Is Radiohead prog?
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Topic: Is Radiohead prog?
Posted By: aspinosa
Subject: Is Radiohead prog?
Date Posted: February 28 2007 at 20:43
| I´ve heard Ok Computer recently because the good reviews but I have to confess it was a disapointment , I expeted more, I will give them another chance but what do you think folks? |
Replies:
Posted By: MusicForSpeedin
Date Posted: February 28 2007 at 20:45
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nawh
and sometime soon one guy will leave a post exclaiming that THIS HAS BEEN DISCUSSED!
but who cares?
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Posted By: heyitsthatguy
Date Posted: February 28 2007 at 20:45
their stuff from Kid A onward only barely sounds like the same band, very experimental with electronic sounds and soundscapes 
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Posted By: stonebeard
Date Posted: February 28 2007 at 20:47
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Tough call. Up until OK Computer: No chance of being prog OK Computer is a masterpiece, with progginess creeping through here and there. Kid A is proggy in the ambient/electronic sense. Hail to the Theif is proggy in the rhythmic and atmospheric sense. The poppy style of the songs gives rise to questioning, though. ------------- http://soundcloud.com/drewagler" rel="nofollow - My soundcloud. Please give feedback if you want! |
Posted By: Cheesecakemouse
Date Posted: February 28 2007 at 20:47
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yeah KidA sounds like a cross between Tangerine Dream, Brian Eno and King Crimson ------------- |
Posted By: moreitsythanyou
Date Posted: February 28 2007 at 20:53
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Ok I will do this one more time:
The Bends and earlier - Excellent alternative (but not prog)
OK Computer - Prog related with some moments of genius
Kid A & later - One of the best Art Rock bands going
ok there might be a bit of a bias to some of the degrees I mentioned (one of the best
 ) but the levels of progressiveness I stand by. There is a great deal of experimenation and the creative spirit to be found, mostly on the later albums.Nevertheless, OK Computer has a lot of melody and character to offer, I suggest another try. -------------  <font color=white>butts, lol[/COLOR] |
Posted By: bhikkhu
Date Posted: February 28 2007 at 20:58
Wow, we must have heard a different album. I can see Eno, and Tangerine Dream influence, but I never heard any KC. Frankly I think it is pretty dull ambient stuff. Prog influenced at best. ------------- a.k.a. H.T. http://riekels.wordpress.com" rel="nofollow - http://riekels.wordpress.com |
Cheesecakemouse wrote:Posted By: el böthy
Date Posted: February 28 2007 at 21:05
Well... let´s see... prog is my favorite music...Ok Computer is one of my favorite albums...there for Radiohead is prog... yes, thats right, cause I say so!!! Got a problem with that?!?! Cause if that´s so... then I terribly sorry
------------- "You want me to play what, Robert?" 
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Posted By: Cheesecakemouse
Date Posted: February 28 2007 at 21:06
I was thinking about the part with the chaotic trumpet section. I don't know why so many people have a hang up when it comes to radiohead, it fits well into electronic prog, for people to deny KidA is prog is to deny Brian Eno or Tangerine Dream as prog.
 I think this album was and still is a revolution compared with a lot of the slop you get nowdays in popular music. ------------- |
Posted By: Father Tiresias
Date Posted: February 28 2007 at 21:08
| NO! |
Posted By: enteredwinter
Date Posted: February 28 2007 at 21:08
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The way I see it, a band could be called progressive for three reasons: 1) Fits into the "prog genre", as defined by the criteria on this site (things like relatively long songs, concept albums, rhythmic complexity, etc.) 2) Their own music changes over time, i.e. intrinsically progresses, and manages to create sounds that are like nothing heard before as a result. 3) Their music is very influential, and acts to shape the future of music by having a strong and obvious impact on future bands and artists, i.e. progresses music as a whole. Now, for this site, #1 is understandably the focal point, but Radiohead have clearly accomplished 2 and 3, which I think is much more important than simply fitting into a style of music. If we are going to try to be inclusive along the lines of ideal progressiveness (e.g. seeing a band like Radiohead as more deserving of the prog label than the many Dream-Theater-copycat bands that are "prog" despite a glaring lack of originality, for example), then Radiohead is a clear-cut choice. And that should be one of the goals when categorizing music as prog or not. IMHO, of course. ------------- 
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Posted By: Cheesecakemouse
Date Posted: February 28 2007 at 21:11
 I agree with you but in terms of number 1, a lot of other prog bands like Can or Brian Eno's Another Green Worlddo not always necessary fit into that section.------------- |
Posted By: Walker
Date Posted: February 28 2007 at 21:31
| They may fit some peoples definition of Prog, maybe even PA's definition, but they don't fit my definition, which in end, is all that really matters to me. So therefore I vote no. |
Posted By: memowakeman
Date Posted: February 28 2007 at 22:03
------------- Follow me on twitter @memowakeman |
Posted By: moreitsythanyou
Date Posted: February 28 2007 at 22:04
 Wait... I just realized you removed your awesome Amnesiac avatar  ------------- <font color=white>butts, lol[/COLOR] |
Posted By: memowakeman
Date Posted: February 28 2007 at 22:13
Yep i did , but it may comeback someday  ------------- Follow me on twitter @memowakeman |
Posted By: bhikkhu
Date Posted: February 28 2007 at 22:19
It fits into electronic, but I don't think denying this is denying the true masters that inspired it. It may be better than popular music, but what isn't? I have also heard the term revolutionary, and groundbreaking before. There was nothing on this album that hadn't been done before. ------------- a.k.a. H.T. http://riekels.wordpress.com" rel="nofollow - http://riekels.wordpress.com |
Posted By: TheProgMonster
Date Posted: February 28 2007 at 23:30
I agree with you 100%. Radiohead are creative and original in thier approach to music and they aren't seen as a prog band. While Dream Theater clones are never questioned for their lack originality. |
Posted By: GoldenSpiral
Date Posted: February 28 2007 at 23:50
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[head asplode] YES  ------------- http://www.myspace.com/altaic" rel="nofollow - http://www.myspace.com/altaic ALTAIC "Oceans Down You'll Lie" coming soon |
Posted By: Certif1ed
Date Posted: March 01 2007 at 02:59
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Do green cows bleat on sunny days?
From Wikipedia:
The most striking tendency and identifying feature of any given piece of progressive rock is that it feels carefully composed, yet spontaneous and improvised at the same time. It is true to say that progressive rock lends itself as much to intellectual analysis as it does to emotional enjoyment. Hence, the most typical characteristics may be found by exploring the basic 5 elements of music as taught to most music undergraduates, but are not easily determined by casual listening alone.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Progressive_rock - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Progressive_rock
...and don't forget - no-one expects the Spanish Inquisition...  ------------- The important thing is not to stop questioning. |
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: March 01 2007 at 03:33
^ you wrote that, didn't you? Well done!
------------- https://awesomeprog.com/release-polls/pa/aotm-2025-1/vote" rel="nofollow - 2025 Monthly Release Poll Listened to: 
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Posted By: Space Dimentia
Date Posted: March 01 2007 at 07:12
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Well Id say depending on the period it depends as to what genre or sub-genre they are in: Pablo Honey is purely alternative with abit of punk thrown in, The Bends is still alternative but in songs like 'Just' you can hear a progressive element coming through by the time we reach OK Computer the prog element is very much there to see just look at 'Paranoid Android' possibly one of the best prog-rock songs written in the last 17 years but by the time we reach Kid A and Insomniac we are going down a much more Art Rock path with lots of soundscape and musical noise, that is very similar to some of the Mars Volta's album filler noise (but better and less irritating), yet there is still a prog/progressive element to them whilst Hail to the Theif is returning to the Pablo Honey/The Bends era it is still none the less intresting with nice ideas but a slightly less prog element.
So I woul say yes Radiohead are prog becuase the never stand still for a second so people can label them, they are always doing somthing differnt and you can hear that in their albums; you can actually hear the progresstion from one style to another and they seem to do it with so much ease! But if we were to ask what albums are what I would say The Bends was Prog-related, Ok Computer is Prog-Rock, Kid A and Insomiac are more Art Rock even maybe touching on Prog-Electronic but Hail to the Theif and Pablo Honey are not prog and are very much in the alternative/punk camp. ------------- Prog is music for the mind Hear your Orphaned child! Check out my bands myspace site: www.myspace.com/equinox17 |
Posted By: Chris H
Date Posted: March 01 2007 at 07:16
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I'd hate to not write a huge long paragraph like everyone else, but of course Radiohead is prog! ------------- Beauty will save the world. 
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Posted By: Slartibartfast
Date Posted: March 01 2007 at 08:01
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Speaking as a huge progressive music fan since 1978, of course they are. Even the last songs on Pablo Honey and the Bends are to my ears. I just fell for this band last year big time. But if I had heard Blow Out or Street Spirit (Fade Out), when they were fresh, I'd have been a longer time fan.
From what I've sampled interview-wise, at least Thom and probably others have disavowed the label. Someone once said about pornography, "I can't define it, but I know it when I see it." I feel the same about this group with regards to progressivity. Take it from a guy who has over 1200 CD titles, most of which are progressive. I'll admit I'm a big tenter when it comes to what I consider prog, and I have something in my collection from just about every prog sub-genre (still need to sample some Zeuhl when I'm up for it.)
I have no problem with the proposition that they are on the fringe of prog, and there's a lot of other artists who should be here that fit that bill. Tori Amos and Nine Inch Nails come to mind (BTW both have been visited by Adrian Belew, if you weren't aware.)
Perhaps a more interesting point of debate, would be are they "Art Rock"? Seeing them in that sub-category on this site was what prompted me to check them out in the first place.
Say no more, nudge nudge wink wink. And of course, no one expects the Spanish Inquisition! ------------- Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened... 
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Posted By: Snow Dog
Date Posted: March 01 2007 at 08:13
Many times. ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Snow_Dog" rel="nofollow"> 
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Posted By: Slartibartfast
Date Posted: March 01 2007 at 08:33
Look, by posting this you are only encouraging us. If you've seen it discussed too many times for you, the best thing to do is just go away. ------------- Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...
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Posted By: Snow Dog
Date Posted: March 01 2007 at 08:42
You go away. ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Snow_Dog" rel="nofollow">
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Posted By: Slartibartfast
Date Posted: March 01 2007 at 08:43
Well, I do need to get to work, so I think I will! ------------- Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...
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Posted By: Snow Dog
Date Posted: March 01 2007 at 08:50
OK
My original quoting of Musicforspeedin was just to oblige him. I should have added a
, I will now.What is your work..creating Fjords I presume. ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Snow_Dog" rel="nofollow">
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Posted By: ken4musiq
Date Posted: March 01 2007 at 11:32
If you keep listening to it, the album will begin to haunt you. I never really considered Pink Floyd as prog rock either. Amnesiac has that one tune on it. Pyramid Song. I think its in 13/8. That song blew everybody away when it first came out. I wnet to see them several years back and it rained and rained. Then when the band was ready to come, out it suddenly stopped. Then they played that song Sit Down, Stand Up, when the section with the line "The raindrops" came up, it suddenly began to drizzle, and then after the song was over, it stopped and never returned . . . |
Posted By: chessman
Date Posted: March 01 2007 at 14:35
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Whether they are prog or not depends on the individual listener.
I say they are experimental. Which doesn't necessarily mean prog.
I have only heard two of their albums, Ok Computer and Kid A.
I thought they were pretty dire actually. Little in the way of strong melody, and the singer's voice put my teeth on edge!
Definitely not for me. In fact, despite the fact I am no Dream Theater fan, I would rather listen to DT anytime than Radiohead.
But they are media darlings, much like U2 and REM, so they will always be popular to those who wish to be seen listening to something good, but who don't have the time or effort to invest in discovering things for themselves.
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Posted By: Slartibartfast
Date Posted: March 01 2007 at 14:38
Yes, only now I'm pining for the fijords. And if you hadn't nailed my feet to the perch, I'd be pushing up the daisys, gone down to join the choir invisible, etc. etc.
And don't forget, the palindrome of Bolton would be Notlob. ------------- Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...
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Posted By: sircosick
Date Posted: March 01 2007 at 15:21
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Well, I'm a proghead, but I'm also a brit-pop lover, so I like Oasis, Blur, Smashing Pumpkins, The Verve... And Radiohead is, by far, the best brit-pop band; but as an art-rock band, it doesn't prevent a special attention by prog reviewers. It is not prog, definitively. Note: Progheads put more attention on "Kid A"; as a brit-pop lover, I could say "Kid A" is the worst Radiohead album. |
Posted By: Fight Club
Date Posted: March 01 2007 at 18:31
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Well first everyone has to see something to make this kind of judgement. There are two kinds of progressive
1. Progressive more as a sound, bands creating music in the style of Yes, Genesis, King Crimson, and the other artists that established the Progressive genre. There are certain sounds that are associated with being progressive, such as Spock's Beard. They use a great deal of the aspects that contribute to the Progressive sound, but are they truly progressive? Not really.
2. Progressive more of an adjective, regardless of sound. This can be harder for some people to understand, because of the constant comparison to the usual symphonic progressive sound. Artists can be progressive without sounding a lot like any other artists in the Progressive genre. An example is Porcupine Tree, they don't follow the usual sound people expect to come from prog, but nonetheless their music is very progressive.
Radiohead falls into the second category. They don't sound anything like any other band typically associated with prog but still their music is highly progressive. If there are any doubts just think, how many artists sounded like Radiohead before Radiohead? ------------- 
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Posted By: valravennz
Date Posted: March 01 2007 at 18:59
You have a good point there Fight Club? Radiohead are quite unique amongst todays music offering. I also think they are progressive and could be considered "experimental" in line with the changes in direction their music has taken over the years. I do not think that "Hail to the Thief" harks back to "Pablo Honey" or "The Bends" in style. HTTT is perhaps Radiohead's most accessible album to date other than "OK Computer". That is a great move as the album has opened the way for listeners to consider and appreciate all of Radiohead's music to date.  ------------- 
"Music is the Wine that fills the cup of Silence" - Robert Fripp |
Posted By: con safo
Date Posted: March 01 2007 at 19:37
deja vu
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Posted By: Avantgardehead
Date Posted: March 01 2007 at 20:04
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I've always thought of them as an experimental pop band with progressive, Avant-garde, and electronic overtones. I was surprised when I found them under art rock, but it doesn't matter.
------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Avantgardian |
Posted By: Bt-Tor
Date Posted: March 02 2007 at 00:05
| This has been discussed many times before... therefore I only say YES! |
Posted By: Ivan_Melgar_M
Date Posted: March 02 2007 at 00:18
This has been discussed many times before... therefore I only say NO!
I explained my arguments before so I won't insist, but who cares? They are here to stay.
BTW: Agree with HT's arguments.
Iván ------------- 
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Posted By: MadcapLaughs84
Date Posted: March 02 2007 at 01:31
I agree with you in all of them but OK Computer, I think that was the turning from being an alternative band to an Art Rock one. And yes, Radiohead is prog. ------------- 
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Posted By: Erpland316
Date Posted: March 02 2007 at 14:13
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Radiohead is a progressive band ------------- "Science is all metaphor"-Timothy Leary [IMG]http://freespace.virgin.net/martin.jones10/amonpic.jpg">[IMG]http://imagegen.last.fm/red/artists/Yeti316.gif"> |
Posted By: Floydian42
Date Posted: March 02 2007 at 14:52
| I think they are. I don't really care, either way I love them. |
Posted By: Stjernestřv
Date Posted: March 02 2007 at 14:58
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I'm kind of a newbie to prog, but I would label Radiohead as prog. Not the classic 70's kind, of course, but we have the 70's for that, don't we? :) ------------- "My stories? No, my little lord, not mine. The stories are, before me and after me, before you too." |
Posted By: Snow Dog
Date Posted: March 02 2007 at 15:15
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Does the Pope sh*t in the woods? ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Snow_Dog" rel="nofollow">
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Posted By: Spiderprog
Date Posted: March 02 2007 at 17:15
| When it comes to defenitions Radiohead are already defined as Prog in the pages of music history (are they not listed in this website?). Personal opinion is something else. I can claim that King Crimson is not Prog, so what if I do? |
Posted By: Mr. Sanchez
Date Posted: March 02 2007 at 23:58
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Not Prog.
Prog-Related perhaps? Whatever..
They dont sound prog to me, just prog.....esque? ------------- It's Calling Me Back To My Home. |
Posted By: Ivan_Melgar_M
Date Posted: March 03 2007 at 00:09
Nothing would happen except that:
Iván -------------
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Posted By: Cheesecakemouse
Date Posted: March 03 2007 at 00:13
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I think as time goes by that people will accept Radiohead as prog I think its just the 'new kid on the block syndrome' ------------- |
Posted By: Ivan_Melgar_M
Date Posted: March 03 2007 at 00:25
Please, why nust it be a syndrome? Why can't it be a sincere and reflected opinion?
There are newer bands that rarely people object, Radiohead is not one of them. IMO Alternatuive/Indie is not equal to Prog, as simople as that.
But again, they are here to stay.
Iván -------------
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Posted By: Cheesecakemouse
Date Posted: March 03 2007 at 00:34
I mean new in approach and technique. ------------- |
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: March 03 2007 at 04:15
OMG how I hate it when opinions are sold as facts.  ------------- https://awesomeprog.com/release-polls/pa/aotm-2025-1/vote" rel="nofollow - 2025 Monthly Release Poll Listened to:
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Posted By: Visitor13
Date Posted: March 03 2007 at 07:46
| No, Radiohead isn't prog, but then I've got a pretty limited definition of what is prog ('prog' as opposed to 'progressive'), so take it or leave it. |
Posted By: Angeldust
Date Posted: March 03 2007 at 08:13
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There must be 1395139519519235 post with the same subject. ------------- 
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Posted By: Ivan_Melgar_M
Date Posted: March 03 2007 at 08:31
Mike, when will you learn I talk with facts and not wild gueses:
I.- Prog Archives: When Prog Archives was added PA was divided in two, Radiohead is the only case I remember in which a petition to remove them was created in a poll with no multiple votes allowed:
The no option vote with less than +/.- 5%, this is a statstical tie in a short ubniverse as Prog Atchives active members.
II.- Major Prog sites: I only really trust in 5 sites besides PA: Gibraltar Enciclopedia of Progressive Rock; Proggnosis and Progressive Ears Progressive World Net and Progressor. The pages I trust in Spanish are Manticornio and La Caja de Musica (Where Cesar Inca is one of the responsibles).
Out of the reliable sites: Only one Prog Archives, considers them fully Prog but the opinion of the members is divided.
One considers them Postrt POP - Rock, in other words semi Prog
One mentions them but doesn't classify them (Progressive Ears.
FIVE sites don't even mention Radiohead
Don't care about Amarok (French) because they are clueless, they consider Radiohead Symphonic.
So you don't say I discriminate your country, checked Babyblaue, my German may be very rusty but still I could understand they consider Radiohead a Pop/Punk/Electronig Guitar Band, they only care for OK Computer as a new kind of Prog.
So Mike, learn something I always talk with support and I base my opinions in facts, in this case not only the opinion of almost 50% of Prog Archives members but the reliable Prog sites, most of which don't even mentoion Radiohead.
But I was the first to say they are here to stay and even those of us who don't agree must accept they are here to stay.
Iván
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[47.70%]Posted By: Angeldust
Date Posted: March 03 2007 at 08:51
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I've lost my faith in humanity really.Don't get me wrong(i'm sure you will though) radiohead is much more prog than bands such as Flower Kings for example.Why's that?They're really pushing the envelope,creating marvelous ,experimental music based on rock (but not always) structures.They progress with each album , and even though they're not great players , they sure know how to play every note they think of..They're exceptional composers and they never created safe,easy music (apart from Pablo honey).Bands that copy the 70s prog sound nowadays, are not progressive for me since they never evolve and never create something new .I'm not saying that it's bad when you do it.But in my opinion that's the starting point and you have to draw inspiration from it .When you produce that sound for yourself that's fine , just don't say that you're a pioneer ! -------------
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Posted By: Raff
Date Posted: March 03 2007 at 08:57
| As Radiohead are included in Art Rock, they are indeed considered as fully Prog here on PA. However, as we proceed in our cleanup (now unfortunately come to a standstill because of Rico's absence and other assorted problems), we'll probably discuss the issue and decide to move them. Personally, I've only heard "OK Computer", and it didn't strike me as particularly prog - though I would see them well in Prog-Related together with the likes of Muse. |
Posted By: micky
Date Posted: March 03 2007 at 09:02
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hmmmm.... battles loom on horizon May exercize my veto power on a Radiohead move ... they are prog in my book and a great AR inclusion.
------------- The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip |
Posted By: Raff
Date Posted: March 03 2007 at 09:13
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Oh, no, no battles... We're a team, and we'll make a democratic decision. If I am outnumbered, I'll accept it without any protest. After all, as I just said, I don't know their whole output, but only that single album - which doesn't make my opinion that well-informed.
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Posted By: Floydian42
Date Posted: March 03 2007 at 09:25
Barley anything on Amnesiac and Kid A is Alternative or Indie. Ok, Pablo Honey and the Bends we're, and I think Ok Computer is Roughly 50/50. That Leaves Hail to the Thief, which I am sure (minus two or three songs) is neither Alternative or Indie. So If you haven't listened to all there stuff, I can see why you'd be saying that, but if you have I wonder what exactly your definition of Alternative and Indie is. |
Posted By: PapaJimH
Date Posted: March 03 2007 at 09:39
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I've tried to get into Radiohead on a few occasions but I just don't get it. I find their music to range from boring to annoying. Werird <> Prog. ------------- http://www.calprog.com" rel="nofollow - Neal Morse T2 Live in Whittier on May 28, 2011 |
Posted By: Certif1ed
Date Posted: March 03 2007 at 11:38
You've pretty much shot yourself in the foot there, and made the point that Radiohead can be considered prog very nicely!
"as a brit-pop lover, I could say "Kid A" is the worst Radiohead album."
...But as a Prog Rock lover, I could say "Kid A" is the best Radiohead album.
That contradicts your statement "but as an art-rock band, it doesn't prevent a special attention by prog reviewers. It is not prog, definitively." perfectly.
Kid A owes more to Kraftwerk and Can than it does to Oasis, ergo, Radiohead are Prog.
Case closed, yer honour!
...caught
 ...and if you read the Typical Characteristics, as presented by Wikipedia, you'll note that Radiohead fit the bill perfectly, from OK Computer onwards.
If you think about it, it's more progressive than the average Barclay James Harvest album (from which it appears to draw a lot of inspiration).
No-one disputes BJH as Prog Rock - odd, since they only ever wrote "standard rock songs", with very few exceptions, and NO experimentation. ------------- The important thing is not to stop questioning. |
Posted By: Ivan_Melgar_M
Date Posted: March 03 2007 at 11:40
Please Floydian, if you knew me you wouldn't accuse me of writting anything without having heard it, I have heard each and every Radiohead album and for me it's Indie/Alternative in it's greatest part, maybe one Prog Related albums at the most.
That's my opinion but you can google Radiohead Indie/Alternative (Very specific) and you will find 51,000 links, If you check for the more Generic Radiohead Alternative, you will find 1'490,000 links, if you google for Radiohead Indie, you will find 1'650,000 links, so I'm not alone.
I have quoted the most reliable Prog sites and 4 out of 7 (Not counting PA) don't even mention Radiohead in their database.
If you trust more in mainstream sites, check Allmusic:
So both, most of the Prog sites and mainstream sites agree in something, it's not Prog and Allmusic describes them as Alternative and Indie plus Britpop.
This appears before BBC's Interview to Radiohead after Hail to the Thief:
BTW: All Radiohead albums since OK Computer except Hail to the Thief won or were nomenees for the Grammy Awards for the Best Alternative albums, prices that they accepted.
So, it's clear, I never talk without support, even when my main source of information is my own knowledge which is probably very limited but I trust in it.
Now, it's not my call to move them but Art Rock's team and they have expressed their opinion which I absolutely respect, but don't try to make me change my opinion because I won't do it and don't insinuate I write smething without having heard it, because that's not how I act.
Iván
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Posted By: micky
Date Posted: March 03 2007 at 11:40
what he said ^ ------------- The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip |
Posted By: Melomaniac
Date Posted: March 03 2007 at 11:42
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I don't think a band that release one so-called prog album can be considered prog. ------------- "One likes to believe in the freedom of Music" - Neil Peart, The Spirit of Radio |
Posted By: moreitsythanyou
Date Posted: March 03 2007 at 12:06
Luckily, they have more than 1
Alright this thread (like several others before it
 ) has gotten a bit out of handMy arguement could end by saying "They've already been accepted by the art rock team, there is no need for debate", but it won't. Therefore I'll use the definition provided by the site to defend my arguement.
1. Long Compositions - I'll concede that they don't have many long compositions, but many other bands widely considered prog didn't have long compositions either and the rules are common butnot definative.
2. Intricate lyrics - Definately Kid A/Amensiac and even OK Computer have these. They are both highly thematic albums which use interesting language to convey messages about the banes of modern life in a way that is both colorful and full of despair.
3. Concept albums - Most of their recent works are conceptual by use of theme. OK Computer is mostly concerning paranoia and dehumanization in the "computer age."
Kid A/Amensiac is a 2 CD concept album basically criticizing modern society for loss of values and emotional detachment along with lack of concern for others and complaceny. Hail to the Thief has the came concept to a lesser extent.
4. Unusual vocals - Thom Yorke's vocal style is highly unique (well recently it has been somewhat copied by modern bands, which makes it all the more important to music) and the band has experimented with abstract vocal patterns (see Like Spinning Plates, which was recorded backwards and Kid A/Pulk/pull Revolving Doors which uses vocal processors for distortion)
5. Electronic instrumentation - basically every album after OK Computer uses electronic instrumentation as an accompanyment to other styles the band uses. It's highly electronic but very different than Electronica/Techno because it's done very differently and used with different instruments as well.
6. Unusual time signatures, scales, tempos - Well I'm no expert on music theory but I do know that they have several songs using time signatures such as 5/4 and 7/4. For example, Paranoid Android switches through several time signatures.
7. Classical music - Again, not too much of this but I think very few prog bands I've heard use classical music as a promenant part of their sound.
8. Music connecting to art - In every booklet of OK Computer and later, there is a huge focus on the album art (some of which band members have made themselves, Thom Yorke and I think Stanley Godrich had an art exoposition using artwork from the albums in Spain recently) For example, Hail to the Thief has artwork used as a map of Los Angeles using the large words similar to the lyrics in the song and on the cover. Kid A and Amnesiac have album art very connected to the music because they are the same in theme. Kid A was even released with a 20 page art booklet with even more art connected directly to the music.
I think that about sums it up, Radiohead are tightly connected to Progressive Rock. They are mostly overlooked as such because they simply don't sell themselves as a Progressive Rock band and mention in every interview how their music was impacted by bands like Pink Floyd or Genesis or something like that. ------------- <font color=white>butts, lol[/COLOR] |
Posted By: Avantgardehead
Date Posted: March 03 2007 at 12:30
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Since being progressive is subjective, it's up to each individual to decide. There is no right or wrong answer.
------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Avantgardian |
Posted By: micky
Date Posted: March 03 2007 at 12:41
yes it is... and as far as the PA's and where they belong.....that is for the art rock team to decide... ------------- The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip |
Posted By: andu
Date Posted: March 03 2007 at 13:12
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I was a britpop fan in the 90s with Oasis, Verve, Blur, Travis, etc. as major favourites. I liked Radiohead albums, OK Computer the most. I felt it as both good and accessible. Then I heard samples form Kid A and understood nothing - they had changed and evolved beyonf my comprehension from that time, and didn't interest me anymore. So yes there is a strong connection with alternative britpop of the time, and at times identity. However they did reach something the normal britpop and alternative fan, like me, couldn't understand. I'll try to have a listen to their latter albums and come back telling if that something is prog or not. ------------- "PA's own GI Joe!" 
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Posted By: Floydian42
Date Posted: March 03 2007 at 13:23
I apologize, Don't mean to falsely accuse, I just mean to say most people judge on only a few things they have heard, so I've grown used to expecting that. Alright, so other website site Radiohead as Alternative/Indie. Both you and I know Prog isn't a very common title, and anyway, I still want to know why you don't consider them prog.... or better yet how you justify albums such as Amnesiac and Kid A as Alternative and Indie. (And no, I know I'm not going to say your opinion, I doubt anyone would from a random stranger on the internet. I just like knowing the answer.) |
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Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: March 03 2007 at 13:29
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@Iván: I did not quote your answer in order to keep this post short ... I respect your opinion but I just don't think it is representative of the "public opinion". This includes the archives and all the major (and minor) websites as well as the countless magazines and every music fan in the world. I think that Certif1ed is completely right with his definition of prog, and using this definition Radiohead fit in very well. However, this very abstract and logical definition differs from a "genre elitist" type of definition. It includes much more genres and styles as long as the music is sufficiently complex in various basic aspects, while the "genre elitists" tend to emphasize the stylistic similarities rather than the musical properties. I mean that for them a band that sounds like 70s Genesis has a good chance of being accepted as prog, even if the music itself is only a re-hash of the original. BTW: Personally I think that either position is too extreme to be applied in real life ... I use a bit of both worlds. Radiohead are an alternative band ... they started as an alternative rock band (although I think that Pablo Honey is a bit underrated - compare it to other successful brit rock/pop bands of the time and you'll notice the difference), and as much as they evolved they are still related to that style, which is not very compatible with the spirit of 70s prog rock ... alternative rock doesn't sit too well with "prog snobs". I don't mean that in any derogative way ... I'm one myself, at least to some extent. But eventually the snobism changes into close-mindedness, if we're not careful ... In the words of Dream Theater: "seasons change and so must I" ... Times are changing, and so does Prog. With a new generation of people, would it really be surprising that we also get a new generation of prog ... which is as different to the classic prog as the people of the new generation are to their parents? ------------- https://awesomeprog.com/release-polls/pa/aotm-2025-1/vote" rel="nofollow - 2025 Monthly Release Poll Listened to:
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Posted By: Ivan_Melgar_M
Date Posted: March 03 2007 at 13:53
You hit the nail in the head Mike.
I believe Radiohead belongs in Prog Archives (I even reviewed one of their albums), has a lot of Alternative/Indie elements and some Prog too, but IMHO belongs in Prog Related being that they are not a 100% Prog band.
Iván
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Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: March 03 2007 at 14:05
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^ maybe you're just more "genre elitist" than me. Radiohead are an alternative band, and part of a "genre" which is called "Alternative Experimental" by some. In a way these bands relate to modern prog like the "Krautrock" bands related to the Prog Rock bands of the 70s. Technically bands like Can aren't "Prog Rock" either ... but their presence is tolerated by most prog fans. But why do you insist that they're moved to prog related ... do you really think that albums like Kid A or Amnesiac are not progressive enough? There are far less complex bands in the archives ... and I'm not talking about borderline bands like Rhapsody or Nightwish. ------------- https://awesomeprog.com/release-polls/pa/aotm-2025-1/vote" rel="nofollow - 2025 Monthly Release Poll Listened to:
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Posted By: Ivan_Melgar_M
Date Posted: March 03 2007 at 14:15
Mike I'm not insisting in anything I clearly stated:
But if I'm asked my opinion, I won't lie, I see them barely Prog in a couple of albums, but the repetitive essense of their music the variations over the same theme, the clear references to REM, Pearl Jam and Talking Heads, their own iinfluence on Btritpop bands like Coldplay and Muse, the "I give a damn for life" sound a la Nirvana, make me think in the word Alternative ecvery time I listen them. Iván -------------
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Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: March 03 2007 at 14:18
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^ none of what you describe above can be heard on Kid A.
------------- https://awesomeprog.com/release-polls/pa/aotm-2025-1/vote" rel="nofollow - 2025 Monthly Release Poll Listened to:
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Posted By: Snow Dog
Date Posted: March 03 2007 at 14:19
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Alternative to what? The mainstream? In which case Prog fills thet nicely and is also "alternative". ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Snow_Dog" rel="nofollow">
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Posted By: Melomaniac
Date Posted: March 03 2007 at 14:21
You got that right, I have to admit... But some will not like this statement at all !
Here's a for your courage to say this !------------- "One likes to believe in the freedom of Music" - Neil Peart, The Spirit of Radio |
Posted By: Ivan_Melgar_M
Date Posted: March 03 2007 at 14:22
Honestly I hear it LOL
This is subjective, specially when a band generates so dicvided o'pinions as in this case.
Iván -------------
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Posted By: micky
Date Posted: March 03 2007 at 14:26
exactly.... and since this is an inclusive site... they sould be included since none of us thinks they know better than anyone else do they. Opinoins are very devided..which in my prog-view is a good thing. Prog is a road well travelled.. if you can say...yes.. that is prog.. it's probably because you've heard it a 100 times.. and done even better. Radiohead is prog.. and will thrown my considerable stubborness to make sure they stay in AR. Which can be quite considerable ------------- The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip |
Posted By: Ivan_Melgar_M
Date Posted: March 03 2007 at 14:30
Alternative Rock or Alternative Music:
No comments required to the definition of Alternative (With capital A) used.
Iván -------------
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Posted By: Snow Dog
Date Posted: March 03 2007 at 14:33
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Sounds like it could encompass prog too. ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Snow_Dog" rel="nofollow">
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Posted By: Ivan_Melgar_M
Date Posted: March 03 2007 at 14:50
You forgot the main element PUNK INSPIRED in different degrees.
Prog is previous to Punk, so hardly can be Punk inspired.
Iván -------------
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Posted By: Snow Dog
Date Posted: March 03 2007 at 14:53
Im not really talking about any literal meaning of "alternative" in a genre sense. Im talking in an alternative to mainstream chart music sense. ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Snow_Dog" rel="nofollow">
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Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: March 03 2007 at 14:55
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^ that would be "independent". I know, these labels suck ...
------------- https://awesomeprog.com/release-polls/pa/aotm-2025-1/vote" rel="nofollow - 2025 Monthly Release Poll Listened to:
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Posted By: stonebeard
Date Posted: March 03 2007 at 14:55
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Radiohead is in a new genre: "mumble rock."
------------- http://soundcloud.com/drewagler" rel="nofollow - My soundcloud. Please give feedback if you want! |
Posted By: mothershabooboo
Date Posted: March 04 2007 at 10:05
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I was thinking about this myself when I found out that Radiohead was deemed prog by this site. Ture, they have some prog qualitys to them, but so does alot of other bands whom arnt on this sight (the Canadian band Arcade Fire for exsample, last time I cheacked was not on the sight, yet have more prog qualitys aboot them).
So I think the verdict will be unconfurmed for a while, if ever. Are they or arnt they? To me, they are not, but that does not make them a bad band. In fact, they are one of my favourit bands, but I persanaly dont think they are Prog.
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Posted By: The Wizard
Date Posted: March 04 2007 at 12:08
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I think they are nowadays. I read an article in Mojo about the new songs they've been writing and they sound very progressive as far as their descriptions. OK Computer is about as prog as modern Porcupine Tree to, except Radiohead have shorter songs and are far more creative. -------------  
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Posted By: chamberry
Date Posted: March 04 2007 at 12:40
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They are for me. They're prog in a doing-something-new kind of way with some obvious hints on prog as genre as well. ------------- 
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Posted By: proggy
Date Posted: March 04 2007 at 12:49
| Two Words for Radiohead : Porcupine Tree. |
Posted By: Space Dimentia
Date Posted: March 04 2007 at 13:11
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Its like I said on thsi thread. Radiohead are prog, they try new ideas, they never stand still to be labeled whilst at the same time use things withoin their sound that hint back to 70's/early80's prog. Isn't that one reason why we love prog, because the bands never hung around long enough in a particular genre to be labeled or dabbled with differnt genres within the frame work of prog rock? Radiohead are prog because of this reasons to me.
Am I right? ------------- Prog is music for the mind Hear your Orphaned child! Check out my bands myspace site: www.myspace.com/equinox17 |
Posted By: micky
Date Posted: March 04 2007 at 15:24
of course you are right. Here... have some clappies.... ------------- The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip |
Posted By: chamberry
Date Posted: March 04 2007 at 17:35
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And if Micky gives you clappies you know you're doing things right.
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Posted By: Nash
Date Posted: March 04 2007 at 22:02
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besides I dont like radiohead very much, I dont consider them to be a progressive band ------------- http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/191/sydbarrettg.jpg/" rel="nofollow"> 
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Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: March 05 2007 at 02:11
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^ wow, could you be any more elaborative?
------------- https://awesomeprog.com/release-polls/pa/aotm-2025-1/vote" rel="nofollow - 2025 Monthly Release Poll Listened to:
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Posted By: superprog
Date Posted: March 05 2007 at 03:21
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OK Computer = prog Kid A/Amnesiac = postrock |
Posted By: Asyte2c00
Date Posted: March 05 2007 at 17:00
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No. Mainstream Rock.
They uise studio chicannery to craete the appearance that they are more progressive than they actually are.
I love Radiohead, but far from prog.
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Posted By: cookieacquired
Date Posted: March 05 2007 at 21:18
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radiohead is proggy(not too much), but definitely not pablo honey/ the bends
they're still good though ------------- 
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Posted By: Fight Club
Date Posted: March 05 2007 at 23:07
Exactly hence the actual meaning of progressive regardless of the sound most prog buffs are used to hearing. -------------
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Posted By: Fight Club
Date Posted: March 05 2007 at 23:11
Hey Micky didn't you used to post on digitaldreamdoor.com? -------------
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Posted By: Ivan_Melgar_M
Date Posted: March 05 2007 at 23:12
That may be the meaning of the adjective progressive placed before a band, but PROGRESSIVE ROCK doesn't require to change or evolve.
Yes was Prog in the 70's and is Prog today.
Anglagard invented nothing new, they even refused to play with post 70's technology but they were 200% Prog.
Magenta is inspired in Yes, Genesis and Olfield but it's a 100% Prog band.
Progressive Rock is the name of a genre.
Iván
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Posted By: Fight Club
Date Posted: March 05 2007 at 23:34
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Yeah but originally it did require change and evolve and being truly progressive still holds to that. I don't require every band in the genre to stick to that though, because like you said progressive rock also describes the sound. The Flower Kings are progressive in sound, not as much in change and evolve. Radiohead was a step in evolution with modern music, but doesn't stick to the expected progressive rock sound. -------------
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