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The most successful modern prog music nation?

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Grumpyprogfan View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (2) Thanks(2)   Quote Grumpyprogfan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 09 2024 at 12:29
Originally posted by Nogbad_The_Bad Nogbad_The_Bad wrote:

If you look at the PA Top 10 for the last decade there are 5 Norwegian albums. There's your answer right there.
If you look at successful as popular, yes. If you look at success as creating something different and fresh, I don't think Wobbler and those other Norwegian bands meet that criteria.
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mathman0806 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mathman0806 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 09 2024 at 12:40
That is part of the discussion points for this topic. What does it mean to be successful? How do you measure success?

In Norway's defense, there is a variety of prog that does come from there, not just retro prog. Though the retro is the most popular on a prog scale.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote LAM-SGC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 09 2024 at 22:24
Favourite: UK, Norway, Germany
Best: Norway, UK
Successful: No idea, I don't study gig ticket and music sales.
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all the birds are leaving,
But how can they know,
it's time for them to go?
Before the winter fire,
I will still be dreaming,
I have no thought of time.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Saperlipopette! Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 09 2024 at 22:57
Originally posted by Grumpyprogfan Grumpyprogfan wrote:

Originally posted by Nogbad_The_Bad Nogbad_The_Bad wrote:

If you look at the PA Top 10 for the last decade there are 5 Norwegian albums. There's your answer right there.
If you look at successful as popular, yes. If you look at success as creating something different and fresh, I don't think Wobbler and those other Norwegian bands meet that criteria.
Being successful is about being somewhat popular. At least to an extent. I much prefer VdGG over Yes and ELP, but I would be incorrect if I claimed that the former band were more successful than the latter bands. Even though I personally think of them as artistically superior to both. If you create art that's differnt and fresh but nobody knows about it, you're partly unsuccessful. Unfortunately.

-Anyway, I think it needs to be a bit of both. A "successful modern prog nation" should to be profilic, vibrant and of course diverse. For every "Wobbler-band" there's at least twice as many experimental and forward thinking "Rune Grammofon" kinds of bands and projects etc... But of course, they are less "successful", so fewer people knows about them. I listen to them though (Wobbler, not so much. Although I fully respect them for working within an established tradition - and doing it well).
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Chiyo View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (2) Thanks(2)   Quote Chiyo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 10 2024 at 00:13
Originally posted by Nogbad_The_Bad Nogbad_The_Bad wrote:

If you look at the PA Top 10 for the last decade there are 5 Norwegian albums. There's your answer right there.
I honestly don't know anything about Progarchives' popularity ranking system, so I can't comment on that. However, this official video from Frost*—East Sussex's band formed in 2004—has a healthy 252,570 views for the time being, and that is a modern take on prog-rock:

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Awesoreno Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 10 2024 at 00:53
^And that's honestly the first track you've posted that actually is "modern" in terms of prog, at least to my ears (love that album). That's not a comment on my opinion of the quality. But I think Grumpy brought up the true dichotomy of how we're discussing this. Are we talking the NUMBER of groups/artists and releases, or are we talking about acts that are actually treading new (or at least somewhat new) ground? 

It's certainly true that Norway (and Sweden) has many current groups that are making all different kinds of music. But it does seem like a significant portion of it is in the symph vein with varying degrees of retro prog flavors. To my knowledge, many more bands from the US (and Japan, Canada) are producing fresh, new material that rivals that of Norway. And ALL of them are blowing the UK out of the water in terms of innovation (as opposed to quantity, black midi notwithstanding). Indeed, most of what you have posted helps make that point. And once again, this is to say nothing of the quality of the music. That is entirely subjective. And I enjoyed much of what you posted, to be fair.
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Chiyo View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (2) Thanks(2)   Quote Chiyo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 10 2024 at 01:42
Originally posted by Awesoreno Awesoreno wrote:

^And that's honestly the first track you've posted that actually is "modern" in terms of prog, at least to my ears (love that album). 
Okay, but I have to say that I'm surprised that the Big Big Train video I posted doesn't sound modern to your ears. Oh, and that one—"The Transit of Venus Across the Sun" live at the Boerderij, Holland—has 25,275 views right now, which is healthy for a live video uploaded to YouTube a few months ago.

Maybe I will be more convincing with this official video from Big Big Train, released a month ago, featuring the song "Oblivion," which is taken from their upcoming album “The Likes of Us," out March 1st, 2024. It has a healthy 138,589 views at this very moment.


Originally posted by Awesoreno Awesoreno wrote:

To my knowledge, many more bands from the US (and Japan, Canada) are producing fresh, new material that rivals that of Norway. And ALL of them are blowing the UK out of the water in terms of innovation (as opposed to quantity, black midi notwithstanding).
Surely, the U.S., Japan, and Canada have a number of interesting contemporary bands that explore new territories; however, I strongly disagree that they "blowing" the UK. In that regard, I'd like to mention Chlöe Herington. She is a London-based avant-gardist whose shining project is called VÄLVE. Emma Sullivan, a fellow Chrome Hoof, joins her, and they released an amazing album recently, titled "Tiny Pilots." This is an official video of the song "Gertrude's List from that album. That is a top-notch avant-prog song, in my humble opinion.




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote David_D Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 10 2024 at 03:48

In my book, the main criteria for being "successful" is to be appreciated.
                      quality over quantity, and all kind of PopcoRn almost beyond
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MikeEnRegalia Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 10 2024 at 03:54
^ by whom?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Cristi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 10 2024 at 03:55
Originally posted by MikeEnRegalia MikeEnRegalia wrote:

^ by whom?

LOL
listeners and fans I guess Smile


Edited by Cristi - January 10 2024 at 03:56
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MikeEnRegalia Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 10 2024 at 04:03
^ My point is that there's different groups of listeners, at the most basic level fans and critics (reviewers). It's highly subjective to say which one should appreciate the band, and some artists will (rightfully IMHO) outright refuse the idea that their success is based on appreciation.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (2) Thanks(2)   Quote Chiyo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 10 2024 at 04:07
Originally posted by David_D David_D wrote:


In my book, the main criteria for being "successful" is to be appreciated.
Guapo is, for instance, a well-appreciated modern band in the avant-prog scene. And they are an English band.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (2) Thanks(2)   Quote Chiyo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 10 2024 at 07:17
Originally posted by octopus-4 octopus-4 wrote:

Unfortunately the war is having its bad impact, but both Ukraine and Russia were making excellent prog
I agree. From Ukraine hails Antony Kalugin, and there is the Russian duo Iamthemorning, currently residing in England. 
Kalugin is a very prolific and well-appreciated musician, both as a solo artist and as the leader of the recognised bands Karfagen, Hoggwash, and Sunchild. Kscope's band, Iamthemorning, made, within the progressive music standards of the second decade of the 21st century, a significant breakthrough in terms of popularity. Also, Iamthemorning composer and keyboard player Gleb Kolyadin released a few well-regarded solo albums with guests like Steve Hogarth, Theo Travis, Gavin Harrison, and so on.
Both acts, Antony Kalugin and his bands and Iamthemorning, are quite modern and original, which is not so often the case in the subgenres in which they work, as the former is symphonic prog and the latter is chamber music-like crossover prog.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (3) Thanks(3)   Quote SteveG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 10 2024 at 07:26
Is the UK just a footnote now? In terms of prog artists they may not be the most numerous but they are certainly the best known and exposed. Consider that Marillion, Porcupine Tree, solo Steven Wilson, IQ et al have had albums out that made various charts in Europe and abroad over the last 20+ years. Recall that the OP's question asks for the most successful.

Edited by SteveG - January 10 2024 at 07:28
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Chiyo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 10 2024 at 08:04
Originally posted by Criswell Criswell wrote:

USA & Italy
Italy indeed continues to be a prog-rock "superpower" since our beloved genre is still popular there and there are modern prog-rock bands who are releasing some great albums.
One of my favourite Italian progressive albums released in the last few years is LogoS' "Sadako e le mille gru di carta" (2020), which is an ambitious concept album about Sadako Sasaki, a girl from Hiroshima who, as a two-year-old child, survived a nuclear explosion two miles away from her home.
I would also point out 2020's "Il Velo dei Riflessi" by Quel Che Disse Il Tuono, a Milanese band that was founded in 2019. It's also a concept album that, via the use of the metaphor of mirrors, delves into topics like the repulsion of one's own personality and latent insanity in humans; each of these subjects is represented by one of the four mirrors and correlates to the first four songs on the album.


Edited by Chiyo - January 10 2024 at 08:15
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Chiyo View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (2) Thanks(2)   Quote Chiyo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 10 2024 at 08:10
Originally posted by Grumpyprogfan Grumpyprogfan wrote:

USA. In my opinion, they have the most quality and quantity of modern prog.
Of course, but the U.S. is so huge and such a big market that at least I don't see much sense in comparing it with these European countries. Maybe if we compare the progressive music production of each individual federal state in relation to a European country, it would make more sense.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Saperlipopette! Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 10 2024 at 09:05
Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:

Is the UK just a footnote now? In terms of prog artists they may not be the most numerous but they are certainly the best known and exposed. Consider that Marillion, Porcupine Tree, solo Steven Wilson, IQ et al have had albums out that made various charts in Europe and abroad over the last 20+ years. Recall that the OP's question asks for the most successful.
Where have IQ charted in the last 20+years? Anyway, bringing up IQ and Marillion makes UK appear like a footnote as a modern progmusic nation. But recent bands such as Black Country, New Road and black midi are relatively successful.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Tapfret Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 10 2024 at 09:07
With this arbitrary criteria of "modern prog", I will just go with the first quarter of the current century. "Success" is a rather nebulous term as well. Is it pure album sales, critical acclaim,etc? I am fairly certain that in terms of pure quantity in the broadest sense of "prog" the US And UK probably outnumber other countries. But with a few exceptions, most of what the US and UK have put out has gotten pretty stale, or even downright bad. Especially in regard to bands that have been around since the classic era.
When it comes to the subset of prog styles I enjoy, the bands are coming mainly from Norway, Sweden, France, Germany and Japan. If I go through my Last.fm it appears to be Sweden, but using scrobble data is limited to counting tracks rather than listening time. France has probably made me say "wow" the most in the last 5 years.





Edited by Tapfret - January 10 2024 at 09:15
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote richardh Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 10 2024 at 09:13
'Modern' is impossible to pin down. I mean there is so much music is just so last year. It's almost an 'Oxymoron' for prog fans to talk about what is modern or not. Would make a nice Monty Python sketch I imagine.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (2) Thanks(2)   Quote Chiyo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 10 2024 at 09:24
As a well-appreciated band, I'd like to mention TesseracT. Formed in Buckinghamshire, England, in 2003,  TesseracT is credited as one of the bands to pioneer the djent strand in the progressive metal genre. The group is well known for its intricate compositions and unusual time signatures. Playing progressive music that straddles the line between metal and djent, TesseracT conjures up strong cerebral imagery and sounds like progressive music of the future—at least for the younger generation of today.
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