American Politics the 2016 edition

*spits coffee on monitor*

oh god that is priceless
 

good to see you back around Kati.

@ Brian.  Yes... I do hope she is as smart as I think she is.  She is building a signficant power base in the Senate. Personally I think she'd be a fool to accept it, if (big if) she was offered it. Hillary IS as smart as I give her credit for.  I don't think she'd offer it to her.  For many reasons IMO.

Now Warren.  She plays her cards right she walks to the Presidency when Hillary has cleared out.  She'll unite both wings of the Democratic party the way Bernie could not. 

In fact it brings up an interesting discussion we were having at work the other day.  Something I brought up much earlier in the thread. We survived the Reagan Revolution and the moving to the right of this country.  Perhaps what has the right in such disaray and in no small amounts of panic (thus the ever increasing vitriol) as they see, as some of us do, that a counter movement is underway. A revolution in sorts . that this country is moving to the left. We have seen it socially, now under the right figure, it could economically. 

I think it will be Warren. Perhaps in 20 or 30 years.. you all will be talking about the Warren Revolution. I think she has the potential to be that trasnsendenal.  Read this.. read this carefully.. this is the stuff of Kennedy. 

'There is nobody in this country who got rich on his own. Nobody. ... You moved your goods to market on the roads the rest of us paid for; you hired workers the rest of us paid to educate; you were safe in your factory because of police forces and fire forces that the rest of us paid for. You didn't have to worry that marauding bands would come and seize everything at your factory, and hire someone to protect against this, because of the work the rest of us did. Now look, you built a factory and it turned into something terrific, or a great idea. God bless. Keep a big hunk of it. But part of the underlying social contract is, you take a hunk of that and pay forward for the next kid who comes along.

I  have been very busy too trying to be fair and explain caucus vs delegates, Bengazi, Hillary defending a rapist etc, all miss construed and I replied to everything with facts. My post are public if you have fb you can read it all, there I was debating with angry Trump supporters who had their facts wrong.

micky wrote: 'There is nobody in this country who got rich on his own. Nobody. ... You moved your goods to market on the roads the rest of us paid for; you hired workers the rest of us paid to educate; you were safe in your factory because of police forces and fire forces that the rest of us paid for. You didn't have to worry that marauding bands would come and seize everything at your factory, and hire someone to protect against this, because of the work the rest of us did. Now look, you built a factory and it turned into something terrific, or a great idea. God bless. Keep a big hunk of it. But part of the underlying social contract is, you take a hunk of that and pay forward for the next kid who comes along.'

micky wrote: 'There is nobody in this country who got rich on his own. Nobody. ... You moved your goods to market on the roads the rest of us paid for; you hired workers the rest of us paid to educate; you were safe in your factory because of police forces and fire forces that the rest of us paid for. You didn't have to worry that marauding bands would come and seize everything at your factory, and hire someone to protect against this, because of the work the rest of us did. Now look, you built a factory and it turned into something terrific, or a great idea. God bless. Keep a big hunk of it. But part of the underlying social contract is, you take a hunk of that and pay forward for the next kid who comes along.

I like this quote up until the "keep a hunk" bit. The previous part makes it seem illogical to me.

A Person wrote: micky wrote: 'There is nobody in this country who got rich on his own. Nobody. ... You moved your goods to market on the roads the rest of us paid for; you hired workers the rest of us paid to educate; you were safe in your factory because of police forces and fire forces that the rest of us paid for. You didn't have to worry that marauding bands would come and seize everything at your factory, and hire someone to protect against this, because of the work the rest of us did. Now look, you built a factory and it turned into something terrific, or a great idea. God bless. Keep a big hunk of it. But part of the underlying social contract is, you take a hunk of that and pay forward for the next kid who comes along. I like this quote up until the "keep a hunk" bit. The previous part makes it seem illogical to me.

micky wrote: rogerthat wrote: ClemofNazareth wrote: micky wrote: 'There is nobody in this country who got rich on his own. Nobody. ... You moved your goods to market on the roads the rest of us paid for; you hired workers the rest of us paid to educate; you were safe in your factory because of police forces and fire forces that the rest of us paid for. You didn't have to worry that marauding bands would come and seize everything at your factory, and hire someone to protect against this, because of the work the rest of us did. Now look, you built a factory and it turned into something terrific, or a great idea. God bless. Keep a big hunk of it. But part of the underlying social contract is, you take a hunk of that and pay forward for the next kid who comes along.' What's sad is that those words are considered leftist and controversial, when they should be so self-evident as to be intuitively grasped by even our youngest citizens. Indeed, they wouldn't be considered leftist here and in huge swathes of the rest of the world.  But then social contract itself is a European concept. so true yet so funny... I imagine our righties would be considered moderates in Europe Though we had our fling with Bush's puppetiers, the so called Neo-Cons here which as close to neo-fascism as I hope we ever get again.  Europe sort of broke the mold in defining true lefties and righties. Our politics are sort of like our culture.. all flash... no substance.

As I tell you often, there is a substantial difference between the right here in the US and in Europe. The  right in continental Europe is violent (at least verbally), while in the US (and to some extent in the UK) it is heartless. I'd never come across hatred and contempt of poor people before I moved here. Anyway,  in terms of economic policies, most of the current crop of European far-right parties are hardly distinguishable from their far-left counterparts. Racism and nationalism are what make them right-wing rather than left-wing. The Five-Star Movement in Italy has characteristics of both the far left and the far right - hence its appeal. Save

micky wrote: A Person wrote: micky wrote: 'There is nobody in this country who got rich on his own. Nobody. ... You moved your goods to market on the roads the rest of us paid for; you hired workers the rest of us paid to educate; you were safe in your factory because of police forces and fire forces that the rest of us paid for. You didn't have to worry that marauding bands would come and seize everything at your factory, and hire someone to protect against this, because of the work the rest of us did. Now look, you built a factory and it turned into something terrific, or a great idea. God bless. Keep a big hunk of it. But part of the underlying social contract is, you take a hunk of that and pay forward for the next kid who comes along. I like this quote up until the "keep a hunk" bit. The previous part makes it seem illogical to me. be prepared for a lonely political existence man...  if you take away the reward.. why put in the work. The question is the size of the hunk.. Give me 150 million a year..I'm happy... give me 75 million a year and provide free education to those less fortunate with the rest. I'm still loving life. I think I can live in only three houses... only drive 10 Mercedes... only have homes in 3 countries. Your kind of mindset will never take hold here man.  If you succeed you should expect reward, financially. The point is.. where does that end.. and social responsibility begin.

I do not feel too lonely actually, there are many like me. If you realize all the things you have, from the clothes you wear and the food you eat to the education you receive, are only possible through the collective effort of your peers and all those who came before them, how then can you justify taking from them the fruit of their labor and the resources of the land for your own private profit? It is very silly. For every person who is successful and makes 100 million dollars, there are a million people who made that possible who only get 100 dollars.

to add to the superdelegate discussion from the other day: Tulsi Gabbard launches petition to end Democratic Party superdelegate process

Not a Bernie boy but this is a pretty apt summation of the problems of neo liberalism (which I am led to wonder whether it's actually a synonym for neo con).  Too bad, they can't accept even after all this time that they were wrong about it.  Oh well, Greenspan did have his callous "sh*t happens" moment.

Edited by rogerthat - June 12 2016 at 03:28