Delete Ratings without reviews
Printed From: Progarchives.com
Category: Site News, Newbies, Help and Improvements
Forum Name: Help us improve the site
Forum Description: Help us improve the forums, and the site as a whole
URL: http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=41356
Printed Date: April 18 2025 at 10:42
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 11.01 - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: Delete Ratings without reviews
Posted By: WaywardSon
Subject: Delete Ratings without reviews
Date Posted: September 02 2007 at 11:43
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I really feel that all the ratings without reviews should be deleted.
To just rate albums brings out all the fanboys and haters, without any proof that they have even listened to the album.
Anyone feel the same way about this?
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Replies:
Posted By: andu
Date Posted: September 02 2007 at 11:46
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No...
------------- "PA's own GI Joe!" 
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Posted By: glass house
Date Posted: September 02 2007 at 11:48
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Yes. For the reasons http://www.progarchives.com/forum/member_profile.asp?PF=8024&FID=2 - WaywardSon mentioned.
Why not Andu?
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Posted By: Tony R
Date Posted: September 02 2007 at 11:53
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Our webmaster says that RWR's allow non-English speakers to give an opinion, as we only allow reviews written in English. For the psychology of this you should be reminded that Max is French-Canadian. |
Posted By: philippe
Date Posted: September 02 2007 at 11:53
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That's a perpetual debate here, many discussions about it but not changes at all because the decision is in the hands of a small group. Off course I'm also against ratings without reviews. ------------- 
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Posted By: andu
Date Posted: September 02 2007 at 11:55
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Are my ratings any less valid than WaywardsSon's reviews just because he can't tell whether I listened to the albums or not? Of course there is no reasonable answer to this question, so the next question that comes would be: should there be a policy of trust or one of distrust? Myself I believe in the "non-guilty presumption" (or whatever it's called in English) as the civilized way to live together. Also, for various reasons I can't seem to be able yet to put my thoughts into written form, though I try to put myself together for this for almost a year now. If this does not change, I would find unfair to be forbidden to express my little expertise in some way. The language barrier is a true, valid, argument, not just a slogan. ------------- "PA's own GI Joe!"
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Posted By: Tony R
Date Posted: September 02 2007 at 11:57
That decision was the hand of one person - see my previous post and stop the demagogy.. |
philippe wrote:Posted By: Trickster F.
Date Posted: September 02 2007 at 12:00
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The biggest difficulty here, as it has already been mentioned, is allowing anyone to express their point of view, regardless of the ability to do so using a language (admittedly, many people have trouble getting their point across in their native language as well).
I don't see how banning ratings without reviews rids the site's pages of the aforementioned fanboys, haters and people who haven't listened to the album. In fact, a great number of reviews are dubious in this regard, as generic references and brief mention of the reviewer's fondnes of specific tracks is usually not convincing enough. ------------- sig |
Posted By: philippe
Date Posted: September 02 2007 at 12:03
I wonder who is the demagogue or the tyran here... -------------
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Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: September 02 2007 at 12:06
  ------------- https://awesomeprog.com/release-polls/pa" rel="nofollow - Release Polls Listened to: 
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Posted By: Atkingani
Date Posted: September 02 2007 at 12:08
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Anyway, changes have been made... ratings-without-reviews have a weight smaller than the ratings-with-reviews. ------------- Guigo ~~~~~~ |
Posted By: Tony R
Date Posted: September 02 2007 at 12:08
Look, the decision about RWR's is Max's alone. The Admin Team has discussed it at length with him and he will not budge. The Admin Team is often torn between representing the consencus of its own views, those of the forum and doing what the owner demands. At the end of the day it's up to him.I would say that this is probably the only issue where the Admin Team and Max disagree.... |
Posted By: philippe
Date Posted: September 02 2007 at 12:10
oh no, please  -------------
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Posted By: laplace
Date Posted: September 02 2007 at 12:10
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Don''t do this. ;P some of the raters I pay attention to almost never review. Besides, it's a pretty arrogant demand, isn't it? Of course, you can ascribe pettiness, shilling or naive fanboyism to unwritten reviews but it doesn't stop people from setting ratings they feel appropriate. Hell, I ascribe those things to most WRITTEN reviews but I don't demand to have them all removed. =P ------------- FREEDOM OF SPEECH GO TO HELL |
Posted By: Tony R
Date Posted: September 02 2007 at 12:10
| It is important to remember that we have two Admin assigned to reviews. Many RWRs that are obviously manipulative have been removed and as Atkinghani mentions the RWRs also have a very low impact on overall ratings. |
Posted By: Jared
Date Posted: September 02 2007 at 12:13
It also allows English people to give sensible ratings for albums, without necessarily having to write a review about them.... I believe I personally am up to about 585 ratings without reviews.... only a few are 5s and very few indeed are 1s...  ------------- Music has always been a matter of energy to me. On some nights I believe that a car with the needle on empty can run 50 more miles if you have the right music very loud on the radio. Hunter S Thompson |
Posted By: bhikkhu
Date Posted: September 02 2007 at 12:16
In your case Andu, I would really like to know what your thoughts are. You don't have to be a journalist, just convey your feelings. ------------- a.k.a. H.T. http://riekels.wordpress.com" rel="nofollow - http://riekels.wordpress.com |
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: September 02 2007 at 12:18
Don't you remember - Darth used to be Max's avatar for quite a while (before Homer Simpson). And he alone makes the decision whether to keep or delete the ratings without reviews. ------------- https://awesomeprog.com/release-polls/pa" rel="nofollow - Release Polls Listened to:
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Posted By: WaywardSon
Date Posted: September 02 2007 at 12:21
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I didnīt really take into account the non English speakers, that was a bit insensitive.
Sorry Andu
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Posted By: andu
Date Posted: September 02 2007 at 12:25
Well that's the problem HT, I wrote on a professional basis in my own language (art criticism) and my problem comes from knowing I can't deliver nowhere near my writing standards in English... I haven't given up, though. ------------- "PA's own GI Joe!"
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Posted By: Atkingani
Date Posted: September 02 2007 at 12:30
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I have the same feelings, Andu, although I'm not an art expert... but now I think the important thing related to PA reviews is "what you say" and not "how you say". ------------- Guigo ~~~~~~ |
Posted By: Easy Livin
Date Posted: September 02 2007 at 14:00
| The FAQ's thread has details of the current weightings for reviews. As you'll see there, ratings without reviews now have only a marginal effect on the overall ratings. |
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: September 02 2007 at 14:09
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^ doesn't that come close to deleting them? I'm not so sure what's the point of allowing people to post ratings without review when these ratings are reduced in weight so much. BTW: Maybe this fact should be included as a hint above or below the review textarea. ------------- https://awesomeprog.com/release-polls/pa" rel="nofollow - Release Polls Listened to:
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Posted By: andu
Date Posted: September 02 2007 at 14:13
Sorry for responding too aggressive... ------------- "PA's own GI Joe!"
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Posted By: Logan
Date Posted: September 02 2007 at 14:31
I'd echo what laplace said, in fact, I was going to write something very similar, only much more long-winded, to what he wrote earlier:
The overall rating is not the only thing of importance to me who uses the ratings and reviews as a guide to what to get. There are raters who rarely review whose ratings I find useful since their tastes are similar to mine. I like to check out their ratings from their profiles, and also, now that the ratings without review with name can be seen, I find this function more useful. I think I said it before in a very similar thread, but I tend to find the ratings without review of some as useful (or more so) as reviews by others. Actually, I've found ratings without review often to be helpful even when I haven't been that familiar with a person's other ratings (but I do like to check the profiles to get a better general overview of people's tastes). ------------- "Questions are a burden to others; answers a prison for oneself" (The Prisoner, 1967). |
Posted By: Easy Livin
Date Posted: September 02 2007 at 17:19
| Interesting point Mike. The weighting came about because of the overwhelming pressure (to the point of threatened rebellion) from the membership to do something about RwR. What do others think? |
Posted By: andu
Date Posted: September 02 2007 at 19:13
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I think that the different weighting (collab review > review > rating) is one of the best ideas this site has ever come out with.
------------- "PA's own GI Joe!"
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Posted By: Shakespeare
Date Posted: September 02 2007 at 19:16
| How much more weight does a long review carry as opposed to a shorter one? For example, on Tago Mago, would a three sentence 5 star blurb carry as much weight as folly's 7000+ word 5 star behemoth? (Somewhat offtopic, but I didn't see the need to start an entirely new one to ask a tiny question.) |
Posted By: Atkingani
Date Posted: September 02 2007 at 19:23
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Once they have more than 200 characters they have the same weight... the weight differences are those displayed at Andu's last post. ------------- Guigo ~~~~~~ |
Posted By: Shakespeare
Date Posted: September 02 2007 at 19:25
Ok thanks.
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Posted By: Barla
Date Posted: September 02 2007 at 19:51
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I'm surprised this opinion comes from a non English speaker. Put yourself in the place of a non English speaker, who wouldn't know to put his thoughts in English and who'd like to participate in this site. Ratungs without reviews is the only way for them... ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Barla/?chartstyle=LastfmMyspace">  
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Posted By: Sean Trane
Date Posted: September 03 2007 at 04:16
I'm all for this weighing factor, and no just because I'm a little heavier than average.
For once the weighing factor works in my favor. ------------- let's just stay above the moral melee prefer the sink to the gutter keep our sand-castle virtues content to be a doer as well as a thinker, prefer lifting our pen rather than un-sheath our sword |