Your top most pretentious prog bands?
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Topic: Your top most pretentious prog bands?
Posted By: floyd4
Subject: Your top most pretentious prog bands?
Date Posted: February 07 2017 at 13:25
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3. Yes 2. Rush 1. Jethro Tull This is an opinion. Respect mine and others'.
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Replies:
Posted By: Rednight
Date Posted: February 07 2017 at 13:29
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1. Area 2. Area 3. Area 4. Area Oh, what the f', it's Area. ------------- "It just has none of the qualities of your work that I find interesting. Abandon [?] it." - Eno |
Posted By: omphaloskepsis
Date Posted: February 07 2017 at 19:00
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1. Rick Wakeman 2. Emerson, Lake , and Palmer 3. Iron Maiden 4. YES 5. KISS |
Posted By: Atavachron
Date Posted: February 07 2017 at 19:24
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King Crimson Genesis ELP Pink Floyd Led Zeppelin ------------- "Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought." -- John F. Kennedy |
Posted By: AFlowerKingCrimson
Date Posted: February 07 2017 at 19:26
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All of them. Wasn't that the point? Also, when did Kiss become a prog band?
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Posted By: omphaloskepsis
Date Posted: February 07 2017 at 19:33
From October 81 - February 82  I included KISS as a joke. Yet, "Music From the Elder" is KISS'es pretentious attempt at prog rock.
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AFlowerKingCrimson wrote:Posted By: Son.of.Tiresias
Date Posted: February 07 2017 at 23:53
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1. Yes Relayer LMAO with the exception of Soon which is typical wonderful Yes music, of course dull cover too :/ 2. Drama LOL, but great Roger Dean cover again :) . . . 3. Pink Floydīs Wall 4. Styx after their 3rd 5. ELP without Palmer and most of the time after day prime in the 70īs 6. GENESIS since Dude 7. Deep Purple after Gillan 8. Uriah Heep after Byron 9. Jethro Tull when Too Old to RockīnīRoll & Heavy Horses 10. Asia since Astra 10. Yes without Anderson 11. BJH without Wolstenholme Airot on meidän :)
------------- You may see a smile on Tony Banksī face but thatīs unlikely. |
Posted By: Blacksword
Date Posted: February 08 2017 at 00:09
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Most prog is pretty pretentious. But that's fine, there's nothing wrong with pretence in music. If all bands 'kept it real' music would be very bland and uninspiring. Yes spring to mind as being ridiculously pretentious. ------------- Ultimately bored by endless ecstasy! |
Posted By: Son.of.Tiresias
Date Posted: February 08 2017 at 00:40
Exactly. Without musical evolution we would still be listening to pop music, quite a boring life. Yes, those pioneers of Prog once become so ridiculous that they didnīt realize it at all. The first time in heard Sound chaser decades ago I just burst out laughing. I still do :) ------------- You may see a smile on Tony Banksī face but thatīs unlikely. |
Posted By: Sean Trane
Date Posted: February 08 2017 at 02:16
| ELP & Wakeman were in a class of their own |
Posted By: Prog Snob
Date Posted: February 08 2017 at 03:47
I don't mind pretentiousness in music. My username aside, I think we need that slight arrogance and the effectiveness of new bands to push the boundaries. Without it we would have not been introduced to Frank Zappa in the 60s, ELP in the 70s, and so on. ------------- 
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Posted By: DDPascalDD
Date Posted: February 08 2017 at 04:10
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I have never been able to understand why showing virtuosity at points is so bad. Those top musicians are able to consider if it fits the music or not most of the time. Apart from live shows, I really don't get what's so annoying??? ------------- |
Posted By: Flight123
Date Posted: February 08 2017 at 04:36
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1. Rush 2. Opeth 3. Dream Theater
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Posted By: Prog Snob
Date Posted: February 08 2017 at 05:09
I'm with you. I suppose we need to look at who is doing the critiquing. Sometimes your answer reveals itself then. -------------
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Posted By: richardh
Date Posted: February 08 2017 at 06:08
A fairly common view but Floyd and Genesis were just as bad accepting that generally their music has stood the test of time better than ELP and Wakeman.
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Posted By: BaldJean
Date Posted: February 08 2017 at 06:18
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1) ELP 2) Pink Floyd 3) Eloy 4) Barclay James Harmless 5) The Nice 6) Yes 7) Genesis 8) Tangerine Dream 9) Hawkwind 10) Triumvirat -------------  A shot of me as High Priestess of Gaia during our fall festival. Ceterum censeo principiis obsta |
Posted By: Son.of.Tiresias
Date Posted: February 08 2017 at 06:40
I see your point I guess. But itīs not a question of virtuosity. On the contrary, the best music is full of virtuosity, in so many aspects, be it classical, jazz, rock, even pop (Beatles, ABBA), for me at least. Itīs all due to dullness, when bands get too self-indulgent, too pompous, playing pointless (too) long solos (to fill the space), pointless rambling and jumping here and there, aimless compositions... sacrificing melody and harmony for cachophony and pseudo virtuosity. Yah, when they get so damn serious, about themselves. Very few artists, even the best "prog" acts did not realize their limits, eventually. Listener eventually gets a feeling he/she has been cheated. Thatīs why punk was born after 1974. Johnny Rotten hated boring pop music, probably the lame TOTP in the first place. But not necessarily ELP because exists a picture of him and Keith Emerson together laughing and having a good time. Emerson is pretentious for some but I never found his playing boring, in the 70īs to be exact. Later since the 90īs ELP just lost their magic, most of the time.
------------- You may see a smile on Tony Banksī face but thatīs unlikely. |
Posted By: CosmicVibration
Date Posted: February 08 2017 at 06:54
| Top band - YesMost pretentious top band - ELP |
Posted By: CPicard
Date Posted: February 08 2017 at 09:28
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Pretentious? As in, let's say: "Dude, we're going to make the most amazing music ever and none shall try to do music after us"? Or as in: "No, seriously, we're an important band in the history of music, our music should be taken seriously, stop making fun of us" ? In the first case: 1) Yes was pretentious in 1974, at the time of Tales From Topographic Oceans (they get better after the tour) 2) ELP when releasing Works or even their triple-LP live album 3) Magma's first album which was a double LP (bold and audacious or simply goddamn megalomaniac?!) 4) Robert Fripp / King Crimson, who takes himself a bit too seriously for a while now (not that I won't listen to King Crimson's new material, if there's any plan to release it) 5) Rick Wakeman, which Hollywood-friendly take on Romanticism had always been a bit too much for my palate (on the other hand, he's a keyboard player...) 6) Triumvirat - see above. 7) Even Pink Floyd had their moments of pretentiousness (hey, let's face it, they did have, didn't they?) I'm trying to add 3 other acts to make a Top Ten (looking towards some Prog-Metal bands...), but that will be for later. |
Posted By: BaldJean
Date Posted: February 08 2017 at 10:23
the gigantic Pink Floyd live shows with flying pigs and whatnots definitely justify the attribute "pretentious" ------------- A shot of me as High Priestess of Gaia during our fall festival. Ceterum censeo principiis obsta |
Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: February 08 2017 at 12:35
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All of them. ------------- This message was brought to you by a proud supporter of the Deep State. |
Posted By: dr wu23
Date Posted: February 08 2017 at 12:41
You beat me to that reply...... by definition prog is pretentious.  ------------- One does nothing yet nothing is left undone. Haquin |
Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: February 08 2017 at 13:11
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Yes, Doc. A big bag of wind + rock= Prog! But God how I love it! ------------- This message was brought to you by a proud supporter of the Deep State. |
Posted By: HosiannaMantra
Date Posted: February 08 2017 at 13:16
| Does Trans-Siberian Orchestra count as a prog rock/metal band? |
Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: February 08 2017 at 13:22
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Yes, they are pretentious as the band Yes. ------------- This message was brought to you by a proud supporter of the Deep State. |
Posted By: Rednight
Date Posted: February 08 2017 at 13:49
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Hate the word "pretentious" in this thread because it seemed to be the main operative word that hack Robert Hilburn (former L.A. Times music critic) used from time to time to describe acts such as Yes and ELP back in the '70s and '80s. I mean, find some other word in a thesaurus already, pal. The guy was a real hose bag, and reading his reviews proved that continually. ------------- "It just has none of the qualities of your work that I find interesting. Abandon [?] it." - Eno |
Posted By: Tom Ozric
Date Posted: February 09 2017 at 00:20
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Yes The Moody Blues Queen (but I don't consider them Prog) Styx ELP VDGG Gentle Giant King Crimson Dream Theater Marillion (......and I love 'em all, except Queen) |
Posted By: Mascodagama
Date Posted: February 09 2017 at 01:52
| Evidently there are very different understandings of what constitutes pretentiousness being employed by different posters. My own personal one is that pretentiousness is about pretence - specifically, pretending to operate on some kind of artistic or intellectual level that is not actually earned or achieved. e.g. Jon Anderson's Yes lyrics were frequently pretentious as they aspired to the status of poetry / philosophy without having any actual substance. Peter Hamill's lyrics with VdGG weren't pretentious because, although they had obvious literary and intellectual aspirations, Hamill had the substance to back it up - an actual poet not a pretend one. |
Posted By: someone_else
Date Posted: February 09 2017 at 01:56
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Yes and ELP. I have to look too far behind to find the others.
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Posted By: rockandbluesman7
Date Posted: February 09 2017 at 04:22
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It's a tough call there are a number of my faves Jethro Tull, Yes, & Pink Floyd. Would you also include Marillion i guess so and yet another one i am trying to get my head around and to think it must be one of the longest tracks i have ever heard, overblown, contentious over the top, Transatlantic Whirlwind just on 80 minutes long. I'll be honest with you still trying to come to grips with the song. In regards to Jethro Tull they are one of my faves i have a number of their albums and a glutton for punishment, their recent remastering/remixing 4 disc box sets Passion Play, War Child, Minstrel In The Gallery, Too Old To Rock and Roll and the 2 disc 5.1 surround sound set of Thick As A Brick. On the way too most likely in the same format will be Songs From The Wood. For better of for worse, a similar path to some of Yes's classics. The anniversary edition of The Yes Album in which you get 7 different versions of the one album! Fragile, Relayer, Close To The Edge, The Yes album & the recent Tales From Topographic Oceans, if i could use a Yes pun, talk about overblown, over the top too much to handle what were they thinking at the time? Who knows but the biggest surprise although there are only 4 tracks on the album totalling just on 80 minutes, the bluray edition although they are the same, with an odd live edit and singles talk about too much 4 songs a total 0f 12 and a half hours on bluray! In other words 36 tracks! It takes a lot of time to get through, Alan Parsons hmmm |
Posted By: Tapfret
Date Posted: February 09 2017 at 10:21
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Can we evolve past this childish term? Its way more self-indulgent than any of the art in question. Get over yourselves already. ------------- https://www.last.fm/user/Tapfret" rel="nofollow">  https://bandcamp.com/tapfret" rel="nofollow - Bandcamp |
Posted By: Dopeydoc
Date Posted: February 09 2017 at 13:34
Agree! But they happen to release some good albums though. |
Posted By: moshkito
Date Posted: February 09 2017 at 13:53
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Hi, Weird ... I do not think that anything in music is pretentious, other than the critics themselves ... we always think that something or other is better than this or that! You do what you got to do, to get attention, if that is your game and desire. But in the end, you and I are not sitting here and saying that Mozart should have been the number ONE person in the list! Or Wagner! Or Verdi ... now let's talk about that ... My vote is NONE. They do not deserve that criticism, and we are not the Hall of Shame! We are about Progressive Music!
------------- Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told! www.pedrosena.com |
Posted By: Tapfret
Date Posted: February 09 2017 at 14:18
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^Today we are in agreement. Other labels I see applied that is abundantly arrogant is "soulless". Just because I do not hear something does not mean it isn't there. Different sounds and acts speak to different people. ------------- https://www.last.fm/user/Tapfret" rel="nofollow"> https://bandcamp.com/tapfret" rel="nofollow - Bandcamp |
Posted By: rockandbluesman7
Date Posted: February 09 2017 at 14:45
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Moshquito i do have to agree in retrospect i have so many acts i call classic bands and their music besides my top 5 in either order The Eagles,Jethro Tull,Doors, Pink Floyd,Led Zeppelin. I have around probably an extra 70 bands i really enjoy & having seen many many concerts if i had to choose 2 concerts one would have to be Pink Floyd during their Momentary Lapse & the late great SRV now that one was a gem. Who cannot forget the above 5 bands did release some all time classic albums that are still played 45 years later & with modern technology sound even better. Just to give you an idea other faves America,Bad Company,Creedence,Beatles Aerosmith,Dokken,Ratt,Rush,ZZTop, Yes,Alice In Chains,Deep Purple,Sabbath,Rainbow,Santana,UFO,MIchael Schenker,Styx,Kansas,Babys,Journey,Frank Marino & Mahogany Rush,Hendrix,Rush,Asia with John Wetton & John Payne,Robin Trower, i don't mind a bit of doom metal, really enjoy Type O Negative, Paradise Lost, My Dying Bride i know there is some good music in there somewhere. I agree too some of the critics do talk crap at times, whether they're fans of the music at times remains to be seen, and the reviews do at times suck eggs. |
Posted By: Thatfabulousalien
Date Posted: February 09 2017 at 15:03
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U2 ------------- Classical music isn't dead, it's more alive than it's ever been. It's just not on MTV. https://www.soundcloud.com/user-322914325 |
Posted By: rockandbluesman7
Date Posted: February 09 2017 at 15:42
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Thatfabu i will never forget there are so many classic albums and for some reason when i first heard Where The Streets Have No Name i thought what a great song from their soon to be released The Joshua Tree, then the song that got me over the cliff and on the Edge oops not intentional hmmm With Or Without You, 25 million albums later or more from my perspective and i have 550 cd's & some vinyl it would have to be an all time classic i'd rate it in my collection top 10 one of the finest. |
Posted By: Cosmiclawnmower
Date Posted: February 09 2017 at 15:46
Ive always believed that music is created in the cosmos and is only channelled through humans therefore it is impossible for music to be pretentious.. even if, on occasion, the people who make it might be ------------- |
Posted By: tszirmay
Date Posted: February 09 2017 at 15:47
Pretentious= word made famous by frustrated music critics who could not put two notes together, describing someone who did actually study music. Because for the imbecile wannabe, studying and knowledge are pretentious.  The second most misused word after: 'like' ------------- I never post anything anywhere without doing more than basic research, often in depth. |
Posted By: Thatfabulousalien
Date Posted: February 09 2017 at 16:40
In my opinion, the closest thing music can get to "pretentiousness" is trying to change the world or preach political agendas, otherwise it's a meaningless word (in context of art) ------------- Classical music isn't dead, it's more alive than it's ever been. It's just not on MTV. https://www.soundcloud.com/user-322914325 |
Posted By: Tapfret
Date Posted: February 09 2017 at 18:42
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^Really? A message is pretentious? Not everyone can be a lawyer or promote change with huge infusions of cash. Again, this word is slung around like it exists anywhere but complete abstraction. ------------- https://www.last.fm/user/Tapfret" rel="nofollow"> https://bandcamp.com/tapfret" rel="nofollow - Bandcamp |
Posted By: siLLy puPPy
Date Posted: February 09 2017 at 19:26
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pretentious pre·ten·tious(prĭ-tĕn′shəs)adj. 1. Claiming that or behaving as if one is important or deserving of merit when such is not the case: a pretentioussocialite. 2. Showing or betraying an attitude of superiority: made pretentious remarks about his education. 3. Marked by an extravagant or presumptuous outward show; ostentatious: a pretentious house. Really? Are bands that are just more able to present musical expressions that you can not yet understand ---- pretentious? Or are you just jealous that you don't get it because you don't want to advance to the levels of getting it? These and other questions haunt our psychological realities day to day but no answers truly satisfy until we do the homework to understand how advanced Calculus was derived from Algebra in the first place. I guess we should call of of creation pretentious? I mean, you don't understand it totally so why not? -------------  https://rateyourmusic.com/~siLLy_puPPy |
Posted By: Tapfret
Date Posted: February 09 2017 at 22:46
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^Fantastic! Except you dropped this.  ------------- https://www.last.fm/user/Tapfret" rel="nofollow"> https://bandcamp.com/tapfret" rel="nofollow - Bandcamp |
Posted By: Thatfabulousalien
Date Posted: February 09 2017 at 23:07
No, a message infused with a huge ego and self-importance to that message. Otherwise, as I see it. Music is music, good and bad. Entirely up to subjective debate. ------------- Classical music isn't dead, it's more alive than it's ever been. It's just not on MTV. https://www.soundcloud.com/user-322914325 |
Posted By: Tapfret
Date Posted: February 09 2017 at 23:34
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^Fair enough. But you REALLY don't like Bono, do you?  I don't even like U2, but I just don't think he's as much of an attention whore as all that. But no biggy. I don't like Roger Waters. ------------- https://www.last.fm/user/Tapfret" rel="nofollow"> https://bandcamp.com/tapfret" rel="nofollow - Bandcamp |
Posted By: Son.of.Tiresias
Date Posted: February 10 2017 at 02:36
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In this context the word pretentious is totally wrong, of course. For me itīs dull. Without Keith Emerson and Rick Wakeman progressive music would have been still quite dull back in the day. They were geniuses, they created something new. No wonder critics hated them. Damn commies ------------- You may see a smile on Tony Banksī face but thatīs unlikely. |
Posted By: Son.of.Tiresias
Date Posted: February 10 2017 at 02:54
Quite rightly so, dear Watcher of the Skies. And I would add that the people who listen to it as well. Silly human, silly human race, isnīt it ? ------------- You may see a smile on Tony Banksī face but thatīs unlikely. |
Posted By: NutterAlert
Date Posted: February 10 2017 at 03:09
Just passing through...but this one sums it up perfectly. Anderson is a pretentious ex-milkman from Accrington, while Hammill is a towering genius. ------------- Proud to be an un-banned member since 2005 |
Posted By: Son.of.Tiresias
Date Posted: February 10 2017 at 03:44
Or maybe you just envy Jonīs gorgeous hair. Passing thru. Great. Go and get a life. Damn commies, didnīt I tell... ------------- You may see a smile on Tony Banksī face but thatīs unlikely. |
Posted By: Lewian
Date Posted: February 10 2017 at 04:32
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Of course proggies could give the word some kind of positive ironic spin. "Now ELP are really badly pretentious, so cool!" By the way, I think there was a pretentious element to most of what Eloy's Frank Bornemann did (I tend to suspect that if he calls an album "Visionary" it's really about himself), but then he managed to get some positive creative energy out of it, so fine by me. (And I'm able to ignore lyrics when listening to music... good for me!) |
Posted By: hellogoodbye
Date Posted: February 10 2017 at 05:08
| Everyone, probably. To confront with Bach, Bartok and Cage is pretentious, but it's also risky. It is that risk taking which sometimes makes prog so interesting. |
Posted By: presdoug
Date Posted: February 10 2017 at 05:40
These guys aren't pretentious, under-rated as hell, but not pretentious. |
Posted By: Arnulf Floyd
Date Posted: July 04 2017 at 06:06
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1: King Crimson 2: Pink Floyd 3: Emerson, Lake and Palmer 4: Yes 5: Genesis ------------- Long Live Rock 'n' Roll |
Posted By: Thatfabulousalien
Date Posted: July 04 2017 at 06:23
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Have any prog bands created societies to take over the planet yet?? ------------- Classical music isn't dead, it's more alive than it's ever been. It's just not on MTV. https://www.soundcloud.com/user-322914325 |