Prog Pop - an oxymoron?
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Topic: Prog Pop - an oxymoron?
Posted By: Time Signature
Subject: Prog Pop - an oxymoron?
Date Posted: September 14 2007 at 13:41
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Is the concept "progressive pop" completely inconceivable, or are there pop albums/songs out there that you'r consider progressive in some sense or another? |
Replies:
Posted By: The Miracle
Date Posted: September 14 2007 at 13:57
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Yeah.... But first explain what pop is... pop as in any relatively accessible melodic music suit for radio and mainstream sales, then sure, there's plenty of prog that's quite popular with the masses... Dredg, Muse, Radiohead for example- great proggy stuff that's quite popular outside of prog circles.
------------- http://www.last.fm/user/ocellatedgod" rel="nofollow - last.fm |
Posted By: micky
Date Posted: September 14 2007 at 14:01
hell yeah.. .and throw Yes and ELP into that as well  ------------- The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip |
The Miracle wrote:Posted By: FranMuzak
Date Posted: September 14 2007 at 14:05
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I think artists like Asia, Saga, Alan Parsons Project, Peter Gabriel,Adrian Belew, It Bites,John Wetton,etc. could be concidered "Progressive pop". I believe there are actually a couple of web sites that have Prog pop as a subgenre. There are also many bands/ artists that they are not listed here(in the prog related) that have some songs with a progressive touch like Journey, U2, Tears for Fears, Bjork, etc. (not enough to be listed here though) |
Posted By: Time Signature
Date Posted: September 14 2007 at 14:10
I wouldn't be able to define pop. I've more or less completely given up on genres with the rise of wizard rock ;-)
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Posted By: Easy Money
Date Posted: September 14 2007 at 14:30
| Yeah progressive pop exists: Sting, Genesis, Stevie Wonder, Beatles, Paul Simon, Moody Blues and of course Holly Holy by Neil Diamond. |
Posted By: P.H.P.
Date Posted: September 14 2007 at 14:34
Pop has a totally different direction than Prog Rock, and most important, another intention behind the music, so for me "Prog Pop" doesn't exists, what does exists is well done Pop and quality Pop/Rock, so there's no need to bring the "prog" word to describe that kind of music, that would only end up confusing more people about what's Prog about, IMO.  |
Posted By: The T
Date Posted: September 14 2007 at 15:00
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progressive in itself has NO musical meaning.. it only acquires it when next to the word ROCK or any other... So no, prog Pop is not an oxymoron.. anything can be progressive...remember, progresive = good FALSE....
That's if we all agree prog = progressive. If we say that prog is a special term that refers to the music genre we all know and love, then it's not an oxymoron but an impossibility,as thet prog term is used to describe an specific style from bands from an specific era in time....
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Posted By: Jared
Date Posted: September 14 2007 at 15:02
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Progressive Pop = ACT ( or would you describe tham as prog AOR??) ------------- Music has always been a matter of energy to me. On some nights I believe that a car with the needle on empty can run 50 more miles if you have the right music very loud on the radio. Hunter S Thompson |
Posted By: TheProgtologist
Date Posted: September 14 2007 at 15:56
When someone says Prog Pop......A.C.T. is the first band that springs to my mind. -------------  |
Posted By: Melomaniac
Date Posted: September 14 2007 at 15:57
At one point it was also Saga's case. ------------- "One likes to believe in the freedom of Music" - Neil Peart, The Spirit of Radio |
Posted By: Roskisdyykkari
Date Posted: September 14 2007 at 16:05
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I'm probably the only person on this forum who considers some songs by Yes as progressive pop. In my opinion songs like And You And I are definitely not rock. I don't know if they are pop either, but perhaps And You And I is more pop than rock. But most of all, it's progressive, sot it can't be 100% either one of those genres.
------------- And the sand-castle virtues are all swept away in the tidal destruction the moral melee. |
Posted By: unclemeat69
Date Posted: September 14 2007 at 16:11
there are some other electronic styles that are called progressive, lke progressive house and progressive trance (as described on All Music Guide). just to let you know that prog is not confined to our beloved prog-rock
------------- Follow your bliss |
Posted By: micky
Date Posted: September 14 2007 at 16:11
you are not.... I nearly made Ivan's head explode when I tired to get him to get Yes out of symphonic... maybe 3 of their albums are truly symphonic.. the rest... amped up, supercharged pop. ------------- The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip |
Posted By: 1800iareyay
Date Posted: September 14 2007 at 16:19
| I'll probably get laughed right off the forums for saying this, but I'd consider Prince as such an artist. He is the most creative and innovative pop artist since the Beatles. He fluidly combined jazz, soul, rock, blues, and pop into songs that were accessible yet challenging and unique. Also, his lyrics far exceed the vast majority of those in the pop (and even prog) field. While he had his fair share of songs on sex, he tackled issues like AIDS, spirituality, war, the threat of nuclear holocaust, the damaging effects of drugs, and a host of serious topics. He also changed his name to a symbol, and a symbo he invented at that. Even ELP never got that pretentious. I'm not suggesting him for inclusion or anything (though I'd support it if it ever came to pass in an alternate universe), but I find his music more creative than a good deal of prog I've listened to. Just my two cents. |
Posted By: Raff
Date Posted: September 14 2007 at 16:23
What's wrong with songs about sex? Seriously, I am another who believes that Prog-pop is NOT an oxymoron. Pop shouldn't necessarily be a four-letter word - there is excellent, well-crafted, clever pop music, and there is awful chart fodder, just as there are prog masterpieces and almost unlistenable, boring, derivative prog albums. |
Posted By: 1800iareyay
Date Posted: September 14 2007 at 16:25
Nothing at all, especially Prince's salacious ditties. I consider him to be the AC/DC of pop, although he also has deep songs and inventive compositions (as an AC/DC fan it pains me to take points away, but facts are facts) |
Posted By: unclemeat69
Date Posted: September 14 2007 at 16:30
You mean like 'poop'? ------------- Follow your bliss |
Posted By: jimidom
Date Posted: September 14 2007 at 16:44
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I don't think it's an oxymoron, but to me it isn't a new subgenre. Prog Pop happens when the general listening public catches up with a prog artist and puts their song and/or album on the pop charts. Genesis, Yes, ELP, Kansas, Styx, ELO, and even Flash have all been on the Billboard pop chart at some point. ------------- "The music business is a cruel and shallow money trench, a long plastic hallway where thieves and pimps run free, and good men die like dogs. There's also a negative side." - HST |
Posted By: Arsillus
Date Posted: September 14 2007 at 17:20
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No, it's not. Progressive music doesn't have to be obscure or mind-numbingly complex to be considered so. GR said it best.
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Posted By: KeleCableII
Date Posted: September 14 2007 at 17:59
| I consider Frost* and Spock's Beard to be prog pop. |
Posted By: efoman
Date Posted: September 14 2007 at 18:15
 I'm not laughing. I agree 100%. Also, am I the ONLY person on here who thinks Jane Siberry is progressive? Because if I am, I'm the only one who is right. |
Posted By: micky
Date Posted: September 14 2007 at 18:22
great post... .and probably a prime example that music can be high quality, virtuositic, pretentious, overblown, full of many influences... yet still not be prog. the trick is... you have to be a huge talent like Prince to do that ^ ... and still be considered Pop. ------------- The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip |
Posted By: Atavachron
Date Posted: September 14 2007 at 18:28
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he's also a bitchin' guitar player with one of the best rock tones in music |
Posted By: micky
Date Posted: September 14 2007 at 18:34
damn right... with the coolest guitar to go with that tone hahahhah  ------------- The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip |
Posted By: Easy Money
Date Posted: September 14 2007 at 18:49
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Posted By: BaldFriede
Date Posted: September 14 2007 at 18:54
As an oxymoron it is conceivable. An oxymoron is a certain figure of speech combining two seemingly opposing concepts into a new one. Examples are "bittersweet", "deafening silence" or "open secret". A very modern oxymoron is "virtual reality", by the way. -------------  BaldJean and I; I am the one in blue. |
Posted By: ProgBagel
Date Posted: September 14 2007 at 18:57
| kansas. |
Posted By: Garion81
Date Posted: September 14 2007 at 19:00
Kansas has very few elements of pop. That isn't to say 1-2 of their songs might fall into the pop category. Spiraling would be my idea of Pop-prog band.
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"What are you going to do when that damn thing rusts?" |
Posted By: micky
Date Posted: September 14 2007 at 19:03
 ------------- The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip |
Posted By: rushfan4
Date Posted: September 14 2007 at 19:24
You might have forgotten the most obvious oxymoron. "Military Intelligence - two words combined that don't make sense" - Megadeth. Or of course Jumbo Shrimp. ------------- 
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Posted By: Slartibartfast
Date Posted: September 14 2007 at 20:18
Yeah, the only album I have in my collection is Musicology, but I definitely noticed prog elements there. That's one of the reasons I keep it in my collection. Plus it was a freebie at the live simulcast.  ------------- Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened... 
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Posted By: 1800iareyay
Date Posted: September 14 2007 at 20:20
| Sign O The Times is the most proggy album I have by him. It mixes funk, dance, blues, rock, and he adds soul to the equation for his best album. It also has his best songwriting. |
Posted By: Slartibartfast
Date Posted: September 14 2007 at 20:28
Thanks for the tip.
My wife took me to the concert and I wen't with open mind. We don't have a lot of overlap in musical tastes, so it's good to have a few things that do. ------------- Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...
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Posted By: Dean
Date Posted: September 14 2007 at 22:16
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Combining two random words to define a genre leads to two obvious interpretations, so for Prog-Pop you could be talking about:
a Prog band that has produced mainstream pop songs; (we all know who they are)
a Pop band that has progressive tendancies; (aka Prog-Related)
However, there is a third interpretation where the music is a natural fusion of the two and therefore it does not sit comfortably in either camp. Prince is a fine example of that - no one could accuse him of being a mainstream Pop artist anymore and he certainly isn't Prog. Those 'difficult' artists like XTC, Sparks and David Bowie (to name three that have been mentioned recently) also fall into this category.
------------- What? |
Posted By: ClassicRocker
Date Posted: September 14 2007 at 23:42
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I think it's an easily-applied term. Electric Light Orchestra, post-70s Alan Parsons, Asia, Breakfast In America-onward Supertramp, and even some Moody Blues, easily make the cut. Lots of pop sounds,etc. with progressive "elements"
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Posted By: terrylity
Date Posted: September 15 2007 at 02:21
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I believe Ive seen this sort of discussion here before, and yes i do think prog-pop does exist. To say Prog-pop is an oxymoron means you believe prog (a sub-genre of rock music, which is a genre of popular music in general) is not pop, or even to the degree that prog is on the opposite of pop. ------------- The Unbearable Weight of A Being ... |
Posted By: Time Signature
Date Posted: September 15 2007 at 04:37
I used 'oxymoron' in the title to imply the notion of pop and prog being opposites.
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Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: September 15 2007 at 04:39
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"seemingly opposing" ... I agree with that.
------------- https://awesomeprog.com/release-polls/pa" rel="nofollow - Release Polls Listened to: 
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Posted By: Philéas
Date Posted: September 15 2007 at 11:13
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Posted By: Ivan_Melgar_M
Date Posted: September 15 2007 at 11:38
I agree partially with you.
Progressive is only and adjective that qualkifies the approach of the bands to music, there vxcan be progressive )with low case p) in every genre, for example I believe REM was ahead of most bands ion their genre, so they were some kind of progressive Alternative.
No Prog (with capital P) is an acrionym for "Progressive Rock", in this case saying Pop prog or Prog Pop is clearly an oxymoron, because both genres are uncopatible to coexist.
Of course there are usually prog bands that played some Pop material and Pop bands that played a couple of tracks, but two opposite genres coexisting together is a natural contradiction.
Even the bands that made some Prog with Pop influences, were creating a different thing, it was not Pop anymore, because the structure, timing and characteristics are not the traditional characteristics of Prog.
My two cents.
Iván ------------- 
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Posted By: Dean
Date Posted: September 15 2007 at 14:50
I think the exception to that is http://www.progarchives.com/artist.asp?id=1129 - Talk Talk . Their first two albums (The Party's Over & It's My Life) were unashamedly Pop while they last two (Spirit of Eden & Laughing Stock) are completely progressive, leaving their middle album (The Colour of Spring) as a wonderful blend of the two, ergo: Prog-Pop. ------------- What? |