Is Ywingie Malmsteen Prog?
Printed From: Progarchives.com
Category: Progressive Music Lounges
Forum Name: Suggest New Bands and Artists
Forum Description: Suggest, create polls, and classify new bands you would like included on Prog Archives
URL: http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=287
Printed Date: April 24 2025 at 19:11
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 11.01 - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: Is Ywingie Malmsteen Prog?
Posted By: Vibrationbaby
Subject: Is Ywingie Malmsteen Prog?
Date Posted: March 07 2004 at 13:55
| The kid next door just discovered Ywingee Malmsteen, Steve Vai and Joe Satriani and had to share this with me. He brought over a live CD called G3 which features all three of them individually on one disc and then all three of them unite for a blowout jam session on the other one. I can appreciate Malmsteen's technical ability because he tackles some pretty intricate classical guitar compositions (albeit with amps turned to eleven), but what would Segovia think? |
Replies:
Posted By: Joren
Date Posted: March 07 2004 at 13:58
| hard to say, I think his ability to write songs is not good enough (I own 'The Seventh Sign') |
Posted By: shark
Date Posted: March 07 2004 at 18:11
|
Does it really matter if he's prog or not? The real issue is whether his music is good or not. As a guitarist he's exciting to listen to, but I'd agree that the songwriting isn't exeptional, but then again I'd say the same thing about Vai and Satriani |
Posted By: Joren
Date Posted: March 08 2004 at 07:17
True... 
|
Posted By: Vibrationbaby
Date Posted: March 08 2004 at 08:40
| To be honest I think these guys are interesting to listen to once and a while. Personally, I agree, it doesn`t matter how you classify music there`s good music and there`s crap. This whole idea of sub-categorizing this music known as "prog" was totally new to me until I joined in these discussions and I`ve been listening to it for over 30 years! |
Posted By: Glass-Prison
Date Posted: March 08 2004 at 19:54
|
Yngwie Malmsteen (That's J. Malmsteen to you) has made many contributions to rock music over the years, and has inspired many of today's prog guitarists. Yngwie (J) is capable of much, including a stunning neo-classical repertoire, a god like sweep picking style, and eccentric stage antics (He looks like a 18th century drag queen...) Nevertheless, the question remains, is he prog? One cannot disregard his contributions to the guitar underworld, but as a band ensemble, he does not fit the prog outline. 90 percent of the time, his band takes a back-bench to his antics, not to disregard his antics, but rather to emphasize them. Does this coincide with the definition of prog? we are in agreement that prog is music that pushes the boundaries of music, and embraces new musical capabilities, be them musical or lyrical, so long as they are thought-provoking, emotional, and transcendant in sound. Now Yngwie (J) obviously contributes much cannon fodder to axemen of these days, but my overall opinion is that, while talented, he does little to further and expand his music, his Etudes(studies) simply prove his value of instrumental finesse over musical transcendance. therefory, Yngwie does not sit on the top shelf with the rest of my prog cds. |
Posted By: janhuss
Date Posted: March 09 2004 at 04:23
no, I wouldn't say he is prog. 
|
Posted By: progchain
Date Posted: March 29 2004 at 14:53
 
|
Posted By: Vibrationbaby
Date Posted: March 29 2004 at 15:51
|
progchain wrote:Posted By: philippe
Date Posted: March 29 2004 at 15:54
His first 'Rising force' is an interesting neo-classical hard/ rock album, the others are ------------- 
|
Posted By: philippe
Date Posted: March 29 2004 at 15:56
|
But nothing very original...Uli John Roth & (up to a certain point) Al di Meola played this kind of speed sweeping guitar parts long time before him. -------------
|
Posted By: Vibrationbaby
Date Posted: March 29 2004 at 15:57
|
I tend to agree he`s an amazing technician but he can`t write. |
Posted By: Glass-Prison
Date Posted: March 29 2004 at 21:32
|
.. Lyrics you mean? it's true most of his songs are instrumental, and the ones that do have lyrics are usually completely inane ("I am a Viking" is a prime example) Obviously he is lacking in that department. However, if someone like Ian Anderson or Neil Peart wrote lyrics for him... |
Posted By: Stormcrow
Date Posted: March 30 2004 at 00:28
|
I was playing scales on the piano at the age of 7. Perhaps not as fast as Malmsteen, but I moved on. |
Posted By: Tarkus
Date Posted: March 30 2004 at 07:36
|
I own "Attack!!" from Malmsteen. I like the music sometimes, but I don't think that it is prog. But very high technical skills are an aspect of Prog an Malmsteen has very high technical skills. And he also includes non-rock (classical) Elements in his music and that is also a main aspect of prog (not only including classical Elements but including some at all!!). In Conclusion I wouldn't say that his music isn't Prog but it ist more Prog than any "normal" rock/metal music. In my Opinion the question if something is prog or not is always relative. Something may be Prog if you compare it with music which is definitely no prog but it doesn't seems like prog if you compare it with "real" prog. |
Posted By: Dan Bobrowski
Date Posted: March 30 2004 at 10:55
| Malmsteen = Not prog. |
Posted By: arqwave
Date Posted: March 30 2004 at 15:21
|
i would say that his influences relies in prog music and classical music, he is the very first bond into heavy metal/speed metal stuff, i spoke about that in another topic, i do think that his speed at playing, and his ability to mix neoclassical stuff is great, but the problem is that he started to write the same album over and over again To me Steve Vai has more idea of prog than the other two members of that G3 video, he actually played with Frank Zappa, and he actually has evolved into a better guitarist, he is the only one of a very big numer of players that actaully has left the idea of burning the guitar with speedness to turning the sound into ambient and crazy sounds |
since "eclipse", where the main title piece is a good example of an instrumental prog oriented song, but he is not prog... the lacks of originallity and capabilities to write and compose has kept him into second class guitar player.Posted By: Bob Greece
Date Posted: November 28 2005 at 03:31
|
Well playing electric guitar with an orchestra is pretty progressive and it certainly was at the time when he did it. If Steve Vai is in the archives then why not Malmsteen? I can't see a great difference. ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/BobGreece/?chartstyle=basicrt10"> 
|
Posted By: iguana
Date Posted: November 28 2005 at 03:38
|
No.
this man alone is responsible for bombing us back to the musical stone age. it doesn't make you a better actor if you can recite your lines four times as fast as everyone else. and that is a quote by none other than ritchie blackmore. |
Posted By: Certif1ed
Date Posted: November 28 2005 at 04:02
|
There's a world, if not several galaxies of difference between Vai and Malmsteen, IMO. Malmsteen has one single style of playing - he may have popularised sweep picking (although Holdsworth was doing that with UK nearly a decade earlier), but Vai has so many different styles that he personalises with little hallmarks, that you cannot really compare the two. Satriani has far more styles than Malmsteen, and I wouldn't call him prog - or even prog related. Was it Malmsteen or Vai that sent a tape to Frank Zappa of themselves playing some of Zappa's hardest music, when aged only 15, and pretended to be older so that he could join the band - Zappa being so impressed that he subsequently credited him with "Impossible guitar parts" on albums...? There's nothing "impossible" about Malmsteen's playing (and even less about his composition) - although the speed is very impressive. I totally admit to owning and liking his first 3 albums - I've got the 4th as well, but that's fairly lame, IMO, and switched me off YJM permanently. The biggest difference is that Malmsteen is a lead guitarist - he leads and expects everyone else to follow, as a rule. Vai is an all-round guitarist - he is equally happy to sit in the background as the foreground - and even when he's in the background, you're aware of his presence without having him "in your face". |
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: November 28 2005 at 04:15
Vai is an exceptional songwriter and composer. ------------- https://awesomeprog.com/release-polls/pa" rel="nofollow - Release Polls Listened to: 
|
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: November 28 2005 at 04:24
|
About Yngwie Malmsteen: His first three albums are excellent (Rising Force, Trilogy, Marching Out), and his live album Trial by Fire. ------------- https://awesomeprog.com/release-polls/pa" rel="nofollow - Release Polls Listened to:
|
Posted By: Logos
Date Posted: November 28 2005 at 04:44
|
Malmsteen will never ever be in Prog Archives
|
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: November 28 2005 at 04:52
|
^ why are you so sure? ------------- https://awesomeprog.com/release-polls/pa" rel="nofollow - Release Polls Listened to:
|
Posted By: Bob Greece
Date Posted: November 28 2005 at 04:59
|
Do you really think there is a chance? ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/BobGreece/?chartstyle=basicrt10">
|
Posted By: Logos
Date Posted: November 28 2005 at 05:01
Well I believe that the intelligent people of Prog Archives wouldn't make such an idiotic, insensible, totally unjustified addition. |
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: November 28 2005 at 05:04
|
^ wouldn't you agree that on his first 3 albums he did a damn good job at combining classical music and metal? ------------- https://awesomeprog.com/release-polls/pa" rel="nofollow - Release Polls Listened to:
|
Posted By: Lindsay Lohan
Date Posted: November 28 2005 at 05:10
|
Hah they have done worse before |
Posted By: Bob Greece
Date Posted: November 28 2005 at 05:12
|
Yngwie Malmsteen is already in the Archives. He plays guitar on Derek Sherinian's Black Utopia album. ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/BobGreece/?chartstyle=basicrt10">
|
Posted By: Lindsay Lohan
Date Posted: November 28 2005 at 05:18
|
Oh no! He has invaded us already |
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: November 28 2005 at 05:24
Of course ... as Prog Related. His early albums are REALLY GOOD - and the debut album in particular is quite complex. ------------- https://awesomeprog.com/release-polls/pa" rel="nofollow - Release Polls Listened to:
|
Posted By: Logos
Date Posted: November 28 2005 at 05:30
For example? |
Posted By: Lindsay Lohan
Date Posted: November 28 2005 at 05:35
|
NIGHTWISH |
Posted By: Manunkind
Date Posted: November 28 2005 at 05:36
|
If they add Malmsteen they'll have to add Cannibal Corpse, too - probably even more influential and much more interesting musically. Do I like Cannibal Corpse? Oh yes. Do I want to see them included? No, no, nie, no. ------------- "In war there is no time to teach or learn Zen. Carry a strong stick. Bash your attackers." - Zen Master Ikkyu Sojun |
Posted By: Lindsay Lohan
Date Posted: November 28 2005 at 05:39
How can anybody listen to music like that... |
Posted By: Logos
Date Posted: November 28 2005 at 05:42
Okay, you're right with that one 
Nightwish on a prog site is definitely a big joke. |
Posted By: Manunkind
Date Posted: November 28 2005 at 05:42
Ain't he a little too old for ya, Lindsay Wombat ------------- "In war there is no time to teach or learn Zen. Carry a strong stick. Bash your attackers." - Zen Master Ikkyu Sojun |
?Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: November 28 2005 at 05:44
Where is the connection between these two? ------------- https://awesomeprog.com/release-polls/pa" rel="nofollow - Release Polls Listened to:
|
Posted By: Lindsay Lohan
Date Posted: November 28 2005 at 05:45
And certainly i am not wombat! |
Posted By: Lindsay Lohan
Date Posted: November 28 2005 at 05:46
Both bands use Drums Bass and guitar |
Posted By: Lindsay Lohan
Date Posted: November 28 2005 at 05:48
Ahum the thread title read: Ywingie Malmsteen...while we have been ranting on about Yngwie malmsteen...oh dear 
|
Posted By: Manunkind
Date Posted: November 28 2005 at 05:54
They're both influential (in quite a narrow, 'specialised' sphere, yes, but still) and one can argue that their music shows at least a certain degree of ambition.
------------- "In war there is no time to teach or learn Zen. Carry a strong stick. Bash your attackers." - Zen Master Ikkyu Sojun |
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: November 28 2005 at 06:02
But Malmsteen really tried to combine Rock (Metal) with classical music, which is one of the key elements of prog music. I fail to see how Cannibal Corpse can be remotely associated with prog. I would not add Malmsteen solely because he was influential ... ------------- https://awesomeprog.com/release-polls/pa" rel="nofollow - Release Polls Listened to:
|
Posted By: Xymphony
Date Posted: November 28 2005 at 06:11
|
If Majestic (do you know this band?) is prog-metal in these archives, Malmsteen at least deserves to be prog-related... Majestic ripped-off many Malmsteen stuff, just with adding some of their technical abilities. I don't want to mention about Nightwish, Therion, Rhapsody... |
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: November 28 2005 at 06:14
^ it should be pointed out that many of these bands - which are usually called "Symphonic Metal" - are discussed on most of the other major prog websites and communities. ------------- https://awesomeprog.com/release-polls/pa" rel="nofollow - Release Polls Listened to:
|
Posted By: Lindsay Lohan
Date Posted: November 28 2005 at 06:16
|
And lets not forget the band that inspired most of them...uhum uhum IRON MAIDEN |
Posted By: NutterAlert
Date Posted: November 28 2005 at 06:18
|
OMG Lindsay, what's going on in your avatar now. (notice no rulez, wombat references Not at all prog for me.
------------- Proud to be an un-banned member since 2005 |
Posted By: Lindsay Lohan
Date Posted: November 28 2005 at 06:19
That is me on the avatar |
Posted By: Manunkind
Date Posted: November 28 2005 at 06:20
Hmm... how much of his repertoire can be described as a successful blend of classical and metal/rock? I don't know the next thing about music theory, but IMHO what Malmsteen does amounts to about 1/20 of what Bach did, for example. The classical element in Malmsteen seems to have been stripped down to the bone. As for CC - I always wonder why people say that "technicality does not prog make". Well, surely some of the things they do (weird time sigs, atonal - I hope that's the word - riffs) aren't exactly standard metal fare and they must testify to at least a rudimentary influence of another genre or genres, as seems to be the case with Malmsteen? ------------- "In war there is no time to teach or learn Zen. Carry a strong stick. Bash your attackers." - Zen Master Ikkyu Sojun |
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: November 28 2005 at 06:27
|
^ of course Malmsteen did not "re-invent" classical music, but he really managed to combine it with Metal. And IMO he did that better than (early) Rainbow or Uli Jon Roth, for example. ------------- https://awesomeprog.com/release-polls/pa" rel="nofollow - Release Polls Listened to:
|
Posted By: Manunkind
Date Posted: November 28 2005 at 06:30
|
Well, that may make him progressive but not necessarily prog... but that's another multi-volume story, one which I'll have to pick up later ------------- "In war there is no time to teach or learn Zen. Carry a strong stick. Bash your attackers." - Zen Master Ikkyu Sojun |
Posted By: Pafnutij
Date Posted: November 29 2005 at 09:17
|
How on earth did we arrive to THIS |
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: November 29 2005 at 09:44
What do you mean ... we didn't stray too far from the initiali question "Is Malmsteen Prog", did we? ------------- https://awesomeprog.com/release-polls/pa" rel="nofollow - Release Polls Listened to:
|
Posted By: Bob Greece
Date Posted: November 29 2005 at 10:41
So who was the blond girl in your avatar last week then? ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/BobGreece/?chartstyle=basicrt10">
|
Posted By: Uther Pendragon
Date Posted: November 29 2005 at 19:14
|
I would almost definitely say that Malmsteen is not prog, although
there is a hint of it from time to time. The best way to describe the
genre is possibly 80s heavy metal crossed with hard rock. But I agree
with the people who said earlier, does it really matter? Yngwie is a
damn good guitarist and had inspired many people, but is also
entertaining and great to listen to. What more do you want? ------------- "And so as I patrol in the valley of the shadow of the tricolour I must fear evil for I am but mortal and mortals can only die." |
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: November 29 2005 at 19:15
|
So there are no influences of classical music? ------------- https://awesomeprog.com/release-polls/pa" rel="nofollow - Release Polls Listened to:
|
Posted By: Uther Pendragon
Date Posted: November 29 2005 at 19:18
Rotten Body Landslide I cum Blood Blowtorch Slaughter Hacksaw Decapitation I don't really get it but am open-minded so if you could explain that would be helpful... ------------- "And so as I patrol in the valley of the shadow of the tricolour I must fear evil for I am but mortal and mortals can only die." |
Posted By: Uther Pendragon
Date Posted: November 29 2005 at 19:23
Yeah sorry, I thought that went without saying, but I mean he has taken the classical element and created a hybrid with these other styles. I mean for the whole classical side you only need to look at Yngwie's early influences and the music he used to listen to, for example, Paganini featured heavily in his upbringing and he transcribed some numbers to guitar in early days, so yes classical too. ------------- "And so as I patrol in the valley of the shadow of the tricolour I must fear evil for I am but mortal and mortals can only die." |
Posted By: decypher
Date Posted: November 29 2005 at 20:04
|
Malmsteen has "wrote" so much crap that it is hard to appreciate him
for his classical- and shred influence. but some guys here are right
that he really brought the neoclassical metal genre to a new level, or
rather to a level at all as there wasnīt much of that style before him. His technique is fantastic, he is VERY secure and plays his scales with a virtuosity that is outstanding. But also that is his problem - he plays HIS typical scales, he sounds so limited while Vai or Satriani at least work on different sounds and song structures. And his blues stuff - he must hate blues almost as much as I do, so dull and stereotype that he makes it sound, itīs almost like "let me out of this scale, Iīm gonne shread you all". His guitar lines are so "present and one dimensional", hard to describe what I mean but itīs like heīs either there sweeping his arpeggios (or leading a "melody" into it) or not. Jason Becker: Brilliant with Marty Friedman, hey those guys were almost kids when they recorded stuff like "images" etc. . Vai: theory in practice Satriani: feels a lot, maybe too much, I want more spectacular stuff (his albums after "Flying" disappointed me. "Memories" live is brilliant!) Petrucci: great, although I still like WDADU most. Thatīs about it. Listen to more Jarzombek and Matheos, both deserve it. |
Posted By: walrus333
Date Posted: November 29 2005 at 20:19
|
Personally I think he could be included on the archives. He influenced alot of prog-metal(and metal in general) guitarists since him and he combined classical and metal as stated many a time already. Although his stuff is quite boring after awhile. ------------- If anyone knows where I can get a copy of some Flute and Voice (Indo-Prog/Raga Rock) albums please PM me! Many thanks! |
Posted By: decypher
Date Posted: November 29 2005 at 21:21
|
I agree, his influence was huge. Just like groups like Symphony x,
Shadow Gallery or Adiago adopted those scales, I see that stuff more as
metal on a higher instrumental level than being really progressive. but
Iīm not here to judge whatīs progressive or not (in my personal opinion
King Diamonds "Abigail" is so damn progressive... or Crimson Glory or
Titan Force etc. (and I loved Shadow Galleryīs Debut)). It doesnīt
matter, anyway, Malmsteen wrote more bullsh*t than any other so-called
prog musician, including Phil Collins. |
Posted By: Destrio
Date Posted: November 29 2005 at 22:16
|
No! All 3 of those people are piss poor songwriters. Although I do like some of Satriani's stuff. |
Posted By: MarkCsigs
Date Posted: November 29 2005 at 22:31
|
Funny that this thread shows up now. I just today heard a radio ad for a Malmsteen concert and it specifically says "An evening of prog rock"
and I thought "Malmsteen is prog?!?" and "Funny ... seems like most
prog bands lately are actually trying to deny that they're prog ..."
------------- I repeat myself when under stress. |
Posted By: beat
Date Posted: November 30 2005 at 03:25
| Absolutely NO.. |
Posted By: Lindsay Lohan
Date Posted: November 30 2005 at 03:26
That was lindsay lohan...famous actress |
Posted By: Bob Greece
Date Posted: December 01 2005 at 07:37
I never heard of her. I checked http://www.imdb.com - www.imdb.com and found that she has been in a few films but I haven't seen any of them. Mind you, I never go to the cinema any more. ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/BobGreece/?chartstyle=basicrt10">
|
Posted By: Lindsay Lohan
Date Posted: December 01 2005 at 07:53
Well you propably would not like em anyways but i think forexample Freaky Friday is great fun! ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Fjuffe/?chartstyle=sideRed - [IMG - http://imagegen.last.fm/sideRed/recenttracks/Fjuffe.gif - |
Posted By: Masquerade
Date Posted: October 20 2006 at 18:06
|
yngwie`s rissing force (first album) is a kind of progmetal?...maybe...probably |
Posted By: SolariS
Date Posted: October 22 2006 at 13:24
|
I don't think so. There's nothing prog about sweep picking scales on every song your write. He's very impressive as a technical guitarist, but his music is what we're discussing here...and the truth is he can't write interesting solos or lyrics. He didn't invent sweep picking either. -------------  
|
Posted By: SolariS
Date Posted: October 22 2006 at 13:25
I actually don't like Satriani's early stuff that much (with the exception of a few songs here and there). Always with you Always with me is a great track. Strange Beautiful Music is the best album effort I've heard from him. -------------
|
Posted By: Chus
Date Posted: October 26 2006 at 12:43
|
in wikipedia, on the Steve Hackett article appears Yngwie as being influenced by him... but barely technically really... Yngwie was really near neo-classical prog-metal in the first album "Rising Force", in which he wrote quite ambitious titles such as "Icarus Dream Suite" and "Far Beyond The Sun". But from that album on he just plain imitated Eddie Van Halen (in songwritting, mind you, the tapping and sweep picking was pioneered by someone else: you-know-who) and other metal outfits. But of course when the music is drowned by the technical ability that's where the "prog" term suffers greatly. I had watched his "concerto suite for electric guitar and orchestra" and that's the first time he implemented a sort of allegro or even sarabande piece. Most of his metal albums are in the same mood... some sort of adagio, and that gets repetitive quickly, but that's probably the mood that metal wants to give us in the first place, and that's one of the reasons I don't like metal (just one of the zillion of reasons I don't like metal). Lately he sounds like an imitation of late 90's power metal bands (Rhapsody, Sonata Arctica, etc), and for me they're just a parody to classical music, as well as Yngwie's work after his first album, and that album was not a cornerstone of classical music in the first place. ------------- Jesus Gabriel |