Bored of the Rings

Tolkien was a pretentious yawn loved exclusively by spotty, No Girlfreind, Dungeons and Dragons playing, sixth form nerds.     

Discuss.

Saying Tolkien wrote literature, is like claiming the Illias and the Oddessey of Homerus, are more than just simple epic poems.

tuxon wrote:

Not very good, in my opinion...

So, could you tell a fantasy book wich could be considered as 'great literature'?

I can... Many books by Herbert Walles, Azimov, Strugatsky brothers... Could Daniel Defo or Verne be considered as fantasy authors too?

I havn`t read any Talkien, is not my cup of tea. But I understand that the making of a world with different species, geography, language and laws ain't no easy job. Maybe is not good literature, but is an outstanding work.

And my tastes in literature goes from Kafka to Kundera (I like Prague, what can I say...) and anything in between (Hemigway, Faulkner, Miller, Montanelli, Borges, Sabato and so on).

Edited, by suggestion of a good friend

I love Lord of the Rings, and I don't care how "great" a book it is. It's an epic tale which engulfs me when I read it, and that's what I want. I wouldn't say I have "quite execrable taste in literature", either; I'm certainly not at all a fan of any of the frankly indistinguishable bestsellers of today. In terms of fantasy I don't like all that much, apart from Tolkien's works and Stephen Donaldson (who I'm sure is technically a better writer, yet interests me less). Perhaps it's because I read The Hobbit when I was 5 or 6, and that's influenced my tastes over the rest of my life? In fact I still read "children's" books from time to time, and find them far more rewarding than at least some adults' books. Alice in Wonderland is an incredibly clever book, as are Swift's satires. And the Chronicles of Narnia and Black Cauldron series, while I won't claim are anything challenging or particularly subtle, still move me. Incidentally, I just picked up a book called "On Raven's Wing", or somesuch, which is based on Irish folk tales and seems quite nice.

Pixel Pirate wrote: Sorry,goose. And the rest of you. I didn't really mean it. It's just that literary discussion always brings out the insufferable intellectual snob in me,and he really is an obnoxius git I wish I could somehow be able to kill off once and for all,but it seems he's destined to reside within me for the rest of my days,my only hope is to curb his cruel barbs as much as possible. Shutting up entirely when the subject of literature comes up would be a good start!

Why would you want to do that Pixel?

You are entitled to your opinion no matter how ridiculous it is ()

Seriously though, as has been stated often on these hallowed pages,you cant have a good argument if everyone agrees!

At the risk of sounding hopelessly, self-aggrandizingly erudite, I consider myself to be among the most well-read people I know, with taste in literature that runs from the classics to sci-fi.  I read voraciously, and consume as many as five or six books a month, which I have done for well over 25 years.  I read "classic" lit, politics, religion, science, nature, lit-crit, psychology, novels, you-name-it.  There are few subjects I have not read - extensively.

I hapen not only to love Tolkien, but to consider him among the most important, creative and amazing writers of any time.  One can like or dislike the world he created or the stories he tells.  But his writing - as writing - is among the most expressive, detailed, poetic and beautiful writing in English literature.  Does he rank with Chaucer, Shakespeare, Milton, Joyce, et al?  Obviously not.  But that does not make him any less great, or even important.

Although Jules Verne and H.G. Wells set the tone that brought us the greats of sci-fi - Asimov, Bradbury, Clarke, Heinlein, et al - Tolkien was also an "influence" on sci-fi, particularly Frank Herbert: I daresay we might not have the Dune series (among other classics) without Tolkien.

The very fact that Tolkien, and LOTR, have become as cherished, beloved and, yes, historically important vis-a-vis English literature, as they have is a testament to how great Tolkien was as a writer.

Peace.

Tolkien was a professor of Medieval literature and an expert on old English, which he considered to be superior to the watered down language we've spoken since the Norman conquest. Personally I find the books almost unreadably boring, but I recognise that they are the product of a great and well informed imagination. I really enjoyed the films, but I've always been a bit of a pleb like that.

As for a fantasy book that could be considered as Literature (with a big capital L) - George RR Martin's A Song Of Ice And Fire is genuinely epic in scope and totally gripping, with complex and well rounded characters. Fantasy for people who don't like fantasy.