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micky 
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: October 02 2005
Location: .
Status: Offline
Points: 46838
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 Posted: July 07 2009 at 20:53 |
 jammun wrote:
micky wrote:
Old news... but I do love hypocrites... and the GOP gives us SO DAMN many of them.
enjoy... hopefully she was worth your career idiot...
"and in I Corinthians 13 it simply says that, “ Love is patient and kind, love is not jealous or boastful, it is not arrogant or rude, Love does not insist on its own way, it is not irritable or resentful, it does not rejoice in the wrong, but rejoices in the right, Love bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things and endures all things”.
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I do love the way the family values guys just can't stop quoting The Bible...even when conversing with the mistress.
And the Gov just might want to check with Steve McNair how that mistress thing worked out.
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yeah... but I give the governor enough credit to have higher standards than a psycho 20 year old professional choke and puke waitress. whoa. Goes to show what happens when men don't think with the right body part. and speaking of not thinking at all... leave it to our GOP friends... who go to show again. They WANT to be out of power for the foreseeable future. No problem there.. they simply don't think and haven't thought about substance over style.. and would put THAT.. quitter....in the White House. Newsflash.. you can't walk out of the White House when things get tough. WASHINGTON (CNN) — It was a stunning announcement that caught many across the country completely by surprise.
Now, four days after Sarah Palin announced that she will step down
later this month as governor of Alaska, a new national poll by USA
Today/Gallup indicates that seven in 10 Americans say Palin's decision
had no affect on their opinion of her.
The survey also suggests a wide partisan split over whether
respondents would likely vote for Palin if she decides to run for the
White House in 2012. More than seven in 10 Republicans said they would
be likely to vote for Palin for the presidency. That number drops to 34
percent among independents
Edited by micky - July 07 2009 at 20:56
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The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip
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MovingPictures07
Prog Reviewer
Joined: January 09 2008
Location: Beasty Heart
Status: Offline
Points: 32181
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Posted: July 07 2009 at 21:05 |
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I consider myself pretty conservative and libertarian (though don't like to associate myself with either label often), but I'd really rather Palin not run for the presidency.
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Henry Plainview
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 26 2008
Location: Declined
Status: Offline
Points: 16715
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Posted: July 07 2009 at 21:10 |
JJ, the deficit matters because China isn't going to subsidize us by buying bonds forever. If countries no longer want to buy our debt, we either have to make up for the gap by printing more money or just default. Neither one is a good idea, even though Argentina is still standing.
Palin running would be extremely entertaining. Palin winning the primaries is another matter.
Edited by Henry Plainview - July 07 2009 at 21:11
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if you own a sodastream i hate you
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JJLehto
Prog Reviewer
Joined: April 05 2006
Location: Tallahassee, FL
Status: Offline
Points: 34550
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Posted: July 07 2009 at 21:11 |
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7 in 10 Republicans would like to see her run....that number drops to 34% among independents.
And among Democrats I'm guessing that number is very close to 0.
Hence, why she would have NO chance of winning the Presidential Election
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micky
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: October 02 2005
Location: .
Status: Offline
Points: 46838
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Posted: July 07 2009 at 21:16 |
MovingPictures07 wrote:
I consider myself pretty conservative and libertarian (though don't like to associate myself with either label often), but I'd really rather Palin not run for the presidency.
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oh she'll run for sure... unless you believe the bullsh*t about quitting as governor because of being concerned about the welfare of her state and drain on state money ( travel expenses anyone?... that she was forced to repay  ). She knows what all politicos know.. it is impossible to raise the type of money she would need and remain the full time governor of a far removed state like Alaska. she'll run... but unless the GOP has REALLY got stupid.. she'll never get the nomination. That is my fantasy dream... but I've used my lifetime supply of having my fantasies come true to life hahah 
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The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip
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micky
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: October 02 2005
Location: .
Status: Offline
Points: 46838
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Posted: July 07 2009 at 21:18 |
JJLehto wrote:
7 in 10 Republicans would like to see her run....that number drops to 34% among independents.
And among Democrats I'm guessing that number is very close to 0.
Hence, why she would have NO chance of winning the Presidential Election
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I think it was in the single digits Thatmuch is obvious that is why I didn't paste it. The interesting thing are the two numbers.. .that 7 in 10 would vote for her on the right, and that 2 in 3 in the vast middle wouldn't. That is a political deathwish. That is where elections are won and lost.
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The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip
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JJLehto
Prog Reviewer
Joined: April 05 2006
Location: Tallahassee, FL
Status: Offline
Points: 34550
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Posted: July 07 2009 at 21:24 |
micky wrote:
JJLehto wrote:
7 in 10 Republicans would like to see her run....that number drops to 34% among independents.
And among Democrats I'm guessing that number is very close to 0.
Hence, why she would have NO chance of winning the Presidential Election
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I think it was in the single digits Thatmuch is obvious that is why I didn't paste it. The interesting thing are the two numbers.. .that 7 in 10 would vote for her on the right, and that 2 in 3 in the vast middle wouldn't. That is a political deathwish. That is where elections are won and lost.
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Oh yeah. I forget the number, (and im sure it varies) but I thought generally 43% of people, on the left and right. Are steadfast voters. So it's that 14% in the middle that is the battle. Hence why politicians run to the left/right in primaries and then towards the center in an election. I agree Micky. The Reps are not that stupid....but I hope to GOD she gets the nom. It would really be their death.
Edited by JJLehto - July 07 2009 at 21:24
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Henry Plainview
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 26 2008
Location: Declined
Status: Offline
Points: 16715
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Posted: July 07 2009 at 21:29 |
You also have to remember JJ, it was Dick Cheney who first said that the deficit doesn't matter, and you don't want to agree with him, do you? ;-)
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if you own a sodastream i hate you
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JJLehto
Prog Reviewer
Joined: April 05 2006
Location: Tallahassee, FL
Status: Offline
Points: 34550
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Posted: July 07 2009 at 21:36 |
Henry Plainview wrote:
You also have to remember JJ, it was Dick Cheney who first said that the deficit doesn't matter, and you don't want to agree with him, do you? ;-) |
It may not seem it.....but Im no political partisan here. If I ever agreed with Dick, or Rush on Ron Paul about something, (cold day in hell though!) I could admit it. And I read what you said about the deficit and China. But to be fair, wouldn't we want countries to stop buying our debt? We keep moaning about it. Besides, maybe then we'd stop running it up. And does the deficit have an actual impact on the US economy?
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Henry Plainview
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 26 2008
Location: Declined
Status: Offline
Points: 16715
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Posted: July 07 2009 at 21:51 |
We don't want them to stop because then we would have to stop spending beyond our means. ;-)
As far as I can remember, the deficit is dangerous because it can lead to inflation and the crowding out of private investment. At its current level, it doesn't do a lot besides cause a headache in Congress, but if the yearly deficit was 100% of GDP, or if the backlog gets too large, we'd have a problem.
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if you own a sodastream i hate you
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JJLehto
Prog Reviewer
Joined: April 05 2006
Location: Tallahassee, FL
Status: Offline
Points: 34550
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Posted: July 07 2009 at 22:02 |
Henry Plainview wrote:
We don't want them to stop because then we would have to stop spending beyond our means. ;-)
As far as I can remember, the deficit is dangerous because it can lead to inflation and the crowding out of private investment. At its current level, it doesn't do a lot besides cause a headache in Congress, but if the yearly deficit was 100% of GDP, or if the backlog gets too large, we'd have a problem. |
Well see that's the reality. But us here, we're not politicians. That's why I can "SCREW THE FEDERAL DEFICIT!" But you say it's not that bad at its current level. Has the debt ever been 100% of the yearly GDP?
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Henry Plainview
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 26 2008
Location: Declined
Status: Offline
Points: 16715
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Posted: July 07 2009 at 22:08 |
Only during WW2, our debt seems so high because it's a percentage of our f**k-awesome GDP. I believe Italy and some south american countries have had problems with the deficit going about 100% and staying there, but I can't quite remember and I'm too lazy to look it up. But Wikipedia made a nice graph for us, the gross debt is more important because it includes social security and stuff.
Edited by Henry Plainview - July 07 2009 at 22:08
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if you own a sodastream i hate you
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IVNORD
Forum Senior Member
Joined: December 13 2006
Location: USA
Status: Offline
Points: 1191
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Posted: July 07 2009 at 22:08 |
I am sorry but I was genuinely shocked. We've been discussing it for weeks and you didn't say you didn't know that...
Anyway, let me try to explain it in simple terms. Deficit is debt. To borrow you need a lender. Other countries buy our bonds and t-bills (our debt) and thus lend us money. We pay them interest. Today it amounts to $200-$300 billion a year, I don't know how much exactly, but these payments grow along with our borrowing. To pay the interest we have to collect taxes or borrow again if tax revenues are insufficient. If we keep on borrowing we will come to a point when the debt becomes unsustainable, i.e. we can't repay it. When our lenders figures it out, they will stop lending to us. Then the only way to pay for everything will be printing money. The Fed is doing it all the time, but if it couldn't borrow the printing will be huge. When there is too much paper money inflation is inevitable. The more money the higher inflation. If you pay $15 for a CD today, and tomorrow it costs $20, in in a week it costs $50, how would you feel? The lack of fiscal stability ruins the economy. A good example of a financial mess is Zimbabwe where inlation runs at the tune of 2,000,000% annually.
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IVNORD
Forum Senior Member
Joined: December 13 2006
Location: USA
Status: Offline
Points: 1191
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Posted: July 07 2009 at 22:14 |
Henry Plainview wrote:
JJ, the deficit matters because China isn't going to subsidize us by buying bonds forever. If countries no longer want to buy our debt, we either have to make up for the gap by printing more money or just default. Neither one is a good idea, even though Argentina is still standing.
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Agentina's inflation was over 1,000% in the early 80s. Argentina went through a series of devaluations, new currency pegged to the US dollar, defaults, new governments. But they always had a lender. The US can't default. It would be the end of the world.
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JJLehto
Prog Reviewer
Joined: April 05 2006
Location: Tallahassee, FL
Status: Offline
Points: 34550
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Posted: July 07 2009 at 22:21 |
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Yea, I knew about Arengtina and devaluing their currency.
I forgot about that actually.
I don't know if we have to worry, at least anytime soon about having our debt be at 100% of the GDP, and staying there. Or having like 1,000,000 % inflation. Only examples I know of that were after wars/in very poor countries.
And sorry to get you riled up....but honestly this is more a debate for the sake of it...
Obviously I don't want to see a massive skyrocketing debt.
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IVNORD
Forum Senior Member
Joined: December 13 2006
Location: USA
Status: Offline
Points: 1191
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Posted: July 07 2009 at 22:23 |
Henry Plainview wrote:
We don't want them to stop because then we would have to stop spending beyond our means. ;-)
As far as I can remember, the deficit is dangerous because it can lead to inflation and the crowding out of private investment. At its current level, it doesn't do a lot besides cause a headache in Congress, but if the yearly deficit was 100% of GDP, or if the backlog gets too large, we'd have a problem. |
30 years ago you could buy a pack of cigarettes for 50 cents. Today it costs $7? $8? i don't know, I don't smoke for over 20 years. TYhat's inflation. I wouldnt' say the deficit had nothing to do with it.
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IVNORD
Forum Senior Member
Joined: December 13 2006
Location: USA
Status: Offline
Points: 1191
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Posted: July 07 2009 at 22:32 |
JJLehto wrote:
Yea, I knew about Arengtina and devaluing their currency.
I forgot about that actually.
I don't know if we have to worry, at least anytime soon about having our debt be at 100% of the GDP, and staying there. Or having like 1,000,000 % inflation. Only examples I know of that were after wars/in very poor countries.
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Don't you think we ARE fightiing 2 wars? If not for the wars Bush could have had his budget pretty close to balanced.
It's not only a matter of haveing it at 100% of gdp but how soon it gets there. When the gdp shrinks (as it is the case now ) the process accelerates
PS. Inflation in Zimbabwe is 200,000,000%, my mistake
Edited by IVNORD - July 07 2009 at 22:36
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JJLehto
Prog Reviewer
Joined: April 05 2006
Location: Tallahassee, FL
Status: Offline
Points: 34550
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Posted: July 07 2009 at 22:38 |
IVNORD wrote:
JJLehto wrote:
Yea, I knew about Arengtina and devaluing their currency.
I forgot about that actually.
I don't know if we have to worry, at least anytime soon about having our debt be at 100% of the GDP, and staying there. Or having like 1,000,000 % inflation. Only examples I know of that were after wars/in very poor countries.
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Don't you think we ARE in 2 wars? If not for the wars Bush could have had his budget pretty close to balanced.
It's not only a matter of haveing it at 100% of gdp but how soon it gets there. When the gdp shrinks (as it is the case now ) the process accelerates |
Oh absolutely. But again, we are the largest economy in the world. We are not like Zimbabwe were a major war will TOTALLY wreck the economy. As for you cigarette example...part of that drastic rise in price is inflation...but also there are alot of taxes on cigarettes. They really could be priced lower than they are. And like I said, I'm not saying "Yeah lets quadruple the national debt!" Maybe Im a little naive on the topic, but this area is not my strong point. I've only had one general econ class.
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Slartibartfast
Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator / In Memoriam
Joined: April 29 2006
Location: Atlantais
Status: Offline
Points: 29630
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Posted: July 07 2009 at 22:41 |
IVNORD wrote:
PS. Inflation in Zimbabwe is 200,000,000%, my mistake |
WRONG!!! Inflation in Zimbabwe is 200,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000.1%.  I've heard they are all moving to Algon (where an ordinary cup of drinking chocolate costs £8.000.000.000)...
Edited by Slartibartfast - July 07 2009 at 22:45
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Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened... 
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IVNORD
Forum Senior Member
Joined: December 13 2006
Location: USA
Status: Offline
Points: 1191
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Posted: July 07 2009 at 22:53 |
JJLehto wrote:
IVNORD wrote:
JJLehto wrote:
Yea, I knew about Arengtina and devaluing their currency.
I forgot about that actually.
I don't know if we have to worry, at least anytime soon about having our debt be at 100% of the GDP, and staying there. Or having like 1,000,000 % inflation. Only examples I know of that were after wars/in very poor countries.
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Don't you think we ARE in 2 wars? If not for the wars Bush could have had his budget pretty close to balanced.
It's not only a matter of haveing it at 100% of gdp but how soon it gets there. When the gdp shrinks (as it is the case now ) the process accelerates |
Oh absolutely. But again, we are the largest economy in the world. We are not like Zimbabwe were a major war will TOTALLY wreck the economy.
As for you cigarette example...part of that drastic rise in price is inflation...but also there are alot of taxes on cigarettes. They really could be priced lower than they are.
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THe reason does not matter. People pay $7 for cigarettes. That's what counts.
As for the cigarette taxes.... my wife, a lifelong Democrat, was very much impressed with Clinton's anti-smoking taxation policies until I explained to her that a $2 tax hike wouldn't do the trick, people will continue smoking. If you really want to reduce smoking tax it at $500 a pack. That will do it. But they don't really want people to stop smoking, they wanted to increase revenues. That was a nice trick, another Clinton's illusion. But he managed to "balance" the budget.
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