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Logan View Drop Down
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Points: 35762 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Logan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 18 2023 at 17:05
Originally posted by Necrotica Necrotica wrote:

Calling All Stations isn't great, but I do think it's overhated. Honestly, From Genesis to Revelation is my least favorite album of theirs by a landslide 


I far prefer the track "The Serpent" off the debut to anything on Calling All Stations (I like that song a lot). The rest of the album I have rarely bothered with, however, but I still prefer it on the whole.

Edited by Logan - October 18 2023 at 17:17
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Originally posted by Logan Logan wrote:

Originally posted by Necrotica Necrotica wrote:

Calling All Stations isn't great, but I do think it's overhated. Honestly, From Genesis to Revelation is my least favorite album of theirs by a landslide 


I far prefer the track "The Serpent" off the debut to anything on Calling All Stations (I like that song a lot). The rest of the album I have rarely bothered with, however, but I still prefer it on the whole.

You like the title track to calling all stations? I agree it's good. I think if that album was by some neo-prog band it would be considered one of the best of the 90s.


Edited by AFlowerKingCrimson - October 18 2023 at 17:26
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Points: 35762 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Logan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 18 2023 at 17:37
Originally posted by AFlowerKingCrimson AFlowerKingCrimson wrote:

Originally posted by Logan Logan wrote:

Originally posted by Necrotica Necrotica wrote:

Calling All Stations isn't great, but I do think it's overhated. Honestly, From Genesis to Revelation is my least favorite album of theirs by a landslide 


I far prefer the track "The Serpent" off the debut to anything on Calling All Stations (I like that song a lot). The rest of the album I have rarely bothered with, however, but I still prefer it on the whole.


You like the title track to calling all stations? I agree it's good. I think if that album was by some neo-prog band it would be considered one of the best of the 90s.



I meant that I like "The Serpent" a lot.
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Originally posted by Necrotica Necrotica wrote:

Calling All Stations isn't great, but I do think it's okay. Honestly, From Genesis to Revelation is my least favorite album of theirs by a landslide 

Their debut has grown on me tremendously--especially when I began my deep dive into 1960s psychedelia (which is how I'd categorize its music). 

In my opinion, every single Genesis album has redeeming parts. Whereas I hated …and then there were three … when it came out, this was more for my disappointment that Steve Hackett had left and I couldn't believe it possible that the threesome could possibly produce anything of value, I now see that I was wrong: there are some great ideas and beautiful and power parts to the album. Having seen the band on the second Seconds Out, Wind and Wuthering, Duke, and ABACAB tours I know that I was a fan of all of those albums at those times. The album that I absolutely loved from the start (and still do) that was not received quite as well at the time was the "Mama" Genesis album.

 I've never owned Invisible Touch, We Can't Dance, or Calling All Stations albums but I've heard them enough to know that there is some good music there. As someone above said, I just grew up with the Gabriel and Hackett era's creating my template for the progressive rock music that I grew to cherish and love.
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Originally posted by AFlowerKingCrimson AFlowerKingCrimson wrote:


You like the title track to calling all stations? I agree it's good. I think if that album was by some neo-prog band it would be considered one of the best of the 90s.

I don't think so. And I like the album. 
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Genesis, like few other bands, has divided the opinion of their fans and critics. The staunch supporters of the Gabriel era and until Hackett's departure do not forgive the band's turn towards more commercially accessible music. On the other hand, there are also followers of the Collins era who are more lenient with this change of style, arguing that the music is more enjoyable and less intellectual. There are also those who find valuable things in all stages. 

Is one era better than another? I don't think so. Instead, I believe that Genesis' metamorphosis since the 80s caused those who didn't identify with the new style to move away while bringing in a large number of those who did receive positive vibes.

Many of the groups I personally adore also had some highly discordant works in the 80s compared to what could be expected. Few could have predicted that Queen, following "Bohemian Rhapsody" and "The Prophet's Song," would produce "Back Chat," "Staying Power," or "Body Language" seven years later. Likewise, who would have thought that Yes would create "Owner of a Lonely Heart" after "Awaken" or "And You and I"? Or that the academic and highly progressive ELP would produce an album like "Long Beach" after "Tarkus" or "Brian Salad Surgery"? And even Hackett himself surprised many by making "Cured" after "Voyage of Acolyte."  All these bands and individual artists still enjoy the respect and admiration of their longtime fans.

However, Genesis seems to have no middle ground. It's up for debate that Genesis went more towards pop and didn't "rectify" their course. All this can be argued. The truth is, each tour by the English band, as long as Collins' health permits, is full of sold-out shows.

To not dodge the point, I have to admit that the music from "Trespass" to "Wind & Wuthering" conveys many sensations to me and deeply moves me. For example, "The Musical Box", "Supper's Ready" or "Firth of Fifth". In contrast, "Me and Sarah Jane", "Invisible Touch" or "Just a Job to Do", for instance, are completely distant to me, like most of their songs from the eighties (except for some elements from "Duke"). Is it good or bad?Neither one nor the other, it's a matter of taste, and in general Genesis music from the 80's onwards doesn't taste good to me. 




Edited by Hector Enrique - October 19 2023 at 11:20
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^Great comments--especially that final paragraph. Thanks, Hector!\
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Thanks to you Drew! Wink
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I've always argued that everyone changed their stance after new wave and punk hit the music scene. That was cataclysmic. Some made interesting records after that (ie Rush, King Crimson) some didn't (ie Genesis, Yes). However by the 90's the 'punk effect' was waning and bands were getting back to connecting with their real audience. Genesis had the notion that they could do something 'new' (CAS) but clashed badly with their fans who wanted the old Genesis back. In the end they gave up altogether whereas Yes latterly made some great prog music (Keys, The Ladder and Magnification) and carried touring regularly and allowing the likes of me who never had a chance to see them back in the day to go and see what the fuss was all about ( I eventually saw Yes 5 or 6 times having never seen them back in the 70's or 80's and they were always at least good if not great ie Yes Symphonic) .Rutherford was already considerably well off even before Genesis became popular while Banks was happy to have the big royalty cheques roll in although eventually gave into the itch to do some more live shows at least.
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I pair Duke and Abacab albums together. Personally Abacab is the last good Genesis album with Duke being slightly better. I wish Abacab would have had the extended Dodo/Lurker suite that would have included Naminanu and Submarine. Second side of Abacab that included that suite ( approximately 16 minutes) and Man on the Corner would have made a strong album front to back, while dumping tracks like Who Dunnit and Another Record. Front side of Abacab, outside of No Reply at All, which I'm ambivalent about, I quite like.

The Genesis ( Shapes) album sits right on the fence. Mama is great and Home by the Sea is pretty good. The rest is meh.

Invisible Touch has 3 songs I deeply dislike. The title track, In to Deep and Throwing it All Away are hot garbage. Anything She Does is barely better than those three tracks, but is still not good. Land of Confusion is not much better than Anything She Does. The Brazilian is a good instrumental. Domino and Tonight, Tonight, Tonight are passable tunes that sound better than they are because they are surrounded by crap. A bad album that included me attending the most disappointing concert I have ever been to in Chapel Hill, NC on that tour.

Not an 80s album, but We Can't Dance is even worse, mainly because it's a double album that gives us even more schlock than what is on Invisible Touch. Driving the Last Spike, a great song, shows that when Tony, Mike and Phil gave a S#*! they could produce good music. But, No Son of Mine, I Can't Dance, Jesus He Knows Me and Hold on My Heart makes me want to drive a spike into my ear drum. It is the worst thing Genesis released. At least I didn't go see the concert on that tour. Learned my lesson from the previous Genesis tour.

Edited by Big Sky - October 20 2023 at 11:46
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Originally posted by Hector Enrique Hector Enrique wrote:


Genesis, like few other bands, has divided the opinion of their fans and critics. The staunch supporters of the Gabriel era and until Hackett's departure do not forgive the band's turn towards more commercially accessible music. On the other hand, there are also followers of the Collins era who are more lenient with this change of style, arguing that the music is more enjoyable and less intellectual. There are also those who find valuable things in all stages. 

Is one era better than another? I don't think so. Instead, I believe that Genesis' metamorphosis since the 80s caused those who didn't identify with the new style to move away while bringing in a large number of those who did receive positive vibes.

Many of the groups I personally adore also had some highly discordant works in the 80s compared to what could be expected. Few could have predicted that Queen, following "Bohemian Rhapsody" and "The Prophet's Song," would produce "Back Chat," "Staying Power," or "Body Language" seven years later. Likewise, who would have thought that Yes would create "Owner of a Lonely Heart" after "Awaken" or "And You and I"? Or that the academic and highly progressive ELP would produce an album like "Long Beach" after "Tarkus" or "Brian Salad Surgery"? And even Hackett himself surprised many by making "Cured" after "Voyage of Acolyte."  All these bands and individual artists still enjoy the respect and admiration of their longtime fans.

However, Genesis seems to have no middle ground. It's up for debate that Genesis went more towards pop and didn't "rectify" their course. All this can be argued. The truth is, each tour by the English band, as long as Collins' health permits, is full of sold-out shows.

To not dodge the point, I have to admit that the music from "Trespass" to "Wind & Wuthering" conveys many sensations to me and deeply moves me. For example, "The Musical Box", "Supper's Ready" or "Firth of Fifth". In contrast, "Me and Sarah Jane", "Invisible Touch" or "Just a Job to Do", for instance, are completely distant to me, like most of their songs from the eighties (except for some elements from "Duke"). Is it good or bad?Neither one nor the other, it's a matter of taste, and in general Genesis music from the 80's onwards doesn't taste good to me. 





While not quite as divisive as Genesis because they didn't lean into pop as hard, but there is definitely a split in fans pre-Dark Side of the Moon with the ones after. Tangerine Dream is another group with so many different eras that fans jump on and off and back on the bus.
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I love 80s Genesis (including We Can't Dance), even though both Duke and Abacab got too much filler for my taste. Calling All Stations, on the other hand, is completely unnecessary - not bad but absolutely non-essential
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Invisible Touch and Genesis are the only two from the 80s that I like and still listen to. Duke is everything the punks hated and I hate it too, it is just nonsense noodling by a band that has lost its way and consequently produced an album full of filler. Abacab is a bit better with two good songs amongst all the filler.
     



Edited by LAM-SGC - October 25 2023 at 08:19
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Originally posted by Logan Logan wrote:

Originally posted by Necrotica Necrotica wrote:

Calling All Stations isn't great, but I do think it's overhated. Honestly, From Genesis to Revelation is my least favorite album of theirs by a landslide 


I far prefer the track "The Serpent" off the debut to anything on Calling All Stations (I like that song a lot). The rest of the album I have rarely bothered with, however, but I still prefer it on the whole.

TBH, although I find that CAS shouldn't have been released (what a sad way to end the band), I really don't think it's that bad.... 
On my scale of worst, it's equal to Abacab, but behind Shapes (whose A-side is the best thing post-Duke), but well ahead of IT & WCD. 



BTW, I rank FGTR above any of those 80's+ albums. 


.
let's just stay above the moral melee
prefer the sink to the gutter
keep our sand-castle virtues
content to be a doer
as well as a thinker,
prefer lifting our pen
rather than un-sheath our sword
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Originally posted by LAM-SGC LAM-SGC wrote:

Invisible Touch and Genesis are the only two from the 80s that I like and still listen to. Duke is everything the punks hated and I hate it too, it is just nonsense noodling by a band that has lost its way and consequently produced an album full of filler. Abacab is a bit better with two good songs amongst all the filler.

How do you know the punks hated it? What's the evidence? Also so what if they did? How is it important?! 

Abacab better than Duke?! I disagree... Maybe you like it more and that's fine, but better?! No way... Confused
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