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Epignosis

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Posted: August 07 2016 at 20:25

HackettFan View Drop Down

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Posted: August 07 2016 at 22:51

Micky wrote:

Trump loses it during the debates.... goes full blown Trump mode... I wouldn't bet on it. He'll have the best coaches money can buy.. but .. he can. The man is not right in the head and is quite capable of simply losing it on stage.. on TV in front of millions of voters. (see the definition of Narcissistic personality disorder (NPD) and see it doesn't fit Trump to a T)

It definitely fits him. To a T for sure!

A curse upon the heads of those who seek their fortunes in a lie. The truth is always waiting when there's nothing left to try. - Colin Henson, Jade Warrior (Now)

Dean

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Posted: August 08 2016 at 02:32

micky wrote:

Dean wrote:

That hasn't answered my question: Why are Texas, Alabama, Louisiana and Mississsippi Republican exactly?

Apparently the great migration is reversing as more African Americans move back into the region - as you say 1/3rd of the deep south is black and that represents 35% of all African Americans - over a third of all African Americans living in the USA reside in just 6 states, and when you count the remainder of the Southern states that total rises to 60%. So I'll repeat my question: Why are those states Republican?

If every single African American (and Hispanic and Asian) voted Democrat in those states would they then turn blue? I suspect the simple answer to that is no. If that is the case then why?

why are they Republican.... there is a short answer and a long one...

the short answer is Guns, God, and a culture of racism... 6 million blacks didn't pick up and migrate north because the weather was better in Chicago or Detroit LOL

In short social conservatism which is what the Republican Party is all about today...and why the South is its power block and why the GOP is heading down the road to becoming a regional party instead of national one. One that naturally plays into white fears that their country is changing and is no longer a white protestant nation with the rules made by whites for a white population and screw the darkies... they are f**king animals...

thus that is why you have seen the Republicans evolve from party that once reach in the northeast and west lose those to the Democrats. It evolved from the party of Lincoln to the party of Jeff Davis... states rights, white power and a profound distrust of the national government for imposing upon their insular culture what was anathema to them. Thus today's Republicans are much more ideologically like the southern democrats of the mid 19th century.

that is the short answer and probably best if I don't get into the longer one. LOL

I would say that is How rather than Why.

If a third of the [state] population is non-white Democrat then you only need a tad over quarter of the white population to vote Democrat to win - when the white population in other states is split between Republican and Democrat on 60:40 or 40:60 ratios then 74:26 should be a doddle.

Mississippikiyay is 57.5% white and 55.5% of the state voted Republican in 2012 - which suggests that either only 3.4% of the white population are Democrats or non-whites voted Republican by significantly more than the national average for their demographic. Either way the conclusions you can draw from that are not good because it is the least affluent of all 50 American states yet votes for the party that increases social class disparity. This raises the question of why do low-paid, blue-collar voters (irrespective of colour) vote for the party whose fiscal and social policies benefit them the least? And that still doesn't fully address the underlying cause of why Southern States vote Republican.

Edited by Dean - August 08 2016 at 02:35

What?

Easy Money View Drop Down

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Posted: August 08 2016 at 02:46

Judging by the recent congressional election advertising (I live here).
These things unite Southern Republicans:

stopping ISIS
anti abortion rights
pro gun ownership rights
stopping illegal immigration
"Christian values" (homosexual, transgender issues and 'happy holidays' issues etc)
anti federal government (anti-Washington), (anti-DC) etc

The above were heavily stressed in recent campaign adds for local offices.
Oddly enough, all of a sudden you rarely hear about the Affordable Care Act anymore.

Edited by js (Easy Money) - August 08 2016 at 10:58

Atavachron View Drop Down

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Posted: August 08 2016 at 02:55

^ What a paltry, eviscerated little agenda.

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The T

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Posted: August 08 2016 at 07:34

HackettFan wrote:

Micky wrote:

(see the definition of Narcissistic personality disorder (NPD) and see it doesn't fit Trump to a T)

It definitely fits him. To a T for sure!

rushfan4

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Posted: August 08 2016 at 08:45

The Donald is speaking at the Detroit Economic Club today at noon. It will be interesting to see which foot he sticks in his mouth today.

Dean

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Posted: August 08 2016 at 10:15

The T wrote:

HackettFan wrote:

Micky wrote:

(see the definition of Narcissistic personality disorder (NPD) and see it doesn't fit Trump to a T)

It definitely fits him. To a T for sure!

Quite the most unfortunate choice of screen-name there Teo. If you don't want the cap to fit you shouldn't put your head in it just in case it does. Tongue

What?

The T

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Posted: August 08 2016 at 11:04

Dean wrote:

The T wrote:

HackettFan wrote:

Micky wrote:

(see the definition of Narcissistic personality disorder (NPD) and see it doesn't fit Trump to a T)

It definitely fits him. To a T for sure!

Quite the most unfortunate choice of screen-name there Teo. If you don't want the cap to fit you shouldn't put your head in it just in case it does. Tongue

I'm definitely changing it. No association with Trump wanted here even if it's through a common expression

LearsFool

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Posted: August 08 2016 at 12:26

The NeverTrump brigade has finally found a lamb: meet House Republican Conference chief policy director and your next president Evan McMullin! Tongue

Let's see if he can get on the forty-nine still open ballots!

And with Trump poised to reveal some sort of crazed tax plan who's metrics have shifted over time, and Rubio tries to hide the true nature of that brouhaha he's going to, I've been moved to introduce you to Mother Jones' The Trump Files. Quite the collection of insanities, hypocrisys, meltdowns, and downright weirdness from the GOP's standard bearer over the decades. Two big reasons to show you the ever growing collection: today's piece on a prank the magazine Spy (the first to call Cheeto Jesus a "short-fingered vulgarian") played on the cheapskate, and a couple of pieces you'll see on the list where Trump reveals his one true love... asbestos.

SteveG

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Posted: August 08 2016 at 14:48

js (Easy Money) wrote:

Judging by the recent congressional election advertising (I live here).
These things unite Southern Republicans:

stopping ISIS
anti abortion rights
pro gun ownership rights
stopping illegal immigration
"Christian values" (homosexual, transgender issues and 'happy holidays' issues etc)
anti federal government (anti-Washington), (anti-DC) etc

The above were heavily stressed in recent campaign adds for local offices.
Oddly enough, all of a sudden you rarely hear about the Affordable Care Act anymore.

What David referred to as a paltry platform, is only what the Good Ol' Boys can say without looking like a bunch of all out racists. The Trump "make America great again" tag is Bubba speak for "Make America White Again."

That means:1) Deport Mexicans and close down the boarder so "anchor babies" can never raise up in future generations and vote the Republican south into oblivion. 2) Stop black men from hooking up with white women and having "mongrel offspring." 3) Stop the spread of black ethnic urban culture into the young white psyche, starting with that dreaded devil music called rap and hip hop. 4) Total gerrymandering so that all black voters have to return to their town of birth in order to vote after having to produce 100 identification documents including all elementary school report cards (which must be verified with local town, city and state embossed seals). And 5) Secretly reinstate the KKK (after making it off limits to Federal Justice Dept.) and have David Duke run for President in 4 years after they dump Trump, as he's only a stepping stone to greater things.

Now all I said is purely satire. After all, people like this can't actually live in a country like America, right?

Edited by SteveG - August 08 2016 at 15:04

LearsFool

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Posted: August 08 2016 at 15:16

So we now have, um, let's call it "Trump's Economic Plan". Light on details, standard GOP smoke and mirrors favouring the wealthy, not much different from his earlier nonsense and with only a couple of populist changes, one of which skews upwards anyways.

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Posted: August 08 2016 at 19:28

^ I guess he was trying to placate the Rich Right and instead spilled the beans on the biggest sham in recent political memory. Working class my ass.

"Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought." -- John F. Kennedy

LearsFool

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Posted: August 09 2016 at 15:17

Trump is getting dirty looks again already after he made what was pretty much a veiled threat towards Hillary and her SC choices over guns, but I think what's far more important is that he's going to be joining Rubio at that anti-gay hoedown in Orlando this week.

Edited by LearsFool - August 09 2016 at 15:18

micky

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Posted: August 09 2016 at 15:36

^ and more important than those.. in the realms of today's news..

Chuck Grassley reaping karma.... in a re-election dogfight that no pundit saw coming... everyone had that as a 'safe' GOP seat.

that would be a sweet Senate pickup for the Dems...

in my mind it isn't a question of who wins... but a matter of how much the GOP implodes.. how much down ballot destruction there is thanks in part to Trump... in larger matter to their own stupidity. That implosion was coming.. Trump is just accelerating it. Clap

Biggest election blowout since '84? Sure looks like it is coming...

as far as the 2nd Amendment comments... good job Donald... that is my horse showing again... couldn't go a week without reminding people why he is completely unsuited... unqualified to serve as city dogcatcher...

Edited by micky - August 09 2016 at 15:38

The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip

micky

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Posted: August 09 2016 at 20:40

Dean wrote:

micky wrote:

Dean wrote:

That hasn't answered my question: Why are Texas, Alabama, Louisiana and Mississsippi Republican exactly?

If every single African American (and Hispanic and Asian) voted Democrat in those states would they then turn blue? I suspect the simple answer to that is no. If that is the case then why?

I would say that is How rather than Why.

call me pedantic... I said why they are Republican...if you want a how the party came to be that way... then you get much deeper than a tossed off reply..

a history book is a good start.. a good book on black white relations in the south in the post war south will work.

The implication that you are making is that in states that have a high non-white population then the whites are inherently racist so Republican racist rhetoric (the RRR clan) is pandering to them rather than creating them. And that doesn't apply just to the South.

where did I make that implication. I only spoke to the south and why the South votes Republican and the core ideals of that party that appeal to cultural and historical aspects of southern society. Thus the solid Republican south we have know for 30 plus years. Which of course was the solid Democratic south before the two flip flopped where the Republicans went from being the party of Lincoln the party of Jeff Davis and the Democrats a 180 in the opposite direction. No racism in not limited to the south... but only there does racism drive politics. To the point where they care more about social issues, like keeping America white over their own goddamned economic well being. More about protecting their bathroom experiences safe from deviants rather than having good economic prospects. The poor ignorant fools. No wonder those states are sh*tholes economically and educationally.

That is what the Republican party sells. All it has to sell. Fear. Southerners eat it up. That sh*t don't play in the west, nor the north. Thus the extinction of the Republican party in the northeast, the far west, and now we are seeing it creep towards the middle.

That rhetoric is generally so illogical it should be impossible to believe - for example illegal immigrants can't simultaneously be stealing jobs and living off welfare benefits - but those two separate statements specifically target two sectors of the population (regardless of colour) and not the whole because no one can be simultaneously unemployed and paying tax.

you are talking too rationally... of course it is bullsh*t.. try telling that to someone who doesn't want to hear reason. Who doesn't think.. use their brains.. who only vote based on fear and anger of blacks, hispanics, gays, trans this .. or especially.... godless Democrats who are just as high up on the hate hit parade. Partisan politics is a cancer in this country.. .rather than civil disagreement.. you have.. to quote Robert.. Us and them. Republicans played that card to the hilt.. made a lot of Right Wing Talk Radio hosts famous while Democrats just shrugged it off and continued to talk reason.. and hard policy.

Finally.. finally..the Democratic Party woke up.. or more likely.. just got tired of the abuse.. and losing elections and decided two could play at that game. So that is where we are at today.. instead of the one legged ass kicking contests we had.. they returned the hate with interest.. so we end up where we are today. Each side sees each other as the destroyer of this country and all it stands for. With very room for compromise. That rhetoric and hyper-partisanship has one big affect on american politics.. specifically on the electorate.. a vacating of the middle. The moderate wing of the Republican Party is dead as a politcal force... and as I've posted here.. the Democrats are many years behind the GOP in gearing up for the culture wars we are now in.. but they are moving left and also vacating the center. If the GOP doesn't like Hillary.. boy on boy.. they are going to hate life when a real left leaning Democrat wins in 2024 for the next 8 years.

Whether the Republicans court or provoke those white voters who fall for their racist rhetoric the fact remains that those voters believe it because it confirms what they already believe. Trump supporters cheer him because "he tells it like it is", and not because the power of his argument is so compelling it changes minds. So why do those white voters in the south buck the national trend in sufficient numbers to defeat the non-white Democrat vote?

not sure what you are asking... what national trend. The only national trend that I see is the due to changing demographics and the alienation of those those demographic groups by the Republican Party they are rapidly becoming a regional party... only winning states where... they are majority white. Only one of the 5 states that is majority non-white is in the south.. the other 4 are solid Democrat.. and the fifth.. Texas.. will be solid blue likely in our lifetimes unless the GOP does a radical 180 which few, and most certainly not myself, think it capable of doing for in doing so... it alienates all those voters in teh rest of the south. The same voters who put the only people capable of making such a radical ideological shift, the congressional leaders themselves. And if we know anything about policians.. they don't want their gravy train interupted. They'll ride this out of control train either until they jump off in time.. or take it straight off the cliff. They know the problem.. and the very real implications of it (National irrevevance) but can not change it without committing career suicides.

Mississippi is a good example.

sometimes gets bandied about as a red-->blue state - people see that it's 37% black and has a white share of the population that's shrinking and wonder how a state like that isn't competitive. Here's how: Obama won 10% of whites in 2012, and 11% in 2008. Our conservadem nominee for senate last year got up to 16%, and we still lost that race by 20 points. It's just too racially polarized to be winnable. I mean, look: eligible voters in 2040 will be 56% white, 38% black, and 7% others. Even if Democrats win 15% of whites, 93% of blacks, and 80% of others, and minorities are not under-represented in the electorate, the Dem will win 49% of the vote. So under some generous assumptions, the state becomes close - by 2040. Are you gonna hold your breath for that?

Southern states are defined by racial polarization Dean.. and that is exactly what the Republican Party has been selling since 1988 when they discovered that appealing to fear (of blacks) turned a losing campaign into a winning campaign

back to 2016... lets take Mississippi since you mention it.... the poster child of where US racism and politics intercect...

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HackettFan View Drop Down

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Posted: August 09 2016 at 23:22

^There are enclaves within the south. Where I'm at in Lawton, Oklahoma, it's not necessarily liberal, but it is very diverse and cosmopolitan due to the neighboring army base (Ft. Sill) and indigenous Indian (Native American) populations. That quickly changes as one moves out from the city. Minorities have had little effect on state-wide politics. But there is a strong left leaning contingency, as Oklahoma democratic primary went for Bernie. Considering Texas, Houston has long been a left leaning city, though the rest of the state was more conservative. I agree that is changing to a large extent, as other Texas cities, like Dallas, become more diverse.

A curse upon the heads of those who seek their fortunes in a lie. The truth is always waiting when there's nothing left to try. - Colin Henson, Jade Warrior (Now)

JJLehto

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Posted: August 10 2016 at 00:05

Texas? Micky dude...I know you love Hillary but...Texas? LOL

And yes, I know the latest poll does have her up by 7 in GA and AZ is in basically tied. I still think Montana and Missouri are up for grabs. I expect every swing state will go blue: OH, FL, NM, CO, NV. (VA is no longer swing, it's solidly blue regardless of candidate for either side). But cmon, something about some warning about getting toooooo confident and ahead of yourself?

And really, the death of the GOP is not coming from this (I think that was set in motion 2010 after they sold out to the Tea Party) and states like GA, AZ, MT if won...are temporary. It's because of Trump more than Clinton.

Like, feels a tad weird to be so excited over a massive victory...over Trump? LOL

It's like saying I won that race by 20 minutes, but my opponent has one leg.

That said, now that both conventions are over and we've had time to let the dust settle, and the media is FINALLY giving the Trump the sh*t he deserves, things look just as we expected. Her lead keeps growing, nationally and in key states, and as you've pointed out NC, GA and yes even AZ are all realistic possibilities.

I will grant NC, and heck maybe even GA. I'm still skeptical of AZ...I mean the state did elect Jan Brewer and gave Trump near 50% of the vote in their primary. If Clinton wins AZ honestly I think it'll be more Gary siphoning votes than anything. It's not really important, what matters is finally some order is arising.

JJLehto

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Posted: August 10 2016 at 00:13

Anyone see the news. 50 national security people have denounced Trump as reckless and pledged not to vote for him.

This is just the latest in GOP defectors, 50 of them, and this is especially bad because this is coming from the party's bread and butter: Defense/security.

I just can't see how he can win, beyond all the demographics and insane quotes, how he can win when so many party officials, big name people from all over the political and career spectrum, are opposing him.

He's of course using his classic "Establishment" as a counter, but fact is this is bad. He has some validity actually in saying most of these people were for the war in Iraq, but us with brains will remember he did originally support the war, before turning against it. It's just depressing honestly...this is the state of US politics.

And with so many truly inspiring, new voices like Sanders, Gary Johnson, Jill Stein and such potential for new ideas we have two of the most disliked candidates in history...a campaign that will be nothing but behaving like and reacting to a spoiled 13 year old, talks of twitter. Really I can save us the time. The next 3 months are going to be this:

"Crooked Hillary!"

"Trump is a racist sexist unstable man"

This is our 2016 election, and the one is likely to win, probably by a large margin, simply due to the fact the other is one of the most reprehensible people we've seen in politics.

Sad

JJLehto

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Posted: August 10 2016 at 00:20

SteveG wrote:

Atavachron wrote:

...but our bruthas & sistas love 'ems some Clintons, and I don't blame them.

I think it's time to throw in some reality with the so-called Black vote. Be aware that poverty levels among Blacks has raised during the Obama years and the incarceration of Blacks over Whites on drug crimes has remained intact, while the non stop shooting of unarmed Blacks remains constant, if not perceived to have actually increased, due to police shootings caught on phone camera and broadcast on social media then on the news media.

Are you sure that so many American Blacks still "love 'em some Clintons" and their democratic party?

Well, they've consistently backed the Democratic Party with over 80% for what, decades? Why stop now suddenly? And the fact is, it's a bloc that loves the name Clinton to boot. Absolutely they are backers of the Democratic Party, and it's lunacy to think that'll change now of all times...when the other party has been using race well before Trump, and in recent years have plunged pretty far down the hole.

Now, there are age gaps. For 30+ and ESPECIALLY older African Americans they do love the Clintons.

As we know younger African Americans, like all young Americans, are more skeptical.

It has been younger African Americans who talked about things like the crime bill, Clinton's trimming of welfare (which btw extreme poverty doubled under Clinton and we know who that disproportionately impacts) the "Super Predators" comment, Hillary's 08 campaign which many felt had racial undertones to it.

I'm proud of my fellow millennials (this is something I say rarely LOL

) regardless of gender, ethnicity even belief...we seem to be more issue/reality focused. Graduating into the worst economy since the end of WWII, with astonishing debts, probably helps Cry

Anyway I hate to say it, but I still see little concrete defense of Hillary, little substance. Excluding the "can't have Trump" all I ever hear people say is "She's so smart! Her experience! Her toughness" or generally just a warm fuzzy feeling of good ol days. These are not great reasons to vote for someone. I hate to say but basically identity politics/personal feelings have in my opinion clouded economic self betterment and a realistic look at things.

Bernie personally did best with African Americans in Michigan. There is little surprise as to why.

Young people all over backed him, and on the flip side young people are into the libertarian thing, not so much Rubio/Jeb/Christie. The focus is on economics. While I disagree with libertarian economics, it is an economic focus and this is very important to conservative friends of mine. They don't just pay lip service, they want real talk and action on gov spending, taxes, deficits/debt, etc etc They care about this stuff, and are willing to do away with Republicans they like to get some more dedicated to their ideals. I think on the left the same is happening.

Edited by JJLehto - August 10 2016 at 01:03