives? I'm curious. 
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Posted By: micky
Date Posted: November 28 2007 at 22:26
hahhaha.. yeah.... so am I.... curious to see who would find these guys attractive  maybe one of our creative geniuses can put together a photo montage for us... the band and wives... hahahha... when we get tired of picking on them... we'll go for the wives... ------------- The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip |
Posted By: Harry Hood
Date Posted: November 28 2007 at 22:39
Portnoy is sexy. -------------
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Posted By: micky
Date Posted: November 28 2007 at 22:42
HAH!!!!!! what do you know ------------- The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip |
Posted By: Harry Hood
Date Posted: November 28 2007 at 22:45
As a gay prog fan, I feel I can judge the sexiness of prog musicians better than most people on this forum.
Portnoy has the whole "edgy New York jew with a heart of gold" thing going for him. The other guys are ugly though. -------------
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Posted By: Logan
Date Posted: November 28 2007 at 22:53
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The only thing Dream Theater really needs is your money, oh, and your undying, fanatical devotion. And praise be to laBrie. If the other members choose to cut theCheese, may laBrie smite them with camembert. To answer part of the original question: To get into the top 15 here they might consider making a retro album that is heavily influenced by Yes, Genesis, and Pink FLoyd, since those are the fans to pander to to be top in PA. Of course I don't think that being top of the PA charts is a top priority for the band. As for success (and remember that some music artists are going strong after 30 plus years) with the general Prog crowd in particular... experiment, try new styles, surprise people. A big part of Prog as an attitude to making music is about experimentation, blending genres, and using song structures that deny expectation. It's about pushing the boundaries of Prog/Metal and taking it into new realms... in part. Unfortunately, some bands find a formula that works, and in their complacency become conventional. Don't know about Dream Theater first-hand (I don't know enough of the band's music), but I see comments saying that the band has stagnated. Progression or death.... If they were to completely change their style, then it wouldn't be Dream Theater anymore, and would alienate the fans (going that far it would be better to change the name of the project), but adding new twists and expanding their musical repertoire could help. Maybe bring in some new musicians (cellist, flautist, saxophonist, whatever) and new musical ideas. But I'm speaking generally, and from a Prog viewpoint as opposed to a mainstream rock/metal one. And who is to define success, be it commercial, critical, or artistic? Ultimately, I generally like artists to make the art they enjoy making; something that they can be proud of. I think being true to yourself is more important than being true to your fans. If the band members are happy with their creations and direction, and enjoy what they do, then I'm happy for them, but bowing to outside pressures can kill the art (though it might be deemed necessary to stay in the industry). For myself, if I were to hear it, I'd like for DT's next album to be rather lighthearted, quirky, zany, and very witty (with some biting social satire). Sometimes it's harder to take music seriously that seems to take itself seriously. ------------- https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLXcp9fYc6K4IKuxIZkenfvukL_Y8VBqzK" rel="nofollow - Duos for fave acts |
Posted By: micky
Date Posted: November 28 2007 at 23:01
we'll I think ... Portnoy not with standing.. you have excellent taste
in men. I wouldn't touch them with a ten foot pole myself.
hahhahaha------------- The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip |
Posted By: Drew
Date Posted: November 28 2007 at 23:17
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I think they need to start taking drugs.
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Posted By: Harry Hood
Date Posted: November 28 2007 at 23:32
Gotta agree with that one. Portnoy is an experienced former alcoholic, but the other guys could benefit from a few acid trips and a coke habit. Then comes the recovery and the finding Jesus, at which point they'll achieve true prog mastery. -------------
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Posted By: Drew
Date Posted: November 28 2007 at 23:33
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Posted By: Yorkie X
Date Posted: November 29 2007 at 01:06
I remember saying to somebody about 10 years "Dream Theater" are very talented but they are missing something after all this time I still haven't put my finger on what the problem is but I suspect its the opposite to what the moody blues are missing. 
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Posted By: Certif1ed
Date Posted: November 29 2007 at 03:37
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I think they need to start writing Prog. ------------- The important thing is not to stop questioning. |
Posted By: sircosick
Date Posted: November 29 2007 at 12:34
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^ Pardon, sir....... but what thing they were doing then?
------------- The best you can is good enough... |
Posted By: Abstrakt
Date Posted: November 29 2007 at 12:36
YEah!
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Posted By: docsolar
Date Posted: November 29 2007 at 14:29
Are you kidding?! Disc two is way better! Disc one is sucky, droning metal!
6DoIT is so worth the purchase, even if only for the second disc. -------------
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Posted By: coleio
Date Posted: November 29 2007 at 15:01
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Personally I don't think Dream Theater need anything. I was listening to Systematic Chaos today for the umpteenth time, and realised that the last track especially was amazing, the first time i've had shivers down my spine about a piece of music in quite a while. And the album as a whole is very good. People just seem to dislike them on this site, purely for the fact they're popular and play too many solo's, too fast. I think the amount of soloing is fine, okay LaBries voice may not be fantastic but it goes well, and as for criticising them for being all too fast and not enough emotion, I've heard far more bands that are guilty of that than Dream Theater, I think Dream Theater have a lot of emotion in their music, if they're so un-emotional, compare them with Behold...the Arctopus or something, I don't see them being criticised. Jesus, bloody old symphonic prog fans eh? Who'd 'ave 'em? ------------- Eat heartily at breakfast, for tonight, we dine in Hell!! |
Posted By: Peter
Date Posted: November 29 2007 at 17:03
But I can be even more provocative than that: What do DT need?To smile occasionally? (Guys, you're not really gloomy teen-aged dropouts with no hope for the future -- you're really very successful, hugely popular, highly talented and fabulously RICH middle-aged men, with a lot of reasons to be happy. That pic of one of your wives reveals at least two such uplifting reasons to be cheerful!)
A collective enema?
Souls?
Seriously though, given their huge success, they're obviously quite good at what they do, so they should (basically) keep doing just that.
  If they changed their sound too radically, to suit the odd cranky (but sentimental and oh-so-sensitive) curmudgeon like me, they'd risk alienating their slavering core audience of alienated, angry, gloomy teen-aged boys (and older perpetual adolescents). So although they are rich, famous, grownup and likely even get laid regularly, they need to keep conveying adolescent angst, hopelessness, lonely alienation and dysfunction, and nascent self loathing turned outward at "the man," parents, teachers, flowers, puppies and all that might just bring a smile, or lend even an iota of hope.Manager to band: "How about we look at our latest bank statements after this photo op, guys? Okay, everybody frown now -- look like you want to kill the photographer. Remember, getting ludicrously rich and receiving mass adulation for doing what you like to do is nothing to smile about. Say CHEEEEESE!"
 Was that provocative enough for you?
Seriously , DT are good at what they do (playing really fast, selling enormous numbers of albums, and raking in the cash cash cash), and to be fair, rock and roll has always seen cynical grown men profiting enormously from teen male hormonal imbalances by pretending to be (or identify with) morose adolescents. See Gene Simmons -- such an unhappy, maladjusted man....
So (other than perhaps stopping helping make everyone think metal is now somehow prog) DT don't need to do anything differently.
Really seriously: Logan's excellent post pretty much expresses my true feelings, but I'd extend it to (most) metal acts in general: stop pretending to take it all so seriously. It's just music, and rock is supposed to be fun above all (isn't it?). There are other human emotions to draw upon, besides alienation, hopelessness and rage. Show a sense of humour. (eg Van Halen, Spinal Tap, Twisted Sister, ELP, Genesis) Mix it up a bit, musically, lyrically and emotionally. Show some vulnerabiliy and sensitivity -- expose the young fans to some glimpses of simple, uplifting beauty via melody, acknowledge the healing, tranformative powers of love. Give the young men in the audience some reason for hope, at least every now and then.
(If Dream Theater already do all that, then great -- they have my deeper respect!)
Rock on, headbangers!  ------------- "And, has thou slain the Jabberwock? Come to my arms, my beamish boy! O frabjous day! Callooh! Callay!' He chortled in his joy. |
Posted By: Syzygy
Date Posted: November 29 2007 at 17:14
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They need to learn Kobaian and dedicate their bodies and souls to Christian Vander in the service of Kreuhn Kohrmann. ------------- 'Like so many of you I've got my doubts about how much to contribute to the already rich among us...' Robert Wyatt, Gloria Gloom |
Posted By: Peter
Date Posted: November 29 2007 at 17:21
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And before anyone replies angrily to tell me he's not angry, and doesn't fit my ignorant, hurtful stereotypes, please bear in mind that (like Spinal Tap) 99%of my DT and metal spoofing is tongue-in-cheek.
Also, you should know that the biggest DT fan I know of (my dear brother in law) is even older than me, a really nice guy, short-haired and well groomed, well educated, successful, happily married, a great dad, and one of the funniest, most cheerful, sincere and intelligent guys I've ever had the good fortune to meet. He's also a fairly accomplished guitar player (and a very good guitar builder), and he really admires DT's sheer musicianship and mastery of their instruments. (I have to acknowledge and respect that.)
 But yeah, I still tease him about his unreasoning love of DT!
Now let the PM death threats begin! ------------- "And, has thou slain the Jabberwock? Come to my arms, my beamish boy! O frabjous day! Callooh! Callay!' He chortled in his joy. |
Posted By: Peter
Date Posted: November 29 2007 at 17:31
^
 You said it all so concisely! If I could learn to be so succinct, the fire would be long since lit, and a great supper would be on the table by now. Me and my rambling, winding, long-winded, circumlocutory, repetitive, redundant, cyclical, circuitous posts (it's like I don't know when to shut up)! Why, I remember a time wh
(freezing, starving offspring drag him away from the accursed computer) ------------- "And, has thou slain the Jabberwock? Come to my arms, my beamish boy! O frabjous day! Callooh! Callay!' He chortled in his joy. |
Posted By: arcer
Date Posted: November 29 2007 at 18:38
I dunno Peter, they look like a pretty cheery bunch to me. That dude on the left looks like he's about to burst out laughing at the beard of the guy second right any minute. God knows I am... Wait a minute, it is a beard there isn't it? He hasn't just stapled a trowel to his chin has he? Or maybe a small animal - possible a chinchilla. Geddit! A chin-chilla. BOOOM! BOOM! Oh well... |
Posted By: Peter
Date Posted: November 29 2007 at 18:43
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^ Nice to see you back around of late, Arser!
All's well for you on the ol' Emerald Isle, I hope? ------------- "And, has thou slain the Jabberwock? Come to my arms, my beamish boy! O frabjous day! Callooh! Callay!' He chortled in his joy. |
Posted By: Shakespeare
Date Posted: November 29 2007 at 18:44
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Posted By: arcer
Date Posted: November 29 2007 at 18:57
Thank you Peter, nice to drift back to the archive now and again, been picking up on a few new bands to annoy my wife with. All is well in the emerald isle I hope, but having been forced to move to grimy old London I'll have to guess at the state of things in the ould sod. Trust things are well with you? |
Posted By: StyLaZyn
Date Posted: November 29 2007 at 20:43
LMAO!!!!!! -------------
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Posted By: E-Dub
Date Posted: November 29 2007 at 20:53
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Personally, they need more songs by Myung to be included. A very underrated songwriter, in my opinion. I also think they need somebody who is good with melody. I get the feeling that Kevin Moore was key in those early DT albums. Just my opinion. E ------------- 
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