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MikeEnRegalia View Drop Down
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Points: 21187 		Direct Link To This Post Topic: Ableton Live ... a serious recommendation!
    Posted: July 28 2008 at 05:10
For the last two weeks I've been checking out various DAW (digital audio workstation) software ... my winner is: Ableton Live. I'm currently using the "Lite" edition that came with the Line6 audio interface, but I'll probably upgrade to the full suite soon.

So - what are your experiences with Ableton, or DAW software in general ... any recommendations or "warnings"?

I'm at work now, but I'll post some detailed info about Ableton Live later ... plus maybe some demo tracks I've recorded. But the Lite edition doesn't contain many instruments - just drums and a rudimentary sampler, so the demos will be a little minimalistic.Wink
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Points: 7559 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 28 2008 at 06:01
I found Ableton's interface a bit counter-intuitive - like a scaled-down version of Sonar. I couldn't get up and recording in 15 minutes, so I stopped using it Embarrassed
 
Sonar's OK - I used to use Cakewalk 3.0 for many of my College projects, but it was a demo version, and I had to record everything and dump it to cassette, because they'd disabled Save. When they introduced Audio in v4.0, I ditched it for Magix, which worked better on my old, slow system.
 
I much prefer Magix Studio, which is why I use ACID - the interface is closer to that of Magix, but the feature set of Express is awesome for free. Magix is only £50 or so - and well worth checking out. I haven't used it since about v7, but I still see good things being written about it.
 
I don't like Cubase - I was bitten a long time ago by version 3.0, which was next to impossible to figure out without someone going through all the bits with you, and now I associate it with something that's just too complex. I want to record my stuff, mix it and move on, not figure out where everything is - but many Pros I know swear by it.
 
I don't know what happened to it, but the best DAW I've ever used was just called Music Studio 1.0 - and I can't remember who made it. I got a copy from a Studio engineer friend of mine while at college, and it replaced Cakewalk instantly. The worst thing about it was also the best - the Score editor was a doddle to use - completely intuitive note entry. But the score printouts sucked big time.
 
Sonar still uses the old Cakewalk Score engine, which is pretty basic compared to something decent like Sibelius - but Sibelius isn't a DAW and doesn't pretend to be.
 
 
 
*What do you mean by "Doesn't contain many instruments?"
 
The important thing is not to stop questioning.
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MikeEnRegalia View Drop Down
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Points: 21187 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 28 2008 at 06:32
Originally posted by Certif1ed Certif1ed wrote:

 
 
*What do you mean by "Doesn't contain many instruments?"
 


The Lite edition contains "Impulse" (a simple drum machine like sampler) and "Simpler" (a simple sampler Wink).

The Suite contains additional software instruments:

Analog synth, FM synth, a better sampler, a simulator for stringed instruments (e.g. bass guitar), session drums (28GB), drum machines and an extensive library of sampled instruments.

Check them out on their website: http://www.ableton.com/suite Smile

BTW: There's also the full version of Live 7 ... it only contains Impulse/Simpler and the library of sampled instruments, not the session drums or the other software instruments.
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Points: 7559 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 28 2008 at 08:01
Right - thought you meant those, but wasn't sure.
 
Magix has some of those too - and since they bought Samplitude, the Top-End version is pretty amazing; http://www.magix.com/us/samplitude-music-studio/
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MikeEnRegalia View Drop Down
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Points: 21187 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 28 2008 at 08:53
^ all that for 75 EUR ... where's the catch?
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Points: 7559 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 28 2008 at 09:54
None - it's that good.
 
Try one of the earlier versions that you can get from Amazon for even less - they don't have the Samplitude engine, but they're amazing for the money.
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MikeEnRegalia View Drop Down
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Points: 21187 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 28 2008 at 10:45
^ I'll try the free edition. Do you know whether you can use the VST Instruments in other DAWs too? That would be cool ... Ableton Live is still cool because of its "Live" mode (Session View). You can record in other applications and then import the clips to create a live performance.
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Points: 7559 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 28 2008 at 17:00

VST is based on a protocol (in essence), so yes, theoretically any VST should work with any DAW.
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MikeEnRegalia View Drop Down
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Points: 21187 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 28 2008 at 17:42
I installed the Samplitude Music Studio 14 trial version today ... unfortunately it's not running as stable as Ableton Live, there are frequent ASIO dropouts no matter which ASIO driver I chose.
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Points: 8844 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 28 2008 at 17:44
Originally posted by Certif1ed Certif1ed wrote:

Right - thought you meant those, but wasn't sure.
 
Magix has some of those too - and since they bought Samplitude, the Top-End version is pretty amazing; http://www.magix.com/us/samplitude-music-studio/


That looks AWESOME.  That'll probably be what I get when I decide to upgrade from Audacity.  Which will probably not be terribly soon. 

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Points: 2888 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 28 2008 at 19:31
I've never used Ableton before and am not sure it would accommodate my needs. I've used max/msp http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Max/msp - down the bottom of the page there is a list of 'notable artist' to give an idea of what kind of musicians use this program. Unfortunately it takes a while to get the feel of the program, starting with a very empty palette, with little to no prompting on how to get started; other than via a hefty user manual. So potentially this could be off putting to a neophyte. The program was originally developed for mac, but now is easily compatible with pc's (tho' I'm skeptical if it would run well on vista) and is perfect to use with external devices, midi, tape loop, analog synth, et cetera.  Draw back, cost $495

http://www.cycling74.com/


Edited by Black Velvet - July 28 2008 at 19:33
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Points: 7559 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 29 2008 at 02:26
Originally posted by rileydog22 rileydog22 wrote:

Originally posted by Certif1ed Certif1ed wrote:

Right - thought you meant those, but wasn't sure.
 
Magix has some of those too - and since they bought Samplitude, the Top-End version is pretty amazing; http://www.magix.com/us/samplitude-music-studio/


That looks AWESOME.  That'll probably be what I get when I decide to upgrade from Audacity.  Which will probably not be terribly soon. 
 
You might want to follow Mike's example and try the free demo version first - I used to use Magix 5 under Windows 2000, and it wasn't until about version 7 that they got it to work with Windows XP.
 
Mike's problems could stem from Magix not having adapted the product to work with Vista - or maybe they optimised it for WaveRT (ASIO/WDM support for DAWs under Vista is notoriously awful).
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rileydog22 View Drop Down
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Points: 8844 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 29 2008 at 03:37
I'm running XP (hoping to delay the Vista transition as long as possible), so I doubt compatibility will be an issue.  

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