Anything that can be digested through the ears is music.

At least, John Zorn thinks so.

Mike Patton agrees.

nice thread Assaf....  though I am not as wild and crazy and adventurous as you the RIO/Avant guys are...I have listened to a few in my RPI explorations. 


it is a very fine line.. one that exsits in the mind of each indidual listener...  and of the artist in question.  Music is art...  and we all interpret it differently.

another reason why prog talibans really piss me off...  take these albums..

DEMETRIO STRATOS

Concerto all'Elfo

1995 Live

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Review | Album details | All reviews | Buy Music Review by micky
[Special Collaborator Italian Prog and Art Rock Specialist]
Posted 10:06:19 AM EST, 7/1/2007

Demetrio Stratos is well known as the front man of the fiery Italian prog group Area. Outside of Area he released a series of solo albums. I picked this album up a couple of days ago on one of my search and destroy missions in Rome looking for RPI gems. I had recently really got the bug for Area and found this album and immediately scarfed it up. I was hoping to find a another incendiary mixing of jazz, rock, electronic, and mediterranean music. Whoa.. was I surprised when I put this in.

This review is a warning...yet still a recommendation.

As I found out later after an interesting first listen hahahha, and as is noted in Stratos' bio. He was student of Fluxus and John Cage. His solo albums are very avant and are explorations into the use of the human voice as an instrument. Be warned.. again... THIS IS NOT EASY LISTENING. But it a funny way.. this ties into RPI quite well. As I noted this morning in a thread, I am a non-speaker of Italian, so an overall portion of the albums is lost upon me. The literal meaning of what the group is trying to say. What that in fact has done has prepared me for an album like this. The voice in Italian prog for became not a vehicle for literal meaning but rather a instrument in itself. Full of emotion and expression like any instrument. That is exactly what Stratos was intending to explore.

To review this album track by track is sort of pointless. Before reviewing this I read some reviews of his solo album on other sites.. I was curious just how you would review something like this. Most reviews, while entertaining in their lofty language, really say little about the music. This is an album that to me is beyond a standard review, it is indeed like trying to 'review' a painting. What you get out of this will be highly personal. There are no instruments to rave over the quality.. no way to contrast the dynamics between the way the instruments play off of each other. This is just an experience between you and Stratos. If you feel like taking a walk down the Fluxus side of life. I strongly recommend you check this out. It intriqued me to check out other of his albums, which as some of you who know my musical tastes.. should probably say more about this album that any song by song analysis could.

Giving the album three stars..and down the road may adjust that to reflect what I think of his other albums. Which I will be checking out. For serious students of 'art' and avant music only.

Michael (aka micky)

FRANCO BATTIATO

L'Egitto Prima Delle Sabbie

1978 Studio Album

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Review | Album details | All reviews | Buy Music Review by micky
[Special Collaborator Italian Prog and Art Rock Specialist]
Posted 3:27:44 PM EST, 6/27/2007

Now before you read this review...please understand that I love the work of Franco Battiato. All phases of his creative explorations. As a musician and amateur painter in my youth I feel a kinship with an artist, and make no mistake Battiato is a musical artist and genius of the first order, and their desire to express themselves through their work. Sometimes art can connect with its audience... and sometimes it doesn't. The true mark of a connoisseur of art is appreciating the effort, even when the attempt leaves you baffled or colder than hell.

This album is probably the most notorious of Battiato's albums.. the most infamous in a string of albums that are hard for even fans of him to appreciate. During the late 70's, as I've noted in previous reviews, Battiato put out a series of albums that explored minimimalist compositions. I do say compositions with a bit of irony of course. Consider sonic experiments.. albums that were made not for the record buying public in mind, but for the sole purpose of expressing an artist's desire to push the boundaries.. both the public's and his own.

The album released in 1978 consists of two side longs. The self titled track takes up the first side. A typical listening experience can be summed up as the following....

00:01 nice intro.. an ascending run of 6 acoustic piano notes played fabulously by Antonio Ballista

00:07... again.. the same 6 notes

00:13 ...ahh....the same 6 notes

1:03... ahhhh... how much did I pay for this album... same 6 notes

1:30.. wonder what Raffaella is making for dinner?

2:09... damn she looks good in that dress

3:10 .. HAH!!!!! he only played FIVE notes that time

4:00... same six notes... the weather sure was beautiful today

4:57 wow.... two quick 6 note patterns

by the time you reach the 14:14 mark with the thunderous conclusion where the same 6 notes sections are split into two 3 notes parts. You are trembling with the release of dramatic tension.

Now we move the side two with...you guessed it.. another side long titled Sud Afternoon. Here we have two pianist trying to outdo each each other by how little they can play. Just kidding... there is more going on with this track. Variations on a root chord.. with long pauses between them. Slightly more interesting than side 1. The unofficial word from Raffaella as she sits on the couch... god this is terrible.. bah.. she's a metal-head. This is art hahaha. *kiss* Anyway.. no room for 'air' piano on this.

An easy album to review... I give it one star for the site. For fans.... I mean FANS of Battiato only. For myself.. again...I enjoy putting it on. If only to remember that if not for albums like this.. I might really think Genesis were boring hahha. 2 stars for me.

Michael (aka micky)

This is an interesting question. Personally I feel that Merzbow has a lot more artistic value than the stuff they play on MTV, which to some (or most?) people sounds more like music. However, not all noise is music. The thing that makes some noise music is that it's not just random noise, but a composed sequence of sounds that's designed to form a musical piece. Even if the piece was improvised or put together of seemingly random noise, the fact that the artist accepts it as a complete and finished work, makes it music and art. Or, from a commercial point of view, everything that's sold as music, is music.

Shakespeare wrote: Anything that can be digested through the ears is music. At least, John Zorn thinks so. Mike Patton agrees.

Edited by ghost_of_morphy - November 11 2007 at 10:49

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder to be sure.  Regarding harsh dissonance, there are times when I can appreciate it, and often I respect it and am interested in what it means intellectually.  But for pleasure listening I'll take more traditional melodic sound. 

It's like food.  Sure I'll try any new thing, and I can enjoy some weird stuff at the gourmet restaurant.  But for comfort food, Mom's spaghetti or stroganoff wins every time. 

ghost_of_morphy wrote: Shakespeare wrote: Anything that can be digested through the ears is music. At least, John Zorn thinks so. Mike Patton agrees.   As my old aesthethic professor would say, elements that occur naturally or randomly can provoke an aesthetic experience, but do not qualify as art (or in this case music) until they are arranged into some form of order.

Is disorder a form of order?

Everything that is disturbing or painful to the ears is noise.

Abstrakt wrote: Everything that is disturbing or painful to the ears is noise. To me, that's extreme Avant, Merzbow, Most Zeuhl and more...

ZEUHL!!?!?!?!?!?!

All (well, most...) Music, Painting, Sculpture, Architecture, Poetry, Prose, Dance, Theatric Performance, etc., is Art, but not all Art is Music, Painting, Poetry, or whatever. Some Art is created beyond any limits of specific techniques and aesthetics, and is usually made to strongly, painfully contradict all we have come (at a point) to think about them; this Art (whether it was Dada, Neo-Dada, Performance Art, New-Media Art, Anti-Art) was always impossible to be perceived and liked as Painting, Theatre, Poetry etc. by the people from the respective eras, though it was always drawing itself from them. We owe to these forms of intellectual courage a lot regarding creativity & renewal. It's an essential part of the cycle consisting of innovation -> masterpiece -> trend -> stagnation -> regression -> renewal. We may not like it, but it deserves a lot of respect. That's my answer to this topic. 

Edited by andu - November 11 2007 at 16:36

andu wrote: All (well, most...) Music, Painting, Sculpture, Architecture, Poetry, Prose, Dance, Theatric Performance, etc., is Art, but not all Art is Music, Painting, Poetry, or whatever. Some Art is created beyond any limits of specific techniques and aesthetics, and is usually made to strongly, painfully contradict all we have come (at a point) to think about them; this Art (whether it was Dada, Neo-Dada, Performance Art, New-Media Art, Anti-Art) was always impossible to be perceived and liked as Painting, Theatre, Poetry etc. by the people from the respective eras, though it was always drawing itself from them. We owe to these forms of intellectual courage a lot regarding creativity & renewal. It's an essential part of the cycle consisting of innovation -> masterpiece -> trend -> stagnation -> regression -> renewal. We may not like it, but it deserves a lot of respect. That's my answer to this topic.

and a good answer it is