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Moonshake View Drop Down
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    Posted: January 20 2024 at 16:47
Vinnie Colauita, Aynsley Dunbar and Art Tripp

Edited by Moonshake - January 20 2024 at 17:26
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Zappastolethetowels View Drop Down
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^^
Jim Gordon,

Played only those two Wazoo tours I mentioned in your quote of me. I know him as being the drummer for Derek & The Dominoes in 1970; I'm sure he played in other bands, just not to my knowledge. 

Hope that helps somewhat?
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Originally posted by Zappastolethetowels Zappastolethetowels wrote:

Dunbar (1970-72) (flo & Eddie era, Waka, Wazoo) - underrated, very fluid & jazzy. Needs to be on top of everyone's drummers list!
Gordon (1972) (touring drummer for the Grand & Petit Wazoo bands; plays title track on Apostrophe) - his story notwithstanding, an incredible talent nonetheless. I hear some Bonham in his playing sometimes, ability 


Dunbar's the best , IMHO
Or at least he's my fave, partly because he plays on Jaka/Wazoo.  

Not aware of Gordon XYZ... can you expand? 
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I wouldn't venture to rank them, and I'm a drummer myself. I'd just respect them each uniquely and individually.

My favorites though are Jimmy Carl Black (from the Mothers period), and Terry Bozzio (from the Zappa solo period). They're the standouts to me. The "Baby Snakes" movie is a great way to enjoy both of their antics.


Edited by Boojieboy - January 19 2024 at 18:28
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Never did (and will not do) a comparative analysis of Zappa drummers and I've only seen Terry Bozzio live, once, in a jaw dropping solo performance. I think Zappa picked his musicians well, in general - that's how it sounds to me anyway.

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Colaiuta no doubt. One of the most skilled drummers of all time. Just look up the story Steve Vai told about Vinnie's audition!

Wackerman and Thompson are also great. Humphrey and Bozzio probably next (the latter, it should be noted, also wins me over with his faux-punk vocals, unrelated but I appreciate it).
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Originally posted by moshkito moshkito wrote:

Hi,

Interesting comment about holding your attention span ... I would think that the drummer's main priority is to the music, and not to the fan ... and this is the tough part.

Personally, I do not dislike many of them, although it seems like the drumming changed to more technical folks playing with Frank, and I think that it was important to help the music stand up even better, as it was obvious that some of the music was going way out there, beyond what most bands ever try to do, or can conceive at all.

I don't look at the drummers as the "thing". To me it has to be the combination and how it works ... Bonzo makes LZ sound special many times. Moonie gives personality to the band's work, unlike so many "progressive" drummers TODAY that can only count to 4 and hit the snare drum! Weird that most of them have 10 or 12 other drums around them, and don't use them much! With all those drums around you, a snare is not needed ... but there would not be interesting enough drummers to try something different, instead of counting beats ... it's like what RF said in the movie ... you don't listen to the numbers or the count ... you listen to your fellow players and adjust and compliment! ...oh btw ... that was 3 of them!

Considering that FZ was able to get so much music, and so much stuff that was different, I would say that he got the most out of many of them ... but I'm not sure that many of them are that special ... FZ got what he could afford and use. 

The main issue with drummers is ... the numbers game. I kinda think that some of them are just trying really hard to keep up with the music. And it gets harder when it goes all over the place!

Ofc, but being a drummer, I can't help myself LOL

No question about the first part of your last statement, but Frank had personal contacts with many of these drummers that just happened to be amazing musicians. I don't think it had anything to do with who he could afford or not. 

About the numbers game - some did a better job than others. We're talking drummers - there's a lot to analyze and differentiate between two given drummers. 
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It seems strange to think that I saw Wackerman playing drums with Steven Wilson about 2015 time. At the time I was a bit disappointed that it wasn't Marco Minnerman (one of the guys that definitely doesn't conform to Pedro's assessment of modern drummers!) . Smile
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Bozzio and Colaiuta are my top 2 plus they're in fact the upper echelon of most skilled drummers in history.
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Colaiuta, Thompson and (of course) Bozzio are the ones I like best.
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Points: 12684 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Grumpyprogfan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 18 2024 at 09:59
Chad Wackerman is my favorite Zappa drummer. And his work with Allan Holdsworth is off the charts.

Vinnie Colaiuta is superb. And he is versatile. He played on a Megadeth record.

Terry Bozzio. Watching him perform Punky's Whips is jaw dropping.

Chester, Ralph, and Aynsley...also great.

Any musician that played with Frank had to be exceptional.
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Hi,

Interesting comment about holding your attention span ... I would think that the drummer's main priority is to the music, and not to the fan ... and this is the tough part.

Personally, I do not dislike many of them, although it seems like the drumming changed to more technical folks playing with Frank, and I think that it was important to help the music stand up even better, as it was obvious that some of the music was going way out there, beyond what most bands ever try to do, or can conceive at all.

I don't look at the drummers as the "thing". To me it has to be the combination and how it works ... Bonzo makes LZ sound special many times. Moonie gives personality to the band's work, unlike so many "progressive" drummers TODAY that can only count to 4 and hit the snare drum! Weird that most of them have 10 or 12 other drums around them, and don't use them much! With all those drums around you, a snare is not needed ... but there would not be interesting enough drummers to try something different, instead of counting beats ... it's like what RF said in the movie ... you don't listen to the numbers or the count ... you listen to your fellow players and adjust and compliment! ...oh btw ... that was 3 of them!

Considering that FZ was able to get so much music, and so much stuff that was different, I would say that he got the most out of many of them ... but I'm not sure that many of them are that special ... FZ got what he could afford and use. 

The main issue with drummers is ... the numbers game. I kinda think that some of them are just trying really hard to keep up with the music. And it gets harder when it goes all over the place!


Edited by moshkito - January 18 2024 at 09:51
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Zappastolethetowels View Drop Down
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Hi,
You will occasionally see me doing these Zappa threads for no reason other than I just love the man - he's my fav artist ever and no shame in that!

I love dissecting all his bands/musicians, but decided to look at the drummers. Why? Well, that lot looks to be a large aspect of his sound, and there are more than a few big names in there! Let's examine them! Feel free to put a short explanation for why you prefer this drummer over that. No Ruth here as I consider her a percussionist.

Let's Rank em... in ascending order

Black (1966-69) - a little sterile for me, but can hold a driving beat like nobody
Logeman (1980-81) (plays on You Are What... & Shut Up guitar set) - kinda average, but should of been given a greater opportunity to play
Tripp (1967-69) (2nd drummer & percussionist with the OG Mothers for the latter half of their existence) - very chamber school, avant oriented, but a better percussionist I must say
Guerin (plays on Hot Rats) - great jam drummer, but was not given enough time to shine 
Mundi (1966-67) (plays on Abs. Free & Money) - significant improvement from Jim Black, but his stubborn technique led to his ultimate ousting from the band 
Bozzio (1975-78) (no explanation necessary) - great, no doubt, but too rock-oriented with not enough control & flow to my liking
Wackerman (1981-88) (plays on every album from Witch through Jazz Noise) - underrated, took on Frank's 80s nuances to good extremes 
Humphrey (1973-74) (plays on Overnite, Apostrophe, & Roxy) - possibly the most proficient & accurate on the list, but sometimes has issues with holding my attention span )
Dunbar (1970-72) (flo & Eddie era, Waka, Wazoo) - underrated, very fluid & jazzy. Needs to be on top of everyone's drummers list!
Gordon (1972) (touring drummer for the Grand & Petit Wazoo bands; plays title track on Apostrophe) - his story notwithstanding, an incredible talent nonetheless. I hear some Bonham in his playing sometimes, ability to break between jazz & rock rhythms like no other! 
Thompson (1974-75) (plays on Roxy, One Size... & parts of Bongo Fury) - boy, is he great! Technicality through the roof and some funk at that
Vinnie (1978-80) (plays on Joe's..., Tinseltown & Shut Up guitar set) - amazing drummer: yes!! For everyone: no!! Bonzo, off-kilter, coordination like I've never seen! Best drummer for Frank's music hands down!! 
That immediately recognizable smack, fill, cymbal wash, another fill - unbelievable!

Give me yours...







 
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