Political discussion thread

The election really lies in the big states that Hillary won. Texas, Florida, New York, Ohio and Michigan. Will these states vote for Obama without Hillary on the ticket? NOPE. The race at this point really comes down to is Hillary on the ticket for VP or not. Without Hillary on the ticket Obama will lose as bad as Mike Dukakis did.

Sooooo finally Obama has the nomination.
This will be interesting for sure, if all the talk and hype is true...there are going to be some interesting battle states this year.
States like Ohio and Virginia of course, as well as Colorado, New Mexico, Nevada, maybe even INDIANA????

Hopefully the Dems won't lose PA, because it is a tight one and I've spent alot of time now out there in Central PA and its not friendly Dem country

What a pity I cannot vote.... Hopefully I'll have already moved to the US by election time, and I have to say I'm looking forward to witnessing the whole proceedings. When I lived in Finland, elections were generally a rather understated affair, while from what I know presidential elections in the US are.. interesting to say the least. We'll see!

Henry Plainview wrote: NaturalScience wrote: Don't support Obama?  Didn't you get the memo?  That makes you a racist. Hm, yes, and when has anyone even come close to saying that? Hillary's supporters shrieked sexism at every opportunity, and to a lesser extent, so did her campaign. But I haven't heard RACIST! from anyone. I don't doubt that the sentiment is there somewhere, and I've probably been looking in the wrong places, but even still, it's not a widespread notion.

I think there is an undercurrent of it, at a minimum.  I've certainly heard many people say that if Obama were to lose, it would mean "America is not ready for a black president".   Also, recall discrepancies in some of the primary elections between pre-poll data and actual results; there were some people that for some reason didn't want to appear racist and so told pollsters they were voting for Obama, but then actually voted for Clinton (or whoever).

The reasobn why Obbama needs Hilary is that in the Democratic Party system the big states divide the electors, in the National Elections if MacCain wins New York, Florida and Texas by one vote, he gets the whole number of electors.

Edited by Ivan_Melgar_M - June 18 2008 at 02:11

Man, I wish I had some more charts and graphs handy to link to, maybe me and Relayer09 could have a dueling graphs thread.

How about  this one?





By the way, I'm not entirely sure who Lieberman would win over if McCain were to pick him for VP who isn't already in his camp.

Here's a link to an interesting site to check in on as the election progresses:

http://www.electoral-vote.com/


Edited by Slartibartfast - June 18 2008 at 08:28

Relayer09 wrote: The election really lies in the big states that Hillary won. Texas, Florida, New York, Ohio and Michigan. Will these states vote for Obama without Hillary on the ticket? NOPE. The race at this point really comes down to is Hillary on the ticket for VP or not. Without Hillary on the ticket Obama will lose as bad as Mike Dukakis did.   People like myself who do not subscribe to any political party and like to think for myself will probably not vote for Obama without Hillary. Me personally, I will not vote for Obama over McCain even with Hillary on the ticket. Obama says the things people want to hear. That's only a good thing if he has a plan to back up those nice sounding things, which I don't believe he can do. There's been alot of skeletons to come out of the Obama closet already and may be more to come. McCain has kept his integrity intact even after being attacked by the New York Times with unfounded claims. So far for me the pendulum has swung towards McCain. Will it swing back? Doubtful at this point but we shall see.

Aaahh. McCain's integrity. Proudly Stands with evangelical preacher one day, disowns him when the racist/homophobic/anti-immigrant/anti-poor statements reach the media.
Accuses Bush of being incompetent when campaigning against him, then eventually gives in and morphs into a quasi-supporter of the Bush administration. Why, well, to put it simply, so as to enable him to win the Republican nomination despite his past disagreements with the GOP's conservative wing on fundamental issues.

Frankly, I believe both parties have ended up with the best possible nominees. But only one is young. Only one, realistically, once in power, would bring in fresh blood into Washington. Who ? Obama. Why ? Because of his relatively short time as Senator has meant that he is still building up the insider relationships so necessary in the political system. And I don't mean this for McCain only. Clinton's presidency would have meant keeping the same old crowd in power.
And as far as no plans to back up the rethoric, and unfounded claims ... well ... specific plans are never examined or discussed in detail during an election because the electorate just doesn't have the will or interest to do so. That's why the generalities, the so-called "values" are on display, for both sides.
And for unfounded claims ... well ... if you think that is an Obama failing, please feel free to stand up and denounce/correct  the following - Obama is muslim/is Arab/educated in Maddrassa (extremist islamic school/sworn in using Koran/radical black extremist/anti-whitey etc ...
Not that the Dems aren't capable at smearing the other side, but they unfortunately don't have idiots like Rush (I'm not a drug addict) Limbaugh, Bill (let's give everyone a chance to explain themselves) O'Reilly, Newt (adulterers don't belong in political office) Gingrich, the Right Wing Gospel of Prosperity Evangelical (what ever I say Jesus meant, is what Jesus meant) christian fanatics, and of course, the ever supportive big business and war mongerers.
Oh, and by the way, for one who says you're not affiliated with any party, you sure seem to be tilting hard to one side, eh.

Relayer09 wrote:

Quite telling. The black columns represent the record tax revenues Clinton managed to sqaunder

Ivan_Melgar_M wrote:   Texas and Florida will be won by Republicans, probably New York also,   Iván

Not necessarily so