Printed From: Progarchives.com
Category: Progressive Music Lounges
Forum Name: Prog Recommendations/Featured albums
Forum Description: Make or seek recommendations and discuss specific prog albums
URL: http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=126270 Printed Date: February 23 2025 at 10:29 Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 11.01 - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: FreehandPosted By: Grumpyprogfan
Subject: Freehand
Date Posted: May 03 2021 at 15:59
Anyone interested in getting Freehand with the new Wilson touch?
I definitely am. The Just The Same remix already sounds awesome. Wilson manages to add so much bottom end to the song without it losing its swingy looseness and the gentle touch of the Gentle Giant.
Posted By: twosteves
Date Posted: May 03 2021 at 21:26
probably--its my fav GG album.
Posted By: Awesoreno
Date Posted: May 03 2021 at 21:40
Will there be extra goodies?
Posted By: richardh
Date Posted: May 04 2021 at 00:08
http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=126259" rel="nofollow - Gentle Giant's Free Hand remixed by Steven Wilson - Progressive Rock Music Forum (progarchives.com)
Posted By: iluvmarillion
Date Posted: May 04 2021 at 01:01
Definitely me. In my opinion their best album.
Posted By: Frenetic Zetetic
Date Posted: May 04 2021 at 01:28
Steven Wilson is like the Vince Russo of prog rock.
Never cared for his remixes; the OG GG is more than enough for me.
-------------
"I am so prog, I listen to concept albums on shuffle." -KMac2021
Posted By: Un Amico
Date Posted: May 04 2021 at 16:06
I can't say I can hear much difference between my original vinyls and the SW remixes.
Posted By: DarkTower
Date Posted: May 14 2021 at 11:27
Of course. Already ordered.
Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: May 14 2021 at 12:30
Grumpyprogfan wrote:
Anyone interested in getting Freehand with the new Wilson touch?
It's strange to see you pimping a Wilson remix. Is it not?
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Posted By: Rednight
Date Posted: May 14 2021 at 12:30
No!
------------- "It just has none of the qualities of your work that I find interesting. Abandon [?] it." - Eno
Posted By: Hercules
Date Posted: May 14 2021 at 15:58
No. The original is quite superb.
------------- A TVR is not a car. It's a way of life.
Posted By: AFlowerKingCrimson
Date Posted: May 14 2021 at 16:01
I'm not sure if SW is the prog wizard like some people think he is when it comes to these things. Just mo.
Posted By: cstack3
Date Posted: May 14 2021 at 16:14
Dammit, I thought you said "Free Bird!"
------------- I am not a Robot, I'm a FREE MAN!!
Posted By: Grumpyprogfan
Date Posted: May 14 2021 at 17:12
SteveG wrote:
It's strange to see you pimping a Wilson remix. Is it not?
I like that you pay attention to forum members posts. Kudos! You are correct, "Red" is the only Wilson remix I have, and I can't say it's better than the original. However, "Freehand" is amazing for me, and it may be worth it to hear his 5.1 mix.
Posted By: Grumpyprogfan
Date Posted: May 14 2021 at 17:15
Hercules wrote:
No. The original is quite superb.
If you are referring to the 'original' One Way CD, it sounds awful.
Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: May 14 2021 at 17:24
Grumpyprogfan wrote:
SteveG wrote:
It's strange to see you pimping a Wilson remix. Is it not?
I like that you pay attention to forum members posts. Kudos! You are correct, "Red" is the only Wilson remix I have, and I can't say it's better than the original. However, "Freehand" is amazing for me, and it may be worth it to hear his 5.1 mix.
See, even a broken clock is right twice a day.
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Posted By: Un Amico
Date Posted: May 14 2021 at 17:29
My SW remix CD of Octopus sounds very similar to my ancient Vertigo swirls lp, which I guess is a compliment.
Posted By: dr wu23
Date Posted: May 15 2021 at 07:31
TBH.....I have never bought any of the SW mixes...in the past I have bought digital or other remixes of various classic and prog rock because some of the early cd's did sound like crap.
I can't say I have ever heard a SW remix played by any friends on their home systems.
------------- One does nothing yet nothing is left undone. Haquin
Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: May 15 2021 at 07:58
dr wu23 wrote:
TBH.....I have never bought any of the SW mixes...in the past I have bought digital or other remixes of various classic and prog rock because some of the early cd's did sound like crap.
I can't say I have ever heard a SW remix played by any friends on their home systems.
Tbh, the Wilson remixes are a mixed bag. The remixes of both ItCotCK and Aqualung are phenomenal, as the original masterings themselves were abysmal and had all kinds of sonic problems that were corrected.
So, it that regard, the Wilson remixes are essential for those albums. The rest, to me, are just alternate mixes that bring out different instruments that were not heard as clearly before, but don't really improve the overall sound or listening experience. And to be honest, only a recording engineer like myself can really distinguish the hundreds of subtle mixing and mastering (not done by Wilson, but he had some input) touches per song done by Wilson anyway. For the people who aren't technical geeks or have a tin ear, it's a lost exercise. They can got the gist of the overall sound, more treble, more dynamics, etc., but not much else. So, is it a money making enterprise? Of course. They are a commodity to be sold. It's that's simple.
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Posted By: Grumpyprogfan
Date Posted: May 15 2021 at 09:58
SteveG wrote:
Tbh, the Wilson remixes are a mixed bag. The remixes of both ItCotCK and Aqualung are phenomenal, as the original masterings themselves were abysmal and had all kinds of sonic problems that were corrected. So, it that regard, the Wilson remixes are essential for those albums. The rest, to me, are just alternate mixes that bring out different instruments that were not heard as clearly before, but don't really improve the overall sound or listening experience. And to be honest, only a recording engineer like myself can really distinguish the hundreds of subtle mixing and mastering (not done by Wilson, but he had some input) touches per song done by Wilson anyway. For the people who aren't technical geeks or have a tin ear, it's a lost exercise. They can got the gist of the overall sound, more treble, more dynamics, etc., but not much else. So, is it a money making enterprise? Of course. They are a commodity to be sold. It's that's simple.
Excuse me for my ignorance, but could you tell me some of the albums you have engineered? And, what do you think of Wilson's remix of Tull's A?
Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: May 15 2021 at 10:45
Grumpyprogfan wrote:
SteveG wrote:
Tbh, the Wilson remixes are a mixed bag. The remixes of both ItCotCK and Aqualung are phenomenal, as the original masterings themselves were abysmal and had all kinds of sonic problems that were corrected. So, it that regard, the Wilson remixes are essential for those albums. The rest, to me, are just alternate mixes that bring out different instruments that were not heard as clearly before, but don't really improve the overall sound or listening experience. And to be honest, only a recording engineer like myself can really distinguish the hundreds of subtle mixing and mastering (not done by Wilson, but he had some input) touches per song done by Wilson anyway. For the people who aren't technical geeks or have a tin ear, it's a lost exercise. They can got the gist of the overall sound, more treble, more dynamics, etc., but not much else. So, is it a money making enterprise? Of course. They are a commodity to be sold. It's that's simple.
Excuse me for my ignorance, but could you tell me some of the albums you have engineered? And, what do you think of Wilson's remix of Tull's A?
Sure, the bigger ones are American Beauty by the Grateful Dead, If I Could Only Remember My Name by
David Crosby and CSNY: Live 1974. I like the "A" remix because it took off a lot of the sharp harsh edges, especially to Anderson's multi tracked chorus vocals, which was quite annoying to me as they were all recorded live and are slightly distorted and slightly out of synch with each other, as opposed to using a dubbing method called Automatic Double Tracking. ADT is where a single vocal is repeated electronically and dubbed onto the chorus with subtle millisecond tape delay, echo, pitch shifting and other studio tricks in order to give the chorus vocals a neater "pleated" sound. I believe the chorus vocals on "Songs From The Wood" are ADT dubbings. These vocals on "A" are much less distorted now and sound warmer and fuller. Pegg's bass was also recorded with little tone and is quite invisible in the original mix, and "muddy" sounding when it actually can be heard on a few songs. Mostly, you can feel it more than hear it. Wilson added a little more definition to the bass and a lot more presence so it can be better heard as well as better felt. A lot of the rest is little balance tricks like dropping the volume of a prominent synth tone when another prominent synth tone was entered into the song, so that they no longer sound congested as they did on the original sound mix. Barre's leads have slight adjustments to his flanging, reverb and echo as well as sound volume, as well as slight stereo altering, etc. There's many more alterations by Wilson but I would have to actually write them down as there's just to much to remember.
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Posted By: Intruder
Date Posted: May 15 2021 at 11:12
Have existed with my vinyl copy (actually, second copy - sold the first to buy another!) for 30+ years, can't see me squeezing any more out of it than I already have, regardless of Wilson's knobbing. Then again, if you have one of those sooper-dooper hi-fi systems and invited me over for a listening session.....
------------- I like to feel the suspense when you're certain you know I am there.....
Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: May 15 2021 at 11:29
Intruder wrote:
Have existed with my vinyl copy (actually, second copy - sold the first to buy another!) for 30+ years, can't see me squeezing any more out of it than I already have, regardless of Wilson's knobbing. Then again, if you have one of those sooper-dooper hi-fi systems and invited me over for a listening session.....
I have a little hi-fi system that will do the trick. How far are you from NYC?
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Posted By: Un Amico
Date Posted: May 15 2021 at 13:57
Yes...I only bought Octopus because I wanted to have it on cd as well. Apparently Aqualung is the one SW remixed record to hear.
Posted By: dr wu23
Date Posted: May 15 2021 at 15:36
SteveG wrote:
dr wu23 wrote:
TBH.....I have never bought any of the SW mixes...in the past I have bought digital or other remixes of various classic and prog rock because some of the early cd's did sound like crap.
I can't say I have ever heard a SW remix played by any friends on their home systems.
Tbh, the Wilson remixes are a mixed bag. The remixes of both ItCotCK and Aqualung are phenomenal, as the original masterings themselves were abysmal and had all kinds of sonic problems that were corrected.
So, it that regard, the Wilson remixes are essential for those albums. The rest, to me, are just alternate mixes that bring out different instruments that were not heard as clearly before, but don't really improve the overall sound or listening experience. And to be honest, only a recording engineer like myself can really distinguish the hundreds of subtle mixing and mastering (not done by Wilson, but he had some input) touches per song done by Wilson anyway. For the people who aren't technical geeks or have a tin ear, it's a lost exercise. They can got the gist of the overall sound, more treble, more dynamics, etc., but not much else. So, is it a money making enterprise? Of course. They are a commodity to be sold. It's that's simple.
Well.. I should buy that Wilson mix then since ITCOTCK is one of my favorites...and Aqualung is also high on my list of lp's.
------------- One does nothing yet nothing is left undone. Haquin
Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: May 15 2021 at 16:12
dr wu23 wrote:
SteveG wrote:
dr wu23 wrote:
TBH.....I have never bought any of the SW mixes...in the past I have bought digital or other remixes of various classic and prog rock because some of the early cd's did sound like crap.
I can't say I have ever heard a SW remix played by any friends on their home systems.
Tbh, the Wilson remixes are a mixed bag. The remixes of both ItCotCK and Aqualung are phenomenal, as the original masterings themselves were abysmal and had all kinds of sonic problems that were corrected. So, it that regard, the Wilson remixes are essential for those albums. The rest, to me, are just alternate mixes that bring out different instruments that were not heard as clearly before, but don't really improve the overall sound or listening experience. And to be honest, only a recording engineer like myself can really distinguish the hundreds of subtle mixing and mastering (not done by Wilson, but he had some input) touches per song done by Wilson anyway. For the people who aren't technical geeks or have a tin ear, it's a lost exercise. They can got the gist of the overall sound, more treble, more dynamics, etc., but not much else. So, is it a money making enterprise? Of course. They are a commodity to be sold. It's that's simple.
Well.. I should buy that Wilson mix then since ITCOTCK is one of my favorites...and Aqualung is also high on my list of lp's.
The good thing with those two is that they're available in less expensive 2 CD sets. We're old but not stupid.
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Posted By: Grumpyprogfan
Date Posted: June 22 2021 at 12:15
Thought this video was kinda cool.
Posted By: miamiscot
Date Posted: June 22 2021 at 14:41
My favorite GG album. But the original is perfect as is. Just saying'.
------------- The Prog Corner
Posted By: richardh
Date Posted: June 23 2021 at 00:01
I have the Alucard 2009 release which is very good.
I'm not massively bothered about Wilson's remixes in general (ELP debut and Tarkus are nothing special) but do like bonus material so I may check it out.
EDIT - doesn't appear to be any bonus material so I'll keep my money in my pocket on this one.
Grumpyprogfan wrote:
