Interactive Playlist: Songwriting-Piano vs Guitar
Printed From: Progarchives.com
Category: Other music related lounges
Forum Name: General Music Discussions
Forum Description: Discuss and create polls about all types of music
URL: http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=131619
Printed Date: December 03 2024 at 00:07
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 11.01 - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: Interactive Playlist: Songwriting-Piano vs Guitar
Posted By: Mila-13
Subject: Interactive Playlist: Songwriting-Piano vs Guitar
Date Posted: September 09 2023 at 15:56
 SONGWRITING: PIANO vs GUITAR Hi everybody and welcome to another edition of our Interactive Playlist series! This edition is going to be about songwriting and using different instruments to write a song. But what are the best instruments for songwriting? To what extent does the choice of instrument influence the songwriting process and type of composition, or is there any difference at all? More generally, it is probably easier to answer these questions using a couple of examples. So, let's do this! Clarification: Singer-songwriters are an obvious and illustrative model in this context. They often provide the sole accompaniment to an entire composition or song, typically using a guitar or piano but there are also other appropriate instruments, of course and the songwriter may well be accompanied by a band or orchestra or be part of a band. However, in order to have a common criterion it makes sense to exclude purely instrumental compositions. Here are the guidelines Note: This is about songs in the original sense, that is compositions including vocals. - Choose 2 songs based on a different instrument each, e. g. piano or guitar. - You can suggest as many pairings as you like, but only one pairing per post. In each case there must be at least one suggestion by another participant between your posts, since in the poll there are only 25 spots in total. - You are welcome to choose any music genre you like but it would be desirable to have a musically diverse line-up. - Please, avoid too long tracks (max duration +/- 7 min) ______________________________________________ Required info: Please write the artist's name and song title next to the YouTube video link. Due to geographical restrictions some videos are not accessible to others. Voting: You can vote for as many songs as you like, excluding your own. The voting will begin as soon as all spots in the poll are taken, otherwise when no more suggestions have been posted for a while, 2-3 days or so. Comments: Optionally, you can say something about why you made your selection and comment on the songs suggested by other participants. So, join us now & have fun!  ____________________________ And here is the https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wJ3m839huMs&list=PLRF2N4J-pa5QhDwdRy6d6irkjYtQ9IpG2" rel="nofollow - playlist Note: The playlist will be updated regularely. It will appear at the end of this opening post only. |
Replies:
Posted By: mathman0806
Date Posted: September 09 2023 at 21:25
| Interesting idea. I don't think there is a "best" for songwriting, but I do have a pairing in mind involving a band on Prog Archives. I will think about this a bit. |
Posted By: Mila-13
Date Posted: September 10 2023 at 00:52
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^ I guess you are right. There is probably not a 'best instrument for songwriting' but I do believe that the choice of instrument makes a difference. I'm looking forward to your suggestions!
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Posted By: mathman0806
Date Posted: September 10 2023 at 04:32
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This may not compare songwriting but does compare songs by essentially the same artists where keyboards is the prominent instrument in one group and guitar is in the other. I like the pairing since I had been listening to these two albums lately. Valdez is a crossover prog band formed by singer/guitarist Simon Godfrey (Tinyfish, Shineback) and bassist Tom Hyatt (Echolyn) with drummer Scott Miller and keyboardist Joe Cardillo. Their debut album This came out in 2015. The music heavily featured the keyboards of Joe Cardillo though Simon Godfrey is the principal songwriter. A few years later, the band begins work on a second album but Joe Cardillo leaves. This results in a lineup change and new guitarist Karl Eisenhart (Pinnacle) takes the lead role (rather than replace Joe Cardillo with another keyboardist) with songs being reworked. Without Joe, the band felt they were no longer Valdez, so they became Tribe of Names. There's a different feel as the keyboard centric Valdez was perhaps more 'delicate' compared to the electric guitar driven sound of Tribe of Names. The Tribe of Names album Evolver came out in 2022 as the band spent 18 months recording through the pandemic and lockdown. I want to pair two particular songs but neither have videos on YouTube so here are links/embeds to Bandcamp. (EDIT: Still no video but decided to replace the Valdez song I originally posted.) https://valdezusa.bandcamp.com/track/thirteen" rel="nofollow - Valdez - Thirteen https://tribeofnames.bandcamp.com/track/mayfly" rel="nofollow - Tribe of Names - Mayfly EDIT: After writing this up, I did find a YouTube video of a live streaming performance of Mayfly. |
Posted By: Mila-13
Date Posted: September 10 2023 at 09:44
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^ The evolution of this band is quite interesting and allows a direct comparison of their sound during and after their period with Joe Cardillo. Even though this does not exactly correspond to the topic description, it is, more or less basically the essence of what it is about imo. I found another song off their album "This" on video. Maybe it is not as representative as yours, but have a listen and tell me what you think about it. |
Posted By: mathman0806
Date Posted: September 10 2023 at 14:36
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^I nominated that song a few years ago in an early interactive poll. https://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=123331" rel="nofollow - https://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=123331 I didn't want to repeat a song and preferred the keyboards in the one I suggested. Though for the sake of keeping the nominees in a YouTube playlist, then it's fine. |
Posted By: Mila-13
Date Posted: September 10 2023 at 14:46
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Here is my first pair of songs. The first song is a piano-based piece by Italian singer-songwriter and jazz pianist Raphael Gualazzi, here accompanied by an orchestra. The song is the title track off his latest album to be released later this year. The second song was written by Egyptian singer-songwriter and accordionist Youssra El Hawary, here accompanied by her band. My intention was to show that there are other instruments besides the piano and the guitar that are suitable for composing. I have deliberately chosen two pieces with orchestra or band accompaniment to create a broader basis for comparison. At the same time these are two pieces that do not differ too much from each other in terms of genre and mood, so that you can hear the subtleties that distinguish them. Raphael Gualazzi: Vivido il tramonto (2023) Youssra El Hawary: Bas Kollo Yehoon (2017) |
Posted By: Mila-13
Date Posted: September 10 2023 at 18:37
Sorry George, I missed your previous comment! I started writing my previous post while watching tennis. It seemed like that second set would never end . .  I know, playlists are not always the best option. Sometime ago I suggested to list the link of each entry individually in the OP instead of using a playlist but that was not implemented. At the moment it doesn't look like there is much interest in this poll. If a few more people join us, we could reconsider and see if my idea gets positive feedback. For now I have added the song with the video to the playlist. But I will keep in mind your first choice on bandcamp.
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mathman0806 wrote:Posted By: Lewian
Date Posted: September 16 2023 at 06:25
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This is a tough topic and I can see why it's hard for some to contribute. Two artists come to my mind that I had both already in the interactive polls, but there is no shortage of stuff of them that I love. Jose Gonzales is a guitarist and his music is very guitar oriented. Barbara Morgenstern is a keyboarder and composes on piano, organ, or synth. Jose Gonzales - Crosses Barbara Morgenstern - Aus heiterem Himmel |
Posted By: Logan
Date Posted: September 16 2023 at 09:55
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Sorry it taking a while to get down to this -- been very involved in other things as well as trying some things of my own at PA (and started work on making an arts platform which I hope to become a full-time thing eventually). I do tend to go with my gut, and von Hausswolff and Holter were the first two artists to come to mind. I decided for whatever I choose to go with live performances, which is limiting. In both cases I went with songs that I have not covered before let alone the performances. I know variety was asked for and these artists share similar ground, but I find these sufficiently different (and I like certain cohesiveness when pairing TBH). And yes, both are keyboards, but one is a piano and the other is a pipe organ. The first is Anna von Hausswolff performaing on a grand pipe organ in New York. Anna von Hausswolff - Funeral for My Future Children (live at Christ Church, NY) Anna von Hausswolff is a singer-songwriter organist (pipe and otherwise), piano player, and keyboardist generally. The second is the singer-songwriter Julia Holter on grand piano. Julia Holter - Betsy on the Roof (live) ------------- https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLXcp9fYc6K4IKuxIZkenfvukL_Y8VBqzK" rel="nofollow - Duos for fave acts |
Posted By: Mila-13
Date Posted: September 16 2023 at 11:29
Thanks for joining us, Christian! I've almost given up. Why did you find this topic so difficult? Is it perhaps due to my wording or is it the topic itself? I thought that in a prog forum including also many 80s music fans it should be relatively easy for people to find something suitable. This is what I wrote in the description: Singer-songwriters are an obvious and illustrative model in this context. They often provide the sole accompaniment to an entire composition or song, typically using a guitar or piano but there are also other appropriate instruments, of course and the songwriter may well be accompanied by a band or orchestra or be part of a band. However, in order to have a common criterion it makes sense to exclude purely instrumental compositions. |
Posted By: Mila-13
Date Posted: September 16 2023 at 11:51
Hi Greg, I'm glad that you found the time to participate in this poll! I have noticed that you have started quite a few new threads lately. I found some of them quite interesting and I have considered joining in, but in part I was a bit owerwhelmed by the sheer amount of music that was presented. I will think again where I might be able to contribute. :)
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Posted By: Lewian
Date Posted: September 16 2023 at 12:07
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^^ Maybe the actual rules for contributing are not that difficult, but the introduction made me think you are looking for some examples that can serve to explore the differences of songwriting between guitar and keyboard. So in order to find something I have to think about this issue, and of course I need to know on which instrument was something actually written. For example I had toyed around with proposing other Morgenstern tracks but decided there was too much guitar in them, it wouldn't really make for enough contrast to the guitar song (though still very different from it anyway), it really should be clearly keyboard oriented. It isn't so easy to figure out what would really fit into this concept. But then one could make one's own life easier by just posting one guitar- and one keyboard-oriented song (or even other instruments), which would probably be OK and not so difficult. Just getting through to the idea that that's just it is something of an effort. The introduction looks as if you're looking for something more sophisticated. |
Posted By: Logan
Date Posted: September 16 2023 at 12:10
It's not like I put much thought into this, sorry. I know mine are not that diverse. Similar moods, and two kinds of keyboards, but I do like to go with the first things to spring to mind. Problem is, that's an associative brain exercise and so those two will be ones that I already associate with each other. My PA topics are mostly for stress relief. I have tried some list type ones to try to get a better feel for what other people's favourite music is, and if it becomes more interactive, that's a great bonus (I like it when we have some conversation, some listening to each other's choices and comments to go with the lists). I should have specified right from the start that people mention one or two tracks from their lists that one wishes to highlight to make listening to other's choices easier even if one just scans it to see if it likely might appeal. I am excited about making my own arts site and platform, which I hope will be a useful resource and good/ encouragaing community support for creative people and people interested in the arts of different stripes. Anyway, thanks for taking on another Interactive Poll, Mila. ------------- https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLXcp9fYc6K4IKuxIZkenfvukL_Y8VBqzK" rel="nofollow - Duos for fave acts |
Posted By: I prophesy disaster
Date Posted: September 16 2023 at 12:24
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I decided to join in. However, I thought the topic needed the further condition that the two songs be by the same artist. So I chose both tracks by Peter Hammill: Peter Hammill - pH7 - Careering (guitar) Peter Hammill - Sitting Targets - Stranger Still (piano) ------------- No, I know how to behave in the restaurant now, I don't tear at the meat with my hands. If I've become a man of the world somehow, that's not necessarily to say I'm a worldly man. |
Posted By: Mila-13
Date Posted: September 16 2023 at 13:00
Glad to see you IPD! That's a great idea to show two pieces by the same artist in this context. There are many ways to interpret the subject. In this case, we have the opportunity to hear the diversity of an artist's compositional style in direct comparison and thus to get to know him even better. :)
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Posted By: Mila-13
Date Posted: September 16 2023 at 15:00
I was hoping that someone else would start a new IA-poll, since this is still my favourite format. Is Lorenzo actually still around? I haven't seen him in a while. Great to hear about your plan to create your own website! I have made a website two or so years ago, actually before I joint PA. I wanted to team-up with a friend but in the end it came to nothing. At some point, I realised that doing it all by myself would require much more time than I have available. It is not just about creating new content but also about the technical know-how needed to run such a website. Do you have someone to help you? Btw. could you maybe suggest another artist who plays an instrument other than piano/keyboards? The point here is also to create opportunities for comparison of piano-based and guitar-based songwriting. It may also be another suitable instrument. There are many other options. :)
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Posted By: Logan
Date Posted: September 16 2023 at 15:15
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I know the person who designed one of my brother’s websites for his business, but he charges big bucks. I am into a plethora of music instruments, know lots of course, although piano is a particular favourite of mine. Do you want to replace one of my selections since pianos and organs both are keyboard instruments? ------------- https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLXcp9fYc6K4IKuxIZkenfvukL_Y8VBqzK" rel="nofollow - Duos for fave acts |
Posted By: Mila-13
Date Posted: September 16 2023 at 17:08
No, that's fine. But perhaps you could suggest additionaly a song that is not keyboard-based?
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Posted By: Logan
Date Posted: September 16 2023 at 17:28
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^ I had planned to come up with another duo, cello and guitar, but then those are both strings based. Actually, scrap my selections, and I'll try to come up with something different anon if I can think of anything that I like and think others will. I probably should have thought this through more. ------------- https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLXcp9fYc6K4IKuxIZkenfvukL_Y8VBqzK" rel="nofollow - Duos for fave acts |
Posted By: mathman0806
Date Posted: September 16 2023 at 17:28
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Hi Mila, I think what I fond difficult, and it has nothing to either your des Tipton, is that my own desire to have my pairing make 'sense', in whatever manner satisfies me. I just don't want to randomly pair a guitar based song with a keyboard based song. And as Christian stated. How do I know how a song is written. My first pairing was based on knowing the story behind Valdez to Tribe of Names. (As an aside, I think I do prefer Thirteen over Black Eyed Susans as a comparison. It's more piano oriented and I like the pairing with Mayfly.) |
Posted By: Mila-13
Date Posted: September 16 2023 at 17:44
It's fine the way it is, Greg! I didn't know you would come up with more suggestions. I'm looking forward to them. :)
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Posted By: Mila-13
Date Posted: September 16 2023 at 18:08
You're right, if it is not just about singer-songwriters it's not as easy as I thought. But still, if there is f.e. a keyboardist in a band then at least there is a chance, that he is one of the songwriters. You have many examples esp. in the prog department and in 60s/70s rock in general. Besides you have all the 80s synth stuff etc. But even if a keyboarder in a band is not a songwriter/composer he can still significantly shape the musical style of a band. Your band Valdez is a great example.
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Posted By: mathman0806
Date Posted: September 16 2023 at 18:46
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Here's a second pairing. Tim Minchin - Confessions Flight of the Conchords - Think About It |
Posted By: Mila-13
Date Posted: September 17 2023 at 04:35
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^ I don't know who's crazier here, Minchin or these two Kiwis, but this is the first time that I have heard of the duo! Are they well known in the u.s., George? |
Posted By: mathman0806
Date Posted: September 17 2023 at 04:46
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Breaking the rules here with a third pairing right after a second but I wanted to get this posted before I lost it. First up is Damn Fine Coffee. I wanted to suggest this band from the start but couldn't think of a pairing that I was satisfied with. Damn Fine Coffee is basically a solo project of multi-instrumentalist Jonn Buzby. On their first two albums, he was supported by a bassist and drummer while he sang and played keyboards. He plays all instruments on the third. No guitars. Jonn is also singer/keyboardist for prog band Land of Chocolate. He was the drummer for prog band Finneus Gauge, where his brother Chris Buzby played keyboards. Loose connection to my first pairing is that Chris Buzby is the keyboardist for Echolyn. Damn Fine Coffee - All We Are The second is Old Man Wizard, a heavy rock power trio from San Diego. Their music has some prog influences. This track isn't heavy rock and felt like it could be paired with the Damn Fine Coffee track because of it acoustic nature. I had suggested but not nominated them in a previous Interactive Poll. Old Man Wizard - Never Leave |
Posted By: mathman0806
Date Posted: September 17 2023 at 05:00
They were known for their TV show. Flight of the Conchords had an acclaimed HBO musical sitcom from 2007 to 2009 in which they played fictionalized versions of themselves trying to achieve success in the U.S. The show earned an Emmmy nomination for best comedy. I believe the clip you saw was from an HBO special filmed in London. Here's the song I suggested as shown in the TV show from episode 3 of season 1 I had not too long ago shared a Tim Minchin song with a friend of mine who had not heard of him and she replied that it made her think of Flight of the Conchords. 
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Posted By: Mila-13
Date Posted: September 18 2023 at 21:59
The British sense of humour is quite different from the American humour I know, although the Kiwi variety is a bit milder and more laidback. I'm glad that the boys were able to make America laugh. They made me laugh too, I didn't know them. Thanks for introducing them here!
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Posted By: Mila-13
Date Posted: September 19 2023 at 02:53
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Here's another pairing from me: Owen Pallett: This Is the Dream of Win and Regine Owen Pallett is a Canadian composer, violinist, keyboardist and singer who came to my attention through his work with Canadian indie rock band Arcade Fire, having been credited as an arranger and instrumentalist on each of their studio albums. But he is also an artist in his own right. This is a song from one of his early solo albums (Has a Good Home, 2005). In 2014 Pallett and Arcade Fire member William Butler were nominated for Best Original Score at the Academy Awards for their original score of the film "Her". Soap&Skin: Heal Soap&Skin is the experimental musical project of Austrian artist Anja Plaschg. In 2008 she played German singer Nico in the play "Nico - Sphinx aus Eis" by Werner Fritsch in Berlin and Vienna, performing several songs in it. After only playing a few concerts she was already being dubbed a Wunderkind. This is a song off her latest album. She composes her music mainly on piano, combined with electronica. |
Posted By: Mila-13
Date Posted: September 20 2023 at 15:01
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Hey guys, would anyone else like to suggest something or should we start the voting (if at all)? |