Hey , How come no Phil Collins
Printed From: Progarchives.com
Category: Progressive Music Lounges
Forum Name: Suggest New Bands and Artists
Forum Description: Suggest, create polls, and classify new bands you would like included on Prog Archives
URL: http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=15509
Printed Date: March 03 2025 at 15:56
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Topic: Hey , How come no Phil Collins
Posted By: PhilPhan
Subject: Hey , How come no Phil Collins
Date Posted: December 06 2005 at 21:25
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Hey, how come there are no Phil Collins CD's listed in the review section ? As one of the original members of the greatest prog band ever, he should be there. There are Steve Hackett and Peter Gabriel solo albums listed there. Why not Phill Collins ? |
Replies:
Posted By: andYouandI45
Date Posted: December 06 2005 at 21:32
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Becuase he is not prog. He is pop, and he did in fact ruin the greatest prog band ever. Maybe he would be in Prog-Related but scince he like literally destroyed Genesis, screw him.
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Posted By: GoldenSpiral
Date Posted: December 06 2005 at 21:34
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because his solo albums are not progressive rock. they are pop rock. not that they're not good pop rock, but they are not prog rock, nor nearly as progressive as PG or hackett's solo records. Notice the absence of Mike rutherford's solo projects....
------------- http://www.myspace.com/altaic" rel="nofollow - http://www.myspace.com/altaic ALTAIC "Oceans Down You'll Lie" coming soon |
Posted By: Bern
Date Posted: December 06 2005 at 21:34
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We can't forget what Phil did in the early days. He was an amazing drummer!! But I agree that his solo career isn't prog at all.
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RIP in bossa nova heaven. |
Posted By: GoldenSpiral
Date Posted: December 06 2005 at 21:34
whoa, guy, the popification of genesis was a team effort. finger pointing is not necessary in this case. ------------- http://www.myspace.com/altaic" rel="nofollow - http://www.myspace.com/altaic ALTAIC "Oceans Down You'll Lie" coming soon |
andYouandI45 wrote:Posted By: Bern
Date Posted: December 06 2005 at 21:39
Totally agree  -------------
RIP in bossa nova heaven. |
Posted By: PhilPhan
Date Posted: December 06 2005 at 21:40
| well, couldn't one argue that genesis did indeed progress. doesn't the term progressive mean change ? what did you want them to do, redo "Firth of fifth" or "cinema show" again and again. |
Posted By: ldlanberg
Date Posted: December 06 2005 at 21:56
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Phil was one of the two best things to happen to Genesis. (Steve Hackett being the other.) I preferred Phil's fluid, athletic stagemanship over Peter's stiff and choreographed stuff. Phil was an exciting drummer as well. Yet I haven't heard anything from Phil's solo stuff that would qualify for reminiscing on this site. But of course I cannot stop anyone from reminiscing about anything. Nor would I want to be that kind of jerk.
------------- LDL |
Posted By: Ivan_Melgar_M
Date Posted: December 06 2005 at 22:25
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Phil hasn't written a single Progressive note in any of his solo albums, he's included as a member of Genesis (Despite his crimes against Prog But as a soloist, he should be in the Pop Atchives. Iván ------------- 
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).Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: December 06 2005 at 22:48
(though just one thing he is a great drummer don`t forget that)
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Posted By: Cinema
Date Posted: December 06 2005 at 23:00
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You might say Phil Collins is to progressive rock, what Judas was to the
disciples. |
Posted By: NetsNJFan
Date Posted: December 06 2005 at 23:46
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Phil Collins has contributed A LOT to prog ------------- 
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Posted By: BleedingGum
Date Posted: December 07 2005 at 00:09
Phil Collins has done such a great job, whether you like it or not. He
can play and write music what he wants to, without listening to
anyone's opinion.  Even me, I stop buying Genesis post ATTWT and I am not interested to collect his albums. but I give him credits.  ------------- ...this is called....BleedingGum ... ! |
Posted By: SlipperFink
Date Posted: December 07 2005 at 00:42
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KILL PHIL!!!
KILL PHIL!!! KILL PHIL!!! KILL PHIL!!! KILL PHIL!!! KILL PHIL!!! KILL PHIL!!! KILL PHIL!!! EVERYBODY NOW!!!!! LMFBO. Ahh me. Gotta love Prog fans. Warms the cockles of me 'eart. SM. ------------- Modesty is an ornament, but one goes further without it. Old German Proverb |
Posted By: lunaticviolist
Date Posted: December 07 2005 at 02:05
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Phil Collins had some great post-Genesis songs. I personally am
not much of a fan of his music, but he definitely deserves
respect. Inclusion on this site (as a solo artist), however,
should not and will not ever happen.
------------- My recent purchases: 
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Posted By: BiGi
Date Posted: December 07 2005 at 02:32
------------- A flower? 
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Posted By: pero
Date Posted: December 07 2005 at 02:56
No way |
Posted By: Jim Garten
Date Posted: December 07 2005 at 03:26
Well, yes, actually - your point being? ------------- 
Jon Lord 1941 - 2012 |
Posted By: Lindsay Lohan
Date Posted: December 07 2005 at 03:30
I dont get that Prog Related thingie...there are many artists there that does not got any progressive elements at all  ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Fjuffe/?chartstyle=sideRed - [IMG - http://imagegen.last.fm/sideRed/recenttracks/Fjuffe.gif - |
Posted By: RoyalJelly
Date Posted: December 07 2005 at 03:34
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Changing one's style is not the same as progressing, especially when the change involves reverting to a set of pre-existing pop clichés. No progression where there's no innovation. It's possible to be innovative within a pop format, Eno, Gabriel, Kate Bush and David Sylvian, for example, can do that, but I wouldn't include Collins or later Genesis in that category. Ohhhh, you can't hurry love, nooohhhh, it's just got to wait!!!!.... |
Posted By: Norbert
Date Posted: December 07 2005 at 03:37
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Most of the solo efforts of Phil Collins are simply pop, not even plain rock. Of course, he's better than Michael Jackson, but this is not enough reason to his inclusion. |
Posted By: Lindsay Lohan
Date Posted: December 07 2005 at 04:28
That should be the ONLY reason for inclusion ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Fjuffe/?chartstyle=sideRed - [IMG - http://imagegen.last.fm/sideRed/recenttracks/Fjuffe.gif - |
Posted By: PROGMAN
Date Posted: December 07 2005 at 06:26
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I've heard "Face Value", "No Jacket Required" and "But Seriously" and must say it is American Radio freindly POP with Ballads, Jazzy Pop, and Electro Elements but no more than that, PROG no way o - zay. ------------- CYMRU AM BYTH 
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Posted By: Bj-1
Date Posted: December 09 2005 at 17:11
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Phil Collins' solo stuff is Porn Pop (that kinda' pop who perfectly fits in Porn movies
------------- RIO/AVANT/ZEUHL - The best thing you can get with yer pants on! |
Posted By: Orbert
Date Posted: December 09 2005 at 17:21
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And just to nitpick - or maybe not - he wasn't an original member of Genesis. He joined on the third album, Nursery Cryme, along with Steve Hackett. ------------- In and around the lake... 
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Posted By: Ivan_Melgar_M
Date Posted: December 10 2005 at 01:51
Ok pal, name a single Prog' song in Phil's solo career? If not, then send him to Pop Archives, because that's the music he was playing as soloist. Iván -------------
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Posted By: Vulkan
Date Posted: December 11 2005 at 23:22
still, screw phill...he should have stayed on the drums ------------- Why are we never too sure till we die or have killed for an answer... ...Though names may change each face retains the mask it wore |
Posted By: Vulkan
Date Posted: December 11 2005 at 23:25
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Phill Collins sold himself to Disney ------------- Why are we never too sure till we die or have killed for an answer... ...Though names may change each face retains the mask it wore |
Posted By: Alka
Date Posted: December 12 2005 at 01:17
| Yeah, sure, why not? let`s add Mike & The Mechanics too |
Posted By: progaeopteryx
Date Posted: January 05 2006 at 21:34
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The only compromise I could suggest on Phil Collins is making an entry for him with a biography that clearly states his contributions to progressive rock with links pointing to Genesis and Brand X. Mention he had a solo career that consisted only of pop albums and that reviewing pop albums is beyond the scope of Prog Archives. If adventurous, list his solo discography in the biography. Disable the ability of users adding albums to the page. Just an idea. Sometimes I wonder about my brain.  |
Posted By: Yanns
Date Posted: January 05 2006 at 21:43
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I'm not gonna lie. That's a good idea. |
Posted By: Yanns
Date Posted: January 05 2006 at 21:44
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Do you mean No way jose?Posted By: Ivan_Melgar_M
Date Posted: January 05 2006 at 21:44
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But Phil Collins doesn't have a single solo Prog note, so he shouldn't be included as a solo artist in Prog Archives. His solo albums are not only POP (There's some great POP) but boring and bland POP. In that case, lets add Peter Banks, John Mayhew, Trevor Rabin and Elton John (He auditioned for King Crimson!!!) Iván -------------
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Posted By: Yanns
Date Posted: January 05 2006 at 21:45
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No. Changing does not mean progressing. Progress involves change, but it also involves moving forward. Moving to pop is not moving forward. Change, on the other hand, does not need moving forward. It can go backward, stay where it is, or go forward, aka, progressing. |
Posted By: Yanns
Date Posted: January 05 2006 at 21:46
| But Ivan, it would just be to show his contribution. Not about his albums done in his solo career. |
Posted By: Ivan_Melgar_M
Date Posted: January 06 2006 at 00:41
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No Yanns, he has contributed as a Genesis and Brand X member, so it's fair to be mentioned in Genesis and Brand X only.
They (Except Mike) deserve to be mentioned as Genesis members and as soloists As a soloist Phil Collins never contributed to Prog, not an album, not a song, not a chord and not even a note so he shouldn't be mentioned as soloist He dserves credit? I don't know, honestly I can't care less for his albums, but doeshe dserves to be in a Prog page? NO WAY JOSÉ!!!!! PhilPhan wrote:
Hey pal: Evolution and progress work like this:
From: The Knife to Musical Box and to Supper's Ready
Genesis "change" worked like this:
From The Knife to Musical Box, to Supper's Ready and way back to Illegal Alien Read Darwin, things go from simple to complex not in the other way. Iván -------------
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Posted By: Kid-A
Date Posted: January 06 2006 at 05:34
Am I the only one getting tired of this mindless phil collins bashing? You think Banks and Rutherford had no say in them turning pop? ALL of the blame gets put on Phil Collins, which is rediculous. And what is wrong with making pop music in the 80's? If you don't like it just ignore it. How exactly does this ruin the band? It's not like he destroyed Genesis' back catalogue or anything. Or would you rather if they just went on and made un-inspired progressive music they didn't want to be making? I think Phil Collins should be added to progarchives, just cause he's quite an important character in prog history. |
Posted By: Ricochet
Date Posted: January 06 2006 at 05:36
COLLINS IS POP!! END OF STORY! 
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Posted By: Phil
Date Posted: January 06 2006 at 05:58
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Posted By: Ivan_Melgar_M
Date Posted: January 06 2006 at 10:22
I believe Eddie Offord and Tony Stratton Smith (Charisma Records) are 1,000 times more important to Prog than Phil Collins will ever be, without them Yes, Genesis and VDGG would never had a chance to reach the heights they reached, and they don't have a place here because they didn't released Prog' albums as musicians.
I believe Tony Banks and Mike Rutherford are almost as responsible for Genesis debacle, but they have at least Prog related albums, so they have more right to be here. Iván BTW: Yes you are one of the few, because bashing Phil Collins is the national sport here and in any Prog place. -------------
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Posted By: JayDee
Date Posted: January 06 2006 at 10:31
Amen ------------- 
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Posted By: Charles
Date Posted: January 06 2006 at 14:22
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Phil Collins definitely should not be included here as for even if he was place in the "Prog Related" section and someone who has never heard his solo career and Genesis prior to and then there were three.. would be in for a major shock.... I personally do not sl*g Phil Collins, I think he is a great drummer, excellent singer and writer of good POP tunes, his first four solo albums reside in my CD collection and my Ipod would sometimes play some of his songs whenever I have it on "shuffle"... Charles
PS: Genesis went POP and Phil Collins was blamed...
Lets see what other band went through the same thing... Chicago-Terry Kath dies and Peter Cetera gets the blame for turning them into a sappy pop band... ------------- G'day |
Posted By: salmacis
Date Posted: January 06 2006 at 16:48
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I thought it was a joke when I first read this thread... As much as I respect Phil Collins as a drummer and singer; I like most of his work with Genesis, prog or not, and they released their all time worst album after Collins left in 'Calling All Stations' proving his worth, but his solo career is as unprog as you can get! |
Posted By: W.Chuck
Date Posted: January 06 2006 at 18:20
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Simply POP, nothing progressive (solo) ! ------------- 
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Posted By: Frasse
Date Posted: January 06 2006 at 18:46
You have good arguments Iván. Phil Collins is mentioned in Genesis and Brand X and that is enough. |
Posted By: digdug
Date Posted: May 01 2006 at 18:52
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OK, Phil Collins has a pop catalogue.......and some bad pop in there to boot..... he is definitely not one of my faves.......
but......
He should be in prog related......that is what I thought prog related was for.....
defnition of prog related .... defnitely not prog.....but related to prog somehow
He is not prog , but he is related to prog, because he is also in Genesis. ------------- Prog On! |
Posted By: Raff
Date Posted: May 02 2006 at 00:22
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To put it in a few words:
you must be joking!!!
 The site would lose all credibility if Collins's solo output were added. It has nothing whatsoever to do with prog. OK, he was a member of Genesis; OK; he was a great drummer - what about the quality of the music he produced when he went solo? As others have already said, it's not even good pop.
What next? If a member of any prog band starts releasing hip-hop or disco albums, shall we add them to PA because they're prog-related ? I'm very open-minded when it comes to music, but I draw the line at such things.
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