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Sean Trane View Drop Down
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Points: 20414 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sean Trane Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 04 2022 at 02:35
Originally posted by Atavachron Atavachron wrote:

Originally posted by rushfan4 rushfan4 wrote:

I borrowed this from a Facebook post, as it sums up my feelings on the subject:
I'm not pro-murdering babies.
I'm pro-Becky who found out at her 20 week anatomy scan that the infant she had been so excited to bring into this world had developed without life sustaining organs.I'm pro-Susan who was sexually assaulted on her way home from work, only to come to the horrific realization that her assailant planted his seed in her when she got a positive pregnancy test result a month later.I'm pro-Theresa who hemorrhaged due to a placental abruption, causing her parents, spouse, and children to have to make the impossible decision on whether to save her or her unborn child.I'm pro-little Cathy who had her innocence ripped away from her by someone she should have been able to trust and her 11 year old body isn't mature enough to bear the consequence of that betrayal.I'm pro-Melissa who's working two jobs just to make ends meet and has to choose between bringing another child into poverty or feeding the children she already has because her spouse walked out on her.I'm pro-Brittany who realizes that she is in no way financially, emotionally, or physically able to raise a child.I'm pro-Emily who went through IVF, ending up with SIX viable implanted eggs requiring selective reduction in order to ensure the safety of her and a SAFE amount of fetuses.I'm pro-Christina who doesn't want to be a mother, but birth control methods sometimes fail.I'm pro-Jessica who is FINALLY getting the strength to get away from her physically abusive spouse only to find out that she is carrying the monster's child.I'm pro-Vanessa who went into her confirmation appointment after YEARS of trying to conceive only to hear silence where there should be a heartbeat.I'm pro-Lindsay who lost her virginity in her sophomore year with a broken condom and now has to choose whether to be a teenage mom or just a teenager.
I'm pro-Courtney who just found out she's already 13 weeks along, but the egg never made it out of her fallopian tube so either she terminates the pregnancy or risks dying from internal bleeding

Important text.   It won't sway the Psychotic Right, but it could influence someone undecided.



Even worse, I'm pro-Lizzie who found herself pregnant against her will and decide to undergo an abortion and have the nay-sayers saying she's using abortion  as if it was a normal birth-control method.
What most pro-life arseholes don't realize is how mind-damaging it is to have someone going up your entrails and perform a still-dangerous act. Even done by specialists, an abortion remains a dangerous act with sometimes dramatic health hazards, let alone psychological consequences.

If my mother hadn't had had abortion in the late-50"s early-60's on three occasions (remember the pill didn't exist and most males wouldn't wear a condom and promised to "withdraw before ejaculation" and then "forgot to")  performed by her female gynecologists,  she'd probably have never met my dad ands I wouldn't be here. 
Let alone to think in what psychological and physical state state that dear woman (who raised three great kids) would be in today.


.



/ 


Edited by Sean Trane - May 04 2022 at 02:36
let's just stay above the moral melee
prefer the sink to the gutter
keep our sand-castle virtues
content to be a doer
as well as a thinker,
prefer lifting our pen
rather than un-sheath our sword
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Atavachron View Drop Down
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Originally posted by rushfan4 rushfan4 wrote:

I borrowed this from a Facebook post, as it sums up my feelings on the subject:
I'm not pro-murdering babies.
I'm pro-Becky who found out at her 20 week anatomy scan that the infant she had been so excited to bring into this world had developed without life sustaining organs.I'm pro-Susan who was sexually assaulted on her way home from work, only to come to the horrific realization that her assailant planted his seed in her when she got a positive pregnancy test result a month later.I'm pro-Theresa who hemorrhaged due to a placental abruption, causing her parents, spouse, and children to have to make the impossible decision on whether to save her or her unborn child.I'm pro-little Cathy who had her innocence ripped away from her by someone she should have been able to trust and her 11 year old body isn't mature enough to bear the consequence of that betrayal.I'm pro-Melissa who's working two jobs just to make ends meet and has to choose between bringing another child into poverty or feeding the children she already has because her spouse walked out on her.I'm pro-Brittany who realizes that she is in no way financially, emotionally, or physically able to raise a child.I'm pro-Emily who went through IVF, ending up with SIX viable implanted eggs requiring selective reduction in order to ensure the safety of her and a SAFE amount of fetuses.I'm pro-Christina who doesn't want to be a mother, but birth control methods sometimes fail.I'm pro-Jessica who is FINALLY getting the strength to get away from her physically abusive spouse only to find out that she is carrying the monster's child.I'm pro-Vanessa who went into her confirmation appointment after YEARS of trying to conceive only to hear silence where there should be a heartbeat.I'm pro-Lindsay who lost her virginity in her sophomore year with a broken condom and now has to choose whether to be a teenage mom or just a teenager.
I'm pro-Courtney who just found out she's already 13 weeks along, but the egg never made it out of her fallopian tube so either she terminates the pregnancy or risks dying from internal bleeding

Important text.   It won't sway the Psychotic Right, but it could influence someone undecided.
"Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought."   -- John F. Kennedy
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I'm ok with people being anti-abortion and pro-life as long as they pay these women to have unwanted children or agree to raise them themselves. The thing is none of these pro-lifers would be prepared or want to raise these children. Are they going to cheer these women on in the delivery room when they do give birth? To be honest, I really don't see why people care what women do or don't do with their bodies. 

Edited by AFlowerKingCrimson - May 03 2022 at 21:18
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I borrowed this from a Facebook post, as it sums up my feelings on the subject:

I'm not pro-murdering babies.
I'm pro-Becky who found out at her 20 week anatomy scan that the infant she had been so excited to bring into this world had developed without life sustaining organs.
I'm pro-Susan who was sexually assaulted on her way home from work, only to come to the horrific realization that her assailant planted his seed in her when she got a positive pregnancy test result a month later.
I'm pro-Theresa who hemorrhaged due to a placental abruption, causing her parents, spouse, and children to have to make the impossible decision on whether to save her or her unborn child.
I'm pro-little Cathy who had her innocence ripped away from her by someone she should have been able to trust and her 11 year old body isn't mature enough to bear the consequence of that betrayal.
I'm pro-Melissa who's working two jobs just to make ends meet and has to choose between bringing another child into poverty or feeding the children she already has because her spouse walked out on her.
I'm pro-Brittany who realizes that she is in no way financially, emotionally, or physically able to raise a child.
I'm pro-Emily who went through IVF, ending up with SIX viable implanted eggs requiring selective reduction in order to ensure the safety of her and a SAFE amount of fetuses.
I'm pro-Christina who doesn't want to be a mother, but birth control methods sometimes fail.
I'm pro-Jessica who is FINALLY getting the strength to get away from her physically abusive spouse only to find out that she is carrying the monster's child.
I'm pro-Vanessa who went into her confirmation appointment after YEARS of trying to conceive only to hear silence where there should be a heartbeat.
I'm pro-Lindsay who lost her virginity in her sophomore year with a broken condom and now has to choose whether to be a teenage mom or just a teenager.
I'm pro-Courtney who just found out she's already 13 weeks along, but the egg never made it out of her fallopian tube so either she terminates the pregnancy or risks dying from internal bleeding.
You can argue and say that I'm pro-choice all you want, but the truth is:
I'm pro-life.
Their lives.
Women's lives.
You don't get to pick and choose which scenarios should be accepted.
Women's rights are meant to protect ALL women, regardless of their situation!
*Copied and pasted, please do the same*
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Atavachron View Drop Down
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^ Then there's Amanda Duarte's statement.  She meant well and I get what she's saying but it came out oh so very, very wrong :

"I do wonder how these white-supremacist lawmakers would feel if their little white daughters were raped and impregnated by black men."
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No truer words have I ever heard spoken than what I heard from an 88 year old woman today:

"If men could get pregnant, there would be abortion clinics on every corner."
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^ Some good points if a little too bombastic--   I do wonder if Planned Parenthood will ironically become common in Anti-Choice states if only to help parents deal with a child they have no way of supporting and had no intention of having. 
"Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought."   -- John F. Kennedy
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Originally posted by Atavachron Atavachron wrote:

Maybe the most significant political issue in the U.S. for the past forty years, it's possible the Supreme Court may return the rights around controlling abortion to the individual States and prevent the Federal government from protecting women nationally, according to a leaked document.

As appalling as this is, will this give the Democrats a much-needed boost this year and in 2024 ?   Or will this provide political capital for Republicans ?  

Most importantly, how do you feel about an adult woman's right to decide what to do with her body ?



Completely reactionary and indefensible. A pox on both the Republicans and Democrats.
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"Gallup polls show Americans support for abortion in all or most cases at 80% in May 2021, only sightly higher than in 1975 (76%), and the Pew Research Center finds 59% of adults believe abortion should be legal, compared to 60% in 1995—though there has been fluctuation, with support dropping to a low of 47% in 2009.

The share of Americans in Gallup’s poll who say abortion is morally acceptable reached a record high of 47% in May, up from a low of 36% in 2009, and a Quinnipiac poll found support for abortion being legal in all or most cases reached a near-record high in September with 63% support."


-- That's from Forbes, BTW, not exactly a liberal bastion.




Edited by Atavachron - May 03 2022 at 15:18
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I'm pro-choice. If someone down the road has an abortion, I won't even know about it. It doesn't affect me. There's enough people in the world, and plenty of unwanted children. I'm in favor of more (free) condoms, morning-after plll (RU482), etc.. But this is at the bottom of issues for me when it comes to politics. I also don't like that it's used as a litmus test. Someone could be wrong on every other issue, but again, it's a litmus test. Just like guns, which I've changed positions on, but that's for another thread.

People were talking about the leak being done to get the public to react, thinking it would get the court to reverse a decision they've already made? I don't like the idea of mob rule. The law shouldn't be political, or influenced by mob rule.
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^ Well we are on to the second page already, and apart from Ompha’s predictable attempts to derail (I would say troll, but I think she’s deluded enough to be sincere) the discussion, we still seem to be quite civil and respectful. Maybe there is hope for us, yet?



Edited by nick_h_nz - May 03 2022 at 11:56
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Originally posted by ExittheLemming ExittheLemming wrote:

I don't want to undermine what is a sincere and thought provoking OP but I'll give this 3 pages before it gets locked. The best case scenario would be for me to be proven wrong and we have a civil, erudite and adult debate about a very polarizing topic. Secure the ornaments....

Don't worry Iain, whether it does or not doesn't really matter.   It has to be discussed.   Besides, if anyone badly trolls this thing I'll just start a fistfight and get the thing closed right away.
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Originally posted by JD JD wrote:

Originally posted by Sean Trane Sean Trane wrote:

Originally posted by BrufordFreak BrufordFreak wrote:

Will Earth become the next Mars?


Yes, Mars could become a solution (if done right - that means kick out private firms from space), but there are already people who've bought property on the Red Planet and will claim ownership. It's a lost cause, if you ask me.
Sean you missed the point here, He's saying Earth will BECOME the next Mars, not that we should go there as a solution. Make sense?

Not the way I read it, because the analogy didn't stick: Mars was never occupied by an "intelligent" life and most likely was never a living planet, despite having some living organism. If we are to poison our planet, it will maybe end up more like Venus (not that Venus ever had an intelligent life either. 


Edited by Sean Trane - May 03 2022 at 09:01
let's just stay above the moral melee
prefer the sink to the gutter
keep our sand-castle virtues
content to be a doer
as well as a thinker,
prefer lifting our pen
rather than un-sheath our sword
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Originally posted by Sean Trane Sean Trane wrote:

Originally posted by BrufordFreak BrufordFreak wrote:

Will Earth become the next Mars?


Yes, Mars could become a solution (if done right - that means kick out private firms from space), but there are already people who've bought property on the Red Planet and will claim ownership. It's a lost cause, if you ask me.
Sean you missed the point here, He's saying Earth will BECOME the next Mars, not that we should go there as a solution. Make sense?
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Originally posted by omphaloskepsis omphaloskepsis wrote:

Originally posted by Sean Trane Sean Trane wrote:

Originally posted by omphaloskepsis omphaloskepsis wrote:

Should gin support for democrats heading into 2022 midterms.  Biden will revisit student loan forgiveness in time for 2022 midterms.  The abortion vote distracts from Russia/Ukraine...a war that Russia is winning. Time to change the channel on America's brain. 

I figure Roberts sits this one out. That said, if Roe/Wade is overturned...Abortion is NOT outlawed. The abortion issue becomes a state decision again.

I wouldn't bet on that... 


That said, I hear this is the first time Supreme Court decision has leaked. (I don't know if it's the first time.) What do you think of the timing of the decision?  Why now?

Interesting answers about Ukraine, but let's not hijack this thread. (let's discuss this in dedicated thread.

Why now? the whole legal/justice process takes time and is theoretically independent of global news. It just follows its course no matter what the WH's agenda is going to be.  As pointed to Steve, there is nothing Biden or the Dems can do to stop it... And the Reps couldn't either, should they ever they want to. 

They  (Dems) can maybe delay it long enough until another judge comes to die and needs to be replaced. But even then, from what I understand, the nomination process will take some time and even if the death would happen at the end of this year, I'm not sure Biden & Dems will have time to nominate their own  candidate in time of the current presidential or congress mandate. 

Originally posted by BrufordFreak BrufordFreak wrote:

The pendulum between egalitarian humanitariansim and depraved hedonism is swinging back toward the latter. How far will it go?

I'm tired of the game. It's just not entertaining anymore. I just wish global warming would accelerate and extinguish this sad version of humans. More, I'm worried that we've infected our Mother with more toxic poisons than she can recover from--that runaway global warming may destroy all conditions for sustainable biological life! Will Earth become the next Mars? Where will we take our addictions for our next lifetimes?


Not sure how to read that. Confused

Yup, I'm not even sure it's worth even trying to save this planet, given that new generations will simply not be better than us.... Unless we have 10G St Greta (Thundberg) refusing to take the plane to go on holidays or let their smartphone die out without being replaced. The young generations are so keen on new technologies that they've got no idea on how to order a Big Mac menu on anything else than a gigantic touch-screen. 



Yes, Mars could become a solution (if done right - that means kick out private firms from space), but there are already people who've bought property on the Red Planet and will claim ownership. It's a lost cause, if you ask me.


. 



Edited by Sean Trane - May 03 2022 at 08:40
let's just stay above the moral melee
prefer the sink to the gutter
keep our sand-castle virtues
content to be a doer
as well as a thinker,
prefer lifting our pen
rather than un-sheath our sword
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and abolish the death penalty
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The pendulum between egalitarian humanitariansim and depraved hedonism is swinging back toward the latter. How far will it go?

I'm tired of the game. It's just not entertaining anymore. I just wish global warming would accelerate and extinguish this sad version of humans. More, I'm worried that we've infected our Mother with more toxic poisons than she can recover from--that runaway global warming may destroy all conditions for sustainable biological life! Will Earth become the next Mars? Where will we take our addictions for our next lifetimes?
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#keepabortionlegal

Enough said.
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One aspect of this that no one really talks about & is absolutely terrifying is the provision put in many of these new state laws that allow individuals  to sue any one who may have " aided some one who received an abortion"
 What does that mean? Well no one really seems to know. Can you sue the Uber driver that took the woman to a clinic? How about the person who bought a woman a turkey sandwich after the procedure? I know these sound like extreme examples but the point is no one knows where it would start & where it would end. So now states that are allowing these law suites have just recruited thousands of vigilante Christian jihadists to target women having abortions & anyone who may have assisted them. Like I said , absolutely terrifying. 
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