Okay, this is really hard for me to admit, but recently, I've found myself liking certain tracks by Genesis, principally 'Supper's Ready' and the whole second CD of Lamb Lies Down On Broadway.  In a mad panic, I decided to acquire their other albums surrounding this period just to reassure myself that I was in fact just having a sanity blip and would promptly be back to hating them by morning light.  It didn't work.  I tried hammering PFM's entire back catalogue into my ears ALL DAY, to quell the echo's of Gabriel's dulcet tones.  No use.  Every time the music stopped, I kept imagining the "great dodgy prog bum grape" appearing with "And it's.....hey babe"

Anyway, here's a Genesis question from essentially a Newbie (excuses).  Is it my imagination, or does Gabriel suddenly leap from well-bred Home Counties BBC accent on Foxtrot/  ("And its...." ) or Selling England By The Pound (whichever came first), to a bona fide New Yawk drawl on the Lamb Lies Down - and is this deliberate? Has he become Broadway?  Its just that, by the time Collins starts singing on Trick of the Tail (thank God for that album - something I can really hate....), we're back to Chas'N'Dave style cockney innit dawlin'. 

Sorry to any Americanos out there who might be wondering what the hell I'm on about.

arcer wrote: just another one of Gabriel's on-record personas I would guess. Much dropping into character's voices on 'Harold the Barrel' and 'The Battle of Epping Forest' etc

Yup, that's pretty much it. Gabriel was a very theatrical singer and would often act out different roles during songs (listen to "Get 'em out by Friday" and you'll hear Gabriel doing a whole cast of characters).

As for "The lamb lies down on broadway", the whole thing is set in New York and Peter is stepping in to the persona of Rael which is the main character of the story (actually a Puerto Rican kid in NYC).

 Interesting you say that, as I remember hearing Jeff Buckley cover 'Back In NYC' on Sketches, and of all the songs on the double album, that was the one that immediately stuck in my head - I didn't even know it was Genesis at the time!

My discovery of Genesis gets more intriguing.  Are there any other websites with all this trivia b****ks on it, as I dont want to bore the Geneso-dinosaurs on this site with the same old questions again.  I'm scared to go on the official site in case someone sees the URL on my computer . 

As Jethro said before, Peter assumed the chatracter of RAEL, a young Puerto Rican troubled kid, so he uses the New York accent, one of his main talents was assuming different characters and voices during his songs and albums.

Try Battle for the Epping Forest and you'll here 10 or more different voices or personas all interpreted by Gabriel.

By the way, I TOLD YOU....Sooner or later you'll be a Genesis fan, welcome to the Genesis family 

Iván

   Hi, new here.  Just don't understand how you can be a fan of prog-rock and not like Genesis, and especially Peter Gabriel. I recomend you have a listen to it all. Every album they have done has a couple of good songs on them. My preference is the Gabriel era, wish I had of seen them then. Have

Welcome Sober7 (the seven stands for 7 days a week I presume).

Your first post, and already so on the mark, impressive.

Rob The Good wrote: You should never be ashamed of liking Genesis...unless it's 80s pop Genesis

 They should have changed their name when Gabriel left.  DEUTERONOMY or something.  Then again when Hackett left - CHRONICLES. 

ivan_2068 wrote: As Jethro said before, Peter assumed the chatracter of RAEL, a young Puerto Rican troubled kid, so he uses the New York accent, one of his main talents was assuming different characters and voices during his songs and albums. Try Battle for the Epping Forest and you'll here 10 or more different voices or personas all interpreted by Gabriel. By the way, I TOLD YOU....Sooner or later you'll be a Genesis fan, welcome to the Genesis family  Iván

This is YOUR fault Ivan - if we'd not had that fight, I'd never have gone back to listen to them again and they'd be resting in my "Vault of the Don't Waste Your Time" along with Kansas, Styx, Alan Parsons, and all 80s prog.

threefates wrote: Poor Ninian... you fell so easily!!  So sad

 I know, it didn't take very much - couple of listens really.  I'm not coping well with this.

I'm still having trouble stomaching Nursery Cryme, SEBTP and the later ones, but the Lamb Lies Down and Foxtrot have some really good moments.  I'd never reached the second CD of Lamb before, in fact, I'd never got to the end of the first one, and I think forcing myself to listen to the whole thing is what did it. 

I also think the timing was right - I've been listening to the same things for years and have been hard pushed to find anything of the standard of PFM that I can alternate between.  ELP sometimes fill in, but I can only play a few compilations I've made as their horror moments make me homicidal   !!  Genesis aren't quite up there with PFM, but bits of it do have a similar 'feel' (what a crap analogy!!).  

sober7 wrote:    Hi, new here.  Just don't understand how you can be a fan of prog-rock and not like Genesis, and especially Peter Gabriel. I recomend you have a listen to it all. Every album they have done has a couple of good songs on them. My preference is the Gabriel era, wish I had of seen them then. Have

I've had a listen to them all Sober7 and as you said, parts of them are really good.  More may grow on me, but I know what I like and I like what I.... 

I'm kind of wishing I'd seen them then too (I'm 32 and only really grew up to COllins era mince) - all I know is what I saw on that Prog Rock Top Ten with Gabriel dressed as a flower. 

By the way, have what? 

 Can you pop over and ask him why he wrote 'Sledgehammer'? 

Wrath of Ninian wrote:

This is YOUR fault Ivan - if we'd not had that fight, I'd never have gone back to listen to them again and they'd be resting in my "Vault of the Don't Waste Your Time" along with Kansas, Styx, Alan Parsons, and all 80s prog.

Don't be unfair Wrath, we never fought, we only had a discussion, but today I'm proud of a job well done

I'll wait a few weeks to introduce you to the wonders of Kansas, band that you unfairly lump with Styx and late Alan Parsons. Hope I will succeed again.

God I feel like the Evangelist of the hated bands.

Iván

Valarius wrote: Peter Gabriel's recording studio is about a 20 minute drive from my house.

Let us know if you see 4 other cars pulling up there, and some old guys with guitars, keyboards and drums getting out!

ivan_2068 wrote: Wrath of Ninian wrote: This is YOUR fault Ivan - if we'd not had that fight, I'd never have gone back to listen to them again and they'd be resting in my "Vault of the Don't Waste Your Time" along with Kansas, Styx, Alan Parsons, and all 80s prog. Don't be unfair Wrath, we never fought, we only had a discussion, but today I'm proud of a job well done I'll wait a few weeks to introduce you to the wonders of Kansas, band that you unfairly lump with Styx and late Alan Parsons. Hope I will succeed again. God I feel like the Evangelist of the hated bands. Iván

  You lawyers take everything so literally - it was actually meant in an endearing way...!

ANyway, credit where credit is due Ivan - I grant you that your undying determination to defend the Genesis camp from the word 'rubbish', was certainly behind me getting ahold of the Lamb again, if only to try and rubbish it formally!  And it backfired on me...!!   But do not rest on your laurels , for I have decided that the other Gabriel albums are nowhere near as good, and in fact, with the exception of some sublime moments on Foxtrot, they are vastly inferior.  

With regards to Kansas, please don't bother.  I listened to Leftoverture yesterday, and it is the worst thing I've heard since Cliff Richard.  Sugary sweet M.O.R., A.O.R., C.R.A.P. with some of the most horrifically bad lyrics, smattered like Nutella over a brioche of bog-standard riffage in a strawberry milkshake of mono-dynamic pop schmultz.  It churned my stomach, Ivan .      

Wrath_of_Ninian wrote: ivan_2068 wrote: Wrath of Ninian wrote: This is YOUR fault Ivan - if we'd not had that fight, I'd never have gone back to listen to them again and they'd be resting in my "Vault of the Don't Waste Your Time" along with Kansas, Styx, Alan Parsons, and all 80s prog. Don't be unfair Wrath, we never fought, we only had a discussion, but today I'm proud of a job well done I'll wait a few weeks to introduce you to the wonders of Kansas, band that you unfairly lump with Styx and late Alan Parsons. Hope I will succeed again. God I feel like the Evangelist of the hated bands. Iván   You lawyers take everything so literally - it was actually meant in an endearing way...! ANyway, credit where credit is due Ivan - I grant you that your undying determination to defend the Genesis camp from the word 'rubbish', was certainly behind me getting ahold of the Lamb again, if only to try and rubbish it formally!  And it backfired on me...!!   But do not rest on your laurels , for I have decided that the other Gabriel albums are nowhere near as good, and in fact, with the exception of some sublime moments on Foxtrot, they are vastly inferior.   With regards to Kansas, please don't bother.  I listened to Leftoverture yesterday, and it is the worst thing I've heard since Cliff Richard.  Sugary sweet M.O.R., A.O.R., C.R.A.P. with some of the most horrifically bad lyrics, smattered like Nutella over a brioche of bog-standard riffage in a strawberry milkshake of mono-dynamic pop schmultz.  It churned my stomach, Ivan .

Then try this WON. Sound quality is not great but you should get the general idea. :

http://rich-williams.tripod.com/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderfiles/1974_The_Pinnacle.wmv - http://rich-williams.tripod.com/sitebuildercontent/sitebuild erfiles/1974_The_Pinnacle.wmv

 Yep. 

 Sorry, was I supposed to be swayed into the Kansas camp by that?  I appreciate the cool clip Garion (I can't even master uploading my own pictures yet...!), but Kansas are just everything I hate about the prog genre.  They epitomise everything I try to play down when my contemporaries lay their boots into the genre for supposedly being pretentious and elitist.  But worse than this, I actually DO dislike it - it sounds vapid and stale - music for music's sake. Making a living rather than living the dream.  There's no passion in the voices, there's no feeling in the lyrics - its utter pretense, and it plays into the hands of those who think prog is worthless. For that, it should be demonised!

Sorry Garion, I cant even bring myself to listen to Magnum Opus again (which was the best track by a considerable distance).  Indeed, were it not for the considerable support they seem to get on this site, I would be calling for their dismissal from the Archives altogether.  Most of that album sounds like Lynard Skynard (is that how you spell it?)

Hey Wrath, do me a favour, listen Song for America once and the talk to me again.

Iván

PS: Sooner or later you'll start to like Nursery Cryme, Selling England (even though is the weaker Gabriel Genesis album IMHO) and you'll start to hate the name Phil Collins when refered to any activity different to playing drums.

Iván

Wrath_of_Ninian wrote:    Can you pop over and ask him why he wrote 'Sledgehammer'?

That's the best post this year!

Wrath_of_Ninian wrote:    Can you pop over and ask him why he wrote 'Sledgehammer'?

Sure.

 ANd with that tirade, i just became a senior member!!  How apt... !

Wrath_of_Ninian wrote:    Yep.   Sorry, was I supposed to be swayed into the Kansas camp by that?  I appreciate the cool clip Garion (I can't even master uploading my own pictures yet...!), but Kansas are just everything I hate about the prog genre.  They epitomise everything I try to play down when my contemporaries lay their boots into the genre for supposedly being pretentious and elitist.  But worse than this, I actually DO dislike it - it sounds vapid and stale - music for music's sake. Making a living rather than living the dream.  There's no passion in the voices, there's no feeling in the lyrics - its utter pretense, and it plays into the hands of those who think prog is worthless. For that, it should be demonised! Sorry Garion, I cant even bring myself to listen to Magnum Opus again (which was the best track by a considerable distance).  Indeed, were it not for the considerable support they seem to get on this site, I would be calling for their dismissal from the Archives altogether.  Most of that album sounds like Lynard Skynard (is that how you spell it?)

Actually that was a 9 and half minute song from them in 1975.  If you truely gave it a chance I will just say we agree to disagree.  Growing up in the 70's my big 4 were ELP Genesis Kansas and Yes followed closely by Jethro Tull .  But I agree about Styx. I could also apply some of your reasons about what you don't like about Kansas to Triumvarat. Cheers 

Sorry Ivan, I was a teenager in the late 1980s when Collins was everywhere - I still remember that You Cant Hurry Love video where he played all the instruments

You don't have to say sorry, all the forum knows how I feel about Phil Collins and how he contributed to butcher my once favorite band.

If you read the polls I never voted for him as the best drummer even when I believe his really good with the sticks (A bit weak with his feet), I believe Bill Bruford, Manu Katche, Carl Palmer, Phil Ehart, Mattias Olsson (Anglagard), to mention a few are superior to him.

Iván

Garion81 wrote: Wrath_of_Ninian wrote:    Yep.    They epitomise everything I try to play down when my contemporaries lay their boots into the genre for supposedly being pretentious and elitist.  But worse than this, I actually DO dislike it - it sounds vapid and stale - music for music's sake. Making a living rather than living the dream.  There's no passion in the voices, there's no feeling in the lyrics - its utter pretense, and it plays into the hands of those who think prog is worthless. For that, it should be demonised!

I just thought of one more comment ,WoN. sorry

That clip I sent you had more than just the music involved in it. Kansas made no money until Leftoverature.  They were not even a headliner until late 1976.  That clip was a tape of a live performance on an American National TV show in late 1975 before the recording of Leftoverature.  Granted you may not like their music but if they are what you say they are i.e.  music to make a living, no passion, basically a formula driven band etc.  Why would they choose to play their most progressive song off of the album they were touring with (Masque) to present their music to 16 million viewers?  It doesn't make sense.  They had a few other hard rock songs if that was what they wanted to do.  They chose that one I sent and another prog song. Just thought I would point that out. It is a rap they have had(and you are not alone on this forum with your feelings) that does not fit them through 1979.  That's all.

ivan_2068 wrote: Sorry Ivan, I was a teenager in the late 1980s when Collins was everywhere - I still remember that You Cant Hurry Love video where he played all the instruments You don't have to say sorry, all the forum knows how I feel about Phil Collins and how he contributed to butcher my once favorite band. If you read the polls I never voted for him as the best drummer even when I believe his really good with the sticks (A bit weak with his feet), I believe Bill Bruford, Manu Katche, Carl Palmer, Phil Ehart, Mattias Olsson (Anglagard), to mention a few are superior to him. Iván

I still think you would have gone to that Roxy show Ivan.

I still think you would have gone to that Roxy show Ivan.

It may sound strange specially living in Perú, where good Concerts are not very common, and progheads go to everything they can.

In Lima I saw Jethro Tull (2 times), ELP, Yes, Jon Anderson (I felt asleep though), Rick Wakeman (2 times and even the famous concert that started a 1:00 am and ended near 5:00 am brecause his instruments ended in Paraguay), Kansas (With John Elefante, a band that wasn't really Kansas), Santana and must confess I even went to see Men at Work and Air Supply (My girlfriend insisted on this one).

But there are two concerts I refused to go one was Village People and the other one was Phil Collins, even when all my friends went.

Iván

ivan_2068 wrote: I still think you would have gone to that Roxy show Ivan. It may sound strange specially living in Perú, where good Concerts are not very common, and progheads go to everything they can. In Lima I saw Jethro Tull (2 times), ELP, Yes, Jon Anderson (I felt asleep though), Rick Wakeman (2 times and even the famous concert that started a 1:00 am and ended near 5:00 am brecause his instruments ended in Paraguay), Kansas (With John Elefante, a band that wasn't really Kansas), Santana and must confess I even went to see Men at Work and Air Supply (My girlfriend insisted on this one). But there are two concerts I refused to go one was Village People and the other one was Phil Collins, even when all my friends went. Iván

Was just teasing my friend.  We seem to agree more than disagree.  It was a good show though even without Peter and Steve.  They did play the knife and The musical Box (not just an excerpt)

Was just teasing my friend.

Now you tell me after I had to confess I went to see Air Supply and Men at Work

Thanks God i didn't went to see

Iván

ivan_2068 wrote: Was just teasing my friend.  Now you tell me after I had to confess I went to see Air Supply and Men at Work Thanks God i didn't went to see Iván

Isn't the guy with the headress on Reed Lover and yes I think that is Peter as the cowboy!

That is OK Ivan I saw Black Oak Arkansas once

Actually Garion...what song is Pinnacle off of...it is amazing...up there with Journey From Mariabronn........

I suppose I'll just look here in the Archives.

gdub411 wrote: Actually Garion...what song is Pinnacle off of...it is amazing...up there with Journey From Mariabronn........ I suppose I'll just look here in the Archives.

Masque.  Thier third. and thanks

Hey Gdub, here is my list of top Kansas tracks not in order:

1. Miracles Out of Nowhere
2. Closet Chronicles
3. Portrait (He Knew)
4. Journey from Mariabronn
5. Song for America
6. Mysteries And Mayhem
7. Icarus Born on Wings Of Steel
8. The Pinnacle
9. The Wall
10. Lamplight Symphony
11. Opus Insert
12. Magnum Opus

Iván

ivan_2068 wrote: Hey Gdub, here is my list of top Kansas tracks not in order: Miracles Out of Nowhere Closet Chronicles Portrait (He Knew) Journey from Mariabronn Song for America Mysteries And Mayhem Icarus Born on Wings Of Steel The Pinnacle The Wall Lamplight Symphony Opus Insert Magnum Opus Iván

What albums are these songs on? I could do it the hard way and spend the next half an hour doing this, but why when i know you can list em in 5 minutes or less.

Songs 1,9,11,12 - Left Overature

Songs 2,3- Point of Know Return  I would also add the Spyder and Hoplessly Human

Song 4- From self tiltled 1st cd.  I would also add Apercu and Belexis

Song 5 and 10- From Song for America and I would add Lamplight Symphony

Song 6,7,8- From Masque I also like parts of All the World and Child of Innocence

There are four songs from reunion cd Somewhere to Elswhere:

Myriad, Icarus II, Distant Vision and Byzantium

There's also a DVD called Device Voice Drums where you can find almost every song here except Closet Chronicles and a couple more.

Despite the terrible voice of Walsh due to his throught operation, the DVD is outstanding.

Iván

Wrath_of_Ninian wrote:    Can you pop over and ask him why he wrote 'Sledgehammer'?

Gabriel said it was his tribute to his R & B influence in the 60's.  He said it was one of the things that got him into music.  It's really not that bad a song. I just think people get cought up in this "image" thing and decide not to like 'cuz it was a #1 single and had a video.  Was a utter stupid thing to ruin your enjoy ment of music.

As for Shock The Monkey.  THAT IS A GREAT SONG!!! Why not to like it? His "Security" album is amazing!

Wrath_of_Ninian wrote:    Interesting you say that, as I remember hearing Jeff Buckley cover 'Back In NYC' on Sketches, and of all the songs on the double album, that was the one that immediately stuck in my head - I didn't even know it was Genesis at the time!

It's a great track isn't it? Made all the better for the lo-fi treatment Buckley gave it. There is also a 'tribute' album out there which has a version of 'Back in NYC' that was a really downtempo affair which I liked a lot too. I only ever heard it once however, so I can't tell you who did it.

Genesis and then Floyd were my 'in' on prog and even though Genesis doesn't really do it for me any more I still have fond memories of where and when I first discovered each album.  

charliefreakz wrote:

Let me answer that question with another.  Have you spent much time listening to the 5 albums prior to Monolith?  You should check them out starting with the self titled album released in 1974.

As for Monolith itself the band was staring to fragment and were not talking much to each other at this point.  The most prog song was left off the album (but it did show up on Audio Visions) No One Together due to time constraints.  While they have some interesting things on it, it is neither good as a progressive album nor as an AOR album. It almost seemed schizoid.  I mean I like On the Other side but it could have been much better.  It seems long for a Radio hit but the instrumental parts do not seem to be overly adventurous like their heart really wasn't in it anymore.

But it is strill better than Power or In the Spirit of Things or Freaks of Nature.  I think the reunion album Somewhere to Elsewhere was much better and I think Proto-Kaw is better still.