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The most successful modern prog music nation?

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SteveG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 11 2024 at 21:11
Originally posted by mathman0806 mathman0806 wrote:

Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:

Originally posted by Nogbad_The_Bad Nogbad_The_Bad wrote:

No but the top four per capita are Norway, Sweden, Finland, Denmark. I wonder if there is a collective name for those countries?
That's a smart retort but your post and Richard's has nothing to do with the topic, which is the most successful modern prog nation, not the most proficient, or the most per capita, as the case may be. Btw, I think that Europe probably has Scandinavia beat.



It does relate to the topic because among the many discussions are what does it mean to be successful and how do you measure success. So, some suggested output and the quantity. Others suggested scaling by population or per capita to even out a country like the U.S. with countries that have a smaller population. There is no right answer here. Sales and now ratings are under consideration. Whether it is meaningful to scale by population is debatable.
Fair enough. Coming from a music business background and specifically doing A&R for a number of years, album sales and an artist's exposure in the media is what is successful to me, but perhaps 'success' is too variable in meaning. However, I don't rate mere album output with success. If that were the case then The Legendary Pink Dots would be the most successful psychedelic prog group in the UK just based on recorded output.

Edited by SteveG - January 12 2024 at 08:22
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (4) Thanks(4)   Quote A Crimson Mellotron Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 12 2024 at 03:38
I think looking at any kind of ratings, rankings, end-of-the-year lists or most expected albums lists, Norway would surprisingly or not, come up as the most prominent and consistent nation nowadays in terms of quantity and quality of releases, whether it be their predominant interest in exploring and expanding the possibilities of 70s influenced symphonic prog, with strong leanings towards bands like Genesis, Yes, Crimson, ELP, Cathedral, mixed with their own sensibility and traditions in folk music, or through their menacing and forward-thinking progressive metal and metal-adjacent albums, always very quirky, yet dark, occasionally jazzy and funky... But the condition that Norway is the present-day prog rock superpower is quite strong, this is my observation!

No doubt that the UK is not letting go and is perhaps on par with (or often even surpassing) their Scandinavian "rivals" when it comes to originality and merging prog rock's mentality with the prevalent sounds of the modern age, the mainstream, if you will, resulting in an interesting injection, at least personally for me, of a very intriguing pop sensibility for what concerns British prog rock releases of the recent years.

In any case, prog rock is in an interesting state of being, and it is by all means evolving, whether or not everyone notices. Evidenced by the emergence of a myriad of new bands that seem to be allocated to this category, when in reality, such bands are quite fluid and even genre-less, and above all, performing quite well commercially, receiving lots of attention, which ultimately leads to the appearance (or rather, re-appearance) of the term/word/genre of "progressive rock" and "progressive music", when put more generally.

Coming back to the original discussion, the US is as usual very prominent, although I am finding it a bit more difficult to be as intrigued by most American prog releases, as I am by their European counterparts. Naturally, Sweden, Italy, Germany, the Netherlands also have their very strong and influential representatives in the prog scene. And then comes the question of the revival of legacy bands, which seem to be touring so often nowadays, with completely new lineups, always busy releasing new music... But this, I guess, is a completely different conversation. These are my thoughts on this thread!


Edited by A Crimson Mellotron - January 12 2024 at 08:29
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Psychedelic Paul Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 12 2024 at 04:04
My Top 10 Prog Nations

01. United Kingdom (obviously)
02. Germany 
03. Netherlands 
04. Japan 
05. United States 
06. Sweden 
07. Switzerland 
08. Greece
09. Denmark
10. Poland
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote David_D Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 12 2024 at 07:05

I guess, things may look rather differently when we talk about strictly defined Progressive Rock instead of progressive music.








Edited by David_D - January 12 2024 at 14:54
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote moshkito Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 12 2024 at 07:13
Originally posted by A Crimson Mellotron A Crimson Mellotron wrote:

I think looking at any kind of ratings, rankings, end-of-the-year lists or most expected albums lists, Norway would surprisingly or not, come up as the most prominent and consistent nation nowadays in terms of quantity and quality of releases ....
...

Hi,

I would think that the country is probably a bit more "organized" and "appreciative" of its artists and musicians, in order to help them. Compare that to the US and then UK where the powers that be don't care, it makes for a place where there are lots of music and groups but very little information and appreciation other than a couple of pockets of fans here and there.

The same thing happens in Italy and Germany, and even France. There is little care for any of the musicians, other than the more famous popsters ... and that makes for the rest of the industry to suffer somewhat ... don't forget that this is very generalized. If I use Portugal as an example, or Spain, those governments couldn't careless about a rock band, and many of them (usually socialists or communists) go around saying that those bands are stealing money from the poor and the starved. Heck they said that when we were talking about moving the ashes of one of their great literature folks of the 20th century ... not likely the best, but one of the great ones.

Many of these places, don't care for the arts ... plain and simple.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Nogbad_The_Bad Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 12 2024 at 07:44
France certainly had some help for the arts, not much but much more than the UK & USA.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote David_D Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 12 2024 at 16:58
Originally posted by A Crimson Mellotron A Crimson Mellotron wrote:

I think looking at any kind of ratings, rankings, end-of-the-year lists or most expected albums lists, Norway would surprisingly or not, come up as the most prominent and consistent nation nowadays in terms of quantity and quality of releases, whether it be their predominant interest in exploring and expanding the possibilities of 70s influenced symphonic prog, with strong leanings towards bands like Genesis, Yes, Crimson, ELP, Cathedral, mixed with their own sensibility and traditions in folk music, or through their menacing and forward-thinking progressive metal and metal-adjacent albums, always very quirky, yet dark, occasionally jazzy and funky... But the condition that Norway is the present-day prog rock superpower is quite strong, this is my observation!

No doubt that the UK is not letting go and is perhaps on par with (or often even surpassing) their Scandinavian "rivals" when it comes to originality and merging prog rock's mentality with the prevalent sounds of the modern age, the mainstream, if you will, resulting in an interesting injection, at least personally for me, of a very intriguing pop sensibility for what concerns British prog rock releases of the recent years.

In any case, prog rock is in an interesting state of being, and it is by all means evolving, whether or not everyone notices. Evidenced by the emergence of a myriad of new bands that seem to be allocated to this category, when in reality, such bands are quite fluid and even genre-less, and above all, performing quite well commercially, receiving lots of attention, which ultimately leads to the appearance (or rather, re-appearance) of the term/word/genre of "progressive rock" and "progressive music", when put more generally.

Coming back to the original discussion, the US is as usual very prominent, although I am finding it a bit more difficult to be as intrigued by most American prog releases, as I am by their European counterparts. Naturally, Sweden, Italy, Germany, the Netherlands also have their very strong and influential representatives in the prog scene. And then comes the question of the revival of legacy bands, which seem to be touring so often nowadays, with completely new lineups, always busy releasing new music... But this, I guess, is a completely different conversation. These are my thoughts on this thread!

Thank you very much for this very good post. Thumbs Up 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cstack3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 12 2024 at 22:10
a) Uzbekistan 
b) Ghana 
c) Liechtenstein
d) Myanmar
e) Faroes Islands

....or something.  


Edited by cstack3 - January 12 2024 at 22:10
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Cristi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 13 2024 at 01:30
Originally posted by cstack3 cstack3 wrote:

a) Uzbekistan 
b) Ghana 
c) Liechtenstein
d) Myanmar
e) Faroes Islands

....or something.  

I was wondering when such a post would show up. LOL Thumbs Up


Edited by Cristi - January 13 2024 at 13:36
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Saperlipopette! Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 13 2024 at 02:26
Originally posted by moshkito moshkito wrote:

Originally posted by A Crimson Mellotron A Crimson Mellotron wrote:

I think looking at any kind of ratings, rankings, end-of-the-year lists or most expected albums lists, Norway would surprisingly or not, come up as the most prominent and consistent nation nowadays in terms of quantity and quality of releases ....
...

Hi,

I would think that the country is probably a bit more "organized" and "appreciative" of its artists and musicians, in order to help them. Compare that to the US and then UK where the powers that be don't care, it makes for a place where there are lots of music and groups but very little information and appreciation other than a couple of pockets of fans here and there.

The same thing happens in Italy and Germany, and even France. There is little care for any of the musicians, other than the more famous popsters ... and that makes for the rest of the industry to suffer somewhat ... don't forget that this is very generalized. If I use Portugal as an example, or Spain, those governments couldn't careless about a rock band, and many of them (usually socialists or communists) go around saying that those bands are stealing money from the poor and the starved. Heck they said that when we were talking about moving the ashes of one of their great literature folks of the 20th century ... not likely the best, but one of the great ones.

Many of these places, don't care for the arts ... plain and simple.
There's of course big differences from nation to nation in regards to supporiting the arts. But I don't think there's a single country in the world where the powers that be cares for - or support a local prog rock scene. Some of the jazzier, or classically trained ones that are educated in music academies may get some support, but probably not bands like Wobbler. Still it's easier to invest a lot of time doing what you love while living a wealthy nation compared to a poor one. But that's because most bands, even relatively successful and profilic ones, spend much more than they earn - playing some kind of progressive rock.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hrychu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 13 2024 at 02:46
Originally posted by cstack3 cstack3 wrote:

a) Uzbekistan
b) Ghana
c) Liechtenstein
d) Myanmar
e) Faroes Islands
I personally like FromUz and Osibisa. Týr is quite solid too.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Cristi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 13 2024 at 02:51
Originally posted by Hrychu Hrychu wrote:

Originally posted by cstack3 cstack3 wrote:

a) Uzbekistan
b) Ghana
c) Liechtenstein
d) Myanmar
e) Faroes Islands
I personally like FromUz and Osibisa. Týr is quite solid too.

Osibisa is great. A Multinational line-up. Smile
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote David_D Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 13 2024 at 04:43
Originally posted by David_D David_D wrote:

Thank you very much for this very good post. Thumbs Up 

Also thanks for all the other good contributions to this topic so far, and not least from Richardh and David Big smile.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lewian Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 13 2024 at 04:49
Originally posted by Saperlipopette! Saperlipopette! wrote:

There's of course big differences from nation to nation in regards to supporiting the arts. But I don't think there's a single country in the world where the powers that be cares for - or support a local prog rock scene. Some of the jazzier, or classically trained ones that are educated in music academies may get some support, but probably not bands like Wobbler. Still it's easier to invest a lot of time doing what you love while living a wealthy nation compared to a poor one. But that's because most bands, even relatively successful and profilic ones, spend much more than they earn - playing some kind of progressive rock.  
Not necessarily related to the moshkito posting you referred to (and not necessarily is disagreement with you), but I think relevant differences between nations exist regarding (a) the emphasis on arts/music in education and (b) the system of social support, taxes etc., namely how viable it is to exist on something like a half time job (or no job at all) if you put much time into music without it paying for the bills. Significant differences exist between wealthy nations in these respects.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hrychu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 13 2024 at 05:34
Originally posted by Cristi Cristi wrote:

Originally posted by Hrychu Hrychu wrote:

Originally posted by cstack3 cstack3 wrote:

a) Uzbekistan
b) Ghana
c) Liechtenstein
d) Myanmar
e) Faroes Islands
I personally like FromUz and Osibisa. Týr is quite solid too.


Osibisa is great. A Multinational line-up. Smile
Yeah but they sorta 'represent' Ghana so that's why they count.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Cristi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 13 2024 at 05:35
Originally posted by Hrychu Hrychu wrote:

Originally posted by Cristi Cristi wrote:

Originally posted by Hrychu Hrychu wrote:

Originally posted by cstack3 cstack3 wrote:

a) Uzbekistan
b) Ghana
c) Liechtenstein
d) Myanmar
e) Faroes Islands
I personally like FromUz and Osibisa. Týr is quite solid too.


Osibisa is great. A Multinational line-up. Smile
Yeah but they sorta 'represent' Ghana so that's why they count.

They count because they are a great band. Tongue
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote moshkito Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 13 2024 at 07:04
Originally posted by Saperlipopette! Saperlipopette! wrote:

... in regards to supporiting the arts. But I don't think there's a single country in the world where the powers that be cares for - or support a local prog rock scene. Some of the jazzier, or classically trained ones that are educated in music academies may get some support, but probably not bands like Wobbler. 
....
 playing some kind of progressive rock.  

Hi,

I don't think that progressive rock, or jazz or any other kind of music gets preferential treatment ... but it would seem easy for us to say that the mariachi bands in Mexico get more help than the rock bands, which is not true ... because most Mariachi bands don't have stuff to sell, and the rock bands usually do.

The higher level of "support" is tainted and sometimes ugly ... check out the arts in Eugene, Oregon ... this season, feels like every season, is Gershwin time again, and the names? You never heard them before either, but somehow "famous" songs get revitalized ... yet again ... which means that the real music of today, is not going to get any representation, and this is the "elite" side of Eugene, Or, or all the professors and Phil Knights that you can blow up ... and when you see the listings, I seriously doubt that many of these folks are any better than any jazz or rock musician out there ...

In my way of seeing things, it's like ... the place lacks personality, specially when it lives in the past and makes it look like it is "the scene" ... it isn't! But tell that to the famous/rich folks that own Eugene! It's the same everywhere else, with universities creating concerts by folks that have a much smaller name than Wobbler will ever have!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote David_D Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 13 2024 at 08:52
Originally posted by Cristi Cristi wrote:

Originally posted by Hrychu Hrychu wrote:

Originally posted by Cristi Cristi wrote:

Originally posted by Hrychu Hrychu wrote:

I personally like FromUz and Osibisa. Týr is quite solid too.
Osibisa is great. A Multinational line-up. Smile
Yeah but they sorta 'represent' Ghana so that's why they count.
They count because they are a great band. Tongue

And especially, if they sing in English. Wink

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Cristi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 13 2024 at 09:16
Originally posted by David_D David_D wrote:

Originally posted by Cristi Cristi wrote:

Originally posted by Hrychu Hrychu wrote:

Originally posted by Cristi Cristi wrote:

Originally posted by Hrychu Hrychu wrote:

I personally like FromUz and Osibisa. Týr is quite solid too.
Osibisa is great. A Multinational line-up. Smile
Yeah but they sorta 'represent' Ghana so that's why they count.
They count because they are a great band. Tongue

And especially, if they sing in English. Wink


That's not a condition if you ask me. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cstack3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 13 2024 at 13:33
Originally posted by Cristi Cristi wrote:

Originally posted by cstack3 cstack3 wrote:

a) Uzbekistan 
b) Ghana 
c) Liechtenstein
d) Myanmar
e) Faroes Islands

....or something.  

I was wandering when such a post would show up. LOL Thumbs Up

Couldn't resist! 

Good prog is where we find it.  I rather enjoy the Mongolian group The HU!  Perhaps not prog in the classic sense, but very aggressive and creative.  

As far as most successful nation....measured by tax receipts?  Touring?  Product releases?
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