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JayDee
Forum Senior Member
VIP Member
Joined: September 07 2005
Location: Elysian Fields
Status: Offline
Points: 10063
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Posted: August 11 2008 at 08:55 |
fandango wrote:
^^quite right...I think it's about time this thread was locked, before some smart-arse decides that Pink Floyd or Genesis shoudn't be here.... |
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iguana
Forum Senior Member
Joined: July 01 2005
Location: Germany
Status: Offline
Points: 825
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Posted: August 11 2008 at 09:55 |
even the most open minded and in musical taste most versatile and best established
cannot be here without having a major question mark above band's names, be it
a commercially successful, “prog-related“ (your term, not mine), a stadium rock
or just a good rock’nroll act. which is why i would like to put in a vote for QUEEN.
this has nothing to do with their importance as a band.
and while we're at it – DOORS and SANTANA are an iffy issue for me, too. so what!
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progressive rock and rural tranquility don't match. true or false?
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Yorkie X
Forum Senior Member
Joined: July 04 2007
Status: Offline
Points: 1049
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Posted: August 11 2008 at 10:29 |
retracted my comment after thinking about it ... dont read this its pointless and a waste of your time
Edited by Yorkie X - August 11 2008 at 11:48
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LeInsomniac
Forum Senior Member
Joined: December 22 2006
Location: Portugal
Status: Offline
Points: 315
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Posted: August 11 2008 at 11:10 |
Some groups don't need to be here, Ill give some examples: Muse, Radiohead, Queen, Talk Talk, Iron Maiden, 10 CC, and Black Sabbath, but thats just my opinion; even David Bowie which I ove shouldnt be here, and its not because of comercial sucess, its mainly because of they're lack of (if we may call it that) progressiveness in the composition in their works;
And the whole idea of Proto-Prog and Prog-Related may be a cute idea to make people learn of some theories of pseudo-origins of other certain prog-rock groups, well if thats so, lets put proto-jazz or something, cause, it was jazz that eventually led to the birth of rock and blues.
Well, let the debate that won't get anywhere...continue.
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Happy Family One Hand Clap, Four Went On But None Came Back
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MikeEnRegalia
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: April 22 2005
Location: Sweden
Status: Offline
Points: 21156
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Posted: August 11 2008 at 11:17 |
It's quite depressing to see how many votes this poll is getting.
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dzx
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 23 2008
Location: france
Status: Offline
Points: 117
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Posted: August 11 2008 at 11:23 |
From being open minded to its definitions of 'prog' this site has become THE resource on the web for discovering good music with reviews that for the most part can be relied upon as being subjective and informative. If you dont believe me visit some of the metal sites which review as a percentage where you find idiots rating albums with every song as 100 cause they like it and others at 0 cause they dont.
Sabbath not prog? give me a break
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was that just an Am augmented minor 9th i heard? nice!
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dzx
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 23 2008
Location: france
Status: Offline
Points: 117
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Posted: August 11 2008 at 11:40 |
King Crimson
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was that just an Am augmented minor 9th i heard? nice!
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WinterLight
Forum Senior Member
Joined: June 09 2008
Status: Offline
Points: 424
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Posted: August 11 2008 at 11:46 |
Something to consider: one need not enjoy or approve of every band featured in the Archives. In fact, you do have the option of not liking every artist sanctioned as "Prog."
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Roj
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: July 02 2008
Location: Manchester, UK
Status: Offline
Points: 3126
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Posted: August 11 2008 at 12:10 |
^ Exactly Winterlight. If you don't like a group, don't read about them, that's what I say. No vote on this poll from me.
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Syzygy
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: December 16 2004
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 7003
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Posted: August 11 2008 at 12:12 |
erik neuteboom wrote:
delete |
Spot on as always, Erik !
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'Like so many of you
I've got my doubts about how much to contribute
to the already rich among us...'
Robert Wyatt, Gloria Gloom
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Logan
Forum & Site Admin Group
Site Admin
Joined: April 05 2006
Location: Vancouver, BC
Status: Offline
Points: 35804
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Posted: August 11 2008 at 12:24 |
Roj M30 wrote:
^ Exactly Winterlight. If you don't like a group, don't read about them, that's what I say. No vote on this poll from me. |
We're all different. Even if I don't like a group I may still want to read about it as I'm interested in things outside of my tastes, and one may like a group that one still doesn't think appropriate to its category, or even to PA. I'm quite inclusive -- provided I think a band/ artist has been categorised reasonably well, and have hoped to see progressive archives progress into more progressive music (even if not really Prog) -- of course this may require new "progreessive" categories for reasonable placement. There are some bands/ artists whose category I would change (and some I'd move to prog-related if it were up to me), but I wouldn't want to remove bands from the archives --a lot of work and preparation has gone into the additions (from evaluation, discussing and even debating the merits/ category, to preparing the addition). It would be unfair on the people who went to all that work to just remove an addition. Each proper addition, ones that follow the guidelines, involves considerable work.
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dzx
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 23 2008
Location: france
Status: Offline
Points: 117
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Posted: August 11 2008 at 12:26 |
Logan wrote:
Roj M30 wrote:
^ Exactly Winterlight. If you don't like a group, don't read about them, that's what I say. No vote on this poll from me. |
We're all different. Even if I don't like a group I may still want to read about it as I'm interested in things outside of my tastes, and one may like a group that one still doesn't think appropriate to its category, or even to PA.
I'm quite inclusive -- provided I think a band/ artist has been categorised reasonably well, and have hoped to see progressive archives progress into more progressive music (even if not really Prog) -- of course this may require new "progreessive" categories for reasonable placement.
There are some bands/ artists whose category I would change (and some I'd move to prog-related if it were up to me), but I wouldn't want to remove bands from the archives --a lot of work and preparation has gone into the additions (from evaluation, discussing and even debating the merits/ category, to preparing the addition). It would be unfair on the people who went to all that work to just remove an addition. Each proper addition, ones that follow the guidelines, involves considerable work.
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was that just an Am augmented minor 9th i heard? nice!
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dzx
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 23 2008
Location: france
Status: Offline
Points: 117
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Posted: August 11 2008 at 12:29 |
Logan wrote:
Roj M30 wrote:
^ Exactly Winterlight. If you don't like a group, don't read about them, that's what I say. No vote on this poll from me. |
We're all different. Even if I don't like a group I may still want to read about it as I'm interested in things outside of my tastes, and one may like a group that one still doesn't think appropriate to its category, or even to PA.
I'm quite inclusive -- provided I think a band/ artist has been categorised reasonably well, and have hoped to see progressive archives progress into more progressive music (even if not really Prog) -- of course this may require new "progreessive" categories for reasonable placement.
There are some bands/ artists whose category I would change (and some I'd move to prog-related if it were up to me), but I wouldn't want to remove bands from the archives --a lot of work and preparation has gone into the additions (from evaluation, discussing and even debating the merits/ category, to preparing the addition). It would be unfair on the people who went to all that work to just remove an addition. Each proper addition, ones that follow the guidelines, involves considerable work.
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At the risk of being pertinent I really think Tori Amos should be included as shes a lot more prog than a lot of artists here and for me is a real omission
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was that just an Am augmented minor 9th i heard? nice!
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Roj
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: July 02 2008
Location: Manchester, UK
Status: Offline
Points: 3126
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Posted: August 11 2008 at 12:36 |
^ Personally, I DO read about other bands, whether I like them or not. What I am saying is that if a band is not considered prog by a section of our posters this does not merit a band's exclusion. If you feel that strongly, just leave it alone, don't bother reading.
This is an amazing website and gives me an immense amount of enjoyment, exchanging news and views with likeminded proggies. I've learnt so much from this site, and I don't know how I managed without it.
You won't find any negativity from me, sorry if my last post came across differently
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Logan
Forum & Site Admin Group
Site Admin
Joined: April 05 2006
Location: Vancouver, BC
Status: Offline
Points: 35804
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Posted: August 11 2008 at 12:38 |
dzx wrote:
Logan wrote:
Roj M30 wrote:
^ Exactly Winterlight. If you don't like a group, don't read about them, that's what I say. No vote on this poll from me. |
We're all different. Even if I don't like a group I may still want to read about it as I'm interested in things outside of my tastes, and one may like a group that one still doesn't think appropriate to its category, or even to PA.
I'm quite inclusive -- provided I think a band/ artist has been categorised reasonably well, and have hoped to see progressive archives progress into more progressive music (even if not really Prog) -- of course this may require new "progreessive" categories for reasonable placement.
There are some bands/ artists whose category I would change (and some I'd move to prog-related if it were up to me), but I wouldn't want to remove bands from the archives --a lot of work and preparation has gone into the additions (from evaluation, discussing and even debating the merits/ category, to preparing the addition). It would be unfair on the people who went to all that work to just remove an addition. Each proper addition, ones that follow the guidelines, involves considerable work.
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At the risk of being pertinent I really think Tori Amos should be included as shes a lot more prog than a lot of artists here and for me is a real omission |
I think I lent support to Tori Amos before when she was suggested for inclusion -- hmm, I seem to remember that it was suggested that she, along with female artists such as Bjork, Laurie Anderson and Kate Bush, be included in a new category -- Chick Prog. Not PC I know -- don't shoot the messenger.
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dzx
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 23 2008
Location: france
Status: Offline
Points: 117
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Posted: August 11 2008 at 12:43 |
Roj M30 wrote:
^ Personally, I DO read about other bands, whether I like them or not. What I am saying is that if a band is not considered prog by a section of our posters this does not merit a band's exclusion. If you feel that strongly, just leave it alone, don't bother reading.
This is an amazing website and gives me an immense amount of enjoyment, exchanging news and views with likeminded proggies. I've learnt so much from this site, and I don't know how I managed without it.
You won't find any negativity from me, sorry if my last post came across differently
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it didnt come across differently and I agree with your views wholeheartedly. This site is a pleasure of discovery and diverseness
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was that just an Am augmented minor 9th i heard? nice!
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Logan
Forum & Site Admin Group
Site Admin
Joined: April 05 2006
Location: Vancouver, BC
Status: Offline
Points: 35804
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Posted: August 11 2008 at 12:57 |
Roj M30 wrote:
^ Personally, I DO read about other bands, whether I like them or not. What I am saying is that if a band is not considered prog by a section of our posters this does not merit a band's exclusion. If you feel that strongly, just leave it alone, don't bother reading.
This is an amazing website and gives me an immense amount of enjoyment, exchanging news and views with likeminded proggies. I've learnt so much from this site, and I don't know how I managed without it.
You won't find any negativity from me, sorry if my last post came across differently |
I wanted to go on a tangent since I've seen it said by a number of people that if you don't like a band, ignore it (which wouldn't work for me, because I want to gain more general knowledge -- though this is just a hobby for me and isn't like, say when I was in film studies which required me to watch and learn about films that I didn't inherently enjoy). For passionate music lovers, and people who are passionate about this site's direction, as well people who just like to debate merits as well as those who actually evaluate music for the site, it's not surprising that some wish to read and post their opinions about merits. Again, we're all different. I find such discussion stimulating. Controversy is stimulating. My opinions are expressed in my post before, but I respect that others feel and wish to express themselves differently. I feel strongly, and get worked up, about wars, yet I still follow it. I would rather people discuss such issues in a less passionate and more rational way, but, hey that's me. Anyway, this topic also relates to the site's direction, how inclusive should PA be? Ultimately that's up to the owners, but those who care about the site will have an opinion. And I generally find exchanges between not so like-minded proggies more interesting (must admit that I prefer getting involved in polite discussion than heated debate as I'm pretty casual in life). Conflict is at the root of drama, and drama can be very entertaining.
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dzx
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 23 2008
Location: france
Status: Offline
Points: 117
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Posted: August 11 2008 at 13:04 |
Logan wrote:
dzx wrote:
Logan wrote:
Roj M30 wrote:
^ Exactly Winterlight. If you don't like a group, don't read about them, that's what I say. No vote on this poll from me. |
We're all different. Even if I don't like a group I may still want to read about it as I'm interested in things outside of my tastes, and one may like a group that one still doesn't think appropriate to its category, or even to PA.
I'm quite inclusive -- provided I think a band/ artist has been categorised reasonably well, and have hoped to see progressive archives progress into more progressive music (even if not really Prog) -- of course this may require new "progreessive" categories for reasonable placement.
There are some bands/ artists whose category I would change (and some I'd move to prog-related if it were up to me), but I wouldn't want to remove bands from the archives --a lot of work and preparation has gone into the additions (from evaluation, discussing and even debating the merits/ category, to preparing the addition). It would be unfair on the people who went to all that work to just remove an addition. Each proper addition, ones that follow the guidelines, involves considerable work.
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At the risk of being pertinent I really think Tori Amos should be included as shes a lot more prog than a lot of artists here and for me is a real omission |
I think I lent support to Tori Amos before when she was suggested for inclusion -- hmm, I seem to remember that it was suggested that she, along with female artists such as Bjork, Laurie Anderson and Kate Bush, be included in a new category -- Chick Prog. Not PC I know -- don't shoot the messenger.
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Forgot about Bjork. If there ever was an experimental artist she is the epitome, ever changing, ever progressing!
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was that just an Am augmented minor 9th i heard? nice!
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unclemeat69
Forum Senior Member
Joined: April 14 2007
Location: Netherlands
Status: Offline
Points: 362
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Posted: August 11 2008 at 13:17 |
leave 'em all in here, I would say, as the acts I know (like Black Sabbath, Iron Maiden, Kate Bush, the Beatles etc.)all did at the very least have some progressive tendencies at some point, with the Beatles being among those showing the way to go.
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Follow your bliss
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Norbert
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 20 2005
Location: Hungary
Status: Offline
Points: 2506
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Posted: August 11 2008 at 13:37 |
For instance Radiohead's Kid A is a commercial album? I have no issues with this bands in the Archives, they are not Gentle Giant, but have some great music, with some proggy tendencies.
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