Flower Kings Appreciation Thread

M27Barney wrote: Roland113 wrote: M27Barney wrote: Anthony H. wrote: I don't get the impression that Roine is a particularly religious guy. Perhaps he isn't - but would a geezer who wasn't religious mention the Bible/religious themes in nearly every song he pens the lyrics for.... He's particularly fond of the Book of Genesis......Maybe it's just all a unconscious link to Gabriel Era Supremacy...... It's been said before by others far more versed than I, but, he has said in the past that he is not a fan of organized religion but he is rather spiritual.  I don't have the full lyrics for numbers in front of me but in my mind, the lyric that you were saying before could be a reference to someone being stuck between a rock and a hard place.   I see no evidence of his Emnity - towards Christianity...and evertbody baulks at taking the piss out of the Koran...Muslims tend to get a 'tad' upset about the slightest suggestions that their holy book is anything but the immutable word of god... And whilst the brilliant "Life of Brian" is an hilarious poke in the eye for Jesus Freaks...Those wacky python boys didn't follow it up with a similar historical satire on the ramblings of the Arabian warlord who disappeared into a cave for years and then claimed that "God" had revealed the "Truth" to him.....   "The Whirlwind" is a sublime piece of music.....but I have tp deliberately ignore the god-bothering lyrics......Morse is a "Born Again".....the worst type of Christian by a long chalk - I should know - my Mum became one about 5 years ago...and she now wears a huge fookin cross round her neck and knits jumpers for the African kids..... She told me that I will regret my non-belief when i start to burn for eternity.....I told her that if she wishes to worship a God who would perpetrate such atrocities and she should be wearing a swastika alongside the crucifix...She wasn't best pleased.....

Roine has never had any enmity towards Christianity or any other religion.  I think I may have posted before, but he things they all have good moral points, but are not worthy individually of being followed.  He only seems to "take the piss out of" material things, like wars, banking, love of money, narcissism, etc.  He seems to have respect for religious beliefs while feeling that religion itself is flawed.  As to the focus on Christianity, he's a white European, so I don't really see that he is going to have a lot of knowledge of other religions, especially since he doesn't appear to have studied any religion in depth.  Just my take, again, based on things he has written.

I guess I don't understand your sensitivity to Christian oriented lyrics.  I agree that sometimes they can be incredibly cheesy and tedious (Neal Morse, I'm looking at you), but I don't have any problem with them beyond that.  I'm not a complete atheist, however, since I can't say with complete certainty that there is no God whatsoever.  If you can, more power to you.  In any case, it just doesn't bother me, especially in Roine's case, where he seems to focus on moral lessons in the bible, and not really on the god bothering and jesus praise that someone like Morse focuses on.  I think it's obvious Roine believes in some sort of God, and that he is most familiar with Christianity, of all religions.  I'd say at worst though, he's agnostic.

It's funny, because I agree with your views on religion more than Roine's (and certainly Neal's), so it's strange that I'm always defending Roine to you.  I suppose he could be a closet Christian, but I think he just likes to focus on the positive and sees that in some aspects of Christianity.  He has plenty of non-religious happy lyrics though (Chicken Farmer Song comes to mind  )

Roj M30 wrote: zumacraig wrote: looks like kaipa have a new one coming out next month.  i've had notes from the past for several weeks now and i just cannot get into it. i like the third song.  i've read that the post roine albums are less TFK sounding.  i think i'll check out a few of those.  it's funny, but roine in this band doesn't heighten my interest at all.  fwiw, the cover for the new album is awesome!   I'm not a big fan of Notes From The Past either.  I tried but it just didn't hit the spot.  Keyholder is fantastic however, and the last one was pretty good too.  I think I'll check out the new one.  Presumably Jonas is on it?  He has been busy.

Yeah, Keyholder is easily my favorite, though I find the last 3 tracks of that one to be less enjoyable than the rest.  The last Kaipa seemed to be more of the same to me, and I just never got into it, but it's not bad by any means.

It pains me to put The Rainmaker at the bottom of the TFK album list every time. I enjoy it so much.

darkshade wrote: @ zumacraig - why would you want to sell those Tangent and Kaipa CDs? After I explored Transatlantic, and an album here and there from TFK, Karmakanic, and Neal Morse, I couldn't stop collecting related bands' albums. The only thing I'm missing is Kaipa's albums and HFMC albums, as well as whatever Spock's, Tomas Bodin and Roine solo albums I'm missing. I tried out a 70s Kaipa album, but it didn't grab me (I know, needs repeated listens). It wasn't what I was looking for at the time, so I'll try some 2000s Kaipa albums (Keyholder). Also, been meaning to check out the new HFMC album. I love The Tangent, both with and without Roine. In fact, I think their latest album "COMM" is their best one, closely followed by the debut and A Place In the Queue.

zumacraig wrote: okay, lot's to respond too. re: roine and christianity...infandous, kudos to you for trying your damnedest to explain that roine is not a christian!  :)  when you get down to it, roine is all about compassion.  care for others, do no harm etc.  i just think it's a waste of time to 'get offended' by other people's beliefs.  as far as neal goes, he's a classic born again.  really excited for a while, joins a cult (which he did before christianity) and quits the band.  now, he's mellowed out a bit, thank 'god' :) as far as TA goes, i love the idea of comfort prog. that's my thing i guess.  i can't think of any other supergroup that has really delivered the goods like TA.  it really seems to be a group project.  as far as tangent and kaipa go, i think my difficulty with them is that they really aren't roine's bands and he has no real say in them (when he was in them).  i've realized i'm just going to have to hold off on getting into those TFK offshoots.  i'm much more inclined towards HFMC, AoM, TA.  kaipa sounds good and is flawlessly produced, but something doesn't click.  oh well.  when i get bored with all the rest, i'll pick up keyholder. btw-i had to do some work to find CD copies of the first Tangent and first Kaipa.  i may sell them, so if anyone is interested, pm me>

Dude, Roine co-writes most of the music and lyrics on Keyholder and has one song all his own, so you might want to consider that one.  He had a lot of input on it, which was not true at all for the other two second era Kaipa albums he was on (Notes and Mindrevolutions).  Just saying, you might be interested in that one, and it might be the only one worth having.  Personally, I really like Notes as well, but along with Keyholder, that's pretty much it for my enjoyment of second era Kaipa.  First era Kaipa, from the the 70's, is very much a band, with Roine contributing as much as the keyboard player (can't think of his name at the moment).  In fact, the 3rd album, Solo is pretty much dominated by Roine's tunes.  Of course, the music is much more laid back than TFK's, and wasn't really something that would be considered top shelf prog from the 70's, but it's still good stuff.

^ Pehaps enough of deep theological hypothesizing......Anyway we are united by our love of music, just listened to Disc 1 of Stardust We Are......Bloody Hell - I don't remember it being just so fecking GOOD......

infandous wrote: zumacraig wrote: okay, lot's to respond too. re: roine and christianity...infandous, kudos to you for trying your damnedest to explain that roine is not a christian!  :)  when you get down to it, roine is all about compassion.  care for others, do no harm etc.  i just think it's a waste of time to 'get offended' by other people's beliefs.  as far as neal goes, he's a classic born again.  really excited for a while, joins a cult (which he did before christianity) and quits the band.  now, he's mellowed out a bit, thank 'god' :) as far as TA goes, i love the idea of comfort prog. that's my thing i guess.  i can't think of any other supergroup that has really delivered the goods like TA.  it really seems to be a group project.  as far as tangent and kaipa go, i think my difficulty with them is that they really aren't roine's bands and he has no real say in them (when he was in them).  i've realized i'm just going to have to hold off on getting into those TFK offshoots.  i'm much more inclined towards HFMC, AoM, TA.  kaipa sounds good and is flawlessly produced, but something doesn't click.  oh well.  when i get bored with all the rest, i'll pick up keyholder. btw-i had to do some work to find CD copies of the first Tangent and first Kaipa.  i may sell them, so if anyone is interested, pm me> Dude, Roine co-writes most of the music and lyrics on Keyholder and has one song all his own, so you might want to consider that one.  He had a lot of input on it, which was not true at all for the other two second era Kaipa albums he was on (Notes and Mindrevolutions).  Just saying, you might be interested in that one, and it might be the only one worth having.  Personally, I really like Notes as well, but along with Keyholder, that's pretty much it for my enjoyment of second era Kaipa.  First era Kaipa, from the the 70's, is very much a band, with Roine contributing as much as the keyboard player (can't think of his name at the moment).  In fact, the 3rd album, Solo is pretty much dominated by Roine's tunes.  Of course, the music is much more laid back than TFK's, and wasn't really something that would be considered top shelf prog from the 70's, but it's still good stuff.

^He's also on a number of live bootlegs. He played with them on their early live shows and a handful of tours afterwards. Actually on their first tour he was something of a frontman, and probably the biggest name involved in the project.

Edited by Harry Hood - July 12 2012 at 23:39

Well i'm happy they ditched the saxophonist - i don't like sax - replace with synth / guitar....every time for me...

M27Barney wrote: Well i'm happy they ditched the saxophonist - i don't like sax - replace with synth / guitar....every time for me...

I loved his contributions, but he hasn't been on an album since Unfold, and was always listed as a "guest", rather than a band member.  He never played at any live performances, either (unlike Brunuisson......who is also listed as "guest" on a number of the albums he appears on, and only played on some tracks of Paradox Hotel).