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Finnforest View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 08 2014 at 23:19
David we have similar tastes....I love stroganoff.  One of those dishes Mom used to make perfectly that I've yet to try myself.  Soon though! Smile
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 09 2014 at 00:12
^ it's one of my all time favorites, Jim, been making it since I was a kid and perfecting it ever since.   The secret is a slow & low simmer so the flavors of the mushrooms, beef and sourcream all come together.  Good luck!

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 09 2014 at 03:01
I love stroganoff - it is one of my celebration dishes for special occasions because the fillet steak and the wild mushrooms (ie enoki, canterelle etc) I use are expensive ingredients. I make mine in completely the opposite way to David, fast and furious. 

The only slow cooking is sweating down the finely chopped onion with some crushed garlic in a little oil over a low heat until they are soft (maybe 5 minutes), then the heat is kicked up a notch and the sliced mushrooms added and sautéed until cooked through (perhaps another 5 minutes). Sometimes I add a splash of white wine or brandy here but that depends on the quality of the mushrooms and how much liquid comes out of them. While this is happening I slice the steak into thin strips no more than 5mm wide and season it salt, pepper, paprika and perhaps a little grated lemon zest if I have used lemon juice to sour the cream (having forgotten to buy crème fraîche). The mushrooms and onions are remove from the pan and the heat is whacked up to high before quickly searing the steak strips until they are browned but still rare to medium rare (this is fillet steak after all, but the same would apply to rib-eye or sirloin), this should take no more than 1 to 2 minutes. The pan is removed from the heat and the crème fraîche (or sour cream) added so that cooks-out in the residual heat of the pan before the mushrooms and onions are mixed back in with masses of chopped parsley. Personally I don't cook anything in cream, always adding it at the end of the cooking away from the heat so it doesn't split (curdle). Sometimes I throw in a few halved seedless grapes and very occasionally a few chopped gerkins (dill pickle) just to add a bit of variety. Served on a bed of white basmati and wild rice and dusted with more paprika.

Adding the cream at the end, off the heat, is also the secret to a perfect carbonara. While the pasta is cooking chopped panacetta is fried off with a little garlic (less than half a bulb) until the bacon is crispy. The egg and cream are whisked together to form a smooth sauce, and to that the finely grated cheese (pecorino and parmesan) is added and seasoned with a good grind of black pepper. Once the pasta is cooked it is quickly drained leaving a few spoonfuls of the cooking water in the pan, I often add a splash of extra virgin olive oil to the pan as well before returning the drained pasta as this will stop it sticking. The panacetta is mixed in and then the egg-cream-cheese sauce, which should cook in the residual heat in the spagetti to produce a smooth rich sauce that coats every strand of pasta. I've been served spagetti carbonara in Italian restaurants that either resembles scrambled eggs or curds and whey, neither are enjoyable.


Edited by Dean - November 09 2014 at 03:03
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 09 2014 at 03:14
^ I used to do a quick-style too and it can be very good.   My solution to avoiding curdling is tempering the sourcream with some liquid from the pan slowly until it can be added back, then simmer 'till flavors have unified.   I never add extras like wine, mustard, worcesteshire or anything else common to this dish, I find it alters the flavors too much.   In Russia they do a different affair all together with the steak separate from the mushroom/sourcream mixture, then eaten together on the same plate.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 09 2014 at 03:45
For me the cooking time is determined by the type of steak being cooked - slow and low is good for cheaper cuts but I couldn't do that to fillet or rib-eye. As I said, the addition of wine is determined by the mushrooms, if they don't produce much liquid of their own, or have a bland flavour, I'll boost them with a splash of wine or brandy but moderation is the key, it is there to keep the 'shrooms moist, not to make a sauce. Paprika (again in moderation - just a pinch to enhance the flavour of the beef, this isn't a goulash) trumps mustard in a stroganoff - dijon and whole grain mustards are too sweet and english too overpowering (apparently other mustards exist but mostly they are just florescent yellow gloop best kept for hotdogs).

I avoid using Worcestershire sauce unless I'm cooking a robust beef dish like osso-buco or ox-tail, it's too much of a flavour-thug even in small doses. 


I made salt-beef last week and it's been the best I've ever made - rather than the normal brisket of beef I used a shin of beef brined for 7 days (water, smoked-salt, muscavado sugar, salt-petre, juniper berries, black pepper corns and several bay leaves) and then slowly poached for 3 hours in a broth of carrot, celery, onion and bouquet garni. Allowed to cool and thinly sliced in a sandwich with lashings of piccalilli... yum Approve 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 09 2014 at 03:53
What's your cream ratio?   I normally make a creamy sauce but sometimes just a dab will make a browner sort of ragù which can be good too.

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 09 2014 at 04:01
That's a by-eye measurement for me, but usually around 150ml at a guess - it depends on how much liquid came out of the mushrooms and steak, but generally I'm after a pale-brown colour to the sauce and a coating consistency - what I don't want is something that looks like it is swimming in an insipidly beige mushroom soup.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 09 2014 at 04:12
LOL  I had a friend who hated the dish and described it as "grey".  

For me what's important is that marriage of deep mushroom flavor with beef, cream and onion.   I'm a better seasoner now too, so I always salt&pepper the beef as well as the finished sauce.   I used to put it over rice but later I realized how perfect egg noodles go with it, I had fettuccine tonight but it wasn't the same.




Edited by Atavachron - November 09 2014 at 04:13
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 09 2014 at 05:32
Stroganoff is my "show-off" dish that I use to impress people with - the fast and furious method is far from fool-proof and requires constant attention to balance the flavours and consistency, I never cook it the same way twice as every step is determined by how the individual ingredients cook. It's like cooking fish dishes - they have to be cooked by the "seat of your pants" because when they go wrong the result is a spectacular disaster.

I prefer egg-noodles to durum wheat pasta any day of the week - I'm not a great fan of cous-cous either but slowly coming around to it. For stroganoff I prefer the nutty flavour of wild rice but since that is not to everyone's taste I mix it with plain white (or brown) basmati.

I have to admit that I have never cooked stroganoff by the slow and low method even though most of the meat dishes I make are cooked that way because I can start them while I'm having my mid-day snack and leave them cooking away until Debs comes home from work in the evening. Slow cooking is fool-proof and difficult to get wrong.


Some of my favourite slow-cooks:

All chilli and ragù - most ground mince is generally made from the toughest meat there is so needs to be slow-cooked to render out the fat and collagen, this improves the flavour and consistency of the sauce. I avoid these cheaper minces when making burgers. A ragù only gets better with longer cooking, it never gets worse and can never be overcooked as far as I am concerned. I have recently been adding a single star-annise to the cooking, and for chilli occasionally I'll grate in some 70-80% cocao chocolate before serving. Unfortunately once I accidentally dropped a chunk of chocolate into the sauce and didn't bother to retrieve it, rather than melt it stayed as a solid lump that Debs discovered while eating the meal - she wasn't impressed.
Short ribs - seared in a hot skillet then brined for 24 hours before slow braising for 3 hours in red-wine, beef stock and passata. After cooking and removing the meat for slicing, the cooking broth is rapidly boiled so that it reduced by at least a half and a good knob of butter is stirred-in to produce a rich glossy sauce. Served with creamy mashed potatoes and seasonal veg.
Dry-roast Fore-rib of beef - there are two schools of thought on this - fast and furious and slow and low - and I like both equally. Usually when pressed for time I'll just roast it in the oven on a high heat. When time permitted I have done the ten hours at 100ºC method in my ProQ smoker and it was impressive but one day I'd like to have a go at Blumenthal's 72 hour sous-vide method which I believe can be done in a rice-cooker.
Roast Flat Brisket - marinated in a dry-rub of smoked-salt, cayenne, paprika and chilli flakes for 24hrs, braised for several hours in beer and beef stock before quickly broiling to further enhance the flavour. The heat from the pepper and chilli generally kicks-in after the second or third mouthful and it is glorious.
Osso Buco - 1" slices of beef or pork shanks complete with shin-bone slowly cooked with the holy trinity of onion, celery and carrot in white wine until the bone-marrow dissolves into the sauce. (no tomatoes - should be cooked "bianco") - served topped with gremolata of lemon zest, crushed garlic and chopped parsley.
Puerco Pibil -basically I follow Robert Rodriquez recipe from Once Upon A Time In Mexico to the letter (except without the banana leaves as these are pretty rare in rural England) - I haven't perfected this yet but love the flavour of oranges and annato seeds with the pork.
Pulled-pork - marinated in a dry rub, slow cooked until it falls apart - served with apple sauce - 'nuff said.
Goulash - pork shoulder stewed in a broth of chilli, bell-pepper, paprika and onions with a splash of red-wine vinegar for many hours until the pork falls to pieces - served with soured cream stirred in at the last minute.
Coq-au-vin - chicken thighs (bone-in) seared in a skillet to render out the fat and colour the skin, slowly braised on the hob for 3-4 hours in a bottle of good quality table wine (red or white) with whole baby onions and small button mushrooms... I serve this with buttered jersey royal potatoes rather than rice and sometimes will cook the potatoes in with the chicken, onions and mushrooms.
Cassolette - confit duck legs, ham and sausage in a broth of beans with a herby breadcrumb crust - next to bouillabaisse this is the ultimate French stew for me. 
Gammon in Coke-Cola  - This sounds like utter madness but it works perfectly - I've tried using cider and apple juice instead but nothing beats the flavours produced by slow-poaching in cola. I guess you could use Pepsi or Dr Pepper if you must.
Tagine - there are no rules to a tagine just as there is no fixed recipe for a ras el hanout spice-mix though I prefer lamb, dried apricots and the aforementioned ras el hanout.

...I have yet to cook beer-can chicken, mainly because I buy my beer in bottles not cans.


Edited by Dean - November 09 2014 at 05:47
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 09 2014 at 06:02
I love a good goulash, and with a glob of sourcream, oh mama I'm home.   Sadly most I've had is bland and fairly appalling, and I've never made it myself.   My suspicion is that, ironically, it's hard to get good deep flavor from a dish that has everything in it.

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 09 2014 at 06:46
I know what you mean, much of what is served up in restaurants borders on unpleasant. Stews in generally remind me too much of bland school dinners and school goulash was the worse of those.

A good goulash should be deep and smoky and even though tomatoes form the base of the sauce, it should taste peppery not of tomato.

So the key to a great goulash are the peppers - the meat is secondary, in fact the cheaper the cut of pork the better - lots of fat but no skin and taken off the bone is ideal. I don't think it is possible to make a small goulash - you need at least 3lbs of pork - I roughly cut this into pretty large pieces - probably around a quarter of a pound each - after seasoning it with a little salt and a lot of black pepper I'll sear this in a skillet to render out most of the outer fat layer - and to boost the caramelised flavour. 

I use a couple of large chilli peppers, de-seeded and finely chopped, several (3 or 4) fresh bell-peppers, again de-seed and sliced and a jar of grilled peppers (skin removed). You can grill your own peppers but the preserved ones add a certain je ne sais quoi to the final dish - I tend not to chop them up too much and leave them in large chunks. All these peppers are cooked together with some finely sliced red onion, a tin of plumb tomatoes and a lot of paprika for ten to fifteen minutes. I'll use equal measures of hot and sweet paprika, but it has to be smoked - at least one heaped tablespoonful is the minimum, two is ideal. Because I don't like eating pieces of cooked plumb tomato I will blitz them in a blender with the paprika before using them but most people prefer to use them straight out of the tin. For seasoning I'll use fennel seeds (the aniseed flavour works really well) and whatever fresh herbs are growing in the garden (thyme, marjoram or oregano) - never dried even though they can be used because of the slow cook. Once the peppers and tomato stock has had its 10 minutes pre-cooking, add the pork and use just enough water to cover the meat, stir in two tablespoons of red-wine vinegar and put in a medium oven for at least 3 hours. When the pork can be easily pulled apart it is cooked, but you cannot overcook it so there is no point in preparing the accompaniments (rice or whatever) until the goulash has reached perfection. 

The result should be quite fiery but not so hot as it rips the skin from your throat as you eat it, hence the need for as you say, a good glob of soured cream. 

I'm hungry now and it's been a while since I cooked a goulash, If I wasn't working away from home next week it would certainly be on the mid-week menu now.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 09 2014 at 14:19
Hear, hear. Nice to read the above - did a Stroganoff myself tonight. First time in a while that I really had time to spare in the kitchen. Reordering priorities leads to good things, apparently.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 09 2014 at 18:23
Wow this thread has me hungry....
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 10 2014 at 03:54
Still had some fettuccine so I made pasta alioli, simple but delicious; olive oil in a warm skillet with three large chopped garlic cloves; saute till tender but not brown; add salt&pepper, a knob of butter, a pinch of red chili flakes, fresh chopped parsley (dry will do, if you must); toss pasta in skillet till coated, sprinkle grated Parm on top.   Very tasty.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 11 2014 at 03:46
A fat juicy burger tonight on a pretzel roll which I used for the first time and it works very well; the perfect texture for the big restaurant-style burger, soft without being mushy--  w/ cheese, lettuce, onion and tomato, and a black cherry cream soda on the side.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 16 2014 at 16:00
Today I got a bit creative with my new batch of applesauce.  Again I mix regular apples with MN crabapples for some tartness.  This time I threw in some cranberries which turned everything a bright red color.  Then I threw in a spot of good Bourbon and brown sugar.  I suspect the liquor will add some nice complexity to a fruit sauce but we'll have to see.  Too hot to eat right now! 


Edited by Finnforest - November 16 2014 at 16:01
...that moment you realize you like "Mob Rules" better than "Heaven and Hell"
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 16 2014 at 18:01
^
That was actually really nice Applesauce.  The small dose of cranberry gave it a deep red color, and the bourbon was a nice contrast to sweetness.  Rich tasting for something with no fat.  Worked well over a Vanilla bean ice cream but mostly I liked it plain.  Num. 




Edited by Finnforest - November 16 2014 at 18:02
...that moment you realize you like "Mob Rules" better than "Heaven and Hell"
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 16 2014 at 19:35
^ Spectacular, Jim, I really admire those sorts of preservings, sounds like you've got quite a knack for it.  Maybe a small business in the future?; Finny's Preserves ? Wink .    I'd buy some.

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 16 2014 at 20:39
Thanks David.  Boy that would be fun to start a little business like that.  I love cooking.  I've thought about breadmaking as a gig as I've had good results with that.  But I imagine the regulations involved in selling food would be soul crushingLOL
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 16 2014 at 20:47
I'd give my left nipple for some fresh-baked bread, the dense white homestyle, toasted with butter
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