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Gerinski View Drop Down
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Points: 5154 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 17 2014 at 15:46
It indeed depends on your definition of classic. I would say that not having heard the main albums from bands like ELP, Yes, Genesis, KC etc is a crime if you consider yourself a prog lover. If you haven't heard them you can't hardly be truly aware of the full meaning of what Prog was / is. But for many, Gong's Flying Teapot is a classic but perhaps not for every progger. For others, Klaus Schulze's Timewind is a classic, for others not. Or Zappa or RPI or the Cardiacs or DT or many other styles, which may be greatly important to Prog per se but may not be everyone's cup of tea.

Personally I'm not into listening to music on the net so basically saying that "I have never listened to" means that I do not own the album. If I check PA's Top list the first I do not own are Peter Hamill's The Silent Corner (No 24), Zappa's One Size Fits All (No 44) and Wyatt's Rock Bottom (No 46), all of them long time in my "want to" list but always something else comes in between.


Edited by Gerinski - February 17 2014 at 16:47
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Points: 5154 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 17 2014 at 15:48
Originally posted by moshkito moshkito wrote:

Originally posted by presdoug presdoug wrote:

I've never heard Yes-Relayer or Tormato. Or ELP-Love Beach. Or Birth Control-Hoodoo Man. Or Amon Duul 2-Tanz der Lemming. Reason being, I am just a bit lazy, i guess.
 
Nowadays, that's silly. On top of it, it is all available at Youtube for free and it says "album" for you. You don't even have to buy it.

That's true but listening to good Prog in YT is like watching the night sky with sunglasses. I would not recommend it to anybody as you are likely to miss many of the nuances which make those albums so great.
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Points: 5109 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 17 2014 at 16:26
Originally posted by Gerinski Gerinski wrote:

Originally posted by moshkito moshkito wrote:

Originally posted by presdoug presdoug wrote:

I've never heard Yes-Relayer or Tormato. Or ELP-Love Beach. Or Birth Control-Hoodoo Man. Or Amon Duul 2-Tanz der Lemming. Reason being, I am just a bit lazy, i guess.
 
Nowadays, that's silly. On top of it, it is all available at Youtube for free and it says "album" for you. You don't even have to buy it.

That's true but listening to good Prog in YT is like watching the night sky with sunglasses. I would not recommend it to anybody as you are likely to miss many of the nuances which make those albums so great.

Couldn't agree more. YT is fine for a preview but prog needs to be experienced fully.
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Points: 20659 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 17 2014 at 19:51
Originally posted by Guldbamsen Guldbamsen wrote:

^I reach for You or Fish Rising if I want a Hillage kick myselfBig smile
His guitar work is excellent on Fish but imo the songs aren't as good as the ones on Khan.
Smile
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Points: 7865 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 18 2014 at 08:23
I'm ashamed to admit I've not let GLASS HAMMER grace my ears at all. I'd like to change that.
I also haven't heard Kayo Dot's, Choirs of The Eye. Heard some great things about Toby Driver, so I guess I better 'drive' that album into my ears. Otherwise, I think I'm fairly caught up for what I'm generally interested in at the moment.
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Points: 7865 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 18 2014 at 08:26
Originally posted by dr wu23 dr wu23 wrote:

Originally posted by Guldbamsen Guldbamsen wrote:

^I reach for You or Fish Rising if I want a Hillage kick myselfBig smile

His guitar work is excellent on Fish but imo the songs aren't as good as the ones on Khan.
Smile


Ah yes. Da Hillage! I really enjoy his work with GONG. Loved the ANGELS EGG. Such an odd, yet lovely concept album. Long live ZERO DA HERO!
Gimmie my headphones now!!! 🎧🤣
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Points: 23104 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 18 2014 at 08:32
Originally posted by progbethyname progbethyname wrote:

Originally posted by dr wu23 dr wu23 wrote:

Originally posted by Guldbamsen Guldbamsen wrote:

^I reach for You or Fish Rising if I want a Hillage kick myselfBig smile

His guitar work is excellent on Fish but imo the songs aren't as good as the ones on Khan.
Smile


Ah yes. Da Hillage! I really enjoy his work with GONG. Loved the ANGELS EGG. Such an odd, yet lovely concept album. Long live ZERO DA HERO!

All of the Gnome trilogy is sheer brilliance imo, but Angels Egg and You take the biscuit. 

Dr: Funny you should say that - I kinda feel the opposite, and I tend to go for the immature and naive in music. Fish Rising is for me all about the compositions and the general playfulness of it. Case in point Aftaglid:

I love the unconventional "melody" if you can call it that, how it's never really played only suggested by the guitar riffing that plays around it. 
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dr wu23 View Drop Down
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Points: 20659 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 18 2014 at 09:42
Originally posted by Guldbamsen Guldbamsen wrote:

Originally posted by progbethyname progbethyname wrote:

Originally posted by dr wu23 dr wu23 wrote:

Originally posted by Guldbamsen Guldbamsen wrote:

^I reach for You or Fish Rising if I want a Hillage kick myselfBig smile

His guitar work is excellent on Fish but imo the songs aren't as good as the ones on Khan.
Smile


Ah yes. Da Hillage! I really enjoy his work with GONG. Loved the ANGELS EGG. Such an odd, yet lovely concept album. Long live ZERO DA HERO!

All of the Gnome trilogy is sheer brilliance imo, but Angels Egg and You take the biscuit. 

Dr: Funny you should say that - I kinda feel the opposite, and I tend to go for the immature and naive in music. Fish Rising is for me all about the compositions and the general playfulness of it. Case in point Aftaglid:

I love the unconventional "melody" if you can call it that, how it's never really played only suggested by the guitar riffing that plays around it. 
Well....many have said that Fish Rising is basically Khan part 2,  but for me Khan is simply more polished and has better song structures but as I said the guitar is excellent on Fish....and You by Gong is a killer album.
I don't have a problem with 'immature and naļve' prog (for the most part); I just like the music on Khan better.
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Points: 849 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 18 2014 at 14:48
Henri Cow's In Praise of Learning... Actually, I probably never heard any RIO/Avant Prog albums...
Why? Well, it's just that I'm not sure to like this subgenre according to its definition... And I never found the album on CD at a good price LOL
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Points: 1474 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 18 2014 at 22:58
Too many. Why? Because you can't have everything. 
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Points: 29372 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 19 2014 at 01:23
Originally posted by progbethyname progbethyname wrote:

I'm ashamed to admit I've not let GLASS HAMMER grace my ears at all. I'd like to change that.


The Inconsolable Secret - 3 disc remastered version

the perfect place to start I reckonSmile
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Points: 5898 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 19 2014 at 04:36
Haven't heard any of the RIO stuff either, except maybe one or two Henry Cow songs. I just find it an instant turn-off when a band's entire concept revolves around an obvious political agenda because of how often the music suffers as a result of taking a backseat to ideology: It's not only my least favourite thing about punk, it's also the reason I find 95% of the more national-romanticist type of black metal a complete and utter chore to listen to.
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Points: 2673 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 19 2014 at 09:45
In the Land of Grey and Pink is the only Caravan album I've heard, and for that matter, the only Canterbury album I've heard. I definitely like it, but my musical focus has been elsewhere, and so I have not explored the Canterbury scene yet. It's something I plan to do, it just may be a while before it happens.
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Points: 4095 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 21 2014 at 22:55
Originally posted by prog4evr prog4evr wrote:

Originally posted by presdoug presdoug wrote:

I've never heard Yes-Relayer or Tormato. Or ELP-Love Beach. Or Birth Control-Hoodoo Man. Or Amon Duul 2-Tanz der Lemming. Reason being, I am just a bit lazy, i guess.
Yes-Relayer is a bucket-list must!  One of the most under-rated (and best) Yes albums (despite the absence of of Wakeman - although he composed most of the music played by Moraz on that album).  You can forget Tormato - it is a waste of your time and your ear audio-waves...

Well you are right that Relayer is a must listen to any prog fan and is highly regarded by Yes fans but Wakeman didn't compose any of the music played by Moraz on Relayer. That never happened. Not only did he not compose it-- but Wakeman has said he could never have been on Relayer because it's music he couldn't play.
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Points: 18058 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 22 2014 at 16:28
Originally posted by bhikkhu bhikkhu wrote:

Originally posted by Gerinski Gerinski wrote:

Originally posted by moshkito moshkito wrote:

Originally posted by presdoug presdoug wrote:

I've never heard Yes-Relayer or Tormato. Or ELP-Love Beach. Or Birth Control-Hoodoo Man. Or Amon Duul 2-Tanz der Lemming. Reason being, I am just a bit lazy, i guess.
 
Nowadays, that's silly. On top of it, it is all available at Youtube for free and it says "album" for you. You don't even have to buy it.

That's true but listening to good Prog in YT is like watching the night sky with sunglasses. I would not recommend it to anybody as you are likely to miss many of the nuances which make those albums so great.

Couldn't agree more. YT is fine for a preview but prog needs to be experienced fully.
 
You both missed the point, I think.
 
It was basically stating, that at the very least, after 5 or 10 minutes, you would be able to say to yourself ... this requires more listening, or a different, and more serious listen.
 
BOOM
 
Now you know. I admit to being lazy to not listening to a lot of things, but using YT as an excuse for my lazyness is bad, and I can not do that. Not to mention that PA also has so many links that you can die before you get to listen to 5% of them in your lifetime!
 
A nuance is always there in music. The fidelity of that nuance, does not always change the appreciation of it, though it might want you to go listen to it within a better context than cheap mp3 format! The music is not different and its inherant "feeling" is not different. YOUR EXPERIENCE of that feeling that comes from it, is a bit different, though as your perception now hears something else from it.
 
At issue, and a problem is that most folks seem to be looking for "copies" and "lookalikes" with the same sound, and of course, any example is going to throw you off. Don't you think that would be your issue, not the music's?
 
Thus I have no issues, but I'm not going to waste my time listening to Rush of Kansas again. Doesn't mean I don't like them. There is just too much out there to go after that is far better and more interesting for my ears.
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twosteves View Drop Down
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Points: 4095 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 23 2014 at 09:16
agree with moshkito and get where he is coming from.Wink
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Points: 29630 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 23 2014 at 15:25
Originally posted by presdoug presdoug wrote:


                           And don't call me "junior", I happen to be 51 years old.


I'm 48 and I'm going to call you "junior" because, frankly, I'm confused. LOL
Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...
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moshkito View Drop Down
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Points: 18058 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 23 2014 at 16:04
Hi,
Originally posted by twosteves twosteves wrote:

agree with moshkito and get where he is coming from.Wink
 
I kinda was able to verbalize this better when I heard the Steven Wilson mixes for the first King Crimson album.
The fact that one instrument was here and the other over there, and later I moved 10 paces and now a different instrument is here and another is there, made no difference to my initial undersanding and vision of the work.
 
None whatsoever.
 
It became just "mechanics" and what I called the "psychic moment" that it happened will forever be there. I doubt that the moment itself can be "changed" from the original, and that moment is long gone in time. If anything, for me, the Steven Wilson remaster/remix was sloppy and cheesy, and simply trying to make it sound more like today's music that lacks personality and has it replaced by the slickness of the studio and the DAW's.
 
But there is a problem here. We never heard Beethoven and how it was done 150 years ago, so how can we say that this recording is better than that because it was remastered, or remixed.
 
In some ways, to me, that DEHUMANIZES the music, and I think we need to remember that.
 
Sorry Steven, but you are too lost in your mechanics to know an inner feeling, from an idea.
Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
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Points: 37575 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 23 2014 at 16:13
..and so endeth the lesson for today.
What?
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Points: 2162 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 23 2014 at 16:13
There's only one or two Rush albums I've listened to all the way through..
Because I always have to turn it off.  Not my thing
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