Forum Home Forum Home > Progressive Music Lounges > Prog Bands, Artists and Genres Appreciation
  New Posts New Posts RSS Feed - Andrew Lloyd Webber and Tim Rice
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Events   Register Register  Login Login

Andrew Lloyd Webber and Tim Rice
 Post Reply Post Reply
Author
Message
  Topic Search Topic Search  Topic Options Topic Options
TheCrazyCloud View Drop Down
Forum Newbie
Forum Newbie
Avatar

Joined: January 18 2022
Location: Wales
Status: Offline
Points: 5 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TheCrazyCloud Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Andrew Lloyd Webber and Tim Rice
    Posted: January 18 2022 at 07:05
Looking to push other prog fans to listen to the two and only rock operas by Andrew Lloyd Webber and Tim rice. These being Jesus Christ superstar and Evita. Both are certainly prog,let be clear I'm talk about the original concept albums and not any form of stage adaptation. All of which are truly subpar and are missing large chucks of instrumentals among an enormous amount of other issues. the level of musical complexity particularly in Evita eclipse any prog I have ever heard, maybe some top end stuff like relayer, thick as a brick, or Passion play are near. But I really think it's a true tragedy that the majority of prog fans associate these albums with horrible and b*****dist stage performances. And I really do recommend everyone check them out.
Back to Top
Cristi View Drop Down
Special Collaborator
Special Collaborator
Avatar
Crossover / Prog Metal Teams

Joined: July 27 2006
Location: wonderland
Status: Offline
Points: 43584 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Cristi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 18 2022 at 07:08
Push us? 
No pushing!!!!!!!!!!!!  LOL

The original Jesus Christ Superstar, with Ian Gillan is great, I get back to it from time to time.

Evita - that I've never cared for. 
Back to Top
TheCrazyCloud View Drop Down
Forum Newbie
Forum Newbie
Avatar

Joined: January 18 2022
Location: Wales
Status: Offline
Points: 5 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TheCrazyCloud Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 18 2022 at 07:19
Have you checked out the original album of Evita ever? Cos the film and the stage shows are all terrible I can't believe how different they are. The bass and guitar work is insane, it feels like if gentle giant wrote an opera lol
Back to Top
Cristi View Drop Down
Special Collaborator
Special Collaborator
Avatar
Crossover / Prog Metal Teams

Joined: July 27 2006
Location: wonderland
Status: Offline
Points: 43584 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Cristi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 18 2022 at 07:34
^ can you post a listening link? 
Back to Top
Argo2112 View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: June 20 2017
Location: New Jersey
Status: Offline
Points: 4462 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Argo2112 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 18 2022 at 08:58
I'm a big ALW fan. Love JC Superstar, Evita, Joseph, Phantom....Great stuff. 
Even School of Rock was fun (Stick it to the Man!)  
Back to Top
suitkees View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: July 19 2020
Location: France
Status: Offline
Points: 9050 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote suitkees Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 18 2022 at 10:34
I'll push with you; I love their rock operas. Saw Jesus Christ Superstar at a West End performance in London, late 70s (I was still a kid). Somehow I always preferred the film score version, with Ted Neely a.o...

The razamataz is a pain in the bum
Back to Top
TheCrazyCloud View Drop Down
Forum Newbie
Forum Newbie
Avatar

Joined: January 18 2022
Location: Wales
Status: Offline
Points: 5 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TheCrazyCloud Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 18 2022 at 11:07
https://youtube.com/playlist?list=OLAK5uy_lt3WuWRr-egvfAYkN_-YDSikWV0gOlzbA
Back to Top
TheCrazyCloud View Drop Down
Forum Newbie
Forum Newbie
Avatar

Joined: January 18 2022
Location: Wales
Status: Offline
Points: 5 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TheCrazyCloud Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 18 2022 at 11:08
Push through to Eva and magaldi that's when it starts to heat up 🔥
Back to Top
richardh View Drop Down
Prog Reviewer
Prog Reviewer
Avatar

Joined: February 18 2004
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 27993 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote richardh Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 20 2022 at 00:34
Don't forget the Variations album that ALW put out in 1978 featuring the fusion band Colosseum II (Gary Moore , Don Airey etc) and Rod Argent as well as his brother. 
Back to Top
moshkito View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: January 04 2007
Location: Grok City
Status: Offline
Points: 17509 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote moshkito Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 20 2022 at 07:53
Hi,

I remember when these came out, and I kinda refused to see (and hear) JCS because the new tendency those days was to deny the fun and dope and say that they were a Christian now ... and the whole thing became a bad joke. I'll probably watch it someday, but I don't like worship things a lot, and always find them shmoozy and overly doped up on the idea. That's never been me.

I think what hurt EVITA, more than anything else, was that the person that kinda helped make it better known (Madonna) but it's hard to not think that the director was valuable since it was Alan Parker, who had already done MIDNIGHT EXPRESS, FAME, ANGEL HEART, MISSISSIPI BURNING, THE COMMITMENTS (not as good as the original English film btw!!!) was going to make it better, however, when I saw it, I thought it was a jumbled mess, and I ended up not listening to the music of the show itself because of it. My guess is that the film was too long, and it got so badly cut up to bring it to an audience that could not endure something for 2 hours, let alone more than that (W says 134 minutes). 

Our listening ability by that time, had already lost its ability to listen to longer pieces of music and more intelligent "concept" pieces around, though some still got out and became known as "progressive", but they were nowhere near the level of quality or creativity than things that had been around some 20 to 25 years earlier.

Just like PA ended up doing a definition and a top this and that, it became a place for fans to vote for their favorite albums, and listening to something from South Africa is rarely in the agenda, let alone something from Japan get a decent word on it, other than Damo's wonderful blog!

I'm not a person that has to see "the stars" ... I saw TD before it was super well known (1st time in first US tour), I saw PF before it was super well known (Hollywood Bowl 1972) and many other things. In general, the only things I wanted to see were Magma, Gong, Ange, Guru Guru, but the chances of these coming to America were very difficult, although Gong did (and lost money) and Magma did fairly well in their first 2 tours. 

As an example, I probably would not buy tickets for a performance of Evita if it was done locally, or in Seattle or in LA (unless it had either Mariah/Brittany or Lady Gaga in the lead? Something that won't happen because they don't need it, but a new strong voice would be nice, but betting on the more tantalizing side of the story, which even the movie had taken away (to save minutes) ... makes for a production that would be hurt so bad by all the cuts and the story getting ripped up ... and of course, it would not stand up to the daily folks that go see the hero films, unless there were some breasts to go see, even if slightly hidden, or suggested as many of those films! Heck a version with some nudity would probably be better received!

It's sad, bizarre. We called "TOMMY" a rock opera, and EVITA was a "rock opera" of sorts and yet, we don't seem to come to grips with the genre or its ideas and ways of performance. In general, the rock fans, do not have the sentiment to sit through an opera ... and you can imagine one of these fans immediately saying what a waste, if they went to see Wagner and how much "filler" and wasted space the opera had!!!!! ... and to me this is serious issue about folks not listening to music, regardless of it being EVITA or anything else.

At a different time, I think there would be more respect, and even some place like the MET might entertain showing it ... but because it doesn't have the "known" big names in music and opera, it will never be there, to attract a new audience ... I imagine they think it is a loser right from the choice at the start!
Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
www.pedrosena.com
Back to Top
suitkees View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: July 19 2020
Location: France
Status: Offline
Points: 9050 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote suitkees Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 20 2022 at 08:44
^ You can say a lot about JCS, but in my opinion it is definitely not a worship kind of thing...

Regarding Alan Parker's Evita, I actually quite liked the film, and even Madonna's role in it (maybe her best role ever, because I don't think she is such a great actress...). And I don't think she did hurt the reputation of the work - how could that be when it was such a box-office success. The critical reception was more ambivalent, probably also because the original work is such a masterpiece, and - I think also - because many of those critics had a prejudice against a "pop artist" interpreting this "highly valued artistic" piece of work.

The razamataz is a pain in the bum
Back to Top
Awesoreno View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: October 07 2019
Location: Culver City, CA
Status: Offline
Points: 3036 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Awesoreno Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 20 2022 at 22:50
Originally posted by TheCrazyCloud TheCrazyCloud wrote:

Looking to push other prog fans to listen to the two and only rock operas by Andrew Lloyd Webber and Tim rice. These being Jesus Christ superstar and Evita. Both are certainly prog,let be clear I'm talk about the original concept albums and not any form of stage adaptation. All of which are truly subpar and are missing large chucks of instrumentals among an enormous amount of other issues. the level of musical complexity particularly in Evita eclipse any prog I have ever heard, maybe some top end stuff like relayer, thick as a brick, or Passion play are near. But I really think it's a true tragedy that the majority of prog fans associate these albums with horrible and b*****dist stage performances. And I really do recommend everyone check them out.

Joseph and the Amazing Technicolor Dreamcoat is technically a rock opera and it is written by those two. So how can Evita and JCS be the only two?
Back to Top
Sean Trane View Drop Down
Special Collaborator
Special Collaborator

Prog Folk

Joined: April 29 2004
Location: Heart of Europe
Status: Offline
Points: 20240 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sean Trane Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 21 2022 at 02:57
Originally posted by Awesoreno Awesoreno wrote:

Originally posted by TheCrazyCloud TheCrazyCloud wrote:

Looking to push other prog fans to listen to the two and only rock operas by Andrew Lloyd Webber and Tim rice. These being Jesus Christ superstar and Evita. Both are certainly prog,let be clear I'm talk about the original concept albums and not any form of stage adaptation. All of which are truly subpar and are missing large chucks of instrumentals among an enormous amount of other issues. the level of musical complexity particularly in Evita eclipse any prog I have ever heard, maybe some top end stuff like relayer, thick as a brick, or Passion play are near. But I really think it's a true tragedy that the majority of prog fans associate these albums with horrible and b*****dist stage performances. And I really do recommend everyone check them out.

Joseph and the Amazing Technicolor Dreamcoat is technically a rock opera and it is written by those two. So how can Evita and JCS be the only two?


let alone The Who's Tommy or Quadrophenia, the most "proggy" ones.


But my fave "opera/musical" is Haïr from Rado, Ragni & McDermot

.
let's just stay above the moral melee
prefer the sink to the gutter
keep our sand-castle virtues
content to be a doer
as well as a thinker,
prefer lifting our pen
rather than un-sheath our sword
Back to Top
Awesoreno View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: October 07 2019
Location: Culver City, CA
Status: Offline
Points: 3036 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Awesoreno Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 21 2022 at 23:39
^Well I was referring to what OP said specifically. That JCS and Evita are the only two rock operas written by ALW and TR. But that isn't true.
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down



This page was generated in 0.133 seconds.
Donate monthly and keep PA fast-loading and ad-free forever.