To include ELO in Progarchives
Printed From: Progarchives.com
Category: Progressive Music Lounges
Forum Name: Prog Polls
Forum Description: Create polls on topics related to progressive music
URL: http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=2991
Printed Date: December 14 2024 at 04:25
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 11.01 - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: To include ELO in Progarchives
Posted By: Guillermo
Subject: To include ELO in Progarchives
Date Posted: January 12 2005 at 19:48
| I think that the Electric Light Orchestra should be included in this website. In my opinion, this band mixed Rock music with very good orchestral arrangements. I consider, at least, that their first 4 albums are more Progressive ("The Electric Light Orchestra" (71), "ELO2" (73), "On the Third Day" (73) and "Eldorado" (74)). Maybe they became more Pop rockers later, but other Prog bands like YES, GENESIS, PFM, TRIUMVIRAT, THE MOODY BLUES and others did it too. What do you think? |
Replies:
Posted By: DallasBryan
Date Posted: January 12 2005 at 20:14
|
NO DOUBT, in their heyday, they were included with
the Moodies, Pink Floyd, Yes, ELP. Jethro Tull, Mike Oldfield, Genesis, King Crimson and Gentle Giant as the main progressive rock bands coming from England. Even though they moved into more commercial ground after there first 4 albums I cant blame them. Almost everything put out by these bands after that was watered down crap and controlled by the record companies. The fact Jeff Lynne was smart enough to steer another course in hind sight wasnt a bad idea. They made more money being commercial than most of these guys did. The Move(pre ELO), Traffic and the Moody Blues were considered progressive rock when Pink Floyd was still considered psychedelic experimental rock and the rest were still nursing on the Beatles and their output. |
Posted By: BebieM
Date Posted: January 13 2005 at 02:46
haha, for a second. I thought you'd said "To include ELP in progarchives"  nono, they're country 
|
Posted By: Man Erg
Date Posted: January 13 2005 at 03:53
|
No,again.
First 4 albums had 'elements' of prog but on the whole they are Beatles Revolver-Abbey Road homages ------------- 
Do 'The Stanley' otherwise I'll thrash you with some rhubarb. |
Posted By: Blacksword
Date Posted: January 13 2005 at 05:23
|
No way! They are rock 'n' roll/Pop Even in their early days, their vague prog tendancies hardly warrent them being given a prog label IMO.
------------- Ultimately bored by endless ecstasy! |
Posted By: sigod
Date Posted: January 13 2005 at 06:15
|
Sorry Guillermo, we have this question asked every two or three months and it always gets voted down. I love ELO, 'Out Of The Blue' was the first album I ever owned and I can still find new things in it even today but for me, the argument is a tad futile as everybody remembers them for the pop stuff not the tricky stuff that they did in the early days. IMO they just don't 'feel' very proggy. What would Roy Wood think of us? ------------- I must remind the right honourable gentleman that a monologue is not a decision. - Clement Atlee, on Winston Churchill |
Guillermo wrote:Posted By: DallasBryan
Date Posted: January 13 2005 at 09:51
|
here we go again with the brits defining the catagory.
they have decided for us, its been debated at Oxford and the Queen has made a ruling. think for once everyone else should decide this one! |
Posted By: sigod
Date Posted: January 13 2005 at 10:10
|
Off you go then... ------------- I must remind the right honourable gentleman that a monologue is not a decision. - Clement Atlee, on Winston Churchill |
Posted By: project23
Date Posted: January 13 2005 at 10:16
| That's funny, I've been listening to ELO for the first time in many,many years and this poll comes up. While my ears are still fresh from the sounds I vote no. |
Posted By: Vibrationbaby
Date Posted: January 13 2005 at 10:40
| I just wnt to say that I voted NO WAY. I like a Roll Over Beethoven but that`s about as far as I go with ELO. |
Posted By: Petra
Date Posted: January 13 2005 at 11:04
|
Another No from me too. Like I said in the other poll we had for ELO, i was subjected to a lot of their music with an ELO obsessed boyfriend and I always thought every song sounded the same to me I know i was a total music snob back then though so i was probably influenced against them because they were always in the charts and on TOTP's .. but if ELO are prog so is Supertramp. Maybe DB thinks us Brits are all music snobs... ------------- Don't hate me I'm not special like you |
Posted By: DallasBryan
Date Posted: January 13 2005 at 11:23
|
OK then! Lets keep it a british idea of what should
and shouldnt be progressive, after all its safer that way keeps em inline. BLAH!!! Give up the control, New Gibraltar dont have any problem with the inclusion of Traffic, ELO, Todd Rundgren, Cluster, Klaus Schulze, Guru Guru, etc. And calls RUSH not to prog themselves! But for my Canadian friends and British folk lets keep it safe, kinda give you a sense of well being, BLAH!!! And for my American friends quit letting them lead you around by the nose! Again, The Move(pre ELO), Traffic and the Moody Blues were considered progressive rock when Pink Floyd was still considered psychedelic experimental rock and the rest were still nursing on the Beatles and their output. ------------------------------ There's a new kid in town Ooh, hoo Everybody's talking 'bout the new kid in town Ooh, hoo Everybody's walking' like the new kid in town There's a new kid in town There's a new kid in town I don't want to hear it There's a new kid in town I don't want to hear it |
Posted By: joniox
Date Posted: January 13 2005 at 11:54
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I don't know!
------------- I repeat myself when under stress, I repeat myself when under stress, I repeat myself when under stress, I repeat myself when under stress, I repeat... |
Posted By: Petra
Date Posted: January 13 2005 at 12:29
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I dunno what you are getting at, this isn't New Gibraltar who says they have it right anyway..are you saying that the British members here are shepherds and the americans are sheep?
------------- Don't hate me I'm not special like you |
Posted By: oliverstoned
Date Posted: January 13 2005 at 12:29
There's no risk of its being debated by your monkey-brainless-president |
Posted By: oliverstoned
Date Posted: January 13 2005 at 12:31
| i was talking to bryan, of course |
Posted By: Garion81
Date Posted: January 13 2005 at 12:46
Why would make such a stupid stament? It has nothing to with this thread. |
Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: January 13 2005 at 14:17
|
I think if your gonna have Supertramp - there's must exist at least a case for ELO - their first two lp's at least - I think if we take controversial inclusions like ELO - or Supertramp then maybe we could just list the early LP's - For Eg Supertramp's 1st is quite proggy in its own way and same with ELO's second LP. It might be a way around it. Just include certain LP's - but of course then its just gonna be well what LP's and your back to grey areas I spose' |
Posted By: Easy Livin
Date Posted: January 13 2005 at 14:30
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I love the music of ELO Guillermo, I think I have all their albums. I really feel though that they don't fit in on this site. They took melodic pop rock to a new level, but their symphonic sound is not in itself enough to make them prog. Sorry. |
Posted By: oliverstoned
Date Posted: January 13 2005 at 14:53
Sorry, it was to answer to Dallasbryan! that's him who start! But, as the proverb says, only thruth wounds! |
Posted By: frenchie
Date Posted: January 13 2005 at 16:13
|
ne pas ------------- The Worthless Recluse 
|
Posted By: Garion81
Date Posted: January 13 2005 at 16:30
Yeah, I see that. He mentioned the Queen and Oxford among other things. Just didn't think we needed another thread to bash GWB. Got enough of them in the "Things Not Related" threads
------------- 
"What are you going to do when that damn thing rusts?" |
Posted By: Syzygy
Date Posted: January 13 2005 at 18:46
|
I was going to debate this, then I realised I'd be arguing with someone who can't spell category. ------------- 'Like so many of you I've got my doubts about how much to contribute to the already rich among us...' Robert Wyatt, Gloria Gloom |
Posted By: Sweetnighter
Date Posted: January 13 2005 at 23:40
------------- I bleed coffee. When I don't drink coffee, my veins run dry, and I shrivel up and die. "Banco Del Mutuo Soccorso? Is that like the bank of Italian soccer death or something?" -my girlfriend |
Posted By: gdub411
Date Posted: January 13 2005 at 23:45
You can't fault DB. His 1st language isn't English. He speaks Texan. |
Posted By: Guillermo
Date Posted: January 14 2005 at 10:18
O.K. I didn`t know that this question has been asked before. I`m in this Forum since late November 2004. Anyway, thanks to all the people who gave their opinions. |
Posted By: sigod
Date Posted: January 14 2005 at 10:22
No problems Guillermo. In your defence, there must me something to your request if it keeps being submitted. ------------- I must remind the right honourable gentleman that a monologue is not a decision. - Clement Atlee, on Winston Churchill |
Posted By: arcer
Date Posted: January 14 2005 at 12:04
|
anyone got Jeff Lynne's number - let's ask him. Personally I think he'd say no. and I agree with him. As I posted elsewhere on this site, Lynn himself referred in the early 80s to his band as techno-pop (as in technological, not ectsasy-fuelled beats) and that's a pretty good description. Great pop, not prog. Same goes for Supertramp. I love both, they're two of my favourite bands and while Eldorado and Crime of the Century have some pretty prog overtones, they just don't fit the bill for me. Straight pop/rock with a prog sensibility.
|
Posted By: Squirrel_monkey
Date Posted: January 14 2005 at 13:38
|
The first 5 albums are almost definately prog, ('ELO', 'ELO 2', 'In the Hall of the mountain king', 'Face the music', 'Eldorado'), songs like 'Kuiama' certainly are. Anyone who says this era isn't probably hasn't given them much of a listen. 5 albums is more than some other bands manage at all! I think saying ELO don't 'feel' prog is unfair, the early stuff certainly fits all the categories, and they are a lot more proggy than alot of other bands on the site. Genesis, went pop in a big way, and no one disputes them as prog. They are included in a lot of other prog sites. ELO could fit into a lot of categories, but that doesn't mean they should be excluded from them all! I think the fact that this topic keeps reapearing shows that they are definate contenders and warrants them a place on the site! ------------- i!i!i!i!i! SqUiRrEl MoNkEy i!i!i!i!i! |
Posted By: Wrath_of_Ninian
Date Posted: January 14 2005 at 17:58
|
I was once forced to watch a German TV broadcast of ELO once, after my friend mistook them for ELP and thought I'd be interested. I have to say, amidst the massive light show in a huge stadium, with orchestral musicians straddling the flanks, I didn't notice anything untoward as the low rumlbing keyboard built up the tension. Indeed, it took several dozen bars of actual music after the lights came up, before I actually realised his mistake. Whats my point you may ask? I dont have one - except to say that I initially thought it was Black Moon...
For the record and the poll, NO. |
Posted By: richardh
Date Posted: January 14 2005 at 18:39
| On the basis that I've only heard 2 ELO tracks that are prog sounding (From The Sun To The World and Kuiama) then NO. |
Posted By: plodder
Date Posted: January 14 2005 at 20:04
|
ELO are to prog as Britney is to metal. awful, awful, non talented band. |
Posted By: The Hemulen
Date Posted: January 15 2005 at 08:28
| Surely we've had this discussion a thousand times? The instruments doth not maketh the prog band. |
Posted By: Squirrel_monkey
Date Posted: January 15 2005 at 13:24
|
Not instruments! Tracks! The instruments are certainly prog, but so too are the tracks. Those two tracks, Kuiama and From the Sun to the world, are from an album of like-styled tracks. Of which there are five. The comparison would hold water if Britney's first 6 years were metal. Whether or not they are prog, you cannot call them untalented. I suppose you've heard two of their songs, and those were probably both from Discovery. The song writing is fantastic and they are all very talented multi-instrumentalists. I think 20% of the vote is a lot more than you'd probably get for Nightwish or many of the other bands on the site. Which is a good thing - it shows all aspects of the genre! ------------- i!i!i!i!i! SqUiRrEl MoNkEy i!i!i!i!i! |
Posted By: Fitzcarraldo
Date Posted: January 15 2005 at 14:10
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My thoughts (on both bands) exactly.
|
Posted By: Guillermo
Date Posted: January 16 2005 at 12:09
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ELO`s keyboardist, Richard Tandy, is a very good musician. Even in the song "Last Train to London", which is almost a Disco Pop song, he played some classical music arrangements in his keyboards. For me, ELO is Progressive, anyway. The "All Music Guide" considers ELO as, among other styles, a Prog Rock/Art Rock band. http://www.allmusic.com/ - http://www.allmusic.com/ You can search for many bands there. That website has some mistakes, but I agree with them in many things. Supertramp had also many Pop Hits. It is also considered as a Prog band/Art Rock band. I can`t believe that Radiohead is considered by Progarchives as a Prog band! For me, it is more an "Alternative Rock band", as many people calls this style. I could also consider Coldplay and The Verve as a Prog bands. Radiohead=Progressive E.L.O.=Not Progressive
|
Posted By: gdub411
Date Posted: January 16 2005 at 12:12
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Why not? Radiohead is here. After that , we can include Abba.
|
Posted By: Custodian
Date Posted: January 16 2005 at 16:18
| Although I'm in the minority, I just voted YES. I think even their later albums had prog elements, as did the Move's albums and Roy Wood's solo albums. Wizzard's Brew is very experimental. I just happened to get an obscure live ELO record in the mail from eBay yesterday. The Night The Light Went On In Long Beach has some very proggy synth work from Richard Tandy. ELO used to be a slightly guilty pleasure of mine but lately I'm enjoying their old stuff (up until Discovery) more and more. |
Posted By: Ivan_Melgar_M
Date Posted: January 16 2005 at 17:41
You said it Guillermo Allmusic makes a lot of mistakes, this page is not reliable at all, just to start is managed by musical and movie industry not by people who remotely cares for progressive rock. I had tosend them a post informing the management that Triumvirat is not a band from Finland and that neither Toto or Boston are progressive bands, when they changed the format they corrected all those mistakes, but there are still a lot. Iván |
Posted By: aqualung28
Date Posted: January 16 2005 at 18:23
|
Ummmmmmmmm. NO! ------------- "O' lady look up in time o' lady look out of love 'n you should have us all O' you should have us fall" "Bill's Corpse" By Captain Beefheart |
Posted By: DallasBryan
Date Posted: January 16 2005 at 20:27
|
Guillermo, you are right ELO is progressive rock in
the early years. No Answer is definitlely and Eldorado was one of the first true(only one or two really worked) concept albums in rock n roll in the mid 70's. There seems to be this either younger generation that has been exposed to so many different kinds of crap and grew up hearing them on the radio or a british society mainstream idea that they are British AOR because they were frequently played on british radio or northeastern USA stations, where they decide in institutes(stuck inside because its to damn cold), what is or aint this and that! Their brains are frozen. 
So dont feel bad your right!
|
Posted By: Guillermo
Date Posted: January 17 2005 at 13:07
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Definitions in Progarchives: http://www.progarchives.com/Progressive-rock.asp - http://www.progarchives.com/Progressive-rock.asp "PROGRESSIVE ROCK — a style that combines rock, classical, psychedelic and literary elements — was born in the late '60s with art-rock bands like Pink Floyd and King Crimson, whose albums typically featured 7 to 10 minutes songs with shifting time signatures and evolving musical themes. " ____________________ |
Posted By: Guillermo
Date Posted: January 17 2005 at 13:22
|
More definitions in Progarchives: http://www.progarchives.com/Progressive-rock.asp - http://www.progarchives.com/Progressive-rock.asp In my opinion, ELO is still Progressive, if you read these definitions. Why Roxy Music wasn`t included before in the discography?
|
" Posted By: Guillermo
Date Posted: January 17 2005 at 14:49
In the "All Music Guide" there are some good writers about music. One is William Ruhlmann. I have a good book about Pink Floyd written by him. Yes, they changed the format, but they have corrected some mistakes, and they also added biographies about bands which didn`t have Biographies in that website. Yes, maybe their main interest is commercial, but a lot of websites survive due to their commercial activities. Anyway, I consider the AMG a good website. I have visited this website since 1999. |
Posted By: Squirrel_monkey
Date Posted: January 21 2005 at 12:36
|
Apparently the best ever prog album... Disc: 2 ------------- i!i!i!i!i! SqUiRrEl MoNkEy i!i!i!i!i! |
Posted By: Easy Livin
Date Posted: January 21 2005 at 15:03
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Guillermo, You're making a good case, I'm starting to believe! I'd certainly agree about "Eldorado", a fine prog album. |
Posted By: Lunarscape
Date Posted: January 21 2005 at 16:54
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Sure enough ELO is progressive enough to be listed here. ________ Lunar ------------- Music Is The Soul Bird That Flies In The Immense Heart Of The Listener . . . |
Posted By: Olympus
Date Posted: September 30 2005 at 18:57
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They should be put a new catogary called semi-progressive. ------------- "Let's get the hell away from this Eerie-ass piece of work so we can get on with the rest of our eerie-ass day" |
Posted By: memowakeman
Date Posted: October 01 2005 at 01:11
|
MAYBE PROG RELATED OR ART ROCK...BUT MAYBE.... IN FACT I DONT CONSIDERE THEM AS PROG ------------- Follow me on twitter @memowakeman |
Posted By: Frasse
Date Posted: October 01 2005 at 10:32
| I voted Yes since there now is a prog-related "genre" in the archives. |
Posted By: Jared
Date Posted: October 01 2005 at 10:35
|
I've gone for 'no' I'm afraid; I agree that the first two albums are def worthy of inclusion, but Third Day and Eldorado less so (I owned all 4 of them once..), and the rest is borderline Art Rock/ Pop, which is of little interest here... ------------- Music has always been a matter of energy to me. On some nights I believe that a car with the needle on empty can run 50 more miles if you have the right music very loud on the radio. Hunter S Thompson |
Posted By: The Miracle
Date Posted: October 01 2005 at 14:33
No, they're not prog. They're a pop band ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/ocellatedgod" rel="nofollow - last.fm |