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apps79 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote apps79 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 22 2010 at 15:21

Tragic mistake by a respected reviewer to post the same review for both MR SIRIUS albums:

 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Logan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 22 2010 at 15:29
I'd hardly call it tragic, but look in this forum a couple topics down and you'll see that's already alerted the site about his mistake.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote lazland Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 04 2010 at 13:40
Originally posted by clarke2001 clarke2001 wrote:

Is this review making sense?


Erm...No, not really, and I've tried a couple of times. No need for the bad language used and sounds like a commentary rather than a review, although I can't really tell.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AtomicCrimsonRush Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 04 2010 at 22:47
Originally posted by lazland lazland wrote:

Originally posted by clarke2001 clarke2001 wrote:

Is this review making sense?


Erm...No, not really, and I've tried a couple of times. No need for the bad language used and sounds like a commentary rather than a review, although I can't really tell.
The review is so weird that I think a person could write this without even listening to the actual songs
 
interesting though, certainly original approach - not the way i would ever write... reviews should tell you about the album itself
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Marty McFly Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 05 2010 at 03:24
Originally posted by AtomicCrimsonRush AtomicCrimsonRush wrote:

Originally posted by lazland lazland wrote:

Originally posted by clarke2001 clarke2001 wrote:

Is this review making sense?


Erm...No, not really, and I've tried a couple of times. No need for the bad language used and sounds like a commentary rather than a review, although I can't really tell.
The review is so weird that I think a person could write this without even listening to the actual songs
 
interesting though, certainly original approach - not the way i would ever write... reviews should tell you about the album itself

Yep, that's something I always am trying to pursuit.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Triceratopsoil Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 09 2010 at 21:53
Originally posted by Any Colour You Like Any Colour You Like wrote:

According to the band website, this album hasn't been released yet, but has been reviewed six times.

Confused


That's a ridiculously high rating for an unreleased album, going to call "sketchy fanboys" on that

{edited to add quote for context since this response to the quote is being moved to Reviews Discussion}


Edited by Logan - May 10 2010 at 19:10
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Any Colour You Like Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 09 2010 at 21:59
I remember the same thing happened with PT's last album. It is possible for those who have already reviewed it to be fan club members, but even then, the special pre-order edition is only out on the 17th. I'm calling those reviews seriously dodgy at best. Also, none of them have actually reviewed the album, just rated it (highly too) which makes it seem even more suspect.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote lazland Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 10 2010 at 14:49
Originally posted by Epignosis Epignosis wrote:

A retaliatory review from a disgruntled artist here:

http://www.progarchives.com/Review.asp?id=281237


To be fair, it's a reasonable defence of their case and work though, isn't it?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Epignosis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 10 2010 at 14:55
Originally posted by lazland lazland wrote:

Originally posted by Epignosis Epignosis wrote:

A retaliatory review from a disgruntled artist here:

http://www.progarchives.com/Review.asp?id=281237


To be fair, it's a reasonable defence of their case and work though, isn't it?


The phrase "prog snob" and the lambasting of other reviewers I believe would be against the rules:

Originally posted by Easy Livin Easy Livin wrote:

Do not belittle reviews posted by others, their opinions are as welcome and valid as yours. It is generally best to avoid commenting on other reviews altogether.


As an aside, I wonder why the author of that review even feels the need to defend his work (especially when almost all of reviewers gave it three stars or more). Ermm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Marty McFly Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 10 2010 at 15:38
 
Originally posted by Epignosis Epignosis wrote:


As an aside, I wonder why the author of that review even feels the need to defend his work (especially when almost all of reviewers gave it three stars or more). Ermm

Because for many people, average of 3 stars means extremely bad ? Just thinking.

There's a point where "avant-garde" and "experimental" becomes "terrible" and "pointless,"

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote harmonium.ro Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 10 2010 at 16:28
Yeah, those kinds of reviews are to be avoided (the guidelines are pretty specific about it).
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ivan_Melgar_M Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 10 2010 at 16:39
I believe I went too high with 3 stars
 
In first place, because I didn't wanted to lie in a Bio, I asked the band to write their bio and they literally say:
 
With this first offering with "UNIFAUN", the duo set out to do "the songs Genesis never did",
 
What can we expect of this? That a couple of copyists are able to make something like Genesis? }
 
More likely that they will copy Gensis style and sound with a vocalist that sounds almost exactly as Collins and tries to sound like Gabriel. 
 
He makes a reference to my review. "Welcome to the Farm" sounds to me as taken from ABACAB because of the music....I don't care what instrument they used....Illegal Alen with Mellotron and Hammond C3 sounds still like Illegal Alien.
 
The problem is that they clon from all Genesis eras and throw all in the same sack, so they can play music from Collins era with Gabriel era instruments.
 
Or is it the case that Mr. Sylvan believes that the instrument make the music?
 
The album is a bad copy of Genesis and only to be kind with a new artist I gave three stars to Unifaun when as a fact a cheap copy deserves 1 star.
 
What...Does Mr Sylvan wants me to rate this cheap copy with 5 stars?
 
Iván
 
 


Edited by Ivan_Melgar_M - May 10 2010 at 16:52
            
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote J-Man Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 10 2010 at 16:59
whoops.. double posted. Embarrassed


Edited by J-Man - May 10 2010 at 17:08

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote J-Man Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 10 2010 at 17:07
Originally posted by Marty McFly Marty McFly wrote:

 
Originally posted by Epignosis Epignosis wrote:


As an aside, I wonder why the author of that review even feels the need to defend his work (especially when almost all of reviewers gave it three stars or more). Ermm

Because for many people, average of 3 stars means extremely bad ? Just thinking.



3 stars means "good, but non-essential". I know that you're more generous with your ratings (which is not at all a bad thing), but for most people it means an album that is recommended to fans of the genre, but won't blow everyone away.

I think the review should be deleted. There's no reason that we should leave a review that calls our more esteemed reviewers "prog snobs" on our site.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Epignosis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 10 2010 at 17:50
Originally posted by clarke2001 clarke2001 wrote:

Speaking of artists who are rating their own work...I don't think it's a bad thing per se, but this is pathetic.




Yeah, Moris, that's pretty lame.

I should review my album and give it a five just to counteract some of the nonsensical one star ratings-only I got when my album was an incredible, huge threat in upsetting:

Martigan, Phideaux, or Ozric Tentancles

Phideaux, Deluge Grander, or Devin Townsend


Big Big Train, Magma, Lobster Newberg

To be honest, the other one-star ratings without reviews are mysteries to me as well, but whatever.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Marty McFly Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 10 2010 at 18:02
Originally posted by J-Man J-Man wrote:

Originally posted by Marty McFly Marty McFly wrote:

 
Originally posted by Epignosis Epignosis wrote:


As an aside, I wonder why the author of that review even feels the need to defend his work (especially when almost all of reviewers gave it three stars or more). Ermm

Because for many people, average of 3 stars means extremely bad ? Just thinking.



3 stars means "good, but non-essential". I know that you're more generous with your ratings (which is not at all a bad thing), but for most people it means an album that is recommended to fans of the genre, but won't blow everyone away.

I think the review should be deleted. There's no reason that we should leave a review that calls our more esteemed reviewers "prog snobs" on our site.

Jeff, don't tale me bad. I agree with you, I agree with Iván.

I heard many times what 3 stars means and it SHOULDN'T meant anything bad, for from some reasons, for many people (I believe), it MEANS bad rating for these people. I'm not defending them, I'm not with them, but I feel obliged to explain how they MAY think. I use capital letters because I'm lazy to use bold text :-) --- Well, they see top charts, they see all these albums with 4.43 ratings, or even higher if they are new. They want to see their beloved albums as high as Prog classics for example. And they complain when they see their album (in this case it's even co-author of this album, or at least someone who claims to be) with 3 bloody stars. 

I don't think like that, but if they do, it would explain a lot.


Leave aside my ratings, because even it's not a bad thing, it's not good either to rate as high as I rate. I'm trying to be more sober last months and I also revisited a lot of my ratings so lower them (sometimes raise) to make it more continuous. Basically - I give 5 star rating to an album that I really like, really think it's masterpiece. To albums that have magic, that are somehow unique.

Asides, I was thinking a hell of a time about this problem. You may rate as guidelines says, many others with 10 weighted rating may too, some may rate higher (there is more of us, who generally rates higher, but also lower, for example Sean Trane rates quite low, but he has a reason for that), but in the end,

many of these normal members tends to rate their loved albums with 5 stars. You can see all the time on main page, they are simply doing this. This maybe spoils the ratings, but if you give sober rating of 3 and two fans give 5 star ratings each, result will be 4 star from 3 ratings.


All I'm trying to say is that this exists and it's not easy to capture, this phenomenon is more like feeling that something isn't right than anything real.

There's a point where "avant-garde" and "experimental" becomes "terrible" and "pointless,"

   -Andyman1125 on Lulu







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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The Quiet One Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 10 2010 at 18:23
^I understand you Marty and I think it's true, some newcommers or musicians from a Prog album that is here may think that 3 stars is pretty bad.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Epignosis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 10 2010 at 18:38
Originally posted by Logan Logan wrote:

Sorry to point this out, but unless the rules have changed, this thread is for reporting abuse, discussion should be done here:
Moderator Tools Reviews discussion
By Easy Livin, September 08 2006 at 15:01


Originally posted by Atkingani Atkingani wrote:

To be clearer, folks.
 
 
Thanks!


Yes.

I've been a good boy and I've abided by that many times in the past.  However, the reviews abuse reporting thread is in a completely different place than the reviews discussion thread, and when you do follow the rules, your post(s) typically get ignored, because you didn't post in the "hot zone" along with everyone else.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ivan_Melgar_M Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 10 2010 at 19:20
Originally posted by Marty McFly Marty McFly wrote:

Jeff, don't tale me bad. I agree with you, I agree with Iván.

I heard many times what 3 stars means and it SHOULDN'T meant anything bad, for from some reasons, for many people (I believe), it MEANS bad rating for these people. I'm not defending them, I'm not with them, but I feel obliged to explain how they MAY think. I use capital letters because I'm lazy to use bold text :-) --- Well, they see top charts, they see all these albums with 4.43 ratings, or even higher if they are new. They want to see their beloved albums as high as Prog classics for example. And they complain when they see their album (in this case it's even co-author of this album, or at least someone who claims to be) with 3 bloody stars. 

I don't think like that, but if they do, it would explain a lot.


Leave aside my ratings, because even it's not a bad thing, it's not good either to rate as high as I rate. I'm trying to be more sober last months and I also revisited a lot of my ratings so lower them (sometimes raise) to make it more continuous. Basically - I give 5 star rating to an album that I really like, really think it's masterpiece. To albums that have magic, that are somehow unique.

Asides, I was thinking a hell of a time about this problem. You may rate as guidelines says, many others with 10 weighted rating may too, some may rate higher (there is more of us, who generally rates higher, but also lower, for example Sean Trane rates quite low, but he has a reason for that), but in the end,

many of these normal members tends to rate their loved albums with 5 stars. You can see all the time on main page, they are simply doing this. This maybe spoils the ratings, but if you give sober rating of 3 and two fans give 5 star ratings each, result will be 4 star from 3 ratings.


All I'm trying to say is that this exists and it's not easy to capture, this phenomenon is more like feeling that something isn't right than anything real.

 

I understand this, but as a system and trying to be fair, I have chosen famous albums that define a rating,

So if I have problems assigning a rating I take one of this emblematic albums of a determined rating and compare both:

My rating standards are:

5 Stars; Close to the Edge, .Foxtrot or Thick as a Brick

4 Stars: Moving Wave by Focus or Trespass by Genesis

3 Stars: Genesis Seconds Out or Pyramid by Alan Parsons (I love both albums)

2 Stars: Works II or The Friends of Mr Cairo by Jon & Vangelis

1 Star: Invisible Touch or Big Generator

In other words, an album that wants to have 4 stars, has to be better than Seconds Out or Pyramids and in the same level of Trespass by Genesis or Moving Waves by Focus.

So I ask the people here...Is a copy of Genesis better than Second's Out?

I honestly don't believe so, love that album (Seconds Out), but not in the level of Trespass which I rated with four stars

Three stars is a great rating, Pyramids is my favorite APP album, and Epignosis understood it when I rated his album in this level.

In other words I rated UNIFAUN (the copyist) as high as the real deal (Seconds Out).....Do you believe I was mean or too kind with this clones called Unifaun?

Iván



Edited by Ivan_Melgar_M - May 10 2010 at 19:26
            
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The Quiet One Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 10 2010 at 19:24
^probably too kind.
 
Anyway, I do not apply the same rating system that you apply. Probably less 'prog-oriented' and more focused in how I feel about the album, generally when an album is very unique and the whole album is memorable I give it 5 stars despite that many people don't consider it a masterpiece, Eg: Islands by King Crimson.
 
However, let's not make this another discussion, unless you find it that it will be a productive one.
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