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Borat, in all its fullness |
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Woon Deadn ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: March 30 2010 Location: P Status: Offline Points: 1017 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Posted: October 30 2020 at 15:58 |
I personally hated the first one, the same with the second movie. I hate pranks, in general. Here, to me, it becomes evident that there's a guy who thinks he's the smartest one and may be a judge, and I don't like that approach. I adore Chaplin's City Lights and Modern Times, considering them eternal, timeless and placeless masterpieces. But I simply see nothing fruitful in the likes of Borat. I don't like being uncomfortable myself and don't want to make any other people uncomfortable. To my mind, those victims that Borat made fun of in his movies, would not be anyhow teached, enlightened by that fact - yet they would obviously be angry at him. I can see how the ending of The City Lights may teach people something. What does Borat teach people? That the average American happens to be ignorant and poorly educated? Well, what a revelation! I am from the Eastern Europe, and believe me, an average Eastern European, especially the younger one, is no less ignorant than the American counterpart. Even the scandalous ending of Borat-2 featuring Mr. Giuliani... It lacks any sophistication. It's just a TV show trick where nothing is totally evident and the narrative is directed by the... well, the creators of the movie. As can be easily seen in the movie the faux-15-y.o. female journalist touches his knee in the beginning of the interview for a few seconds, then at the end she touches his belly and lower (and under) - is that appropriate for a 15 y.o. girl? Is that normal for a team of interviewers to let the interviewer touch such areas of the interviewed person? Shouldn't there be a technician to put the microphones in and out of the interviewee's body? Chaplin made it honest, didn't he? He honestly stood for things he stood for. Nowadays, it's all artificial. As far as I can get, for good example, Rupert Murdoch somehow stood behind the movie's production - if you sent him a girl like that with such a provocative behavior, what would he do?.. We will never know for he paid for the movie... And Mr. Giuliani didn't. Also, as a native Russian speaker and the former Soviet citizen, I feel uncomfortable on many VARIOUS levels, seeing that one of the former Soviet republic, Kazakhstan, is pictured a bit... a bit too much, a bit too often, just too... The fact that the girl actress is from Bulgaria, a Slavic country, the native village of the protagonist was filmed in Romania, a non-Slavic European country, and Kazakhstan is a central Asian, rather Turkic in many ways country, also adds to my dislike of this movie. Also, the very idea of filming gypsies in what they may afterwards perceive as mocking at them scenes... the last time it was Hitler who mocked at gypsies, you know... Other than that, fresh concepts, fresh ideas (at least in Borat I) - I agree. But, in all sincerety, there's a Japanese very rough female domination bdsm site Yapoo Market, with men eating female feces and all that stuff. In all sincerety, Yapoo Market are also fresh, but they do everything by consent, and they are not going to tell there are ethnicities or gender or whoever else who is inferior or superior. They are just looking for those Japanese (sic!) men who want to play their games and play their common games happily ever after. Although I'm not the biggest fan of Yapoo Market I think they win in the competition versus Borat's. In Borat there's a one-way teenage maximalism when you do not tell, explain, consult with the other side - you're just mocking at it because you are powerful enough to do that. It sounds like bullying. And you won't teach anyone anything new, then it's a journalism, where's the art then? The art where you look at the picture and see something new and get into something new. Borat do not change anyone's way - everybody will have his/her views unchanged after watching the movie! Now, that's my view. Edited by Woon Deadn - October 30 2020 at 16:02 |
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lazland ![]() Prog Reviewer ![]() ![]() Joined: October 28 2008 Location: Wales Status: Offline Points: 13795 |
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I don’t find him particularly funny. He used to do a parody chat show here in the UK, and turned the late Tony Benn over by pretending to be a serious political journalist, but spent the entire time basically taking the piss. He got into a Royal birthday party by pretending to be some kind of foreign dignitary.
There is nothing intrinsically wrong with parodies of cultures. My objection to him is quite simply that he is an unfunny tosspot.
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Woon Deadn ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: March 30 2010 Location: P Status: Offline Points: 1017 |
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To me he is definitely unfunny, too. But I also think that he may be a professional journalist, reporter, columnist, interviewer - yet not a professional man of art, not a professional movie creator. I also think that it's unprofessional not to make things look real in the least. His trademark Yakshemash greeting is obviously Polish "Jak sie masz?" (How are you doing?), the actress is obviously Slavic, the filmed locations are settled by gypsies in the European country of Romania, there's nothing even remotely resembling the Turkic Asian nation of Kazakhstan. If Monty Python or Benny Hill or whoever else parodied the cultures they at least tried to use the stereotypical view of the nation. Here, unsurprisingly, nobody knows anything about Kazakhstan. Perhaps the authors of the movie could do some few-clicks research on the Net to find out something really domestic to real Kazakhstan. Because, well, gypsies are not your usual Kazakh people. The Kazakhs are Asian-looking, Japanese-alike-looking, if you like. Also, there's a high percentage of Slavs in Kazakhstan, from the Soviet and Russian Empire times. Kazakhs, for all I know, never had ANY relations, any concerns about Jews, at all! Quite like Chinese or Japanese. Their paths simply never crossed. Instead, the movie makes an Arabic nation out of people living next to China... Plus to that, Kazakhstan is going to change its alphabet from the Soviet times' Cyrillic one to the Latin one, the creators of the movie do not even know it, it seems... The movie portrays very vague stereotypes, mixing a lot of absolutely different terms in one pot. I understand that the movie probably laughs at the American... well, at the American. But it rather looks like a TV comedy show, or a journalist work. I feel no art in it, at all. It's not a surrealism, nor a half-real style of art, it's quite series of TV interviews with interludes, intersections, TV anti-ads (against Trump team). As a kind of journalism meets pranking, it sure looks professionally made. Where's the art? As the sort of PS, here are two famous Kazakhs, both famous Russian comedians. Nobody of them have any possible concerns about Jews, as Jews and Chinese never met in the whole human history, at all: Edited by Woon Deadn - October 31 2020 at 06:18 |
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BaldFriede ![]() Prog Reviewer ![]() ![]() Joined: June 02 2005 Location: Germany Status: Offline Points: 10266 |
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I am not into that kind of humour at all; I consider it to be not even childish. Children do at least have intelligence.
Edited by BaldFriede - October 30 2020 at 17:25 |
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Woon Deadn ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: March 30 2010 Location: P Status: Offline Points: 1017 |
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Originally I thought my nationality/belonging did not let me enjoy this comedy. Now, judging by the number of views, I see it is rather the level of intellect, probably. The higher it is - the worse is the perception of Borat. It looks like.
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A Crimson Mellotron ![]() Prog Reviewer ![]() ![]() Joined: September 10 2020 Location: Sofia, Bulgaria Status: Offline Points: 5690 |
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First one is genius, the second one is, expectedly, weaker and less original. Also, I expected anything but a Borat post here.
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Woon Deadn ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: March 30 2010 Location: P Status: Offline Points: 1017 |
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^General Discussions are so generous. And so generally unexpected!!
Edited by Woon Deadn - November 17 2020 at 14:02 |
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Mind_Drive ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: September 06 2009 Location: Germany Status: Offline Points: 389 |
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Borat exposing the pedophile hollywood elites (at minute 3:30):
...nowadays, only through comedy you can speak truth in public.. |
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It's just a ride... <3
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dr wu23 ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: August 22 2010 Location: Indiana Status: Offline Points: 20660 |
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Never seen either film though of course have seen clips and know of his style of humor.
To me it's obvious slapstick prankster stuff and not particularly well done imo. It's easy to pretend and make fun of others in life and the way people are is complicated; so his 'comedic attacks' are often unwarranted and unfair imo. It would be interesting to see someone prank him and film it...to see how he would react. ...his background,...https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sacha_Baron_Cohen |
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One does nothing yet nothing is left undone.
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Woon Deadn ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: March 30 2010 Location: P Status: Offline Points: 1017 |
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I certainly am not going to express anybody's view but mine.
To me, Borat represents the very western and very modern way of making art. To me, it is not art anymore. I can't say I don't like western art. As I already told more than once, Chaplin's City Lights and Modern Times are my favourite black-and-white movies. Sure, painters like Monet or Manet or Van Gogh, and all those classics of literature and music - I have no problems with them. Still, at some point in, you know, sixties or what, the west came further on. Me, I was born in the USSR in 1983, my parents in 1952. We didn't. The whole idea of, say it, talk shows with the audience engaged in discussing things like geopolitics where they do not have the leastest idea of what they are talking about (the host and the cameramen included)... Comedy shows expanding the boundaries of sanity... Music videos, mostly stupid thru very stupid. Borat lacks depth, to me. Pedophiles among elite? Perhaps, I didn't witness, so I can't approve. Powerful people are looking for new impressions, new sensations in their lives. They are overfed with women and men. Why can't it be true? But the impact, the effect of the Borat's exposure is close to nil, actually. What 99% of his watchers saw was that he forced the TV host to get naked. What should that imply? Is there any concept behind that? It is not clear. But he can do it, so he does. Feels like a bully's credo. Then, I don't understand Yes - and people like them. A matter of taste - no more, no less.
Edited by Woon Deadn - November 19 2020 at 12:16 |
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Woon Deadn ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: March 30 2010 Location: P Status: Offline Points: 1017 |
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I may be too strict on this, but I think that the parody should always reflect bits of truth. Borat or his screenwriters found that there's a country ending in -stan and that its language uses Cyrillic script. That was practically all they have found on the topic. If it's -stan (so they supposed) it must be like Afghanistan or Pakistan - which implies poor ordinary Arabs hating Jews. Fine, but totally incorrect. Cyrillic script as used in Kazakh language has several different letters not found in Russian language. Cyrillic fake Kazakh in the movie massively uses Russian words and plain Russian alphabet. So, it's then becoming a kind of satire at the whole post-Soviet space... Then it fails - at least for us. Because we, the inhabitants of post-Soviet space, see numerous mistakes in depicting our reality, and do not then see any constructive paradigm behind the movie's depiction of Americans. Americans... well, they are like Russians - they think their country is the Third Rome (Russians think the same about Russia, btw), so why bother with learning of what's really what in the rest of the world. And so? What is constructive in showing the ignorance of Americans? The victims got angry, the comedian made fun - what's constructive in the whole mess? |
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