Why do some people have religous beliefs?
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Topic: Why do some people have religous beliefs?
Posted By: SteveG
Subject: Why do some people have religous beliefs?
Date Posted: October 25 2015 at 13:13
| A broad question perhaps, but why do some of us believe or have the need to believe in a God, an afterlife, redemption and all that goes along with Judeo-Christian beliefs? |
Replies:
Posted By: O666
Date Posted: October 25 2015 at 13:29
| I think we (I is better than we) need a "Big Hope" to "Tolerate" this hard , dark and scary life. |
Posted By: Triceratopsoil
Date Posted: October 25 2015 at 13:40
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why not |
Posted By: dr wu23
Date Posted: October 25 2015 at 14:29
Oh my....I can see all the erudite answers coming very soon from all the pontificators from the other thread where religion is being pommeled. ------------- One does nothing yet nothing is left undone. Haquin |
Posted By: HackettFan
Date Posted: October 25 2015 at 15:34
| I think the reason we have religious beliefs primarily cultural. To me it is only secondarily to satisfy an internal need or inspiration. This is not to say that it's not a very real inspiration for those who have become thoroughly enculturated by it. I'm just saying that it's the end result of a lifetime of influences. |
Posted By: The Dark Elf
Date Posted: October 25 2015 at 16:11
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Christianity survives on human guilt and the fear of death. These are what drove untold wealth to monasteries via bequests in the Middle Ages (many thousands of monks were devoted to praying for specific well-off dearly departed), and guilt and death is what still fuels multi-millions being forked out to preaching hucksters to this very day. It is a holy scam that plays on age-old, primal fears. ------------- ...a vigorous circular motion hitherto unknown to the people of this area, but destined to take the place of the mud shark in your mythology... |
Posted By: dr wu23
Date Posted: October 25 2015 at 16:25
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After some thought perhaps the better question would be, why do some people not have religious beliefs since the majority on earth probably do. ------------- One does nothing yet nothing is left undone. Haquin |
Posted By: twseel
Date Posted: October 25 2015 at 16:29
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According to this neurological bestseller that I read there's a part of the brain generating the specific feeling of spirituality, probably evolutionarily installed to keep a group together or something.
...and here's something from Wiki to support it: Spiritual experiences[ https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Spirituality&action=edit§ion=35" rel="nofollow - edit ]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neuroscience" rel="nofollow - Neuroscientists have examined brain functioning during reported spiritual experiences https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spirituality#cite_note-166" rel="nofollow - [146] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spirituality#cite_note-167" rel="nofollow - [147] finding that certain neurotransmitters and specific areas of the brain are involved. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spirituality#cite_note-168" rel="nofollow - [148] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spirituality#cite_note-169" rel="nofollow - [149] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spirituality#cite_note-170" rel="nofollow - [150] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spirituality#cite_note-171" rel="nofollow - [151] Moreover, experimenters have also successfully induced spiritual experiences in individuals by administering psychoactive agents known to elicit euphoria and perceptual distortions. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spirituality#cite_note-172" rel="nofollow - [152] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spirituality#cite_note-173" rel="nofollow - [153] Conversely, religiosity and spirituality can also be dampened by electromagnetic stimulation of the brain. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spirituality#cite_note-174" rel="nofollow - [154] These results have led some leading theorists to speculate that spirituality may be a benign subtype of psychosis ( http://www.patheos.com/blogs/epiphenom/2013/06/does-hallucinations-happiness.html" rel="nofollow - see ). https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spirituality#cite_note-ReferenceB-155" rel="nofollow - [135] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spirituality#cite_note-175" rel="nofollow - [155] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spirituality#cite_note-Cottam.2C_S._2011-176" rel="nofollow - [156] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spirituality#cite_note-Davies.2C_M._F._2001-177" rel="nofollow - [157] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spirituality#cite_note-178" rel="nofollow - [158] Benign in the sense that the same aberrant sensory perceptions that those suffering clinical psychoses evaluate as distressingly in-congruent and inexplicable are instead interpreted by spiritual individuals as positive—as personal and meaningful transcendent experiences. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spirituality#cite_note-Cottam.2C_S._2011-176" rel="nofollow - [156] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spirituality#cite_note-Davies.2C_M._F._2001-177" rel="nofollow - [157] ------------- 
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Posted By: wilmon91
Date Posted: October 25 2015 at 16:57
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I think the answer to the question is the same as to why people have beliefs at all (not just Judeo-Christian beliefs). There are many answers because there are many reasons for different people. It can be a cultural thing, or a traditional thing. Or a psychological need, which may enable some kind of self therapy for people. There can philosophical reasons. I think we can agree that humans only have a very small bit of knowledge compared to what is unknown. And the unknown is reality. How do you acknowledge the unknown(reality) - by ignoring it - since it is unknown , or by forming beliefs or ideas around it? It is human nature to be able to have a concept of the unknown. Kind of similar to have an idea of the future or the past. No matter what extent of knowledge we have, we do exist. So if we believe in ourselves we have to believe in the unknown. But it's not just a belief in an unknown reality, it is related to ideas on what is meaningful, good and bad etc. I I don't think these things should be called "needs". The alternative is to believe that there is no such thing as meaningfulness. That is a radical materialistic way of thinking, where there is no substance to empathy or compassion and such things. I think western culture today is pretty nihilistic. Personal success and money is what counts. There is no real worth to things, so everything becomes light entertainment in a system of consumerism and money making. There is no room for inspiration and creativity that isn't adapted to satisfy the expectations of the consumers. The only thing going forward is technology. I believe there is a lot of anxiety behind peoples motivations, because of norms and ideals that influence them. We live in a reality, we have a self conscious intellect, that's why we can have beliefs around everything, both of what seems self-evident and what seems less obvious. |
Posted By: Otto9999
Date Posted: October 25 2015 at 17:45
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Removed due to PA's deliberated act of deleting threads as alleged featuring negative behaviour posts towards others.
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Posted By: Atavachron
Date Posted: October 25 2015 at 17:53
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What if the 'answer' is not so great? Or just dull? What if there's an afterlife which is no different than normal tangible life? What if we are more-or-less who we always will be? ------------- "Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought." -- John F. Kennedy |
Posted By: Polymorphia
Date Posted: October 25 2015 at 23:56
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There are three reasons why people believe or disbelieve anything: 1) They believe that evidence and logic support that decision, 2) they want to, 3) they were taught to and never questioned it. Were you expecting any other answer? ------------- https://dreamwindow.bandcamp.com/releases" rel="nofollow - My Music 
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Posted By: Dean
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 02:07
Because they don't need them. If we start from an assumption that superstition and belief in the supernatural evolved as a survival trait then everything that follows, all the way to non-belief, is a pretty logical evolutionary sequence. Obviously a believer cannot make this assumption. ------------- What? |
dr wu23 wrote:Posted By: Ozark Soundscape
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 02:54
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Posted By: Sean Trane
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 04:13
Call it that if you wish: I call it superstitions and lack of assurance
fixed that for you!!!   Now there is the erudite answer " from all the pontificators from the other thread where religion is being pommeled " you were scared of reading of in your first intervention... I know it's Monday morning, but that's hardly an excuse  |
Posted By: Blacksword
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 07:47
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No idea. Seems silly to me, but each to their own. If they leave me alone I won't try and infect them with my nihilistic atheism. ------------- Ultimately bored by endless ecstasy! |
Posted By: The T
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 08:29
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Because those people need it. Plain and simple. Whether because they were raised to need it or because they have grown to need it doesn't matter. It's just a need. ------------- 
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Posted By: NutterAlert
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 08:35
Let's hear it for God 
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Posted By: dr wu23
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 09:07
Yes...that was very erudite ........... ------------- One does nothing yet nothing is left undone. Haquin |
Posted By: dr wu23
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 09:09
Now you know what happens when you 'assume'. ------------- One does nothing yet nothing is left undone. Haquin |
Posted By: chopper
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 09:37
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Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 09:39
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Well, it seem that the nonbelievers won the first round in what was not intended to be a contest. Ok, believers, it's your turn.
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Posted By: Guldbamsen
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 10:00
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I remember back when my dad first tried explaining this to me. He referred to the west coast of Denmark, where there still is a rather big (for Denmark that is) Christian community. Most of the folks living there were/are fishermen, which means having to sail some of the most treacherous seas in Scandinavia. Every time they sail out, they're in harms way. In the olden days when people knew nothing of weather forecasts and natural occurring wonders, they still had to have some faith in their safe return....and who else do you turn to when something is out of your hands? It is not hard to imagine such a strong tradition carrying on to the next generation and the one after. I think gods basically stem from man's incessant urge to put everything into little tiny boxes. When we come across stuff we don't understand, it's comforting to turn to deities or the supernatural. With gods we got the ultimate boxes. When something doesn't fit in anywhere else, you know exactly where to put it. ------------- “The Guide says there is an art to flying or rather a knack. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.” - Douglas Adams |
Posted By: Sean Trane
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 10:37
Karl Marx |
Posted By: Padraic
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 10:56
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It's an old and traditional method of attempting to answer the fundamental human query of "Why are we here?" A search for a bigger meaning. I suppose on some level it's depressing to think that there is no bigger meaning. |
Posted By: Otto9999
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 11:09
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Removed due to PA's deliberated act of deleting threads as alleged featuring negative behaviour posts towards others.
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Posted By: Otto9999
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 11:11
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Removed due to PA's deliberated act of deleting threads as alleged featuring negative behaviour posts towards others.
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Posted By: Polymorphia
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 11:48
Specifically, I could list the reasons why I think evidence and logic support my decision (which would take a long time), why it's appealing to me (which doesn't necessarily decide what I believe, but almost everyone has a preference of what they want to believe, even if they believe the opposite; also a long conversation), or if there are any unquestioned assumptions I have, stones unturned in my assessment of thousands of years of thought, arguments, and counterarguments (I would like to believe that there aren't, but naturally, as is true of all human beings, there are). ------------- https://dreamwindow.bandcamp.com/releases" rel="nofollow - My Music
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Posted By: jayem
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 12:18
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My parents and many relatives are very religious, and should faith in Jesus massively disappear on Earth, they want to be the last believers. To tell them we don't believe would express disdain for dozens of years of endless efforts at spreading the Good News. I'd DESERVE Hell to exist if I betray the faith they've fought so hard for. I don't know if anyone of their descendants will ever enter Heaven, but if my parents make it they won't end up alone: Mrs & Mr Stalder, retired hairdressers, and the baker's wife (I have a doubt about the husband) Mrs Rappaz will be there. I tell you this is the truth. Now beware ! Mrs Rappaz is the One who'll read names into the Book of Life. Believers can dismiss any steady reasoning upon how God cannot exist : 1. God's existence doesn't make sense. 2. Life doesn't make sense. ...Ergo: religion and life team up very well. The only safe way to get rid of religion is the eradication of all vulnerabilities. I don't know how one could possibly raise humans so that everyone become balanced + prone to making sense out of everything. No predators ? No lazy losers ? Which religious doctrine would Stalin, Pol Pot, Mao or Kim whatever, have used to manipulate people, making things worse than what happened ?... ------------- http://www.digger.ch/?lang=en" rel="nofollow - Support mine-clearing ! https://bandcamp.com/machinechance/?lang=en" rel="nofollow - bandcamp collection |
Posted By: Dean
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 12:29
I get smart-arse comments from a http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prunus_mume" rel="nofollow - Japanese apricot tree ? ------------- What? |
Posted By: dr wu23
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 12:30
Uh...how exactly did 'they' win? Belief in religion/God is a personal reality paradigm choice . There's no way to prove winning or losing in that. A confused agnostic...  ------------- One does nothing yet nothing is left undone. Haquin |
Posted By: Smurph
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 13:06
------------- http://pseudosentai.bandcamp.com/" rel="nofollow - http://pseudosentai.bandcamp.com/ wtf |
Posted By: Polymorphia
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 13:15
^It's only a matter of time. ------------- https://dreamwindow.bandcamp.com/releases" rel="nofollow - My Music
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Posted By: wilmon91
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 13:23
Who are the nonbelievers and how did they score points ?
I don't know about that urge, but it reminds me of the scientific revolution. All knowledge was put into a system where eveyrhing was divided into separate filelds and sub-fields. Tiny little boxes, you could say. The ability to look at the whole and to realize everythings interdependence was lost. I don't see how a belief would be putting things in tiny boxes. |
Posted By: O666
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 13:25
| This question can have different answers in different communities. Its relevant to culture , history , rate of illiteracy , psychology and... I mean believers are different and this make many answers to this question. There are too many things that science can't explain YET and this is very important. |
Posted By: wilmon91
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 13:27
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Another interesting question would be if you met a psychopath, with no sense of feelings and empathy, who asked you what was the point of feelings? What arguments are there to convince the psychopath about the value of feelings and conscience? |
Posted By: Smurph
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 13:28
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It's funny to think about religious people putting things in boxes because the entire concept of God to me is something that is inconceivable
------------- http://pseudosentai.bandcamp.com/" rel="nofollow - http://pseudosentai.bandcamp.com/ wtf |
Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 14:28
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Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 14:41
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There are probably many valid answers to my question. Although, it can't be verified, I feel that we humans base a lot of our actions on beliefs. If we believe we're in eminent danger, such as a hearing someone breaking into our house at night, we're going to perform actions that will put ourselves out of danger quickly. It could have just been someone who was drunk and was trying to get in the wrong house. In these cases, we act on belief. We believe we're in danger and don't wait around to confirm this notion with absolute fact finding observation. So, I think we can transfer this 'protection belief' system to other aspects of our behaviors such as belief in deities, afterlife, etc., along with the standard thinking of cultural conditioning, Freud's 'fear of death' mental response and hundreds, if not thousands of other valid reasons and theories for why we have religious beliefs.
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Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 14:48
Oh, and I dismiss the notion that my question can have one all encompassing answer. That to me is hubris at it's worst. ------------- This message was brought to you by a proud supporter of the Deep State. |
Posted By: timothy leary
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 14:48
The Origin of Consciousness in the Breakdown of the Bicameral Mind...........Julian Jaynes. |
Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 14:54
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No problem Tim, I can throw the destruction of bicameralism onto the pile. ------------- This message was brought to you by a proud supporter of the Deep State. |
Posted By: timothy leary
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 14:58
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Yea, don't read the book |
Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 15:00
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I'll read the book Tim, but it's another theory that no one can prove. ------------- This message was brought to you by a proud supporter of the Deep State. |
Posted By: timothy leary
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 15:04
| Recent neuroimaging studies provide new evidence for Jaynes's neurological model, i.e. auditory hallucinations arising in the right temporal-parietal lobe and being transmitted to the left temporal-parietal lobe. This was pointed out by Dr. Robert Olin in Lancet https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bicameralism_%28psychology%29#cite_note-17" rel="nofollow - [17] and Dr. Leo Sher in the Journal of Psychiatry and Neuroscience, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bicameralism_%28psychology%29#cite_note-18" rel="nofollow - [18] and further discussed in the book Reflections on the Dawn of Consciousness. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bicameralism_%28psychology%29#cite_note-19" rel="nofollow - [19] |
Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 15:11
| Tim, critique and criticism of Janyes's theory will go on long after we're dead. When Jayne's theory becomes a fact, I will acknowledge it. |
Posted By: timothy leary
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 15:18
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You are the one who posted a thread which invited theories, since you have not read the book your dismissal of the theory seems uninformed. |
Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 15:23
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All theories are valid to me, Tim. Unfortunately, that's what you don't understand. ------------- This message was brought to you by a proud supporter of the Deep State. |
Posted By: timothy leary
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 15:28
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okay, enlighten me |
Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 15:31
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Absolute belief in one theory makes as much sense to me as a belief in one true deity, one true religion, one universal truth...are you enlightened yet? ------------- This message was brought to you by a proud supporter of the Deep State. |
Posted By: timothy leary
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 15:32
| All theories are valid is as lame as..........Absolute belief in one theory makes as much sense to me as a belief in one true deity, one true religion, one universal truth |
Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 15:36
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An absolute belief in a single theory or idea is what causes wars, kills countless thousands, etc. etc. etc. You know Tim, that might just be as close to a universal truth as we can come. ------------- This message was brought to you by a proud supporter of the Deep State. |
Posted By: timothy leary
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 15:44
| I think disbelief plays an important role , not only do I believe in my government, religion, sports team, I disbelieve in your government, religion, sports team. The remedy is marching over and strip away your government, religion and sports team. We wore white hats and the native americans were savages. |
Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 15:50
| Perhaps, if you hold both our government, religion, sport steam and your government, religion and sports team to be equally scrutinized and not take either one at face value as being better or believed in, as you put it, this would not be a problem. |
Posted By: The T
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 15:55
Also, opium might be good...  -------------
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Posted By: timothy leary
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 15:58
| Most likely but would not any strategy be a belief |
Posted By: jayem
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 16:01
(Only a robot has no feeling, and if there's a will it is dicted by feelings). Absolute empathy is nearly impossible since it requires that one would be able to feel like someone with different experiment and memories. Now people that are called "psychos" have developed an addictive taste for absolute power on others (of any kind) and they're sort of emprisoned into that feeling of being irresistible. Maybe you'd like to know whether a psycho would convert to judeo-christianism: the answer is yes, everyone can "repent" even crazy killers, but better be put out of exerting power first.
------------- http://www.digger.ch/?lang=en" rel="nofollow - Support mine-clearing ! https://bandcamp.com/machinechance/?lang=en" rel="nofollow - bandcamp collection |
Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 16:03
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Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 16:19
| I've got to head off. These discussions usually devolve into semantics, so I'll close by stating again that I seek empirical data to support a claim, not an argument to support a belief in a claim. |
Posted By: rushfan4
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 16:21
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Once upon a time in a land far, far away, a wise person or persons whose identity(ies) is (are) lost to the ravages of time came up with an explanation for the who, what, how, and why of our existence. This explanation of a diety or dieties to explain the way things worked which might have begun as early as the days of the caves has been passed on through the travails of time in many forms and formats resulting in a number of different surviving beliefs. Whilst any of the beliefs throughout time are as valid or as invalid as any others, the ones that have survived until modern day are those that were held by the conquerors; as it is the conquerors who get to write the account of history. Maybe it was God's will that these were the conquerors or maybe it was dumb luck. Either way, what exists to this day is what exists. The "beauty" of it is that until such diety or dieties reveal themselves to us as proof that they do exist it can neither be proved nor disproved that he/they don't exist. You either have faith or you don't. And to this day, it is still an answer to the who, what, how, and why of our existence....for those who choose to accept it. ------------- 
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Posted By: dr wu23
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 16:35
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This seems like it might fit in here...always liked this comment: "Is what we moderns have remaining to learn about the nature of reality slight and will it require only light fine-tuning of our current way of looking at things; or do we understand very little , missing the point entirely about the nature of our situation in being?" Terrance McKenna ------------- One does nothing yet nothing is left undone. Haquin |
Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 16:40
^Now, that's really a deep question Doc. And a very good one too. 
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Posted By: Otto9999
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 16:49
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Posted By: rushfan4
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 17:17
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Posted By: HackettFan
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 21:47
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Posted By: HackettFan
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 21:53
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Posted By: manofmystery
Date Posted: October 26 2015 at 21:54
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Same reason some people still believe in communism/socialism and other forms of totalitarianism. Fools desire for some all-knowing central entity to run the world for them. -------------  Time always wins. |
Posted By: Sean Trane
Date Posted: October 27 2015 at 04:56
you could almost add Hitler to that list, though the Nazi regime didn't declare itself atheist... it kind of avoided the subject, I think ((not sure about this, because they did use some kind of mythology) What led those arsehole's regimes to those atrocities is that religion became an (in not THE prime) element of resistance to the non-religious egalitarian society projects that they were trying to install. (well the pol Pot regime was yet another thing, where just being able to read got you killed)
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Posted By: Skalla-Grim
Date Posted: October 27 2015 at 05:23
The main cause for religious beliefs is education and tradition. Most people who believe in certain supernatural holy phenomena, do that because they were told to believe by their parents, priests or whatever. I don't think many Christians know that the cause for most Europeans being christians is that a Roman emperor believed the Christian god would grant him victory over his political enemies.
The nazi regime wasn't atheist, it tried to create christianity without its jewish heritage. There are various speeches from Hitler in which he claimed he was fulfilling God's will. |
Posted By: Otto9999
Date Posted: October 27 2015 at 07:41
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Removed due to PA's deliberated act of deleting threads as alleged featuring negative behaviour posts towards others.
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Posted By: Otto9999
Date Posted: October 27 2015 at 07:46
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Removed due to PA's deliberated act of deleting threads as alleged featuring negative behaviour posts towards others.
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Posted By: jayem
Date Posted: October 27 2015 at 08:41
No regime is bound to totalitarianism, though regimes based on extreme doctrines will probably encourage it. Once we know dazzling charisma offers no quality guarantee, and once we choose not to trust trust people with excellent official results in their careers to become our masters, totalitarianism is unlikely.
------------- http://www.digger.ch/?lang=en" rel="nofollow - Support mine-clearing ! https://bandcamp.com/machinechance/?lang=en" rel="nofollow - bandcamp collection |
Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: October 27 2015 at 11:44
| Two days, four pages ... when there's already another (recent) thread about faith. |
Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: October 27 2015 at 11:49
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Religion, regardless of one's stance and even one's lack of a stance, is a never ending topic for discussion. This in its self always struck me as significant. ------------- This message was brought to you by a proud supporter of the Deep State. |
Posted By: Dean
Date Posted: October 27 2015 at 12:22
I suspect the reason why has changed considerably thou'. ------------- What? |
Posted By: Guldbamsen
Date Posted: October 27 2015 at 12:37
 ------------- “The Guide says there is an art to flying or rather a knack. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.” - Douglas Adams |
Posted By: timothy leary
Date Posted: October 27 2015 at 12:58
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Posted By: Otto9999
Date Posted: October 27 2015 at 12:59
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Removed due to PA's deliberated act of deleting threads as alleged featuring negative behaviour posts towards others.
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Posted By: wilmon91
Date Posted: October 27 2015 at 14:48
The question has some implication, as if saying - why don't people stick to what we can see, hear and register with our senses. We don't need to believe in anything until we have seen it. Why believe in extraterrestrials until we have seen one? However, it's extremely unlikely that extraterrestrials don't exist, it is too improbable. The scientific progress only works with what we have discovered and what is measurable, though. But you can't
So we might as well ask, "why do people need a purpose?" But that calls for the question, "why don't some people need purpose?" . It's the same with the question in this thread. It is a naive question, since there is no explanation to why the question was asked, and there is no argument for not believing - it's only implied. |
Posted By: wilmon91
Date Posted: October 27 2015 at 14:50
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Posted By: wilmon91
Date Posted: October 27 2015 at 15:02
But the point I tried to make is that some things can't be explained in a factual way. |
Posted By: wilmon91
Date Posted: October 27 2015 at 15:04
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pressed the wrong button.. |
Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: October 27 2015 at 15:38
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Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: October 27 2015 at 15:50
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Posted By: jayem
Date Posted: October 27 2015 at 17:37
Like predestination ? ------------- http://www.digger.ch/?lang=en" rel="nofollow - Support mine-clearing ! https://bandcamp.com/machinechance/?lang=en" rel="nofollow - bandcamp collection |
Posted By: jayem
Date Posted: October 27 2015 at 17:37
Like all "standard" religions Judeo-Christianity is about finding an answer to that question: how it is that one would feel either so well taken care of, or on the contrary so hurt, and nobody one knows can claim responsibility for. There must be someone responsible, one can talk to... After some would claim to have found the ultimate truth about that, more or less satisfactory to others, Judeo-Christianity did provide its own answers about who God is, and what to do to ensure God's benevolence. It requires not focusing too much on questions like: if God is in total control of everything, why would some people be luckier than others, and figure out their own interests better than others ? For non believers, the answer would be that it's just part of what can possibly happen in an universe the way we know it, and what happens happens, and we'll do what we'll do. ------------- http://www.digger.ch/?lang=en" rel="nofollow - Support mine-clearing ! https://bandcamp.com/machinechance/?lang=en" rel="nofollow - bandcamp collection |
Posted By: wilmon91
Date Posted: October 28 2015 at 14:33
If one would say that peoples actions are governed only by will, that would be doubtful.. "will" is a bit ambiguous word. It's controlled by a hierarchy of different forces , I would guess. But I was thinking mostly of the intellectual will coming from the soul. This reminds me of a movie, "Der Freie Wille:  about a rapist who seems to have an uncontrollable drive. But he appears like he hates this side of himself, like it wasn't part of him. I didn't buy the story completely but it was an interesting premise. There's people who want to change but doesn't change, and they start to believe that no one can change. That's not true in my opinion. But I don't think it's a s simple as making a decision.
I was thinking about human psychology, it can't be explained with scientific terms. |
Posted By: jayem
Date Posted: October 28 2015 at 15:24
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OK... I can't argue further but welcome comments from experts ! ------------- http://www.digger.ch/?lang=en" rel="nofollow - Support mine-clearing ! https://bandcamp.com/machinechance/?lang=en" rel="nofollow - bandcamp collection |
Posted By: HackettFan
Date Posted: October 28 2015 at 19:06
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Posted By: BaldFriede
Date Posted: October 31 2015 at 05:09
I don't believe in that. I do however have religious beliefs, but they are (almost) completely my own. I say "almost" because I am co-founder of a religion that worships Gaia, the ancient Greek Goddess of the Earth. I founded it with my beloved wife BaldJean. We are both High Priestesses of it. Our small religious group currently has 27 members, counting us and our two daughters Alice and Dorothy. There are other religious groups in the world that worship Gaia. We are however completely independent of them. We even created a new calendar which we call the "Gaian calendar". It has 13 months with 28 days each. Since 13 times 28 equals 364 only there is also a New Year's Day, which does not belong to any month or week and which is followed by leap day, which also does not belong to any month or week. Out year starts with the vernal equinox. That way a year resembles a human life, with spring being childhood and youth (the first 20 years), summer young adulthood (the next 20 years), fall middle-age (the next 20 years) and winter old age (the rest). This calendar has the advantage that the same date will fall on the same weekday every year. What's more, all months start with the same weekday as well since our week has seven days as in the Gregorian calendar. Figuring out which weekday a certain date falls on thus becomes extremely easy. The names of the weekdays and the months are taken from Greek mythology. The weekdays are named after the seven Pleiades, the months after Greek Goddesses. The solstices and equinoxes, which mark the beginning of the four seasons, are our holy days. We paint ourselves head to toe in the color of the beginning season for these days - green for the grass of spring, red for the flowers of summer, yellowish-brown for the leaves of fall and white for the snow of winter. As to why people belief in religions, not just the one you mentioned: Because they think there is some meaning in this world; it is not just arbitrary. -------------  BaldJean and I; I am the one in blue. |
Posted By: dr wu23
Date Posted: October 31 2015 at 10:21
On a simply practical attrition level that's the reason for spread of 'religion' but not why people still believe in that ontology after several millennia. ------------- One does nothing yet nothing is left undone. Haquin |
Posted By: BaldFriede
Date Posted: October 31 2015 at 10:32
I think you misphrased your sentence since according to the dictionary "ontology" is "the branch of metaphysics that studies the nature of existence or being as such". ------------- BaldJean and I; I am the one in blue. |
Posted By: Vompatti
Date Posted: October 31 2015 at 10:42
| Do some people have religious beliefs that don't concern the nature of existence or being as such? |
Posted By: BaldFriede
Date Posted: October 31 2015 at 11:02
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No, but "ontology" is the science that studies things that exist. And he certainly did not mean he does not believe in that science. ------------- BaldJean and I; I am the one in blue. |
Posted By: Vompatti
Date Posted: October 31 2015 at 11:15
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1 : a branch of metaphysics concerned with the nature and relations of being 2 : a particular theory about the nature of being or the kinds of things that have existence
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Posted By: BaldFriede
Date Posted: October 31 2015 at 11:25
The second definition does not apply either. Or wold you define "religion" as "a theory of the things that have existence"? I certainly would not. ------------- BaldJean and I; I am the one in blue. |
Posted By: Vompatti
Date Posted: October 31 2015 at 11:51
I would say that if religion doesn't lead to an ontology that would be impossible without the religion, it's not much of a religion. |
Posted By: BaldFriede
Date Posted: October 31 2015 at 12:24
It depends a lot on how you define "theory". If you define it in the scientific sense, which I prefer since I am extremely interested in natural sciences, it means " a well-substantiated explanation of some aspect of the natural world that is acquired through the scientific method and repeatedly tested and confirmed through observation and experiments". But that is exactly what a religion is not. ------------- BaldJean and I; I am the one in blue. |
Posted By: Svetonio
Date Posted: October 31 2015 at 13:09
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Posted By: Dean
Date Posted: October 31 2015 at 13:24
Do you know what? I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt here and believe that you really do believe that bollocks and aren't just being dickish to be provocative.
------------- What? |