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JrKASperov 
Forum Senior Member
Joined: July 07 2004
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Points: 904
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 Posted: November 29 2006 at 14:12 |
 Trademark wrote:
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In other words, slaves are to be freed on the 50th year, except for Hebrew slaves, who are to be released on the 7th.
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Epic.
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Trademark
Forum Senior Member
Joined: November 21 2006
Location: oHIo
Status: Offline
Points: 1009
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Posted: November 29 2006 at 14:16 |
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Exactly right, not really fair, but that's how they did it.
It was my feeling that the slavery issues under discussion in this thread were more of the "non-hebrew" type. I should have clarified that point.
Edited by Trademark - November 29 2006 at 14:18
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Ivan_Melgar_M
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: April 27 2004
Location: Peru
Status: Offline
Points: 19557
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Posted: November 29 2006 at 14:29 |
jalas wrote:
This is what I get for arguing with a lawyer. Why did I even bother? Ivan, I know you are a master at the art of spin because you are a lawyer, but you fail to see that you are attacking me about things that don't even really matter to people like you.
Well, I'm not spinning the truth, just quoting facts and not because I'm not a Socialist doesn't means I don't care for social injustice, it's only that I don't believe in a system that has proved until know being flawed.
don't think that I don't know what I am talking about because I do read books and I do find out as much as I can from both sides of the issue. I watch the news in this country which is extremely bias and I read books by Zinn and Chomsky which are extremely bias also and the middle ground that I found is where I stand now. All I want is compromise and people like you are always making it difficult.
Jalas, you started attacking without real knowledge the country that gave your father assylum.
I would have the same opinion about a person who is son of a refugee in a communist country and attacks them, because it's unfair, they received your family when you required it so the less you have to do is to be humble and thank them.
you know, that in theory, democracy works.
It works, there are countries with an impeccable record of democracy, each time a President ended his period was replaced or reelected depemnding in the Constitution.
You also know, that in theory, socialism would work.
Until now it's only a theory never has worked so why should it work?
Alone, each is very much in danger of being corrupted. Together, they can keep each other in check. I don't see what is so bad about thinking this way. I don't know why you have to take your anger out on me.
The one who expressed anger against everything are you, you hate democracy, freedom of speech, people who have more because they worked more.
But you use a democratic system to express your disagreements against the country that received your family, that's unfair.
Also, the Bible does talk about slavery, but there was a special day every couple of years where all the slaves were released. Also, slavery was different. They were not put in chains and forced to work for other people. They voluntarily became slaves because they needed food and money.
Sorry, that's wrong, if an Hebrew had an Hebrew slave (Yes they had slaves from their own race) they had to receive their freedom in six years and if the slave was a foreigner he received the freedom after a much longer freedom.
But that's not the point Jalas, I was talking about perspective of history in time, what was correct in the Old Testament days was probably incorrect in Lincoln's days and what was correct in Lincolns's days (Hey the pseudo scientists Phrenologists said black people and women had less intelligence than white Caucasian men) is absolutely wrong today.
You can't judge a society without a perspective of their time and culture, still today I find barbaric acts in the mountains of Perú and in some African tribes
It's funny that all the people that attack me are either Ivan the lawyer or Americans. This is what I have to deal with everyday.
Then don't attack, try to be fair, I disagree with a lot of things USA does, my first post in his thread was to disagree with the damn wall but I don't tollerate that our disagreement is used as an excuse to make propaganda of things I also find wrong.
Iván |
BTW JRKAsperov: Yes the term of freedom was the seventh year, but only if the slave was a Hebrew, if he was a foreigner he/she had to wait until the 50th year.
The rules were different for Hebrews and non hebrews
| If thou buy an Hebrew servant, six years he shall serve: and in the seventh he shall go out free for nothing. Exodus 21:1 |
The rule that applied for non Hebrews was in Leviticus 25:10:
| 10 And ye shall hallow the fiftieth year, and proclaim liberty throughout all the land unto all the inhabitants thereof: it shall be a jubile unto you; and ye shall return every man unto his possession, and ye shall return every man unto his family. |
Edited by Ivan_Melgar_M - November 29 2006 at 21:12
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Sasquamo
Forum Senior Member
Joined: September 26 2006
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 828
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Posted: November 29 2006 at 16:27 |
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So jalas, if democracy doesn't work, give me a real life example of a type of government that does work.
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OpethGuitarist
Prog Reviewer
Joined: June 25 2006
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 1655
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Posted: November 29 2006 at 17:06 |
Every day I grow more respect for Ivan's wisdom. Thanks for your thoughtful posts Ivan 
Edited by OpethGuitarist - November 29 2006 at 17:06
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back from the dead, i will begin posting reviews again and musing through the forums
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Arrrghus
Forum Senior Member
Joined: July 21 2006
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 5296
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Posted: November 29 2006 at 21:06 |
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jalas
Forum Senior Member
Joined: September 07 2006
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 283
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Posted: November 30 2006 at 12:46 |
Sasquamo wrote:
So jalas, if democracy doesn't work, give me a real life example of a type of government that does work. |
There is no government that works. Government is created and run by humans. Humans make mistakes and we can't just sit back and accept any decision that governments make. we can't because nationalists and be all patriotic about our countries. Thats where the leaders get their control. That is why Hitler was so successful. He got almost everyone in Germany to believe that the Jews were a problem so when the Jews were being persecuted and put into ghettos, few said anything of the inhumanity.
Ivan, could you please stop putting words in my mouth? I accept that socialism doesn't completely work and just because I say that democracy doesn't always work doesn't mean I hate it. It is just that in the wrong hands, as it is always in, it is easily corruptible. In the US, people don't have much to complain about, but to keep the country stable, many people have to be exploited or killed in this country and in other parts of the world. I don't want to stop and start praising my country. It's not about me. IT's about all the victims of US policy. Everyone has a right to be happy, and I know that not everyone will ever be happy, but There are too many people who are unneccessarily unhappy.
I am not a militant person. I am just asking for a compromise. You have to be willing to see things from my point of view before you say anything else. I have to be exposed to your point of view all the time. Not from you directly, but from CNN and Fox News ( the trusted names in news in America. [ha]). I don't think their is a wrong side. ON one side is anyone who believes in democracy. The best part about democracy is the freedom to make as much money as you can. I don't have a problem with that as long as no one gets hurt. On the other side, we have socialists who think that money should be distributed for the common good. socialism is just for people who don't have money as a priority. It doesn't make it work. Democracy can work better because of all the money that the government allows its real leaders (businessmen) to make. There is enough money to make a middle class that will not complain as much and as long as everyone has all the luxuries that they want, everything will be ok. Human have lived without TV, AC, video games, cell phones, computers, and MP3 players for so long and the companies are making it so that these become neccessities. THat is where the corruption is in democracy: mind control, just like socialism, except a lot more comfortable.
I have thought about it for a while now, and since global warming is very real, I guess I'll just move to Canada.
Edited by jalas - November 30 2006 at 12:48
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JOIN THE COMMUNIST PARTY!
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Forgotten Son
Forum Senior Member
Joined: March 13 2005
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 1356
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Posted: November 30 2006 at 12:57 |
Ivan, I did spend a huge amount of time replying to you response in detail, but, frustratingly, my post was lost when I hit the "post reply" button.  I will do my best to sum up my views on this matter succinctly, instead. I in no way advocate or excuse Soviet or Cuban crimes, they are indeed terrible, but the US has a far worse history of aggression and state-sponsored terrorism than both of them put together. The US may have done a lot of good in the world, particularly around the Second World War in defeating the Nazis and deterring Stalinist Russia, however the vast majority of US foreign policy is undertaken for the benefits of America's ruling class. Millions of people have died as the cost of furthering US global interests. The idea that the US loves democracy is absurd, it has frequently suppressed populist movements and replaced them with oppressive regimes after devastating the country in question eg Haiti. It has even gone as far as supporting genocide to follow it's interests. I cannot sit by uncritical, buying into all the propoganda issued forth by a state so destructive and hypocritical, even if it did help defeat great threats in the past.
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OpethGuitarist
Prog Reviewer
Joined: June 25 2006
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 1655
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Posted: November 30 2006 at 12:59 |
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The only person who controls my mind is myself.
Companies are very good at persuasion, but they control no minds, and neither do any goverment.
Compelling arguments persuade people, but mind control assumes that you have basically tortured someone into a predictable response. On one hand you are saying the govt controls minds, yet on the other you say you are a free spirit. Are you saying that you are somehow better than everyone and have not fallen into some sort of mind control trap?
No one controls my mind, and no one controls yours. We have choice. Sometimes those choices may be bleak, but we all have control of our thoughts.
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back from the dead, i will begin posting reviews again and musing through the forums
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Trademark
Forum Senior Member
Joined: November 21 2006
Location: oHIo
Status: Offline
Points: 1009
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Posted: November 30 2006 at 14:45 |
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jalas,
If you need help packing, just let me know.
Edited by Trademark - November 30 2006 at 14:47
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JrKASperov
Forum Senior Member
Joined: July 07 2004
Status: Offline
Points: 904
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Posted: November 30 2006 at 15:44 |
OpethGuitarist wrote:
Companies are very good at persuasion, but they control no minds, and neither do any goverment.
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Yeah right, tell that to the two parties that everyone votes for. Ever watched one of their congresses? It's like a god's on stage, that's how mad those people are.
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Epic.
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OpethGuitarist
Prog Reviewer
Joined: June 25 2006
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 1655
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Posted: November 30 2006 at 15:50 |
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I don't vote Democratic or Republican usually, and I'm certainly not forced to vote for either. The style of govt (majority wins) sets itself up to be a dual party system. That's not controlling my mind, that's an explanation for the kind of government the US has.
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back from the dead, i will begin posting reviews again and musing through the forums
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Syzygy
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: December 16 2004
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 7003
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Posted: November 30 2006 at 15:55 |
Ivan_Melgar_M wrote:
This is Socialism:
- The right to determine matters concerning administration and law belongs only to the citizen. Therefore we demand that every public office, of any sort whatsoever, whether in the nation (*), the county or municipality, be filled only by citizens. We combat the corrupting parliamentary economy, office-holding only according to party inclinations without consideration of character or abilities.
- All citizens must have equal rights and obligations.
- The first obligation of every citizen must be to work both spiritually and physically. The activity of individuals is not to counteract the interests of the universality, but must have its result within the framework of the whole for the benefit of all.
- Abolition of unearned (work and labour) incomes. Breaking of rent-slavery
- In consideration of the monstrous sacrifice in property and blood that each war demands of the people personal enrichment through a war must be designated as a crime against the people. Therefore we demand the total confiscation of all war profits.
- We demand the nationalisation of all (previous) associated industries (trusts).
- We demand a division of profits of all heavy industries.
- We demand an expansion on a large scale of old age welfare.
- We demand the creation of a healthy middle class and its conservation, immediate communalization of the great warehouses and their being leased at low cost to small firms, the utmost consideration of all small firms in contracts with the State, county or municipality.
- We demand a land reform suitable to our needs, provision of a law for the free expropriation of land for the purposes of public utility, abolition of taxes on land and prevention of all speculation in land.
- The State is to care for the elevating national health by protecting the mother and child, by outlawing child-labor, by the encouragement of physical fitness, by means of the legal establishment of a gymnastic and sport obligation, by the utmost support of all organizations concerned with the physical instruction of the young.
- We demand abolition of the mercenary troops and formation of a national army.
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Very nice...very advanced...very proletarian.
You know who wrote it?
Adolf Hitler - Mein Kampf - The 25 point Program of the Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei (NSDAP)
The first time I read it I laughed when Socialistrs in the University called all of us who were fro the centre or moderate right Facists  Facism and Nazism are closer to Communism and Socialism than any Liberal or right oriented ideology.
That's why I think that Communism ands Socialism (In this case National Socialism ) are a danger against all civilized societies and a catapult for any dictator and or Genocide, not entuioning that all this is an utopic belief.
There will always be rich and poor, if not the owners and producers will be the Government officials and party members.
Iván
(*) Replaced the word Reich for nation, becausae it would have been too obvious. |
Oh for f***'s sake... Pope wears big white hat and lives in Vatican! Bears known to defecate in forested areas!
Ivan, as you and anybody else with some functioning brain cells and a slight knowledge of political history knows, the ideology of the 3rd Reich was called National Socialism, which in its German form Nationalsozialismus became shortened to Nazi. Given the prominence of the word 'socialism' in the very name of its defining ideology, it's hardly surprising that some of the ideas in 'Mein Kampf' would not be out of place in a socialist manifesto. This line of thinking wasn't even original in the 1930s. Anarchists declaimed those very sentiments at hippie rallies in the 1960s before informing the small minority who hadn't realised what they were doing that they were quoting Adolf Hitler. Shocking! Yoko Ono did the same thing on stage with the Plastic Ono Band. Yeah, shocking!
The fact that Adolf Hitler agreed with some socialist principles does not invalidate it as a political ideal, any more than Charles Manson's claim that his crimes were inspired by the Book of Revelations invalidates Christianity.
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'Like so many of you
I've got my doubts about how much to contribute
to the already rich among us...'
Robert Wyatt, Gloria Gloom
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Ivan_Melgar_M
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: April 27 2004
Location: Peru
Status: Offline
Points: 19557
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Posted: November 30 2006 at 16:46 |
Syzisgy wrote:
| Oh for f***'s sake... Pope wears big white hat and lives in Vatican! Bears known to defecate in forested areas!
Ivan, as you and anybody else with some functioning brain cells and a slight knowledge of political history knows, the ideology of the 3rd Reich was called National Socialism, which in its German form Nationalsozialismus became shortened to Nazi. Given the prominence of the word 'socialism' in the very name of its defining ideology, it's hardly surprising that some of the ideas in 'Mein Kampf' would not be out of place in a socialist manifesto. This line of thinking wasn't even original in the 1930s. Anarchists declaimed those very sentiments at hippie rallies in the 1960s before informing the small minority who hadn't realised what they were doing that they were quoting Adolf Hitler. Shocking! Yoko Ono did the same thing on stage with the Plastic Ono Band. Yeah, shocking!
The fact that Adolf Hitler agreed with some socialist principles does not invalidate it as a political ideal, any more than Charles Manson's claim that his crimes were inspired by the Book of Revelations invalidates Christianity.
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THAT’S MY WHOLE POINT  .
I wasn’t saying Socialism or Marxism doesn’t work because National Socialism, it only was an argument to prove how ignorant are the guys who qualify liberal, democrats or Republicans as Fascists or Nazis, BECAUSE FACISM AND NAZISM ARE TWO FORMS OF SOCIALISM and are closer to Marxism than any form of right oriented system.
I believe Socialism doesn’t work, because it has failed everywhere it was applied, but it's also truth that Facisn, Nazism, Soicialism and Communism are based in powerfull and centralist states, so yes they are a first step to totalirian Governments.
You could have saved a lot of time and space if you would had read the post that you quoted. 
Iván
First of three posts.
Edited by Ivan_Melgar_M - November 30 2006 at 16:51
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JrKASperov
Forum Senior Member
Joined: July 07 2004
Status: Offline
Points: 904
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Posted: November 30 2006 at 17:01 |
OpethGuitarist wrote:
I don't vote Democratic or Republican usually, and I'm certainly not forced to vote for either. The style of govt (majority wins) sets itself up to be a dual party system. That's not controlling my mind, that's an explanation for the kind of government the US has. |
You're only talking about yourself. Hello mister minority! 
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Epic.
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OpethGuitarist
Prog Reviewer
Joined: June 25 2006
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 1655
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Posted: November 30 2006 at 17:06 |
You arent forced to vote for either party either. You choose to. Politicians arent sending you in to voting booths in chains forcing you to vote for them. It's a choice, not mind control.
This kind of apathetic blame game is pretty sorry and low. If you or anyone has real problems with something, be a catalyst for change, don't blame everyone else for your problems. I think the new movie Pursuit of Happyness, plans to show that.
As I said, the way the US democratic system is set up inevitably leads to a two party system, but that doesn't mean we should all feel satisfied with it. It's just the nature of how this country was set up.
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back from the dead, i will begin posting reviews again and musing through the forums
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Peter
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: January 31 2004
Location: Canada
Status: Offline
Points: 9669
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Posted: November 30 2006 at 17:12 |
I have some cousins who are Americans, but I prefer Japanese cars and motorcycles. 
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"And, has thou slain the Jabberwock?
Come to my arms, my beamish boy!
O frabjous day! Callooh! Callay!'
He chortled in his joy.
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Sasquamo
Forum Senior Member
Joined: September 26 2006
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 828
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Posted: November 30 2006 at 18:06 |
jalas wrote:
Sasquamo wrote:
So jalas, if democracy doesn't work, give me a real life example of a type of government that does work. |
There is no government that works. Government is created and run by humans. Humans make mistakes and we can't just sit back and accept any decision that governments make. we can't because nationalists and be all patriotic about our countries. Thats where the leaders get their control. That is why Hitler was so successful. He got almost everyone in Germany to believe that the Jews were a problem so when the Jews were being persecuted and put into ghettos, few said anything of the inhumanity.
Ivan, could you please stop putting words in my mouth? I accept that socialism doesn't completely work and just because I say that democracy doesn't always work doesn't mean I hate it. It is just that in the wrong hands, as it is always in, it is easily corruptible. In the US, people don't have much to complain about, but to keep the country stable, many people have to be exploited or killed in this country and in other parts of the world. I don't want to stop and start praising my country. It's not about me. IT's about all the victims of US policy. Everyone has a right to be happy, and I know that not everyone will ever be happy, but There are too many people who are unneccessarily unhappy.
I am not a militant person. I am just asking for a compromise. You have to be willing to see things from my point of view before you say anything else. I have to be exposed to your point of view all the time. Not from you directly, but from CNN and Fox News ( the trusted names in news in America. [ha]). I don't think their is a wrong side. ON one side is anyone who believes in democracy. The best part about democracy is the freedom to make as much money as you can. I don't have a problem with that as long as no one gets hurt. On the other side, we have socialists who think that money should be distributed for the common good. socialism is just for people who don't have money as a priority. It doesn't make it work. Democracy can work better because of all the money that the government allows its real leaders (businessmen) to make. There is enough money to make a middle class that will not complain as much and as long as everyone has all the luxuries that they want, everything will be ok. Human have lived without TV, AC, video games, cell phones, computers, and MP3 players for so long and the companies are making it so that these become neccessities. THat is where the corruption is in democracy: mind control, just like socialism, except a lot more comfortable.
I have thought about it for a while now, and since global warming is very real, I guess I'll just move to Canada. |
If no effective government exists, then why are you complaining about America's government?
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Ivan_Melgar_M
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: April 27 2004
Location: Peru
Status: Offline
Points: 19557
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Posted: November 30 2006 at 18:14 |
jalas wrote:
Sasquamo wrote:
So jalas, if democracy doesn't work, give me a real life example of a type of government that does work. |
There is no government that works. Government is created and run by humans. Humans make mistakes and we can't just sit back and accept any decision that governments make. we can't because nationalists and be all patriotic about our countries. Thats where the leaders get their control. That is why Hitler was so successful. He got almost everyone in Germany to believe that the Jews were a problem so when the Jews were being persecuted and put into ghettos, few said anything of the inhumanity.
I will take the liberty of replying for Sasquamo:
READ HIS POST!!!!!!!!!!
SASQUAMO TALKS ABOUT SYSTEM (A deytermined idelology that each Government follows) AND YOU'RE REPLYING HIM ABOUT GOVERNMENTS (The group of men that was elected or imposed to rule a country). two different concepts, a Government may faill despite the system that follows.
No system is perfect, Democracy is the worst system except for all the others, but it has worked in many places:
- A President or Pruime Minister is elected by the votes of the citizens.
- The President or Prime Minister (The second elected by the majority of the Parliament elected by the people) are elected for a certain period of time or until a determined situation happens (In the case of the Prime Minister, his party looses the majority).
- At the end of his period, the President is re-elected or leaves his place and in the case of the Prime Minister,m he resigns before he's being changed.
That's all Democracy is about, if it works....then Democracy works despite how cruel, stupid or great is the President or the Prime Minister.
Socialism doesn't work, normally ends with a Dictator that keeps the power for himself until he dies, supported by a central Government.
Ivan, could you please stop putting words in my mouth? I accept that socialism doesn't completely work and just because I say that democracy doesn't always work doesn't mean I hate it.
Sorry, you first said:
| This is why democracy works. It works for the greedy who are always there waiting to see who they are going to devour next. |
Then you insisted:
| true democracy is also a lost cause but it seems like it works, but at the expense of many lives |
And again:
| all the good that has come out of this country will never bring back all the lives that have been lost unjustly for the sake of democracy. I don't hate democracy, but I know it's easily corruptible so that's why I prefer socialism. |
If you don't hate democracy....then you perform a great act because your words are from a person who hates democracy.
It is just that in the wrong hands, as it is always in, it is easily corruptible. In the US, people don't have much to complain about, but to keep the country stable, many people have to be exploited or killed in this country and in other parts of the world. I don't want to stop and start praising my country. It's not about me. IT's about all the victims of US policy. Everyone has a right to be happy, and I know that not everyone will ever be happy, but There are too many people who are unneccessarily unhappy.
You said the magical word USA POLICY...the system works, the humans sometimes and sometimes not.
If you disagree with the current USA policy....go when the time comes and vote for the Democrats or an independant movement.
I am not a militant person. I am just asking for a compromise. You have to be willing to see things from my point of view before you say anything else.
Sorry, but your point of view has caused that my country is so poor, Capitralism is bad, ok lets assume that:
- With a democratic Government we were the first country in the world insea products, Saint Velazco f the poor, entered to the Government woith the tanks, threw away the foreign fishing companies...now we don't appear in the list of the top 100.
- With a democratic Government we were the fitrst country in the world in potato production...San Velazco of the poor came, made his Reforma Agraria shouting "The land is foir those who work it", six months after that, we were importing potato from Czechoslovaquia. Yes Perú wrere potato was born
- In a democratic government, the unenployed rate was bellow 15%....San Velazco came and now we have 50% at least of unemployed people.
So don't want to see the things from the Socialist point of view, we had enough of that.
I have to be exposed to your point of view all the time. Not from you directly, but from CNN and Fox News ( the trusted names in news in America. [ha]).
At least you have news, Communist and Socialist Governments are not famous for their tolerance of free speech, if not ask Valladares or Sojenitzhin who wpent their lives in Cuban Prison and The Guulag for writtig POEMS.
I don't think their is a wrong side. ON one side is anyone who believes in democracy. The best part about democracy is the freedom to make as much money as you can. I don't have a problem with that as long as no one gets hurt
To live where you want, to wroite what you want, to believe in the God you want, etc.
On the other side, we have socialists who think that money should be distributed for the common good.
Yeah , Fidel Castro, Daniel Ortega or the Politboureau members lived as dirty Capitalists travelling all the world while the people in their countries was starving,
They distribute the money yes, but among the hiigh members of the oparty, ask the girl who studied 5 years to be an engeneer and cleaned my toilet in the hotel of Varadero for 149 opesos a month (20 dollars) if she received some of the money Fidel distributed.
Socialism is just for people who don't have money as a priority. It doesn't make it work. Democracy can work better because of all the money that the government allows its real leaders (businessmen) to make.
I agree, in Socialists Governments there are no business men because all of the investors escaped when there was not a table system:
- Less investors = Less companies
- Less companies = Less work
- Less work = More poor people
- More poor people = System doesn't work
But it's ok while the leaders live in the huge houses they took for free from the people who worked all their lives.
There is enough money to make a middle class that will not complain as much and as long as everyone has all the luxuries that they want, everything will be ok.
At least there0's a middle class...in Socialist and Communist countries there are no classes, nobody owns anything, all is property of the state (Supposedly the workers) but the leaders control all the resources.
Human have lived without TV, AC, video games, cell phones, computers, and MP3 players for so long and the companies are making it so that these become neccessities. THat is where the corruption is in democracy: mind control, just like socialism, except a lot more comfortable.
Now you're an Amish?
How many Prog CD's do you have? In what do you play them? How do you have Internet access? So in this case..Are you part of this corruption?
Humanity has to progress and if ths allows us to be more comfortable, why reject it? But at least you admit Socialism is mind control but without comfort.
The world is not fair and believe me I'm not rich, I don't have a stable work, if I don't work a week I don't eat because Peruvian lawyers are rarely rivch, but I know that if I work and have a bit of luck I will have enough money to marry and allow my children to live well and study.
I have thought about it for a while now, and since global warming is very real, I guess I'll just move to Canada.
Yes, to the Revolutianary Canada. Very convenient.
Iván |
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Peter
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: January 31 2004
Location: Canada
Status: Offline
Points: 9669
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Posted: November 30 2006 at 18:41 |
jalas wrote:
I have thought about it for a while now, and since global warming is very real, I guess I'll just move to Canada. |
Leave your guns stateside though, eh?
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"And, has thou slain the Jabberwock?
Come to my arms, my beamish boy!
O frabjous day! Callooh! Callay!'
He chortled in his joy.
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