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Trickster F.
Prog Reviewer
Joined: February 10 2006
Location: Belize
Status: Offline
Points: 5308
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Posted: April 24 2006 at 11:41 |
MikeEnRegalia wrote:
Anyways, let's not argue too much about what we DON'T like. |
Excellent words, I whole heartedly agree.
Like I said, I'm not trying to be redundant and force my opinions to others. I have really nothing but support even to people who dislike the music I like. If somebody gives my favourite group the lowest rating, I will accept his opinion if it his argument is credible. If it's just insulting the artist and the fans, such review holds no value in my mind.
And I suppose you are right, I guess it is not mature to participate in discussions of things you dislike if you have already expressed your opinion once. Wait, or is it? Wouldn't all the TFK and DT get boring if a party pooper like me hadn't come in? ![Wink](https://www.progarchives.com/forum/smileys/smiley2.gif)
-- Ivan
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Rorro
Forum Senior Member
Joined: December 31 2005
Location: Uruguay
Status: Offline
Points: 508
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Posted: April 24 2006 at 11:42 |
MAN, I FEEL LIKE A WOMAN
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eddietrooper
Forum Senior Member
Joined: February 27 2006
Location: Spain
Status: Offline
Points: 940
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Posted: April 24 2006 at 12:28 |
I like TFK a lot, and I don't mind if they are too much influenced by 70's or not, that's no reason for me to rate low an album is it contains quality music. But somewhat I agree with the fact of them not being in the top 100 with any album for the fact that none of their albums are really five stars albums for me: they have very good albums like their debut, Space Revolver, or Paradox Hotel but they are not masterpieces, all of them contain excellent songs but also some simply good tracks, which I wouldn't call filler but they are not so excellent. If TFK had released only 2 or 3 albums in their career taking only their very best music and trowing away the average songs, that albums surely would be on top 100. But the fact is that they have released a bunch of albums, most of them good but no one deserving really five stars.
Edited by eddietrooper - April 24 2006 at 12:43
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Dirk
Forum Senior Member
Joined: August 11 2005
Location: Netherlands
Status: Offline
Points: 1043
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Posted: April 24 2006 at 13:29 |
The main reason TFK albums are not rated that high is the length of the albums. Flower Power has one hour of music which i would rate 5 stars (Garden of dreams). Mind you this is almost twice the length of most 70's cd's.
Alas Flower power is 2 hours of music and the second hour i rate 3 stars so the average rating for this album is 4 stars (excellent) for 120 minutes of music. The same goes for Stardust we are.These 2 discs i would rate 4.5 and 4 stars respectively.
This doesn't bother me at all. TFK is already well known so very high ratings are not that important. In fact i love their albums being so long. Gives us so much more to explore.
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Tomodachi
Forum Senior Member
Joined: April 10 2006
Location: Italy
Status: Offline
Points: 147
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Posted: April 24 2006 at 14:19 |
Ivansfr0st: it's all right if you don't like TFK, but I only want to tell you that your opinion about pointlessness of their music was also my opinion the first time I listened to them, and even my first impression when I listen to a new work of theirs. But with several listenings I found myself seeing little by little a meaning in every note they play... and since this is what happens to me with all the greatest prog bands (e.g. I could see no meaning in CTTE the first 3-4 times I listened to it, but then it appeared to me slowly and it's great to find and appreciate new subtleties at every new listening) I started considering TFK in the prog olympus. Of course if that is your opinion even after many listening is all right, you don't like TFK. I will not die if TFK will never reach the top 100, if I like a band I don't mind much others opinion, I only wanted to know if anyone else had my same opinion because n. 330 is a REALLY low result... but I repeat: if this is people will, I'll accept that. TFK importance in my opinion: - great role in keeping alive symphonic prog nowadays, with obvious references to the 70s greats but also with great freshness and originality IMO; - all top notch musicians; - many solid album released; - undoubtable high quality music, whether one may consider it as progressive or regressive.
Rorro: you're not alone, I love Adam&Eve too, I think Love Supreme, Driver's seat and Blade of Cain in particular are some of TFK best works
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Sir Hogweed
Forum Senior Member
Joined: March 29 2005
Location: Netherlands
Status: Offline
Points: 191
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Posted: April 24 2006 at 14:34 |
Dirk wrote:
The main reason TFK albums are not rated that high is the length of the albums. Flower Power has one hour of music which i would rate 5 stars (Garden of dreams). Mind you this is almost twice the length of most 70's cd's.
Alas Flower power is 2 hours of music and the second hour i rate 3 stars so the average rating for this album is 4 stars (excellent) for 120 minutes of music. The same goes for Stardust we are.These 2 discs i would rate 4.5 and 4 stars respectively.
This doesn't bother me at all. TFK is already well known so very high ratings are not that important. In fact i love their albums being so long. Gives us so much more to explore.
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I have to agree with everything you said here. I also like the 80 minutes per disc approach but it doesn't seem to help getting to the top of the list. Too bad, because every disc has at least 35 minutes of great shameless prog on it, easily worth 4 or 5 stars.
But I hope this remains their strategy. It has been almost a month now and I'm still digesting Paradox
Hotel (and of course liking it better with each spin).
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Visitor13
Forum Senior Member
VIP Member
Joined: February 02 2005
Location: Poland
Status: Offline
Points: 4702
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Posted: April 24 2006 at 14:43 |
I'm not a big fan of TFK, but I think that their best moments match those of Yes easily.
Also I think if Yes' next album sounded like TFK, it would reach the top 100 in no time...
Edited by Visitor13 - April 24 2006 at 14:43
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richardh
Prog Reviewer
Joined: February 18 2004
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 29317
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Posted: April 25 2006 at 01:56 |
I used to love TFK but now I think their albums are full of humdrum filler.I first started to fall out of love with them when I watched 'Meet the Flower Kings' DVD especially in relation to the drumming.Zoltan Csorz is fanstically talented and can be very heavy but he's reduced to keeping time and looking bored while they meander their way through various stuff that just all sounds the same.I need some balls in the music but all you get is the laid back prog that hardly gets the blood pumping.Instrumentally they can cut it but Roine Stolte too phlegmatic for a front man.Oh well maybe I'll get the latest album and fall back in love with them.So many seem to be going apesh*t over it judging by the reviews section.
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oddentity
Forum Senior Member
Joined: June 28 2005
Status: Offline
Points: 248
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Posted: April 26 2006 at 00:05 |
I have been ambivalent about the Flower Kings myself over the years, sometimes enjoying them, sometimes not. But I have to say that their latest, Paradox Hotel, is absolutely stellar. The way it flows along without a single note out of place is very enjoyable to listen to. Unlike previous albums, none of the music is forced. It all seems to come effiortlessly from their own vision. It's almost as though they have found themselves with this album.
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Rorro
Forum Senior Member
Joined: December 31 2005
Location: Uruguay
Status: Offline
Points: 508
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Posted: April 26 2006 at 17:19 |
Tomodachi wrote:
Ivansfr0st: it's all right if you don't like TFK, but I only want to tell you that your opinion about pointlessness of their music was also my opinion the first time I listened to them, and even my first impression when I listen to a new work of theirs. But with several listenings I found myself seeing little by little a meaning in every note they play... and since this is what happens to me with all the greatest prog bands (e.g. I could see no meaning in CTTE the first 3-4 times I listened to it, but then it appeared to me slowly and it's great to find and appreciate new subtleties at every new listening) I started considering TFK in the prog olympus. Of course if that is your opinion even after many listening is all right, you don't like TFK. I will not die if TFK will never reach the top 100, if I like a band I don't mind much others opinion, I only wanted to know if anyone else had my same opinion because n. 330 is a REALLY low result... but I repeat: if this is people will, I'll accept that. TFK importance in my opinion: - great role in keeping alive symphonic prog nowadays, with obvious references to the 70s greats but also with great freshness and originality IMO; - all top notch musicians; - many solid album released; - undoubtable high quality music, whether one may consider it as progressive or regressive.
Rorro: you're not alone, I love Adam&Eve too, I think Love Supreme, Driver's seat and Blade of Cain in particular are some of TFK best works
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good to hear that ![Tongue](https://www.progarchives.com/forum/smileys/smiley17.gif)
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