genesis (abacab)
Printed From: Progarchives.com
Category: Progressive Music Lounges
Forum Name: Prog Bands, Artists and Genres Appreciation
Forum Description: Discuss specific prog bands and their members or a specific sub-genre
URL: http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=111824
Printed Date: March 06 2025 at 10:19
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Topic: genesis (abacab)
Posted By: grantman
Subject: genesis (abacab)
Date Posted: September 01 2017 at 12:47
Upon listening for the 4 th time i discovered not without a couple of duds ,for a Canadian guy raised on prog,this is not really a terrible record ,the opener for one is a very strong heavy metal vibe or punk style song .Later the the songs i find most appealing is ME AND SARAH JANE ,NO REPLY AT ALL as for DODO/LURKER although kinda silly is well constructed ,my fav has got to be KEEP IT DARK the duds for me was THE MAN ON THE CORNER ,LIKE IT OR NOT which i feel belongs on a phil collins solo works ,the worst was of course WHODUNNIT ,any other thoughts please share. thank you for reading grant 
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Replies:
Posted By: Rednight
Date Posted: September 01 2017 at 13:39
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It served its purpose (especially Me and Sarah Jane). ------------- "It just has none of the qualities of your work that I find interesting. Abandon [?] it." - Eno |
Posted By: AFlowerKingCrimson
Date Posted: September 01 2017 at 14:02
| I think Duke and even ATTWT are more consistent but it's certainly not the terrible album it's sometimes made out to be. I think even the so called duds such as "another record" and "who dunnit" are fun to listen to. It's sort of like the little brother to Duke in the same way that Big Generator is to 90125 or that the Final Cut is to the Wall. :) There are even some full on prog songs like the title track and Dodo/lurker. Other than that mostly quirky pop. I think they were influenced by solo Peter Gabriel at the time and maybe even XTC. |
Posted By: UMUR
Date Posted: September 01 2017 at 14:23
Yeah in recent years I´ve actually found that Abacab is a pretty good album too. Keep It Dark is a great track indeed... ------------- http://www.metalmusicarchives.com/" rel="nofollow - Metal Music Archives https://rateyourmusic.com/~UMUR" rel="nofollow - UMUR on RYM |
grantman wrote:Posted By: Kepler62
Date Posted: September 01 2017 at 14:39
| saw them in Jarry Park in Montreal on the '82 tour. Think it was in August. As I remember it was really a Phil Collins showcase. They had made a complete transition on that album to a full blown pop band. They were really big in Quebec in the early 70s but for some reason they had an even bigger following. But I remember us older fans not really liking the new thing with Phil. It's interesting that they reunited with Gabriel a couple of months later for that reunion 6 Of The Best in London. It's not an album I put on the turntable that often. It can become quite annoying. The last album that I can barely tolerate by Genesis is ATTWT. |
Posted By: Atavachron
Date Posted: September 01 2017 at 16:14
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Great production and pretty original material for the time; probably their cleanest, best sounding recording. ------------- "Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought." -- John F. Kennedy |
Posted By: mlkpad14
Date Posted: September 01 2017 at 17:02
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It's my favorite album by them, besides maybe Trick and SEBTP. ------------- https://gamecrazyprofessional.weebly.com/ |
Posted By: Cristi
Date Posted: September 01 2017 at 17:25
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decent album I don't get Who Dunnit, not even as a joke. Submarine was a B-side... really? that's gotta be a wtf moment...
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Posted By: Dellinger
Date Posted: September 01 2017 at 21:44
| I haven't heard it in a good while, but as I remember it was the worst album I have heard from them, and I'm just missing a few from the 80's albums (I think only the self titled album). Besides "Dodo / Lurker", I just found nothing to like on it, and not because it has pop songs (there are a few from the other albums that I do like a lot), but because they are just forgettable, boring, or even annoying. By the way, there's an extended version of Dodo / Lurker that is really cool. |
Posted By: Tom Ozric
Date Posted: September 01 2017 at 21:58
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A mixed bag of Crossover Prog and a couple of duds (I'm looking at you, Who Dunnit ?). Another Record started out promising, but got bland very quickly. The rest of the tunes I don't mind, to varying degrees. Dodo/Lurker being very good, quirky even. My rating : Abacab - 4 No Reply At All - 2.5 Me And Sarah Jane - 4 Keep It Dark - 4 Dodo/Lurker - 4 Who Dunnit ? - 0 Man On The Corner - 3 Like It Or Not - 3 Another Record - 1 25.5 out of 45 = roughly 57 %. Barely a 3 star album, but some good stuff here and there, let down by a few 'clunkers'. |
Posted By: YESESIS
Date Posted: September 04 2017 at 15:15
| I definitely don't consider it one of Genesis' better albums but it is good. Obviously the title track is a monster. No Reply at All was on the radio all the time in the 80's, so that kind of success speaks for itself. And then the rest of the songs are good but not great imo, with Like it or Not being pretty underrated. |
Posted By: Cosmiclawnmower
Date Posted: September 04 2017 at 15:52
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I saw them at the Showerings pavilion in Shepton mallet in Somerset in September 1982; I remember that pretty much every time the played a pre '& then there were three' track, Phil would say 'this is the last time we are going to play this sh*t'... but it was a good show and they finished with 'Suppers ready'.. It stuck in my throat at the time but looking back I guess they were bored with playing older tracks when they felt they were on the verge of making new, shiny and more streamlined music. In hindsight, its all part of their legacy and it was just of the time. The lp is to me, as much of a period piece as their earlier work and has a much more direct, 'worked out live as a 3 piece in the studio' feel and certainly reminds me of my life at the time. There are some good tracks and some duff tracks but I feel that the fact that the 2 best tracks from the lp sessions, Submarine and Naminanu, ended up as 'B' sides shows that although they still had prog- fusion tendencies, they preferred to keep it hidden away! ------------- |
Posted By: Chula Vista
Date Posted: September 06 2017 at 13:08
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Prefer the self titled "Genesis" (1983) of that era more but Dodo/Lurker is an amazing song. ------------- I'd much rather have a bottle in front of me, than a frontal lobotomy. |
Posted By: Argo2112
Date Posted: September 06 2017 at 13:34
I like the " little Brother to Duke" analogy. I think that's pretty accurate. It does have a few good songs on it though & it was kind of a gateway album to Genesis for me.
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Posted By: YESESIS
Date Posted: September 06 2017 at 18:05
Absolutely agree. Up until the last two songs that album is really excellent. |
Posted By: Tom Ozric
Date Posted: September 06 2017 at 19:24
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^ It's Gonna Get Better is quite a decent tune, though Phil can be cringe-inducing with his falsettos. I prefer s/t over Abacab too. |
Posted By: Barbu
Date Posted: September 06 2017 at 19:30
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I like that one. ------------- |
Posted By: lostrom
Date Posted: September 07 2017 at 00:26
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Abacab is their best post Hacket album. ------------- lostrom |
Posted By: Cristi
Date Posted: September 07 2017 at 05:58
better than ATTW3 and Duke?
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Posted By: HackettFan
Date Posted: September 07 2017 at 06:18
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It's as good as Duke ad better than what came after. If anyone recalls my dissing of Duke, that's not saying much. The second half of the title track was very good. I agree with David that it was their cleanest, best sounding recording. ------------- A curse upon the heads of those who seek their fortunes in a lie. The truth is always waiting when there's nothing left to try. - Colin Henson, Jade Warrior (Now) |
Posted By: Blacksword
Date Posted: September 07 2017 at 09:35
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2.5 stars overall.. Abacab - Pretty good. Nice little rocker No Reply At All - No comment at all Me And Sarah Jane - Good Keep It Dark - Interesting and infectious. Dodo/Lurker - Good Who Dunnit ? - sh*t Man On The Corner - Boring Like It Or Not - Not Another Record - I hope it's not like this one. ------------- Ultimately bored by endless ecstasy! |
Posted By: lostrom
Date Posted: September 07 2017 at 11:09
Yes. ------------- lostrom |
Posted By: Cristi
Date Posted: September 07 2017 at 15:35
ok, feel like I'm pulling teeth. Care to explain?
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Posted By: hegelec
Date Posted: September 07 2017 at 16:42
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no reply at all would actually be a killer, menacing track without the cocaine horns. sorry EWF. you guys rock. but putting you on that track was a big mistake. ------------- Cheers! |
Posted By: hegelec
Date Posted: September 07 2017 at 16:47
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ABACAB is underrated. But I'd like it even better if they'd pulled a Duke and scattered the Dodo suite through the album rather than relegating more than half of it to maxi-single B-sides. https://youtu.be/eEatqARfZgM" rel="nofollow - https://youtu.be/eEatqARfZgM as is, ABACAB is sadly off-balanced and not totally cohesive. ------------- Cheers! |
Posted By: hegelec
Date Posted: September 07 2017 at 16:57
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The drop from Naminamu into Dodo is f**king massssssive. It would have slayed live. ------------- Cheers! |
Posted By: Blacksword
Date Posted: September 08 2017 at 00:03
Exactly how I feel. I like EWF, but those horns are totally out of place on a Genesis album. ------------- Ultimately bored by endless ecstasy! |
Posted By: richardh
Date Posted: September 08 2017 at 00:18
| I nearly wept when it came it out. My only similar reaction to any other album release by any other artist was ELP's In The Hot Seat. It's that feeling of 'where has my band gone'. Over the years I've softened a bit on it when I realised that I really liked Dodo/Lurker (I'm actually happy with the edited version) and Keep It Dark. The title track also worked well played live with the extended run off. The rest though I still don't care for. From Abacab onwards there is just about enough decent Genesis material to have made a good (4 star) album methinks. |
Posted By: hegelec
Date Posted: September 08 2017 at 00:38
Me and Sarah Jane I've always had a soft spot for. Because it's one of those endearingly meandering Tony-pop songs, like Duchess, that's way too clumsy and long-winded to actually work as a pop track but which still has some great chord changes overlaid with a really powerful, simple melody. ------------- Cheers! |
Posted By: hegelec
Date Posted: September 08 2017 at 03:08
Almost anything is better than ATTW3. Their limpest and least interesting til Shapes. At this point, the band was basically the Tony Show and sadly he was just in a slump, both composition-wise and in his sound design choices. The album is grey. Just grey grey grey and flaccid and dull. https://youtu.be/H4hTXOZKq0M" rel="nofollow - https://youtu.be/H4hTXOZKq0M "The Waters of Lethe" should have been the centerpiece of the album -- its "One for the Vine" -- the Tony masterpiece of staggering genius that single-handedly redeems all of the album's weaker moments. But instead we're stuck with "Undertow" and "Burning Rope". Blah. The *sole* stand-out on the album for me is the sprightly and delightful "Scene from a Night's Dream". Just a magic track. But 3 minutes of bliss is simply not enough. (And while "Down and Out" is acceptable, come on guys ... we've scaled this Volcano before.) BUT... ABACAB better than *Duke*? Nonsense. Duke is mighty. ABACAB has some excellent tracks, but Duke has something ABACAB will never have: a balanced tracklist and thematic cohesion. ------------- Cheers! |
Posted By: richardh
Date Posted: September 13 2017 at 00:26
| ATTWT is actually one of my favourite Genesis albums. For me not a weak song or track in evidence and it all holds together really well. Yes they were in the process of inventing 'Neo Prog' but that was not a bad thing in my book. Where I had more of an issue is when the music started to become a bit plastic. BTW Tony still managed to write one of the best 'rejected' songs ever 'When The Light Went Out' when he was going through his slump! |
Posted By: Cristi
Date Posted: September 13 2017 at 00:30
it's called The Day the Light Went Out I love ATTW3, too :)
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Posted By: Dellinger
Date Posted: September 13 2017 at 21:30
There are several songs from the 80's I like a lot. However, I think they are mostly better live... I don't know if what I understand as a plastic quality in their 80's music is the same as yours, but I feel the live versions do sound less plastic. I guess there's quiet a bit of drum machine on the studio songs, which are really played live... perhaps more guitars... however, they just sound better. |
Posted By: M27Barney
Date Posted: September 14 2017 at 00:41
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H'm - I might suggest that anybody who has already spun 'Abacab' and has any amount of 'proper' prog - to go at, why on earth would they bother with such atrocious 80's garbage? Perhaps they only have 3 CD's ? I would suggest that I probably have at least a thousand CD's I'd rather spin - 'Abacab' is not and can't possibly be a 'desert-island' disc contender surely? Or is it just me? ------------- Play me my song.....Here it comes again....... |
Posted By: Jeffro
Date Posted: September 14 2017 at 07:35
There's more to life than prog. Desert islands disc? no way but it has its moments. Overall, I'd rather listen to pre-ATTWT Genesis. Actually, I'd rather listen to a whole lot of stuff over Abacab and the 80s did feature some quality music. yeah, it's not classic 70s prog but who cares? Good music is good music. ------------- We all dwell in an amber subdomain, amber subdomain, amber subdomain. My face IS a maserati |
Posted By: Darious
Date Posted: September 14 2017 at 08:31
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Although Abacab might be an average Genesis' record, I personally couldn't live without Abacab and Like It Or Not. Besides, it's Genesis, man! ------------- Writing about truth is a little bit like getting your dick out in public and hoping no one laughs (Steve Hogarth) |
Posted By: miamiscot
Date Posted: September 14 2017 at 08:42
| The last Genesis album I genuinely enjoy. |
Posted By: Rednight
Date Posted: September 14 2017 at 09:35
------------- "It just has none of the qualities of your work that I find interesting. Abandon [?] it." - Eno |
Posted By: progaardvark
Date Posted: September 14 2017 at 10:06
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The thing that bugs me the most about Abacab is the drop-off in quality for all the tracks following Dodo/Lurker. A very poor ending for a mixed bag that had some nice highlights. During this period the group kept making long suites (The Duke Suite and the extended Dodo/Lurker ideas), but when it came time to put it down on record, they kept splitting them up. I guess it was a sign of the times. In hindsight, it wouldn't have hurt anything if they had kept making suites. Enough of their other material was making the pop charts, and as we all know, parts of suites can be issued as singles on their own. ------------- ---------- i'm shopping for a new oil-cured sinus bag that's a happy bag of lettuce this car smells like cartilage nothing beats a good video about fractions |
Posted By: lazland
Date Posted: September 14 2017 at 11:01
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Abacab is a strange album. When it is good, it is very good. I love the extended title track, Dod/Lurker is a great suite, Keep it Dark is menacing, and I adore Me and Sarah Jane. However, the horns had no place on a Genesis album, and some of the more commercial short tracks strike me as being somewhat bland in retrospect. It is still, though, a good album, and one I enjoy revisiting every now and then. ------------- Enhance your life. Get down to www.lazland.org Now also broadcasting on www.progzilla.com Every Saturday, 4.00 p.m. UK time! |
Posted By: richardh
Date Posted: September 15 2017 at 15:26
Ballad Of Big - I like a lot especially the cheesy lycrics! Snowbound - It's that wall of sound thing they were doing at the time. All about production. I don't mind the lyrics either. Deep In The Motherlode is classic Genesis imo. Maybe prefer the live version a bit more though. |
Posted By: someone_else
Date Posted: September 15 2017 at 16:22
I find Abacab hard to appreciate. The title track sounds unfinished on this album (the Three Sides Live version is how it should be). Me and Sarah Jane is decent, but somehow it sounds to my ears as if it just misses the point. Who Dunnit: ultimate crap. Keep it Dark and, to a lesser extent, Another Record are quite OK and Dodo/Lurker is one of the best post-Hackett Genesis tracks. The other songs are to be classified as forgettable filler. ------------- 
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Posted By: Chula Vista
Date Posted: September 15 2017 at 16:41
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I'd been a fan of Genesis since Nursery Cryme ATTWT is the first album by them I didn't like. Collins had done a good job for stepping up after Gabriel left and I really dug both t**tW and TOTT. Losing Hackett was just too much. I did end up liking Duke a lot but mainly because it hit home seeing as I was going through relationship issues at the time. ------------- I'd much rather have a bottle in front of me, than a frontal lobotomy. |
Posted By: BunBun
Date Posted: September 18 2017 at 18:59
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I love this album, i personally find that this is the most listened to post-Hackett album by me. I love the title song, Me and Sarah Jane, and Dodo (and the long version with submarine and Naminau). However, it has one of their absolute worst songs which is Who Dunnit, I really don't get it. But overall I think the material was a good change up from their other material with catchy, fresh, original stuff. |