Rick Beato · Rick Wakeman on Prog Rock - Progressive Rock Music Forum

Hi,

Nice ... and the stories alone are worthy of the fun in it. BTW, the title is not quite right ... this is not really about "prog rock" at all but about RW and how he handled a lotof situations but the ones that you will remember are the history of his early days and what he learned.

I was thinking that is some ways, it shows how/where RW came from ... it was mostly pop music, and I never thought of him as a classical musician at all, and his albums as ... maybe ... something that just went a few steps further than pop music.

The sad part is enjoying all this stuff, but not be able to get a good feel for his ideas in music and specially composition ... and how TFTO can't be accepted by him, but we are supposed to think that the wife's stuff is better composition. I think the free form material was the part that threw him off. Creativity just being there for the sake of it being there sort of thing according to his thoughts about music?

This was good and nice to hear ...

BTW, make sure you check out the interviews that RW did with several folks ... to my knowledge these have never been "released" but some of them are on the toob ... there are some good ones in there and the Ian one will throw you for a loop, as will the one with Tony ... I would have liked to be able to find/see several of the others as well, but have never found them!

Edited by moshkito - November 13 2024 at 08:13

Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
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Big Sky wrote:

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As far as the classical music, he stated in an interview many years ago that his Dad told him to learn to play classical music as it would give him the technique to play anything. Rick stated he liked classical, so that was not an issue. Wakeman attending the Royal Academy of Music, he was certainly learning to be a classical musician.
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Hi,

The only schools that did serious music were at the Universities or equivalent like the RAM, which was another University so to speak. But, in general, all folks that had gigs outside of college/uni, ended up leaving, which, other than the chance to make money, in many ways said a lot more about the folks teaching it, than otherwise ... so a professor is going to tell RW, or KE that there is nothing they can teach them anymore? I don't think so ... and they could definitely help them in their compositional ability ... since almost all of them were excellent players, but no one really knew much about any other talent or ability. Ex: Can you translate your playing ability into composition? ... We're only aware of a couple of folks in classical music that did, starting with Vivaldi ... who was according to RW one of the first rock stars at the time ... he played and improvised everyone sillly! (RW special on Vivaldi!!!)

Like I mentioned before, though I can not exactly say this about today, but in the 1980's when I was at UCSB, there was no chance that someone was going to get a step up on any of the professors, specially when so many of them were in actuality failed actors, or at least some that did not go far in the business. Still the case today, I'm sure! So, at the very least, a lot of professors hid under the umbrella of "knowledge" not exactly playing talent. I'm almost positive that any University out there, has a Musical Department, but it is not exactly centered on the more intense side of things and composition, which I think are more for GRADUATE students than the rest. But guess what, both RW and KE fit into the "rest" at that time, although both had shown some ability that many did not have ... but all the professors could think of was, that I could not teach you anything else? A bit strange!!! Very strange.

Big Sky wrote:

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Essentially, the Professor told him unless he wanted to be strictly a classical musician, no. The musical opportunities were already there, he had a good grasp of musical theory and excellent technique that there wasn't much more the academy could teach him.

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The life of a "classical musician" is a dead end, these days ... you might get a few shows on the college circuit from it, so Eugene (OR) thinks it got some class and talent ... but in the end, I'm not sure many of those folks can make a decent living, unless they end up getting more famous for one reason or another. I'm not sure this has changed any ... but seeing the listing of performing folks here in Portland, I don't think I see any of those folks listed anywhere with classical music! Or listed with various classic recordings, other than "hits".

Big Sky wrote:

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As far as Tales is concerned, there was another interview with Rick where he said if CDs existed during the 70s, that Tales would have been great, because there was 50-55 minutes of good music. Unfortunately, in his opinion, that was to much for a single album but, not enough for a double, which resulted in an album that had about 25 minutes of padding because, the band ( ok, mainly Anderson and Howe) wanted a double album.

I like this thought ... but the time was the time, and that was the end of it ... comparing things to what they were 50 years ago, is ... probably ... a dead end. The technology was not there ... and I'm not sure that the comment is worth a donut, or any curry for that matter! The fact remains that what he said about it a long time ago, was bad, specially for a young musician, and in my book, he was making sure he could advertise his solo album which was far better than anything YES did ... ??? I don't think so!

But, heck in hell's waters ... I would love to see/hear that 50-55 minutes of music non stop ... I still (badly or not!!!) look at TFTO as a Symphony in 4 parts ... everyone did that going back to a lot of classical composers.

SIDE NOTE: I like to mention what a professor anywhere, even today, would say about TARKUS when a score was presented to them for a grade ... I still think that many of them would say it is messy and not cohesive piece of music, and it doesn't have the necessary "flow" of most pieces that are considered concertos or symphonies. I DON'T THINK THAT YOU CAN SEE THIS AS PLAYED ... AT ALL ... but when you hear Rachel Flowers play this on piano, and/or organ ... oh my gawd ... a true modern piano concert. And this, for me, is what is missing in those high level schools ... to the point that even Berklee (the music college) can only graduate these folks to get them out of the building into a band or two ... I guess you could say all those folks know the circle of fifths, sevenths and 69ths ... really well, and better than almost all stuff on radio, and listed on Variety!

And this, would have been an issue for RW, KE and many others. No one really wanted to take things "seriously" and already by that time, the rock press was already burying the media in pop music to the point that it pretty much killed at least 50/60% of all classical music purchases. RW and KE had no choice in the matter ... it was that or death as a fat old sun ... oooppppsss professor!

Edited by moshkito - 2 hours 25 minutes ago at 05:29

Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
www.pedrosena.com